Do they have similar effects placed under pre-amp or sources?
Stillpoints Ultra6 reference vibration controlers?
Category: Amplifiers
I started to work in audio in july 1998. I remember that the first day I started I had a blocknote with me. I started in room 1 of the loudspeakers. Here it all started to write down properties of each individual tool. For a long time I was addicted to audio. I was busy with audio for 80 hours a week. It was never enough for me.
Almost 17 years later I have done thousands of tests in audio. From the mid level till highend. I became aware that I could judge and understand audio a lot more easy than all my collegues. But I never understood why. Untill in 2012 I became aware that I have a photographic memory in sound. I trained this part of my brain for a long time. Every single audition I can recall. So a second audition I see in front of me and the first one is on the left side. Within a few tenths of a second I know already the difference between them.
When you are aware of all the properties of each individual 'tool' you will see and understand the patterns between them. And you will understand the connections between them. This means you understand how the stage and overall sound has been created. I can see 3-4 steps further than other people in audio can.
I judge every single tool on what I call Total Sound. Total Sound is like a blue print of the original sound. When I audition sets from 'new' clients, at shows or at another audio shop in almost all situations it is what I call 'incomplete'.
In most 'new' sets I need to bring in parts of Total Sound to make it complete. At the end it is so much more addictive to listen to any set I 'repaired'.
Parts of Total Sound:
- Soundrealism: you want and need an instrument to sound like
in real. I use Pass labs amps to the max for this. It is the
focus on sound of each different instrument and voice. For
example: you want to hear the difference between 2 acoustic
guitars of a recording. I always want to hear the full
pallet in the mid freq. The timbre is an essential part
of listening to music
- 3 dimensional soundstage: this is the most exiting part of
audio in general. This sets your beloved music in full 3D
in front of you. During listening you can focus on each
individual part of a recording.
- Intimate sound: instruments and voices are very small in
dimension and very direct in sound. You want a realistic
proportion of instruments and voices. Intimate sound has
a very big influence on our emotion.
- Blacks: The space between the instruments and voices with
their acoustic information during the recording. This is
level of physical appearance. You want to touch every single
instrument and voice of the recording. Germans use the word
'darstellung'.
- timing and speed: it is a very important part for authority
and control of the overall sound. Better timing will give
you less acoustic limitaions. But also a more natural sound.
Biside this you also can reveal more layers of the low freq.
- Resolution: you want to hear all details of the recording.
And it needs to be physical apparent.
- Air: This part gives the instruments and voices the freedom
during listening. Separation makes your music so much more
appealing.
- A big freq. response: When your system goes deeper in freq.
response you will hear more information of a recoding. This
also has a big influence on our emotion. People can hear
till maximum 20 khz. But...the freq. response above it
influences our brains.
- articulation of voices: how clear you can hear word
endings, breathing of singers and moving lips.
- heights: When I received 2 sets of the Audioquest Wel
Signature xlr's it became more clear than ever. It makes
listening to music different and even more appealing.
I wanted to tell this information first before I start with the review of the Ultra 6. Because it makes it much more easy to understand how I work. By using tools for their properties you always will reach a superior endresult in sound. For a perfectionist like me you always go to the max. There is no room for error.
When you have done thousands of tests like me, you are aware of how important and unique the working of Stillpoints are in your set. I am a stillpoint dealer and use many of them in my set. They are an 'essential' part for the absolute sound. Why? Because they can add 'new' qualities I could not create with other tools.
At this moment we speak I do a lot of research with new tools and systems. I call it creating a new 'statement' in sound. Because I want to reach a higher endresult than ever before regardless price in audio. It is a higher level of accuracy and realism than before.
Without Stillpoints I would not be there were I am at this moment. When you compare the Ultra 6 against the other Stillpoints you know how much better they are.
I put them under my Pass labs X350.5. They operate in a different league. They even bring your set into a new zone. Like it puts your set into pause and it sets your music free. Your stage becomes wider and deeper and you get more air around all instruments and voices.
The mid freq. becomes more involving than before. Also the authority and control of the mid freq. is more precise.
When you compare amps or sources which have a huge difference in price ( 2000 dollar against 10.000 dollar+) you will never have this difference in timing the Ultra 6 gives to you. It is mindblowing in what it does with the speed and timing. It becomes so much more accurate and refined.
