Hi Audphile1, This has been my experience in Computer Audio, I invested in digital audio via Mac Mini. I sent it to Mojo Audio where they:
- Removed Mac Mini’s internal switch-mode power supply (SMPS).
- Upgraded to external power supply.
- Installed Internal Power Supply Filter Modules
- Installed hard wired DC power cable to connect to power supply
- Replaced HDDs with SSDs for software and library.
- Upgraded RAM to the maximum amount.
- Optimized OS X
The external Power Supply is the Mojo Illuminati v3 I use WyWires Platinum USB and The Uptone ISO Regen re-clocker I am connected to a Wadia S7i.Dac. Audirvana through WiFi. AIFF When I received the upgraded Mac Mini back it sounded the best that it has ever sounded, however I found it still lacked in overall performance for the same reasons you and others have identified. The best music presentation I get from my set up is playing Redbook CDs from the Wadia S7i CDP/ transport to Rogue Audio Hera 2 preamp. A couple of interesting points - 1. I confided in a well respected audio manufacturer / professional, of my findings and he told/schooled me - there is no streamer/ computer audio on the market today that is going to best a well designed CDP. The technology is just not there. Yet. 2. The absolute closest I ever got the Mac Mini to sound as good as the Wadia is when I placed a Stage 3 Kraken Power Chord on the external power supply. I knew it would make a substantial difference, but did not expect that it would enhance its performance the way it did. Everything improved, Soundstage, imaging, details... That said, as impressive the change was, the Wadia is still better. I hope this helps, Good Luck |
George,
The 24/96 "Reference Recordings" that you mention are not CDs. That's just marketing bullcrap.
Why do you think it is better to convert from analog to 24/96 and then to 16/44.1 than to convert analog to 16/44.1? The only reason they do that is because they use "Peak Extend" in the conversion process so they can effectively gain some bits back, up to about 20. They are not real bits though. It is just a method to extend dynamic range to what you get with 20 bits.
So yes, if you have an HDCD compatible player, the "Reference Recordings" CDs can sound better. But, as the link I provided in my previous posts shows, if you don't have an HDCD compatible player, the results are not so good.
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lalitk1,737 posts04-13-2020 5:19am“I think there are a number of inherent problems with the Mini as a streamer based on my recent findings. One is the internal Power supply. The other is the fact that it isn’t optimized for streaming music in the context of a high end system”.
In my opinion, unless you get rid of mac-mini you will never experience the true potential of high resolution digital streaming.
Bingo!! |
Just take your cd out of its case and just put it in your cd player and enjoy...life is to short ,enjoy what you have and be happy.... |
The 24/96 "Reference Recordings" that you mention are not CDs. That’s just marketing bullcrap. 🤦♂️🤦♂️ Can’t see the forest for the trees. Believe what you want, just have a listen to just one RR 24/96 CD, on a CD player even without a HDCD capabilities! |
Appreciate everyone’s thoughts and feedback. Since I started this discussion, night after night I proved to myself that a CD does sound a lot better than the same album rip played thru the Mac Mini. While I don’t doubt that running the Mini wired and adding bells and whistles such as EtherRegen to the set up will improve the sound, I still think that the sonic gap between the CD transport and the Mini is just too large to bridge. Yes, we can throw more money into the Mac set up with mods, etc. but...will it get to where the CD transport is sonically? I’m not sure.
So I pulled the trigger on the Auralic G1 and it’s arriving next week. The G1’s wireless capabilities are appealing to me and will allow me to get the Mac out of my system. I’ll give the G1 a few days of continuous burn in before I judge it and compare it to the CD player transport (remember the Marantz player is over 20 years old). I hope it’s at least as good or better than the CD. If it isn’t, I’m down the shipping cost, and back to spinning discs. I also like the concept and flexibility of the CD player with digital inputs such as the Luxman 03x that was mentioned in this thread so this may be my fallback option. I’ll report back on what I hear from the Auralic.
