you sick little monkey?
That's the name of a little movie I saw last night :-)
Speaker cable arrows???
I bought a used pair of Silverline Audio's Conductor cables. Plugged them in
and was very pleased with the neutral sound I was getting. Bare wire to the
speakers, and bananas on the amp end. Then I realized that the arrows on
the cables where pointing towards the amp. OOPS, I reversed the path
direction, and couldn't hear any difference. Zero.
My preference would be to have the bananas on the amp end.
Can I disobey the arrows, and run the cables effectively backwards?
and was very pleased with the neutral sound I was getting. Bare wire to the
speakers, and bananas on the amp end. Then I realized that the arrows on
the cables where pointing towards the amp. OOPS, I reversed the path
direction, and couldn't hear any difference. Zero.
My preference would be to have the bananas on the amp end.
Can I disobey the arrows, and run the cables effectively backwards?
186 responses Add your response
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Amazing! I must be feeling even better now, doing the RIGHT thing. 😯 No need to investigate OCD, now going to listen to the correctly flowing sound if music. Very good in deed, though not so sure the OP feels any better, still listening to cable ass-ways first being his actual esthetic preference... 🙄 M. |
andy2 And to make things even more complicated, an AC current is not AC that is it is not symmetric. Some of its aspect is sort of like a DC current. >>>>That is interesting. How does it affect directionality, or does it? |
andy2 To make things a bit more complicated, a speaker cable exists in a three dimensional space, therefore the electro-magnetic energy not necessarily confined as in a 2 dimensional circuit diagram for example. >>>>>I’m pretty sure that has been covered already. Ad nauseam, actually. We have Poynting vectors up the wazoo. |
I don't get it, are speaker cables now the same as inductors? I was always under the impression they were CONDUCTORS... However that all maybe, I'm detecting a strong psychological component here, inducting me to think that if I'd reverse the writing or arrows in the backward way it would give me a case of audio-nervosa non stop, even though it be sounding all the same. 😟 Maybe time to speak to an analyst about OCD?!? 🤔 Now may one express this fear without risking the hurtful embarrassment of another post deletion? I'm learning... M. |
Answer this question. If I have 7 inductors that are L7>L6>L5>L4>L3>L2>L1 that is L7 is greatest and L1 is smallest in that order. Let’s say I put them all in series, starting with L7 and ending with L1 in that order. And run an AC current through them. Measure the output. That is if you input at L7 then the output would be L1, and vice versa Now does it make any difference if the input is L7 or L1? My guess is the objectivists would say no difference since all the L’s are in series so it does not matter if you input the signal at L1 or at L7. I think I managed to come up with a question that can't simply be looked up on the wikipages :-) I suspect a few posters here use that to appear smarter :-) |
The trouble with the theory that the writing goes is the correct direction is that the manufacturer of cables that don’t have arrows probably don’t believe in directionality OR don’t know about it. Otherwise, they would be 100% sure to put arrows on the cables since, you know, cables in the correct direction sound better. Obviously, on some cables where shields are present the arrows usually simply indicate which direction the shielded cable should go. However the shield is a separate issue so the best case scenario is the manufacturer is cognizant of both types of directionality whilst constructing the cables. |
@isochronism Wow, confusion reins supreme, eh? But thanks for your clarification. More on the level, directionaly of speaker cables is not in one of my current believe systems. My deleted post had made that point, alas to facetious? However, before some plenty years back, before I came to this learning, I had heard, that if no arrows are present, follow the direction of the cable sleeve print! So I did... as I recall(ed). Now after I'd gone over this here thread, in deed I'd checked whether all was still as I'd recalled, and so it is/was. Though, just most resently a change from tweeter / mids terminals connection to the bass terminals of the sc, now running the jumpers bottom up so to speak, had a most unexpected sq improvement as a consequence. More air, tighter bass, better integration over all, even improved tonality. Yet please note: the jumpers of ~ 2" length are directional only by best fitting the terminals (of their soldered cable shoes). Now I hope, this post will pass inspection.. M. |
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Immediately I had the powerful urge to check on my Straight Wire 'Waveguide' speaker cables, in case there was a 180° reverse situation. Alas, NO ARROWS are to be found on it. Short of some metallurgical analysis I decided to go with the flow (of the writing) in place of them badly missing arrows... All turned out to be installed correctly this way, thereby preventing them waves guided backwards into my PASS X350.5. Now I'm sure this one has enough muscle 💪 to chuck them waves right back to my speaker terminals, eh? Does anyone disagree? 🤔 Michélle |