I noticed that the sound of a piano and cello becomes so much more natural sounding.
In the high freq. you will reveal more details. And again the control and authority in the high freq. gets to a much higher level.
The low freq. go deeper than before with a much higher level of authority again. You hear more layers but beside this the natural sound of a bass drum has never sounded this 'real'.
I am the first person who bought then in the Netherlands. And I am thrilled to own them. They are a crucial part of my set. They will have an important part for me to be able to create a new 'statement'in sound.
When you ask me the question; are they expensive? You know they are even rather cheap for the quality and level they bring. I'll love them till death!
Sound&Vision Consulting 16-2-2015
I started to work in audio in july 1998. I remember that the first day I started I had a blocknote with me. I started in room 1 of the loudspeakers. Here it all started to write down properties of each individual tool. For a long time I was addicted to audio. I was busy with audio for 80 hours a week. It was never enough for me.
Almost 17 years later I have done thousands of tests in audio. From the mid level till highend. I became aware that I could judge and understand audio a lot more easy than all my collegues. But I never understood why. Untill in 2012 I became aware that I have a photographic memory in sound. I trained this part of my brain for a long time. Every single audition I can recall. So a second audition I see in front of me and the first one is on the left side. Within a few tenths of a second I know already the difference between them.
When you are aware of all the properties of each individual 'tool' you will see and understand the patterns between them. And you will understand the connections between them. This means you understand how the stage and overall sound has been created. I can see 3-4 steps further than other people in audio can.
I judge every single tool on what I call Total Sound. Total Sound is like a blue print of the original sound. When I audition sets from 'new' clients, at shows or at another audio shop in almost all situations it is what I call 'incomplete'.
In most 'new' sets I need to bring in parts of Total Sound to make it complete. At the end it is so much more addictive to listen to any set I 'repaired'.
Parts of Total Sound:
- Soundrealism: you want and need an instrument to sound like
in real. I use Pass labs amps to the max for this. It is the
focus on sound of each different instrument and voice. For
example: you want to hear the difference between 2 acoustic
guitars of a recording. I always want to hear the full
pallet in the mid freq. The timbre is an essential part
of listening to music
- 3 dimensional soundstage: this is the most exiting part of
audio in general. This sets your beloved music in full 3D
in front of you. During listening you can focus on each
individual part of a recording.
- Intimate sound: instruments and voices are very small in
dimension and very direct in sound. You want a realistic
proportion of instruments and voices. Intimate sound has
a very big influence on our emotion.
- Blacks: The space between the instruments and voices with
their acoustic information during the recording. This is
level of physical appearance. You want to touch every single
instrument and voice of the recording. Germans use the word
'darstellung'.
- timing and speed: it is a very important part for authority
and control of the overall sound. Better timing will give
you less acoustic limitaions. But also a more natural sound.
Biside this you also can reveal more layers of the low freq.
- Resolution: you want to hear all details of the recording.
And it needs to be physical apparent.
- Air: This part gives the instruments and voices the freedom
during listening. Separation makes your music so much more
appealing.
- A big freq. response: When your system goes deeper in freq.
response you will hear more information of a recoding. This
also has a big influence on our emotion. People can hear
till maximum 20 khz. But...the freq. response above it
influences our brains.
- articulation of voices: how clear you can hear word
endings, breathing of singers and moving lips.
- heights: When I received 2 sets of the Audioquest Wel
Signature xlr's it became more clear than ever. It makes
listening to music different and even more appealing.
I wanted to tell this information first before I start with the review of the Ultra 6. Because it makes it much more easy to understand how I work. By using tools for their properties you always will reach a superior endresult in sound. For a perfectionist like me you always go to the max. There is no room for error.
When you have done thousands of tests like me, you are aware of how important and unique the working of Stillpoints are in your set. I am a stillpoint dealer and use many of them in my set. They are an 'essential' part for the absolute sound. Why? Because they can add 'new' qualities I could not create with other tools.
At this moment we speak I do a lot of research with new tools and systems. I call it creating a new 'statement' in sound. Because I want to reach a higher endresult than ever before regardless price in audio. It is a higher level of accuracy and realism than before.
Without Stillpoints I would not be there were I am at this moment. When you compare the Ultra 6 against the other Stillpoints you know how much better they are.
