Proac D48R

@itzkak1969,
Thank you for the suggestion. My listening room is "almost" symmetric. Almost - because there is a door on the first reflection point. But it has been reinforced with extra ply, so that it is on the same level as the wall. I did try out this method, as you suggested, but ended up symmetrical.

@ctsooner ,
Thank you for adding on to the previous suggestion. I did try out your suggestion last night. But the way I ended up was, pointing the speakers directly at the listening position where neither side of the speakers are seen.

For the past few days I struggled for more than 12-15 hours trying to find out the best position for the speakers in the room. What I found out was, even moving the speakers 1/8th inch, changes the imaging. While it was also the case with my older speakers, the changes with this speakers is huge. I was able to lock down this down with the songs "The Rain Falls" ( Eleanor McEvoy) and "Desperado" (Eagles). What I find now is that, not all songs have the vocals coming from dead center. Some songs have vocals that are slightly on the left, while some to the right. Even my chair is positioned exactly in the center of the room.
I have the speakers on the granite plinths with the Herbies footers and that improved the bass. They are 70" (front face of speaker) from the back wall and 41" (tweeter center) from the side wall. I am enjoying my music more than ever.

One of my takes on Johnny's post is to make sure you see an equal sliver of the inside of the speakers wood.  I owned many Proacs over the years and that's how they are supposed to be positioned.  Let us know what you end up with

Try to move one of the speakers little bit forward than the other it seems strange but it did miracles at my room with my Proac's the right speaker is more forward to my position listening than the left one the soundstage became more focused and transparent. 

Thank You for letting me know JohnnyR. Not really keen on the asymmetric approach. But will move the speakers slightly away, instead of facing directly at listening position and check the results. I believe I have tried that, but will experiment more.

((((I was wondering how you have positioned your ProAcs?))

With almost a square room why not try an asymmetrical approach.
This is where you sit in almost the back corner and stare straight ahead into the front corner than each speaker goes up each wall 6 feet maybe 7 or so adjust speakers so you can see just a little of the inside wall of each Proac.
Bring speakers out into the room or push back to taste.
 Best JohnnyR

@heinrichmilw,
I was wondering how you have positioned your ProAcs? I am trying to find the BEST positions for them in my room which is 18X15X8. I have currently placed them about 5 feet from the back wall and 3 feet from the side wall. Both positions are approximate for now, since I am still trying to adjust to the new sound. I have also toed them per ProAc's recommendation - speakers are facing directly at listening position, with neither side of the speaker sides seen.

I use the Audio Research VSi75 integrated. with Audience SX cables with my D48Rs. Sounds quite good, very musical

I would consider pre plus power (not integrated) of Macintosh or Bryston for the D48R ,it will cost you more than 5K for new but for speakers that cost around 10k do deserve better amplification maybe you can find better options in your budget at the used market than you can consider Pass lab,Audio Research, Krell,Classe act  as well .

I had the Supertowers and also 2 pair (from family members) of the Studio 1's if I remember correctly. Sold all of them and got the Vandersteen Treo's that Bob now owns.

Hey, why not make this the official ProAc D48R owner's thread? Now I have them and love what they are doing.

@gdnrbob,
Thank You sir.Good to know that you like ProAcs too. I found them musical at the demos I had. All I am hoping is that they would gel in my system.

ctsooner What Proacs did you own?

I actually owned three pair of Proac's for well over 20 years.  Sold them all off to get the Vandersteen Treo's. I went to Audio Connection to get my cones surrounds redone as they all were rotted out.  I went to listen to the new D series speakers and then Johnny forced me to listen to the Treo's even though I told him no Vandies for me.  I fell in love with the Vandies, but ProAc's are still one of my favorite speakers.  They are the only ribbon I've heard to date that don't make my ears bleed.  Really like them a lot.

Thanks kclone. Your feedback regarding room size and experience also played a role in my decision.

milpai, congrats on your decision.  I love mine, just great speakers all around.   

+2 congrats.
I got to hear ProAc's at Audioconnection. I have to say they are a pair of speakers I would consider if I ever strayed from Vandersteen. 
Quads and Maggie's a close 2nd and 3rd.
If I remember correctly, they were paired with Aesthetix amplifier and pre.
Bob

Congrats.  I'm sure you'll love them.  

@cmach,
I completely forgot about our discussion from 2 years back. Yes, you also auditioned the D48R. BTW what is your room size? You need to post some pictures of those D30R.
Also, you are right. Clear Days are excellent cables. I will continue to use them on the D48R as well.

@gnostalgick,
Thank You.
BTW, I had posted on your system page sometime back.

Congrats on the new speakers!

