No, the TRL have no rolled off in any of the speakers that I tried. But the VTLs were. We also tried them a friend's B&W 802 and we concluded the same.
I owned all of these amps.
This is based on my listening and I have not read any review nor do I care to. |
Gallant_diva,
If they work for some and sound rolled off to you, would you not suspect a mismatch somewhere? |
Dan_ed: What you said is entirely possible but your argument should be directed to Albert because I just posted my opinion which admittedly is very subjective and relative, but not directed at proving someone wrong. So, long as we keep that basic principle in mid, it is ok to engage in useful and friendly argument. And if it gets a bit out of hand, I will be first to leave the scene.
In fact, arguing for "my toy is better" is not my forte, as you can see from my posts. But in true audiophile spirit with an open mind, Instead of getting irritated one can do something more creative. For example, I would be interested in comparing the TRL and VTL on a neutral ground here in the DFW area. I can bring my GT-400 (the GT-800 is too big and the contest is not worth the effort) and Albert can bring his VTL and also his own judges :-). I am willing to bring the TRL GT-400 anywhere in DFW area and try with any system for the contest. How about that ;-)? |
I'm not arguing anything, just making a suggestion. Might I make another? "In my system the VTLs sounded rolled from the top." FWIW. :-) |
Dand_ed:
I respect your suggestion but with minor changes as I mentioned in my previous post I used several speakers and also my friend's system.
"In my systems and my friend's system the VTLs sounded rolled from the top."
ok, pal? |
I'm not your "pal", "buddy", "son", etc. have a nice life. |
hmmmmmmm..........Gallant_diva seems to have retained his highly off-putting nature! |
By the way Keith, your speakers are not so highly efficient so you will be better off using a good amount of power like 80-100 WPC or so or at lpud volumes a lower power tube amp can clip.
You may also want to look at CAT amps even though VAC is a good choice too. Von Schweikert uses VAC to demo his speakers and the combo kicks butts. Both should be in your price range. |
Who said the VTLs rolled from the top?
Don't make me laugh...... |
Though I went from VTL 250's to Atma-Sphere MA-1 MkIII's, it wasn't because I thought the VTL's were rolled off or that they had any other serious flaws for that matter. I just decided it was time for a change and wanted to try something different.
Actually, I thoroughly enjoyed the VTL's for over six years, they were trouble free and I could happily go back to them. I'm sure my friend who went from the 450's to the VAC Phi 300.1's would say the same thing.
On the other hand, both the 250's and 450's are outclassed when compared to either the MA-1's or the VAC's as they well should be considering the large price differences. |
Thank you all for the great info. I am actively looking and studying my options. I love the passion but let’s all stay cool guys. |
I second CAT. The JL2 used will fit your price range.
While I'm partial to CAT, as others have mentioned, VTL, and Atma-Sphere are other great choices. |
McIntosh Tubes are an excellent choice though more expensive than comparable amps (with better re-sale too)... especially for rock music...they are not overly revealing of flaws, excellent bass and excellent highs, they play loud ...the MC2102 is an awesome amp...2 of them will work even better. |
Kronzilla with VSA VR-11s |
I know this will make people's eyes roll but I will my amplifier selections to toss into the mix here are:
Jolida JD-502P
I'm really enjoying this amp with my gear. I've used 6550/KT88 type power tubes to even the Tung Sol KT-120 tubes in it and the music in my system was wonderful.
Another favorite that may not be made anymore is the Response Audio Bella Extreme 60 monoblocks. These use 2 6C33C power tubes and 5 6SN7 tubes in each monoblock.
Wonderful sounding even with a solid state preamp in the mix. The only issue I had is sourcing quality 6C33C power tubes. |
I think pairing most any tube amp with the right speakers will more determine "kick ass" potential than anything inherent with any particular tube amp.
I notice a pattern with tube amps that people, even vendors, get carried away with demonstrating how little SET amp tube power is needed to drive high efficiency speakers just to make a point about low power tube amps and high efficiency speakers.
Its true a set amp can go a long way with high efficiency speakers, but I think they are only capable of being "kick ass" with the absolute highest efficiency and largest horns, 100db efficient or more. At least that is what I am hearing with various set tube amp demos to date.
The thing that tubes share with SS amps is that more tube power rather than less, though to a lesser extent,is needed to get most speakers to "kick ass" on the types of music that rely on power and dynamics to truly hit home. Pop rock and even metal, big band, large scale classical works, etc. are all good examples. Recordings of smaller mostly acoustic ensembles might get by with less, though if there is drums/percussion involved, not so much. |
All I can say is I NEVER heard a Cary or Jolida amp that I would consider as "kick ass". And FORGET the V12 it doesn't do it, they just don't have the speed or reach the nether regions. These are midrange amps. I also agree that first off, don't buy more power than you need. The speaker load will determine that. The CAT's (JL2 used) kick ass and offer ultimate refinement and will probably work on almost anything and this thread is 4 years old so I sure hope the OP found what he is looking for by now!
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Want good all around and good bass? Cary CAD 120's with Gold Lions. You must also have a good preamp too. |
This OP started in 2009, and now 2013 :)
You gotta try the Carver 180 or 305 - kick ass tube amp.
I used to own Cary 120S, old AS MA1- now the Carver 180 with KT120 tubes. Very powerful tube amp and very sweet sounding |
Just got my VAC 450 monos back from Florida after having an on-rush circuit as well as auto-bias circuitry installed in each amp, plus a few more tweaks that remain confidential to VAC.
After only a day, I now have startlingly realistic sound, unlike anything I have heard anywhere. Tight, commanding bass, extended sweet highs, great imaging, PRAT, etc., etc. Best bass I've ever heard from a tube amp anywhere, as well as the legendary VAC mid-range, with imaging and musicality to spare. Definitely get my vote in the tube "kick-ass" category. |
I heard a system once with DCS source, VTL pre-amp, and hefty VAC amps driving Magico mini speakers in a smaller dealer demo room. THis combo was uniquely striking and reference quality in particular in its ability to deliver orchestral strings from standard CD in an exceptionally realistic sounding manner. So it "kicked ass" in that particular way, and was no slouch otherwise as well. The VAC monoblock amps were particularly striking aesthetically as well. Dealer mentioned some kind of automatic tube bias system in the VAC gear. DOn't know the details of how that worked, but it was working quite well that particular day. |
Fplanner2000 - VAC rules the roost for me. I've never heard anything better - including ARC, Mc, VTL and numerous others. I'm saving for a pair of VAC phi200's. |
Add me to the recommendations for VAC amps. I have a Phi 200 and have barely had it break a sweat in my small room driving Nola Micro References, which are not a particularly easy load. It has all the power and bass control you could ask for, while still being one of the most realistic and musically involving amplifiers I've ever heard (ranking up there with Jadis and Lamm in that respect). The monos would be even better, if your room is large. |
check out Jolida's fusion monoblocks at 200wpc. seems like some serious tube amp. and you could get both for about 5k.
buy both at the same time. see posequipmentsales.com.
brian will be very helpful. just a suggestion. |
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