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I'm using a Oppo 105 fed into my Marantz SR7005 for CD's. Comparing it to streaming was pretty close. However, Just picked up a MHDT Orchid. I was so impressed with the SQ when streaming, I decided to hook the Oppo up to it and bypass the internal DAC. Now my CD's sound amazing! SQ noticeably better than streaming. Probably wont go back to full time CD's, but its nice to know its an excellent alternative. |
@georgehifi
George I also have faith in the Marantz. I know what I’m looking for from the player and I have a pretty good idea of my system‘s capabilities. We’ll see how it goes. |
This is my thought. I understand in the audio world that you can’t put a band-aid on equipment that is subpar. It is only as good as the limitations of the electronics. It took me a while to figure this out. I’m currently using a Cary Audio DMS600 DAC/Streamer that does both Tidal & Qobuz. I run it with a Cary Audio SLP-05 Preamp with the upgrade and with the Cary Audio CAD805 AE (Anniversary Edition) Monoblock amplifiers. My Turntable is a Clearaudio Reference with an Ayre PX5e Phono Preamp. My CD Player is a Sony SCD1 ES. I’m happy and love the sound all three sources put out. My Cary DMS600 gets as close to my other sources and I’m extremely happy. Streaming is coming along as technology improves. Pick a system you will be happy with and enjoy the music.
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Audio streaming. It’s a good place to find new music, or provide background, other than that? Meh. I prefer the simplicity of physical media.
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Audio streaming. It’s a good place to find new music, or provide background, other than that? Meh. I prefer the simplicity of physical media. Agree, good way to look at it. Then go and buy the most uncompressed (most green boxes) CD version of it here http://dr.loudness-war.info/ which is usually the first release, or the vinyl. Cheers George |
Have yet to hear a CDP that’s clearly better than Linn’s first gen Klimax with power supply upgrade, let alone their latest Katalyst version which is quite mind blowing. I have heard a lot... esoteric, playback, dCS, Ayre, EMM, Naim, etc.
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Audio streaming. It’s a good place to find new music, or provide background, other than that? Meh. I prefer the simplicity of physical media.
What type of DAC and streamer are you using? I believe streaming has come a long way. Your gear definitely depends on the quality of the sound. If I was to pick, definitely prefer listening to music on my turntable. With the Clearaudio Goldfinger Statement Cartridge, very tough to beat. Some audiophile specialist did comment on my DAC/streamer was impressed how well it sounded. Some never thought it was as possible. At the end of the day, like I said, equipment combination makes all of the difference when it comes to the sound you’re looking for.
Happy listening😊 |
Update...
The Aries G-1 has about 48hrs of play time by now. I’ve been running it round the clock non-stop.
Initially it sounded a bit “new” but is evolving nicely. At this point I am running the Lightning DS with Qobuz and the HDD with my AIFF CD rips plugged into the rear of the Auralic. The Auralic sits on my wifi network.
I am pleasantly surprised so far with both the build quality and the sonics of this streamer - my expectations were exceeded and not by a small margin. There is that silent black background that I wasn’t able to achieve with the Mac Mini, better dynamics, better resolution and separation of instruments, more space around individual instruments and singers, wider and deeper soundstage.
I plan to run it in some more and do a listening session over the weekend.
Next steps are to try the Auralic as a Roon endpoint using my Mac Mini as a Roon core.
There are few things I’m not in love with but they’re all related to Lightning DS interface and have nothing to do with the sound. |
@audphile1 . Since your a Roon user, I’m wondering if you would have been better off just getting a Nucleus and connecting you DAC into it and let Roon handle your streaming? |
OP @audphile1 : thank you for coming back to your thread and giving an update to everyone. Not many people do so, as they disappear once they receive nice gents’ feedback and help.
Since you already have Roon, it will be a no brainer to let your Mac Mini handle the Roon Core duties and let your new “toy” handle the streaming duties. Then your issues with the proprietary Auralic streaming protocol will go away.
Enjoy!
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@gelle I thought about the Nucleus. However, I needed a wifi capability. Didn’t want to run more wires for an access point, EtherRegen, etc.
@thyname I felt like I owe you all an update.
Things I’m not in love with right off the bat...
1 - Lightning DS interface. Decent and would do if I haven’t seen Roon. 2 - Qobuz on Lightning DS...can’t see different versions of the album. Can’t see bitrate until you start playing the album or track. Also the artist and album info is not always available. 3. With the HDD connected to the back of Auralic, missing bunch of album artwork. That was never an issue with Roon. What would it take to incorporate a call to a Discogs API or other source to pull down the metadata for cover art...not much at all. Not sure why Auralic chose not to go down that path. Other than that, no major faults and as I said before, the sound quality is far beyond what I expected. Both the mac mini and the CD player are out of my system now.