I put them under my Pass labs X350.5. They operate in a different league. They even bring your set into a new zone. Like it puts your set into pause and it sets your music free. Your stage becomes wider and deeper and you get more air around all instruments and voices.
The mid freq. becomes more involving than before. Also the authority and control of the mid freq. is more precise.
When you compare amps or sources which have a huge difference in price ( 2000 dollar against 10.000 dollar+) you will never have this difference in timing the Ultra 6 gives to you. It is mindblowing in what it does with the speed and timing. It becomes so much more accurate and refined.
I noticed that the sound of a piano and cello becomes so much more natural sounding.
In the high freq. you will reveal more details. And again the control and authority in the high freq. gets to a much higher level.
The low freq. go deeper than before with a much higher level of authority again. You hear more layers but beside this the natural sound of a bass drum has never sounded this 'real'.
I am the first person who bought then in the Netherlands. And I am thrilled to own them. They are a crucial part of my set. They will have an important part for me to be able to create a new 'statement'in sound.
When you ask me the question; are they expensive? You know they are even rather cheap for the quality and level they bring. I'll love them till death!
Sound&Vision Consulting 16-2-2015
90 responses Add your response
Hello how are you one palcer, I live in Argentina and I am known orionpc, he put the debate that amp is better for Wilson Sasha, I tell you as I see you got doubts the line 8 of Pass Labs, in my opinion are a great step forward against the line .5 at all, much more fluid sound, enhanced bass, treble sweeter, less noise, resulting in much better stereo image with better recreation of instrumentalities !! I have extensive experience in pass Labs , XA-30.8, and sold three units, and all customers !! fascinated, I also sold about 8 months ago an X-350.8, with speakers B & W 802Diamond, and the truth is that the result was magnificent !!! much higher old X-350 speakers use !! Tell me that, and I give my opinion !! also I really liked your review of Purist powercord Limited Edition, this marac sell it more than 12 years ago in Argentina and the LE, is the cable I use in my Esoteric K-01X, in my pre Pass Labs XP-30, also concidero that is sensational !! I recently bought the powers Pass Labs XA-160.8, and the truth is that are incredible !!! Maybe I pass my system! These replaced a Krell CX-700, which I still !! also excellent !!! Best Regards Adrian Molina |
Good story Adrian, I also use Furutech for electricity from the wall input. But the Oyaide M1/F1 are superior to the FI50/51 wich I also owned. As a perfectionist only the best counts. I love to test and compare. When there is a new reference I will but it. Í am addicted to music and sound. This is why I love to test and create a higher endresult in sound. This proces never stops. I love it till dead!! |
bo1972, Just stumbled on the 3D vs 2D concept. I've always wondered what was wrong with my hearing because I could never "hear" much depth in sound stage over maybe 4 feet behind my speakers. I have Monitor Audio RX-6. You say Onkyo is a good brand with my speakers. I've always heard a dedicated stereo amp is better than an AVR for music. You've recommended the TX-NR929 and TX-NR3010 which are AVR's. Does Onkyo have stereo amps (integrated) that meet your 3D approval? Would a vintage Onkyo (5 - 10 years old) be worth buying? |
With Audyssey they way we work we can outperfrom any stereo amp. Stereo without our way of measuring is inferior. I could not hear to stereo without it. Even the highend sets of 300.000 dollar irritates me directly. It has to do with timing. Old school audio is difficult to create a stunning sound without any limitation. I work by Tru-Fi. These are 8 parameters you judge sound for. With old school audio is is a lot more difficult to get all those 8 parts you judge Tru-Fi for. I have proven that I even can outperform the Marantz PM11S3 in stereo mode with an Onkyo TX-NR3010 with S.A.P. measurement. It only can be achieved with my knowledge. For customers this is fully useless. |
I have proven that I can create a much higher endresult out of any system regardsless money. This counts only for my clients. I can think and work in properties. Because I work by Tru-Fi. All other people work by Trial and Error. This means you are only able to listen to the endresult and do changements on this. This is a very ineffective way of doing audio. I do this since I was 6 years old. This is not my work, but a part of who I am as a person. I can outperform any company in audio in the world at any level. First of all I have a photographic memory in sound. You cannot copy this. This is what you need to work by Tru-Fi. And second I can hear patterns in sound and I understand why the sound and stage is what you hear. I also work with the best lasers in the world. No floor or wall is fully straight. Beside this the acoustics always will influence the sound the most. That is why I did hundreds of tests in acoustics in about 6 years of time. https://www.facebook.com/bobby.kingma/media_set?set=a.10156554423700083.1073741937.588405082&typ... https://www.facebook.com/bobby.kingma/media_set?set=a.10156573228780083.1073741942.588405082&typ... goodluck |
