To Stream or not to Stream

OP what flavor?

@lalitk The only thing that makes me balk at the ACS100 is what Aurender's site says about it:

best sound quality is achieved when using an N100H, N100C, N100SC, N10, A100, A10, A30 or W20SE Aurender music server / streamer as the main player

They pretty much say the same about the ACS10:

However, the highest audio performance is realized when using the ACS10 mated with models A10, N10 or W20

...which I'm just reading now. This is what I mean by paralysis. Just when I'm about ready to make a purchase another detail derails me. In writing, Aurender is admitting you will not get the best sound unless you pair it with one of their dedicated streamers. Seriously wtf? Transparency is nice, but now off to a deeper dive on the competition. There must be at least one offering that covers all bases? If the only way to achieve this is to spend far north of my target...ugh. This quest was fun up until now. It is far from straight forward.

I need a Baskin-Robbins...

@izjjzi,

I would go with ACS100, being a newer product; it has all the latest enhancements. Having an isolated power supply is huge plus, IMO. Having owned N100H, N10 and N20, I can say confidently that ACS100 doesn’t short change you in SQ. And you can have upto 8TB of storage in ACS100.

As far as ripping goes, I have yet to come across any errors in reading discs. If the disc is unreadable, the ACS100 will spit out the disc (like it does for single layer SACD’s).

As far as experiencing the best quality, it’s very subjective in my opinion and largely depends on the DAC and rest of components in the signal chain.

@lalitk Very helpful. Advice and further reading keep bringing me back to Aurender. I would love the ACS10. There are two being offered here, but besides storage capacity, is there a difference in sound? If yes, I may spend more than I want and go with the 10 over 100. The ACS is in my top 5, especially if I want to rip the 200 or so CDs I haven’t used since the 90’s.

Side question - how do modern rippers deal with scratched discs? Do they report ripping issues / artifacts? Would be sweet to learn that they do, so I don’t discover such things through listening.

As for the McIntosh DA2... there is so little out there. I guess I’ll have to hear it. If other DA2 users went with alternatives after giving the DA2 a chance, I would love to hear about it.

I will be going to Qobuz. My Tidal Masters trial will be up soon. I was only worried about DSD because the McIntosh literature speaks to supporting it. I want to experience the "best" quality the DA2 supports and have that as my base for as you said, exploring other DACs in the future.

@surfcat I do like what I’ve seen online for the Roon and Conductor UIs. I agree that when going the digital route that software is important. I can’t believe how many new artists I’ve discovered from recent AB’ing at local shops using these apps. Discovery is one of the things I’m looking forward to the most! Thank you so much for the suggestions. Such suggestions are welcome and have joined my growing list of tracks to listen to once my system is ready.

@millercarbon @jjss49 @cleeds Thank you for the legit LOLs.

@izjjzi 

No, you're not alone. I was behind a guy like you once at Baskin-Robbins.

lmao!!  👏👏👏👏

izjjzi OP21 posts07-27-2021 9:36am

I am paralyzed. There are so many options, reviews, recommendations... I am truly frozen, unable to choose. Wish it were easy ... I think I've already researched too much and will always be second guessing ... I need a break... two nights of restless sleep ... I suspect I'm not alone experiencing this type of paralysis?

No, you're not alone. I was behind a guy like you once at Baskin-Robbins.

Get Roon and Tidal, maybe Qobuz for the odd thing that's not on Tidal.  You music collection suddenly becomes almost everything you can think of or even hear about.  Yes, there are a few exceptions that aren't yet on those two... very few.  Sound quality is very high and realistically gonna take a hell of a system to expose the difference.  And remember, listening is not about endless A/B testing, it's about listening to music.  Roon let's one explore stuff they'd never think to buy are are surprisingly good.  Samantha Fish.  And have you ever seriously listened to Miley's voice?  Pretty souful stuff, tho in no way my kind of music.  Or Sunday morning with Chopin's Nocturnes.  And the bass player in Bela Fleck is absolutely unbelievable.  If we're gonna be stuck living in the future we might as well take advantage of it.  And I do wish Hegel would finally get through the Roon cert process so I can ditch the old PC that's currently functioning as my Roon core.

Don’t make it so hard.  It isn’t.  Just do it.  A good quality DAC is the key. 

@izjjzi,

Been in your shoes, don’t give up. If I may suggest, buy Aurender ACS100. IMO, it is lot more versatile than N100, within your budget and offers much better SQ (over N100) due to its isolated UPS power supply. The conductor app is way superior than Bluesound iOS app. Use it with your DA2 DAC for now and down the road audition different DAC’s. The ACS100 will give you a solid foundation and state of the art file management.

1. Your CD rips may sound better vs streaming files and vice versa. I have retained about 300 cd rips (out of 800) that are rare and sound better to my ears.

2. McIntosh expertise is in analog, their digital gear is serviceable at best. Only you can decide what’s sound best to your ear by trying different DAC’s from another manufacturer.

3-5. I wouldn’t worry too much about DSD, Qobuz high resolution streaming is pretty good. DSD is currently only available as downloads or rips from SACD’s. You may download a DSD file from Nativedsd.com to see if it sounds audibly better in your system. Personally I do appreciate the DSD (64, 128 and 256) files, in my system as they sound way superior than CD rips or streaming.

6. Roon Nucleus - No direct experience.

https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/9445

Hope this helps!

I am paralyzed. There are so many options, reviews, recommendations... I am truly frozen, unable to choose. Wish it were easy to try things at home before you buy, and by try I mean AB. I'm sure anything I select in this range will sound nice because there is nothing to compare it to.

Unless it is streaming through my integrated and Focals, I will have no idea what it will really sound like until it's home. My answer could be to not compare, get something and never know the difference, but again, what is that one something? I think I've already researched too much and will always be second guessing unless I've heard 'em all... ugh.  

I need a break... two nights of restless sleep with every model and review looping in my head. I suspect I'm not alone experiencing this type of paralysis?

Listening to CDs from a streaming service works for most people, but it does put you at the mercy of the quality of the streaming service, your router, your ISP (many have throttled bandwidth during the pandemic, with everyone Zooming, streaming movies at home, etc), and finally, the ability of your streamer to connect and play with all of the above.  There is a lot to be said for putting the CD in the transport and hitting play.
  Assuming your must be the bees knees because it says McIntosh on the faceplate is like assuming that all Cadillacs must be great cars.
   How much DSD content do you plan to purchase?  Do streaming services such as Tidal even stream in DSD?  And as someone else up thread implied, you need a pretty highly resolving system (I.e., probably past your budget) to really appreciate it.
fwiw, I play the DSD layer of my SACDs via HDMI using my Oppo 105, which can output the DSD layer over HDMI, into my Bryston DAC3, which has HDMI inputs, but it’s DSD 64.  I was able to stream 1 recording of an SACD that I owned over usb at DSD 128 and heard no difference.

i thought i mistakenly logged into a urology forum

We are streaming experts We sell a lot of dacs and streamers

Good servers make a very noticable improvement in sound quality

We sell bluesound, lumin, roon and the amazing sounding 432EVO servers from belgium

In the past We have sold innous sotm, naim and aurrender
Dave and troy
AUDIO INTELLECT NJ

Yeah. Why don't you cross that stream when you come to it?

Why not start cheap and see if you like it?
There are multiple choices with USB out <$1K.

1. Ripped CDs usually sound better to most than streamed Redbook, starting with the noise floor.
4. DSD is only available from ripped SACDs. 
6. DSD512? A betting man banks on you not being able to ID it blind without <$50K in cables.