This is what I've used for several years on my SP-10:
Custom Design Inert Turntable Matt
http://www.analogueseduction.net/turntable-mats/custom-design-inert-turntable-matt-for-suspended-turntables-.html
You'll need the stainless steel version. |
I like the Herbie's business. They sell a lot of nice accessories for reasonable prices, but I would not rate their tt mat in the same league with the best of the others that have been mentioned. In my mind, therefore, the mat is a false economy. For less than $200 more you can have the Mat2. Since the SP10 (Mk2 or 3) is worth a few to many thousands of dollars, it does not make sense to save a few hundred on something as crucial as a platter mat. That's just my opinion developed over a few decades of looking for least expensive ways out. I stopped thinking that way. I do respect your opinion which may differ from mine as far as ranking the Herbie's mat. (I do own a Herbie's mat, by the way.) |
I'm using the OMA carbon mat which is similar to the Boston Audio 2 only thicker and it's designed to fit the the recessed SP 10 platter exactly.
Probably the best value is the Herbie's "way excellent" 2 turntable mat. They have a 4mm thick, 292mm diameter version that fits the SP 10 platter. It's around $75 and has a 90 day home trial so you can decide for yourself. |
Then why not sit on the f***in' thing? Be my guest.
"Resonance" is one of the most used and abused terms in audio. Like I said in reply to Raul, the theoretical advantages of record dampening are obvious. I only know that when I do it using the available mechanisms, most of the time I do not like it. So I don't do it. (Most of the time.) Same goes for hitting myself in the head with a hammer. I could counter with some equally hypothetical arguments about why record weights might not be so good, but I believe we are speaking past each other (plural), and it would only lead to more misunderstanding. The OP asked about platter mats, and I have offered my opinions. |
The goal of the TT is to have the stylus trace the groove accurately. So, the analogous question to ask is, is it easier to walk on a vibrating floor or a stable one?
Your TT is the source for sonic information. If you desire to hear what is truly recorded from the LP, then choose components that will maximize the accurate reproduction of sound from the groove. With that being the goal, compliance anywhere in the chain of LP through tone arm will be deleterious (translated: no rubber, foam, or soft mats). Additionally, sonic resonances from the bearing; ambient resonance transmitted through plinth, tone arm, platter; and stylus-resonant feedback need to be mitigated. This is accomplished through materials that dissipate resonant energy.
I have found that TTW Audios mats are products focused on that goal and do a superlative job. I have used a variety of their mats from alloy, copper, Delrin, combination mats with the carbon fiber. The Ultimat provided the best platform at reducing resonances. I believe TTW has a mat priced above the Ultimat. I have no experience with it.
Your LP needs to be coupled to the platter/mat with a periphery weight and center weight to maximize sound retrieval. The greater the mass, the more resonant energy is absorbed. Ideally, the only thing to resonate is the stylus from tracing the LP groove.
I have no affiliation with TTW. |
Raul, I freely admit that what you say may be true. I believe it myself. Nevertheless, I do not like heavy record weights. (I said nothing at all about vacuum hold-down; you impute to me an opinion I do not hold. Nor did I say I prefer metal mats; as you know, I am not using any metal mat except the one designed to be part of the L07D platter) It is my opinion that the analog/vinyl medium is so full of imperfections at all levels, from recording venue to playback system, that sometimes by serendipity one "distortion" can complement another, with the net result that the listener is more pleased, the sound is more "real". I know you detest the "I like it" school of thought, but there it is. Live music can be very "ragged" and full of life; I do not want to use a device that removes that possible sensation completely, as do many very heavy record weights and peripheral rings. If you want to do that in the interest of removing "distortion", that is your choice.
I am a scientist by profession. You have no idea how far from real science is this art of reproducing music at home. It's nearly impossible even to do a valid "experiment" in home audio. |
Dear Lewm: +++++ " I always have found that the really heavy gravity-dependent record weights suck life out of the music. " +++++
other people like you do not likes vacuum type mats because similar reason.
Could be interesting that we ask our self: need we a mat/clamp , why?
Which is the function of a mat: IMHO to present a better mate/match to the LP when the stylus is riding the LP grooves " eliminating " TT feedback platter/bearing and mat feedback to the cartridge during playback. So this could tell us that the mat must be as a damper tool with out self additional minute resonances/vibrations on playback.