Most things you can’t even see. I only show a few things. There are many important things we do we never will make any photos of it. We will try to do something with it. Because I have proven many times that I do not have any competition. I make progress sometimes every week. It is my goal to become the best in sound&vison in the world. I will proof it by sound. Because the best and most convincing sound always will win. This outperforms any other quality in sound. Because it owns so mcuh more emotion and details. I met a person who is a marketing specialist, he will sell my knowledge. This way I can give many people in the world a much higher level of sound. I can educate people so it will be available for more people. This is still one of my goals.But I will not give it away for free. I even think I can bring live music soon to a much higher level as well. I did some test what showed that I can use it in many situations. In surround I can outperform very easily anything what is on the market. We also have plans to bring cinemas to a higher level as well. Because my way of measuring is superior to the Audyssey way. I can see 3-4 steps further ( deeper) in sound than other people can. I see patterns most people don’t hear. Audio is for me often very easy to understand. What is difficult for me is that other people who work in audio are like children in audio. When I am at a show, shop or new client the list of mistakes is always big. For me it is simple like one and one is two which mistakes they make. These days I even work at half mm. precision. And no there is no other person who comes even close. Because in everything I do I want to do it 100 times better than the best one does. This is how I was born. In clothes it is the same. I have it in my head. My clothes are made in italy by hand based on how I see it in my head. Perfectionism is in your system. It guides you to a level most people not even can think of. Soon I will be in the US as well. Many overhere thought I was making a joke. But I will be there and proof it by sound. Then there is no person anymore who can deny it. Sound is all about the truth. That is why my sound is Tru-Fi! |
This is not my area, I have a marketing person for it now. The fact is that the difference in sound quality is on each part you judge sound for galaxies away. We are now discussing how we will sell it. In about 2 months our website will be ready. This will be a totally different approach in sound&vision. I can promise you that it is a new an higher level what is available at this moment. We also will start making a videoblog about sound&vision. I do capture all data of each set I sell. For many years I photographed everything I did. It is my goal to bring many people as possible to a new and much higher level in sound and realism. Audio by trial and error only can give people a very limited level in sound quality. Based on trial and error you always will miss essential parts in sound for the absolute sound. |
bo1972 ... I have proven many times that I do not have any competition ... In surround I can outperform very easily anything what is on the market ... I can see 3-4 steps further ( deeper) in sound than other people can. I see patterns most people don’t hear. Audio is for me often very easy to understand. What is difficult for me is that other people who work in audio are like children in audioBo, I can only imagine the suffering you endure. After all, you possess supernatural abilities and extraordinary knowledge and wisdom, yet must suffer the "children" and fools who populate the world of audio. Best of luck to you. |
The best sound in audio wil be chosen by each person. When you work by Tru-Fi, you are able to create a much higher level in emotion. We are emotional human beings, we prefer the sound what creates the most emotional feeling. Tru-Fi is how music sounds in real. There are so many things what influence the sound before it reaches your speakers. When you test each part of a set after time you will understand how you can improve it. And how limitations in sound can be solved. When you visit an audio shos in most situations the results are limited. They always blame the room. I don't have this problem anymore. This gives a huge advantage over any other company. Even the companies who create acoustic pannels work by absorbing frequencies. This means less information. With S.A.P. you solve the acoustic limitations but you will keep much more details and information of the music and movies you play. Shootouts against highend pre amps like the Pass labs XP-20 and Audioresearch Ref 5SE showed how much informattion they loose in the low, mid and high frequencies. These differences are huge and unacceptable!! |
"Even the companies who create acoustic pannels work by absorbing frequencies. This means less information." Actually that’s not really true, well, it could be true if one was all thumbs and put the panels in the wrong place, but ordinarily the panels absorb *unwanted* sound, e.g., echoes or first or second reflections or standing waves. Acoustic effects that interfere with the primary signal. That means more information, not less information. Comb filter effects are not a good thing under any circumstances. Same goes for resonators like those cute tiny bowl acoustic resonators. They could hurt the sound if put in the wrong place but when used as directed there is more information, not less. |