Milpai,

The Clear Day jumpers are an excellent choice. I'm using those on my Proac D-30R's.

I got to demo the D-48R at Audio Revelation. I brought my Manley Snappers along to have some point of reference. The rest of the equipment was provided by Jay at Audio Revelation. I just remember how big and effortless the sounded with great imaging and depth. Due to space constraints I ended with the D-30R which continues to impress.

@itzhak1969,
Yes, I will be using the custom made Clear Day jumpers that I am currently using for my Quads.Thanks for the suggestion.

@cmach,
Thank You. Just curious, what was the system that you heard the ProAcs in? Will definetely report back after I spend some time listening to the speakers.

Congrats Milpai, got to hear the D-48R's briefly and was very impressed.
Agree with itzhak1969, replacing the stock jumpers is a must and yes the Proac's do take a while to break in. At about 100 hours you'll get a better idea of what they sound like. Please keep us updated.

I recommend you to change the stock metal jumpers for better quality ones as soon as the speakers arrive to you because they do degrade the sound severely also Proac speakers are known for their very long burn-in period allow about 500 hours before fully break in( it is also mention at their user manual). 
You made the right choice please keep us update for first impression. 

@jperry,
Thank You. Your's was one of the system that inspired me to start looking at the ProAc.

@milpai 

Congrats on your purchase. I am sure you will be very happy with your decision. A great sounding pair of speakers.

Thank You @carmenc . Yes, I will post my impressions once I spend sometime with them. Yes, spent almost 2 years searching for speakers to replace my current ones. The Quads are really that good. But it was between family, overseas trips, work, etc, that I had to find time and audition the speakers.

@milpai ....congrats on your Proacs!  I know you’ve spent some time researching and listening to various speakers.  Glad you chose the speaker that is best for you.  Keep us posted on when they arrive and your impressions.  Best....

Folks,
The decision has been made. My ProAc D48R in Ebony are on order. Should get them by end of November or start of December.

I have found that in general, most speakers will not over power a room.  It's all about room treatments no matter what you run as a system.  They don't even need to be expensive.  Folks seem to worry about the bass.  That's the biggest reason I went with the Vandersteen Quatro's as I wanted to have total control of the bass, however I also auditioned the D48R and D30R.  Both are spec'd to 20hz, however it doesn't show how much they are down at that point.  One moves more air than the other, but I also felt that the sound was much more fleshed out with the 48's.  I felt they gave me a much larger sound stage, that you'd expect from a larger speaker.  There was just more of everything like the poster above stated.  It's just a much more refined speaker in every way.  You can get standing waves in any room if you push too hard and that's often distortion that will ruin the speakers as well as the sound.

Loved tsloan's post about amps too as it's common sense and what so many 'audiophile's' constantly don't even think about.  Manufacturer's recommendations for amp power are just that.  Recommendations...  A great amp delivering clean power is what is needed.  The 48's will need an amp that can control the bass and mid bass units and any top amp will do that.  Anyone using a speaker like this will most probably be running a top amp and if not, they may want to rethink their systems, lol.

I miss my ProAc's, but love my Vandy's better.  Just lot's of great choices with all the new technology these days.

In this thread and others regarding Proac speakers D48R vs D30R inquiring minds have wondered which would be a better fit.
EX: Would the D48R's be TOO BIG for my medium size room? Should I get the D30's instead?
I would like to point out that speaker size and room size are only two out of four parameters that factor into deciding the right speaker for you.
We must also consider the amount of amplification and the volume.
As many posters have suggested, the D48R's can be driven with modest amount of tube amplification - even under 50 watts - to satisfying listening levels. Both speakers are capable of playing very loud. The D30's will overpower a room driven by a 300 watt amplifier at high volume whereas the D48R's would not if they were driven by a less powerful amplifier OR the same 300 watt amp at a lesser volume.
I chose the D48R over the 30 because it is a better speaker - it improves on all the strengths of the 30 - better bass, even more refined highs and a richer, meatier, more palpable presentation across the board. I use a 300 watt CODA integrated amplifier.

Jim,

As soon as I find the right position for my speakers and fully break them in I will try the Sort Fut. 

I really like your upgrade path... Analogue, tubes, Nordost and Proac, I know what your system sounds like. I'm really into Joni Mitchell, Meshell Ndegeocello, Erykah Badu, Jill Scott, Seal, Shawn Colvin, Billie Holiday  and Pat Metheny just to name a few. These artists would sound so good on your system. To me there's nothing like a female vocalist floating between the speakers...Goosebumps!

Thanks so much for your input and I will keep in touch.