From that point of view metal mats could be the worst ones ( as the MS and others. Metal here is the MUSIC information enemy. ), metal tends to resonate when in motion and because the stylus/LP vibrations that return to the cartridge due that the metal can't damp it.
Jarret said about: " bit too lively but outstanding in terms of dynamics and soundstage " , that " feeling " of dynamics is no other thing that additional distoritons but not MUSIC grooves information.
You said some clamps " suck out life out of the music ": too much damping????
Lewm, what could be what we are looking trough the mat/clamp kind of help?:
that through the cartridge obtain the MUSIC information recorded in the grooves with out adding or losting " nothing ".
The cartridge stylus/cantilever riding groove modulations generate non musical vibrations in the LP that goes to the mat/clamp/TT platter and return to the cartridge along TT self vibrations/resonances. All these kind of non-musical information degrade the cartridge signal, so we need " something " that really could damp it. A good designed mat is supposed that was designed to makes exactly that: damp.
IMHO, we can't overdamp the cartridge/LP during playback but through several years our brain is accustomed to those non-musical information ( added distortions, non-damped ones. ) and when we really damp down there what we listen is that " suck life out of the music " but is not because an " overdamping " subject but because non-musical information tends to disappears and that's why we don't like it. Of course that a heavy clamp other than damp it changes frequency resonances between the LP and cartridge/TT platter and create other kind of resonances/distortions.
In the other side that " suck life out... " could be because it's the way the LP was recorded it's the way must be heard.
It is not easy to re-equalize our brain for non-distortions ( lower ones. ) in what we are listening trough each one audio system.
There is a lot to discuss on the whole subject and certainly different points of view.
Regards and enjoy the music,
R.
|
Downunder, I used a BA Mat1 for quite a while on my Lenco platter. It's excellent in that application, but I found that the Mat2 is far better than the Mat1 on my SP10 Mk3. I have not tried the Mat2 on the Lenco, because now the Mat2 "belongs" to the Mk3. I would guess you will like the Mat2 better than the Mat1, for your P3. (By the way, if you hear of a P3 for sale, let me know.)
One thing I don't like so much about the BA mats is that they tend to slip against the platter. That is not good for those of us who worry about torque and stylus drag. What good is a powerful motor if the platter mat is slipping, even a tiny bit? So I use a very small piece of Scotch Tape along the rim, to prevent slippage on the Mk3. On the Lenco, I used double sided tape, between mat and platter.
Dover, I never met a record clamp I could really love. I do occasionally use the SOTA clamp, but I almost never actually clamp it. I just sit it on top of the spindle so as to dampen vibrations just by virtue of its mass. Yes, it's rather light in weight for this application, but I always have found that the really heavy gravity-dependent record weights suck life out of the music. On the other hand, I don't own any of the very heavy copper or other metal mats. The SAEC SS300 (my only metal mat) is quite a bit lighter than the CU180. I think it weighs only a bit more than the stock rubber mat made for the SP10 Mk3. The Kenwood L07D uses a 5-lb stainless steel "platter sheet" that is part and parcel of the platter itself, altho it is removable. I don't like the OEM Kenwood record weight either, for its effect on the sound of the L07D. |
No issues with the weight of 870 GM's. In the day the SAEC was used a lot on the SP10's.
Hi Lew, never tried my Boston 1 mat on my Exclusive P3, maybe I will :-) |
I have had much experience with both the Final Audio copper mat 4.5kg and the Micro Seiki 180 copper mat on a variety of TT's. Both of them sound significantly better when used with either a heavy stabiliser/washer or reflex clamp/washer.
I have both the Final Audio stabiliser (1.8kg) and Goldmund Reflex Clamp - different sounding but both are good. The Sota and Simply Physics Reflex clamps would be worth a look. You get the benefits of the copper and clamping properly takes the "edge off".
I also think the use of the copper mat on the SP10 provides a bimetallic dampening effect on the platter overall. I prefer it in this application to an acrylic mat. |
I second either the Boston Audio Mat2 or the SAEC SS300 mat, with a slight nod in favor of the BA one. I use it on my SP10 Mk3. |
Have one made from Delrin. |
Boston Audio Design Mat 2 is a carbon based platter mat that has been recommended in lieu of copper. |
The mat weighs 870 grama, any issues with the motor control?
C |
The SAEC mat is in between
http://www.topclassaudio.com/web/eng/used_product_details.jsp?gid=6265 |