I visited several people with highend sets who also spend a lot of money on acoustic pannels. They still were not satisfied and still had a lot of acoustic limitations. S.A.P. is first of all much more effective. Beside this is is a lot cheaper. Many acoustic pannels are not the best looking. Maybe they are a lot better looking than 10 years ago. But they are still not that pretty. Beside the acoustics there are so many parts where you loose quality. At the end people are only able to get a very low % out of the capability of a speaker. The knowledge in acoustics is very poor for most people who work in audio. The same you see about electricity and smog. I work togheter with companies who are speciallized in these things. I did a lot of research and testing with different tools regarding electricity and also smog. And you create a lot of improvement in these areas even for low prices. We also do a lot of modifications to amps and sources and again the improvements are huge for reasonable prices. You are not able to create a higher level by spending the same amounts on new speakers, amps, sources or cables. I still love to test and always looking for new improvements. As a perfectionist you are only interested in creating the best results for the lowest prices. We want to create improvements for the best prices. So we can give all our clients the maximum for their money. The biggest limitation in audio is trial and error. Each set created by trial and error tested by Tru-Fi is always incomplete. And I can explain to these people what is missing. And I never heard any one to dissagree. Tru-Fi works by parameters you judge sound for. It has nothing to do with taste. But is based on essential parts which need to be there for the absolute sound. That is why I want audio/highend to work by parameters. Because now audio is a free world with a lot of bullshit and it is based on nothing. |
The thing is that you cannot copy me. I can explain this very easily. When you are not able to think and work in properties, you will never understand why the sound and stage is what you hear. Each part in your set including the acoustics influences the stage and sound what comes out of your speakers. It even does not make sense to use the same brands and stuff I use. In the past I have many examples for this. When I left a company, it stopped selling Platinum loudspeakers. It is the way how I use all the parts. This is information I will never explain. I use many new products and I use them all a special way. I have proven that I can create about 300% more quality than other companies for exactly the same money. You cannot copy my brains and insight. It is important to see the patterns in each room and situation. It will be different based on the room and also the components. The biggest limitation in audio is that by far the most products are 2 dimensional. This means their d.n.a. is not able to create more than 1 metre of depth. The d.n.a. alway will be the limitation. This cannot be changed. This is why over 99% of all the sets in the world are 2D. We only sell and create 3D sound. S.A.P. is an importnt part for our quality and sound. But without understanding the d.n.a. of each part in a set it is a lot less effective. The older Onkyo is the only stuff I know for normal prices what is able to create depth. You will go higher in prices to find it in other brands. When you judge speakers on stage depth and width you will hear that most speakers are 2 dimensional. This means they are only able to create more than 1 metre of depth maximum. When you want a 3D stage, you need an amp, source, speakers and even cables who are good in creating it. Each part of your set needs to own the d.n.a. of creating a deep and wide stage. When you are not able to think and work by Tru-Fi you will not understand the d.n.a. of each part in your set. So you need me! |
You need to make it as easy as possible. I sell by shootout. And Stillpoints are sold by shootout as well. It is very easy to let people hear the differences between the old situation and the new situation with Stillpoints. Will they be a succes in every situation? No that is why you need to test it first. In most situations they make a clear improvement. Audio needs to be open and transparent as possible. So monitoring is essential in each part you test and compare. Innovation and testing is the most fun part in audio. These days we have much more tools to use. And yessss most tools are useless. That is why we test all the time to find those products who are the best. In my world audio depends not on brands but on the quality it owns at the moment we live. When later another product will be better, this will become the new standard. I don't care about a name, I care more about the quality. Different Stllpoints have proven in many situations how effective they are. And this is what matters most. |
bo1972