Ron

Ron,

I was able to demo the sort fut, and as I said it did make a significant positive difference. The downside is the price. I have sort kone TC under my amp and preamp.

I did not try the other Nordost speaker cables before purchasing the Tyr 2.  I bought a trade-in pair, which I did take home and try, then kept them. The pricing on the trade-in pair was too good for me to consider another Nordost speaker cable choice.  I jumper the speaker cables per my dealer's recommendation with the Nordost Reference bi-wire jumpers.

I have 2 pieces of Valhalla 2 in my system, a tonearm cable on my primary turntable and the AC cable from the wall to my QB-8. The interconnects are Tyr 2 and the other AC cables are Frey 2.

Thanks for the comment on the album wall. My wife helped me with that and we both like to look at it. The lady on the cover of Whipped Cream is still around and lives in Seattle area according to an article I saw a while ago.

I hope you enjoy you Proac speakers as much as I enjoy mine.

Best Regards,

Jim Perry

Jim,

I am curious how you ended up with the Sort Fut. There doesn't seem to be much written about them. Were you able to demo them before buying? I have Sort Kones and use them under my amp and CD player and like them, have you tried them? Also did you try any of the other Nordost IC's and speaker cable ie. Frey 2 or Valhalla before deciding on the Tyr 2's? And do you bi-wire your speakers or jump them. It seems Nordost prefers to jump and Proac likes bi-wiring. Did you experiment with that? Also I love your wall of albums. I think I lost my virginity to that Herb Albert "Whip cream and other delights" album cover. lol ... Thanks, Ron

I've also found that both MIT and Transparent are great with the new Proac's. I have never heard the new Audioquest cables not sound great too (the DBS ones).

Ron,

Send me a private e-mail if you are in Phoenix. Great to hear your son is at ASU. I am an ASU alumni. I use Nordost sort fut under my D-40r and found them be a significant improvement over the stock spikes. Expensive, but worth it in my opinion.

Best Regards,

Jim Perry

milpai and jperry, You both have amazing looking systems. I still have a long way to go with the new Proac's. I am just reaching the 100 hr mark and have yet to find the right placement and spike them. Milpai I see you use Herbie's audio lab dbNeutralizer base pads. I used the big fat dots between my 1sc's and my speaker stands and liked them, do you recommend the dbNeatralizers? I have hardwood floors and have always used spikes and cups but recently talked to another Agoner who recommended Soundcare superspikes which are spikes with a  polycarbonate material used instead of a cup.... jperry, I think the Proac/Nordost combo sounds so right. I remember my 1st CES and seeing and hearing Lars demo the Nordost line. I was so taken with their open, fast, clean and natural sound I have been using Nordost ever since. I use sort kones, Valhalla (V1) PC's, Valhalla IC's and a Qbase 4. My speaker cables are are old white lightning cables from my home theater set up. I thought I would let the system break in and then fine tune it with a speaker cable upgrade at that time. I see you live in Arizona. My son is a junior at ASU in Tempe.... I have a lot of work to do on my system and  when I get a little further along I will take some photo's and post them. Thanks for your input. Ron

Ron,

Glad to hear you are happy with your Proac D-30 r speakers. A really great sounding speaker, and system as well, I am sure.

Ron,
Congratulations on the new ProAcs. I would love top see the D30R loudspeakers in your system. Care to post some pictures so that I can drool over?
Thanks!
:-)

Over the last 15 years I have owned Proac's. I had the response 5's powered by BAT tubed mono's then the BAT 250wpc SS amp. Loved those combo's but felt the 5's were a little too big so I sold everything and got the 1sc's and a Cary 300sei which was midrange magic. I lived with that combo for about 5 years and sold the Cary and replaced it with a Classe 100wpc SS amp. That combo was nice but as my music preference changed I felt the need for a deeper bottom end. One of my closest friends is a Proac dealer so I (for the last couple of months) started researching the new Proac line. I was torn between the D48r and the D30r. My room is aprox. 28'L x 17'W x 8'H. I was looking for that Proac midrange with a deep controlled bass. I finally decided on the D30r's (I was so worried they wouldn't have the bass I was seeking). I have had the D30r's now for 2 weeks and am totally blown away with them. They have the lush midrange and great soundstage of the 1sc's with the best, deepest and most controlled bass I have ever had. I have a Classe front end, Marantz preamp, Classe 100wpc SS amp with Nordost PC's, IC's and SC's. I couldn't be more happy. I think the D48r's would have been too big for me and my room. My musical tastes are R&B, jazz and some rock/blues....Ron