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I think what it all comes down to is this ; what is the difference between hearing a difference and imagining that you hear a difference? This is the essential problem with audiophiles.This accusation is tiring to listen to....Like the recurrent placebo effect...And generally decreed by people who have no clue about the way to go to with the embeddings of their audio system , except the totally insufficient rule : buy, plug, and use it.... In my experiments for the last couple of years creating spectacular homemade NO-COST solutions for my audio system, I encounter no placebo effect, and no hearing and imagined hearing alternatives, WHY? Simply because a long CUMULATIVE series of positive small or bigger audible changes are NOT reducible to auditory illusion... WHY ? Because they are incrementally and STEP BY STEP created by exploratory experiments, in the mechanical, electrical, and acoustical dimension fields of the audio system of my house.... In a word: a pill that make your heathier each weeks for years is NOT a placebo effect pills....Especially if someone else feel the same after eating it....The mechanical, electrical, and acoustical embedding dimensions are not illusory tweaking obsession of cranks, they are the 3 conditions necessary to gives to yourself the true potential S.Q. of any audio system.... For the directionality of cable, I only go with the advise of the cable seller....I had no opinion about that.... |
I think what it all comes down to is this ; what is the difference between hearing a difference and imagining that you hear a difference? This is the essential problem with audiophiles. They don't understand that there is a difference between these two things.They think that they are the same thing. They think that if they imagine there is a difference then that means there actually is. It's very much the same as christians who think that because they believe then that means that their belief must be true. |
"Since all wire is inherently directional 🔜 speaker cables, internal
speaker and electronics wires, inductors, transformers, digital cables,
HDMI cables, fuses, ribbon connectors, capacitors, resistors, et al
should be controlled for their inherent directionality during
manufacture. The industry, sadly, moves at a snails’s pace. It probably
hasn’t even got the memo yet. 🐌 If everything was in the right
direction the audible effect of reversing one cable wouldn’t be subtle
then, would it?"
THIS IT WHAT I CALL PURE COMEDY!ALSO PURE BS! |
The electricity that makes speaker drivers in and out is not like water in a faucet. It pushes the speaker out and pulls it in. It does this by alternating the current back and forth at the frequencies of the music. Directional speaker wires are pure hokum. Avoid dealers who tell you otherwise, unless you still use a green Magic Marker on your CD edges. If that is the case, Please contact me for my special CBD oil rubbed speaker wire. |
when I bought my B&W powered subwoofer I paid extra for the special audiot ( or is that audiophool) nano-ceramic cross-linking polymer subwoofer signal cable with which to connect the preamp output to the line level input on the sub. And I'm pretty sure it's directional since it has little arrows on it. But not having noticed the little arrows at first I inadvertently installed it in the wrong direction.After listening for a week I noticed that the little arrows were pointing at the preamp. My common sense notwithstanding I moved the whole system away from the wall in order to re-orient the cable in the "correct" direction. This took quite a lot of time and energy given how obsessive-compulsive I am about connections and such. I even measure how far away the entertainment center is from the back wall at each end. No joke. Then made little marks on the floor in order to facilitate re-positioning without re-measuring. Finally, I sat down and listened to my newly re-oriented low frequencies. My heart sank as I failed to notice the "night and day" difference that any true audiophile would have. But at least I can be sure my preamp is no longer straining to force the signal into and thru the cable in the wrong direction. And my sub no longer has to suck the unwilling signal out the other end. I made up a new word here. "audiot". How do you guys like it? |
Install them in whichever direction they sound best to you. Personally, I always start by following the arrows on the jacket, but having violated that many times, and in the majority of those cases without any noticeable difference, it's not something to be obsessive about in my opinion, but you know what they say about opinions, they are like rear ends, everybody's got one. |
While there is good information in that thread, maybe a few posts, most of it is a disaster, and pretty much none of it matters at audio bandwidths. Transmission line effects are not relevant at audio bandwidths and cable lengths except poorly matched digital cables and connections. Bulk effects would be far more relevant and there would need to be directional differences large enough to make a difference. There are many reasons cables can be directional and that thread only covers one really, but huuuge difference between reasons and MFG differences large enough to have any potential ability to be audible. |
Jea48? Thank you! The thread you referenced earlier was absolutely on point! Herman and Kijanki both expound precisely with "correct" information to help explain doubts about this subject matter. And further they accomplish this in a way that I think most here can understand. Nsgarch, Almarg and also yourself, also add to this nicely rounded thread. I would highly recommend that anyone here with any doubt or question on this subject? Please reference that thread before continuing here on this one; https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/directional-cables |
when I got my first stereo I wish the seller had been less concerned with ensuring that the cable was put in the right way (and I was forever after terrified of putting it the wrong way incase I bust my system!) and more concerned with perhaps letting me listen to several pairs of speakers, ie the things that would entirely change the sound I was presented with. |
Time's up?🕰+1 All the best,Nonoise |