I have proven that I can create about 300% more quality than other companies for exactly the same money.I haven't seen that proof posted here. And I don't think it's possible to measure sound improvements in terms of percentage of total quality. I sell by shootout. I think that's the worst possible way to choose an audio component. I want to be able to evaluate a component over time, not be pressured into a snap decision in a "shootout" scenario. |
I will try to explain each part. S.A.P. creates so much more precision what is never possible with 'old school' audio. The acoustic influences each set. Most sets are used in a living room. I have proven that the way I measure you get a much better timing in the low freq. Beside it is more controlled you will hear more layers. The precision of a subwoofer reaches a new and much higher level of integration. When you play a cello you can feel the energy in the middle. When we compare stereo with and without a subwoofer, the resulls are superior when we use a subwoofer. Without it we go to a lower level in sound. The diversity in the middle freq. are much bigger. You can easily hear more different information in voices during listening. You can hear the vibration in voices. When we auditioned the same music with the Pass Labs XP-20 and Audioresearch Ref 5SE, the diversity of the vibration was gone. Even breathing and moving lips could be heard with the S.A.P. measuement. With highend pre amps these details were gone. We were using one of the best cables in the world ( Audioquest Wel Signature latest version 2 sets and 4 pieces of Purist Audio Limited Edition powercables) for the different pre amps. When you collect a system based on properties, you are able to use more different properties in each set. It make each set more complete and more attractive. S.A.P. brings the physical appearance of voices and instruments to a much higher level of realism. Each system I audition I can directly explain what is missing. Working by Tru-Fi makes it very easy to understand what is missing. I use different songs to test each part of Tru-Fi. I use them to explain it to other people. You want to make it as easy as possible to understand it for each person. When I ask people who work in audio for many years as I do the simple question? Which properties do you take out and which do you put in when you change this speaker for this speaker? They all gave the same answer: we don't know. So I said: then you are not aware why the sound and stage is what we hear now? They said: I think you are right. So I said; it is not important if I am right, you need to understand that the way you build an audio system is based on loose sand. This way audio always will be a big guess. That is why al sets I audition are incomplete. They always miss different parts of Tru-Fi. |
Bo1972 "I met a person who is a marketing specialist, he will sell my knowledge. This way I can give many people in the world a much higher level of sound. I can educate people so it will be available for more people. This is still one of my goals.But I will not give it away for free." I am not attempting to copy your methods. I understand you being guarded in sharing the information it's taken you a long time and lots of hard work to discover. I'm only asking which brands you've found capable of producing the 3D sound? You say most components have 2D in their DNA and can't produce 3D sound. So could you share which ones ARE worth buying? Do you sell these products over the internet? Bo1972 "We also do a lot of modifications to amps and sources and again the improvements are huge for reasonable prices. You are not able to create a higher level by spending the same amounts on new speakers, amps, sources or cables." Do you have a business (brick and mortar) building where you do these modifications? What do you charge? Can a person send their source to you for these modifications? Bo1972 "We are now discussing how we will sell it. In about 2 months our website will be ready. This will be a totally different approach in sound&vision. I can promise you that it is a new an higher level what is available at this moment. We also will start making a videoblog about sound&vision." Looking forward to it! |
I did run an audio shop from 2007-2009. I had a nice and big room for demos. I always had a 2 dimensional system playing and also a 3 dimensional system. This gave me the perfect information how men and women react on 2D vs 3D. They all choose for 3D sound. This made me decide never to sell any kind of 2 dimensional sound anymore. In the lasy 7 years I brought many people from 2D to 3D sound. And their reactions and they way they use their sets says it all. They often use the word; addictive and they all used their set so much more than ever before. Beside the physical 3 dimensional stage I spend a lot of time in creating more diversity in the middle frequencies. This is the most important part during listening to music. People can experience the most different emotions in this part. When you work by Tru-Fi, you focus on emotion. Because each part of Tru-Fi influences our emotion. I am addicted to music. I spend many hours listening to new music each week. I buy a lot of new music each month. Hi-Res recordings bring music to a higher level of realism. I am a Lumin dealer. And my S1 gives me music at the highest level you can experience. We also will modify Lumin networkplayers. We always go to the max. We want to improve sound each week. I am addicted to music and sound since I was a child. New systems, higher level of audio components and higher level of recordings creates new levels in sound quality. Togheter they give us the options to create a new statement in sound. |