I've owned nearly all the Proacs from the 90's until 2002 or so. I still have my Krell Stealth Dac that I'm going to sell. We all felt it sounded better for some reason than the DAC 32 that cost a lot more. I have the Cal Audio Labs drive for it that needs a new home too lol. I also have the CAL Terret CD player that I'm going to sell. That was a great pairing I. The day. Now digital is a different breed. Budget is most important. I own an Empirical Audio OSDE/SE DAC and run a Marantz blue ray and a totally rebuilt MAC Mini with a Haynes linear power supply and 500gb Samsung Soild state drives. Cable is an empirical solid silver hand made USB. I run fully balanced with an Ayre AX-5 Twenty integrated. I ran my ProAc Super Towers that were upgraded through ProAc and my former dealer. From MIT internal wiring to the response drivers and rebuilt crossovers with mundorf's etc. It was such an awesome system, but I upgraded to VANDERSTEEN Treo's. ProAc and VANDERSTEEN seem to have changed their corporate sound over the years but I heard the 7k proacs I believe they were and they were one of the only ribbon tweeters that I have liked. 

Personally i I feel that AR digital is their weak point. They have newer gear that sounds better but Aesthetix is making some great digital but it costs a lot. Personally I'd just spend 1500 and buy the Ayre Codex. Alex and the guys know what they are doing. It's a great DAC and can be used as the pre in a simple system with a good quicksilver or AR amp if you want to go that route or paired with that AR integrated. I do love that Ayre DAC for the price. It seems to be liked by most regardless of what they like to listen to as they get rid of the digital ringing. They understand digital filtering as well as analogue. Just some personal thoughts. 

heinrichmilw, I have been mainly using the mac mini->Dac route in the last 8 or so years. The last CD player I remember was the  Cambridge 840c but that is because it had a digital input. So even that I was using it as a Dac mostly. Its just too conveniant to have all your music on the server and then have app on your smart device to use it as a remote!

After that I have tried many dacs including Benchmark DAC, Arcam, Mhdt Havana, and then Rega. I settled on the Rega DAC, and now the DAC-R, as it has the most analogue like sound. It works very well with the D series Proac. If you are looking for CD players I would suggest auditioning the Rega Apollo-R and the Saturn-R. The latter one also has the digital input that supports 24/192.

For speaker cables I use Proac cable and Ridge Street Audio Poiema!!! IC. I would not spend too much money on these ultra expensive cables. Buy the best reasonable priced cables that you can afford and enjoy the music!

Not much doesn't sound great on Proac's, especially with ARC driving them. If you're looking for CDP what's your budget? If you're ok buying used, an ARC CD3 is a nice player. I once owned a CD2 and it sounded nice on Proacs. I've dragged my Cambridge 851C over to my fathers system; ARC with Proacs and sounds great to me. Guessing you don't have your ARC yet. Think you'll be very happy with the combo. Congrats!

zeeshanb, Over the years what cd players have you tried and liked best with your Proacs? Also speaker cables, ICs & PCs

Please let us know your feedback once you have VSi75. I currently have the AR LS26 and VS60 combo but interested in going towards the integrated route as I am very limited on space and only use one input on the LS26 preamp (from the Rega-R dac). My local audio store tells me that Line Magnetic integrated are also very good too but I have not tried that in my home yet.

I used to have the Proac D38 but sold it due to moving to a much smaller place. I am currently using Proac response 2.5 that I bought it locally but interested in upgrading to the D30R at some point. Though I am not sure if I should call it upgrade as I just love the 2.5! There is some magic about it that draws me into the music. Obviously the D38s were more dynamic and had a bigger sound stage and could extract more detail.

So very interested in this discussion. You can obviously tell I am a Proac fan!

That's a really fun integrated.  You can even tube roll if you want, but honestly, AR does a pretty good job with their tubes.  I've never changed their tubes when i have owned their gear.  I used AR in years past with my Proac speakers and it really meshed well.  

Thank You for all the advice and suggestions, very much appreciated. I went with the Audio Research VSi75. Should arrive next week. 

brown, that's pretty funny.  Thanks I needed a laugh

Wow, autocorrect really worked against me on that last post. Glad my system is full tilt away from that working well and sounding great. 

I love my ProAc studio 148s with my audio refinement / YBA separates. They sound more tube like than the rogue cronus magnum or vista audio i34 integrates. Maybe one of yba's integegrateds?

Thanks sense 63. I appreciate the comment on my system.

If your room and budget work with the size and cost of the D-48r that would be my choice. The D-48r will have more bass extension and play louder than the D-30r due to the additional woofer and larger cabinet.
 
The D-48r is an update of the D-40r. The D-40r is is the same size as the D-48r, but does not show as a current speaker on their web site. The sound will be very similar.