I don't listen to much networked music but I have bought several high resolution CD's from HDtracks. I have about 60 vinyl LP's. Some I've bought as CD's over the years, the rest have been converted to FLAC files on my computer using Audacity. I also own a ton of CD's. Do you recommend or sell any integrated amps that meet your standards for producing 3D sound? |
I believe when S.A.P. will be used all over the world, audio will get to a much higher level. Because you loose so much quality based on the acoustics You can spend a lot of money on audio, it still doesn’t make sence. To be honest I don’t believe in stereo and surround without S.A.P. Because you go back to an inferior level of quality. You always will be limited by faults. Another example: I have spoken to many people who have spend a lot of money on audio for a very long period of time ( some even over 30 years of time) and still were hoping to find the sound they were looking for. Any kind of 2D sound will never be attractive for any human being. Because the distance between you and the music is too big for the level of emotion you need and would like to have. This is why people sell there stuff or look for a new part in their set to get a better sound. When you go from 2D to 3D you are pulled into the music. It brings you closer to the music. This makes it a lot more emotional and involving. This is why these people use their set so much more often and also for a longer period at the same time. Music and movies as well is all about emotion. That is why you need to experience them with all the emotion the music or movie owns. |
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It depends in which price league you are looking. The funny thing is that they delete my post when I tell the truth. The truth in audio is rather hard. Audiogon lives by advertising. I understand that, they don’t want you to write things what will be negative about some brands. I don’t believe in any 2 dimensional audio. But most brands are 2 dimensional. These are facts, and they count most. This is something I cannot change. I have talked to many people who told me that they always were looking for the sound they hoped to find. And when I talked to these people I found out that all the sets they owned were 2 dimensional. It is a fact that any kind of 2 dimensional audio will be after time not that interesting anymore for people. This is based on our emotion. Because when you own a 2 dimensional system the distance between you and your music is too big. It is not able to create enough emotion to be liked for a long period. This is why people try to look for new parts in their set. I have proven that only when people go from 2 dimensional to 3 dimensional audio they will use their set a lot more. And also for a longer period at the same time. And again this is based on the emotion of us human beings. When you own a 3 dimensional system you are pulled into the music. This brings you closer to the music. It will become a more intens and emotional experience. Most brands and also series of loudspeakers do not own crossovers and the d.n.a. to build a deep and wide stage. These are the essential parts to be able to create a 3 dimensional stage. Even when you would own a speaker who is able to build a deep and deep stage. You still need an amp and source how also own the properties to build a deep and wide stage. In 18 years of time I have tested many many amps, sources, cables and other parts to find out what the d.n.a. is. But it takes a lot of time to be able to think and work in properties. I started to work in audio in 1998. I worked for about 40 hours a week. Beside my work time I spend about 40 hours on testing each week. I was addicted to music and sound. And this never changed. These days I still test a lot and this makes my knowledge and insight grow on an on. Audio for me is like a Formula 1 car. You want to improve over and over again. When you are not able to think in properties you choose audio by trial and error. This means that you only judge the endresults. This is very limited because you miss a lot of the information you need to understand why the stage and sound is what you hear. Based on the knowledge I have now I understand why all the shows and expensive sets I auditioned in the past sounded so limited. Because they were incomplete. This means that they miss parts of Tru-Fi. When you miss parts of Tru-Fi you miss parts which influences our emotion. The level of emotion in the music is of a lower qualtiy. |
The Utopia, Sopra and 1000 series are able to create a deep and wide stage. The cheaper one are not good in creating stage depth and width. I think this also will count for the Aria’s. The 28khz tweeter I see as a limited tweeter. Because you still will get harsness in the high freq. The Monitor Audio Gold speakers use a superior tweeter compared to the tweeter of the Aria. Even the Utopia tweeter can give difficulties in high frequencies. In many auditions we counterd these issue’s. Dome tweeter I call second WW tweeter. Because it is so limited based on many parts. I would never sell a loudspeaker in the price range of the Gols series with a dome tweeter. I hate any kind of limitation. I will never sell any kind of limitation to any client. |
A few years ago I listened to Monitor Audio PL200 and PL300 series I. I didn't think they were horrible, but I didn't prefer their sound. A few months ago a really good friend told me I had to hear the new Monitor Audio PL500 II. I did some research, talked to a few people and took a chance. I've owned several speakers over the years(Mirage M1, Revel, Aerial, Wilson Audio) and have listened to many more. The PL500's are simply the best speakers that I've ever owned. In my humble opinion they represent a very good value and maybe one of the best speakers available today. Unfortunately they aren't talked about as much as some other speakers. I can't speak for their other models, but I love the PL500's. |
Can't afford the PL500's, but just made a great deal for a pair of PL300's brand new in unopened box. The reason why I bought without hearing is because I have a pair of Monitor Audio RX-6's and they're great speakers for their price. Just felt a need to upgrade. Can't wait to run them in and start enjoying. |
I own the Pl-500 as well, but Monitor Audio make many great speakers. I have sold hundreds of MA speakers in over 9 years of time. In the last 7 years I sold them all with a 3 dimensional stage. This is what the MA speakers make so special compared to all other brands. Most shops do not have the knowledge to think in properties. They really don’t F know which brands are able to create a 3 dimensional stage. The most dissapointing part is that in most shops in the world MA speakers are demoed always in 2D. This way they never can demo why they are so much more special compared to all the other brands. |
When you work and think by Tru-Fi you can reach a superior level out of audio compared to the limited trial and error way everybody is using. By working by Tru-Fi you can use all the properties/talents the MA speakers own. I create a much higher level and quality out of any Monitor Audio speaker. You cannot compare it with the sound and quality all other shops are able to reach. This level I can create has no competition. I has a higher level of emotion and intensity. We create and sell a sound instead of brands. Monitor Audio is only a part of our sound. The main focus is always the sound. All the different parts in a set are only used by their properties. We are only interested in properties, the rest doesn’t matter. We collect properties with them we build our sound. This is a totally different approach in audio. But in endresult and quality superior to any system you could create by trial and error. |
Deal for the PL 300’s fell through (beaten by a higher bidder). I’ll be receiving a new pair of MA Gold 300’s (2015 edition) instead. They’ll be paired with a Marantz 11S3 integrated which I bought last year. b01972, I believe you said Marantz’s are 2D. Are you 100% sure? If so, what would you recommend as a replacement in it’s price range? |
The 11S3 is an exeptional poor 2D amp. I have a shootout of the 11S3. I invited 2 of my clients who play with the Pl-200 at this moment. They played both with Marantz 2D amps. I wanted to bring them to a 3 dimensional stage. So we did a shootout. You have to translate the text. After the shootout they both directly sold their Marantz amps. This is what 3 dimensional sound does with people. The 11S3 plays a full flatt 2D stage with the GX-200. The Onkyo TX-NR3010 with a S.A.P. measurment outperformed the 11S3 in stereo use with ease. The 11S3 is e 2D hifi stereo amp. This is F insane to be used with any Monitor Audio loudspeaker. You must be a fool to use this combination. https://www.facebook.com/bobby.kingma/media_set?set=a.10155458418710083.1073741874.588405082&typ... https://www.facebook.com/bobby.kingma/media_set?set=a.10155460238350083.1073741875.588405082&typ... Audio always need to used by it’s properties. The Marantz has the d.n.a. of a 2D stage. You cannot change this. Each Monitor Audio loudspeaker goes to a much higher level when you use a 3D amp. That is why I only use amps which are able to create a deep and wide stage. |
I think the best option for you is to sell the Marantz. You need power for the Pl-300. You need to spend some extra money on an amp. Based on the fact that you do not have a lot of knowledge I will give you some advice you can use for yourself. Primare A32 and Pre30 is a very good option. To contol the Pl-300 and to create a deep and wide stage. Pathos Inpol-2 is also an option. You need to see for a used one. This one cab also create a 3D stage with the Pl-300 |
Don’t buy a Pass Labs integrated. I tested them a few times. I didn’t like them. This has nothing to do with the sound or stage. But based on the fact that the individual focus of instruments and voices is not as real and intimate as it should be. I had many conversations about this with Desmond of Pass Labs. In real instruments and voices are a lot more intimate and direct. I owned the Pass Labs XP-20, it was not good enough. Pass Labs creates stunning amps and good Pre amps. But not stunning ones. Audio is in my world only about the best ones, the rest doesn't matter. The primare I30 has not enough power for your speakers. Even the 11S3 is not enough. The Gold 300 also need space from the wall. |