One interesting observation - the USB into the Chord Qutest DAC sounds better than via coax digital cable. |
Decathlon,
i stream from my Moon Mind to my Moon Supernova CD player’s digital input, so whether streaming or playing a CD, the DAC is the same. Source material for streaming is either my laptop (ripped cds) via Ethernet connection, or tidal via Ethernet. I also stream radio paradise and some jazz channels.
the only thing I’m missing is a NAS to replace my laptop as the source for ripped cds. And an MQA compatible dac. And maybe better file management. Don’t forget a linear power supply. All that and more.
streaming has too many nits that need picking for me to get too deeply involved with it. Just call me Dino, I’m okay with it.
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“Audio streaming. It’s a good place to find new music, or provide background, other than that? Meh. I prefer the simplicity of physical media,”
“the only thing I’m missing is a NAS to replace my laptop as the source for ripped cds. And an MQA compatible dac. And maybe better file management. Don’t forget a linear power supply. All that and more. streaming has too many nits that need picking for me to get too deeply involved with it.”
@fundsgon,
It appears you have not explored all the available options. Streaming couldn’t be any more easier with a high quality dedicated audio servers. This is where ‘rubber meets the road’ and one gets to enjoy superlative SQ of streaming files. What you need to do is simplify your existing setup and go for one box device that allows streaming from Tidal / Qobuz, onboard internal storage for your rips and built-in internal DAC.
You were seeking advise on DAC’s to eventually replace your Simaudio Supernova not too long ago. If you’re serious about digital streaming, I would look into Aurender and Lumin brands that offers one box players with built in DAC and internal storage.
Hope this helps! |
Thanks Lalitk,
we’ll be looking for a replacement for our Supernova in the not too distant future. I would prefer to have a separate CD transport, and a DAC with streaming capabilities. Perfection would be a CD/SACD transport.
all the best. |
“Audio streaming. It’s a good place to find new music, or provide background, other than that? Meh. I prefer the simplicity of physical media,” “the only thing I’m missing is a NAS to replace my laptop as the source for ripped cds. And an MQA compatible dac. And maybe better file management. Don’t forget a linear power supply. All that and more. streaming has too many nits that need picking for me to get too deeply involved with it.” @fundsgon, “It appears you have not explored all the available options. Streaming couldn’t be any more easier with a high quality dedicated audio servers. This is where ‘rubber meets the road’ and one gets to enjoy superlative SQ of streaming files. What you need to do is simplify your existing setup and go for one box device that allows streaming from Tidal / Qobuz, onboard internal storage for your rips and built-in internal DAC”. “You were seeking advise on DAC’s to eventually replace your Simaudio Supernova not too long ago. If you’re serious about digital streaming, I would look into Aurender and Lumin brands that offers one box players with built in DAC and internal storage”. This is why I asked the question earlier and offered a simple solution with the Cary Audio DMS600. It’s not cheap but neither is buying multiple items just to try to reach the the same goal of Hi Fidelity. It is a Hi End Streamer and DAC all in one. Check it out for yourself. https://www.stereo.net.au/reviews/cary-audio-dms-600-network-audio-player-reviewhttps://www.stereophile.com/content/new-cary-dms-550-and-dms-600-network-audio-players-sli-100-integ...https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/dms-600-owner-review |
Interesting thread. I'm getting my system setup again after years of sitting in boxes. Lots of traveling and a move. With WFH likely to be my new normal it seemed time. I've been listening to CD's in rental cars until the last few months when I've been unable to get one with a player. I listen to ripped CD's on my workstation while I do work from home, or Photoshop (I'm a photographer) or Davinci Resolve, etc. I work in tech so work with server, databases, etc. As I'm setting up my listening room, I was looking into redbook players and found this thread about streaming. After reading the histrionics required for streaming I'm definitely going to stick with physical media. The other issue is that I'm thinking that a "no-internet zone" would be good for sanity in these times. I've always preferred the singular experience that comes along with an LP or CD that needs to be changed. Keeps me listening to the thing I've chosen rather than a stream of content flowing in the background. Probably another focus approach to keep me sane.
The idea of what sounds better is a concept that lost interest for me years ago when I realized that I was spending more time listening to the same few reference CD's to try out
all manner of: cables, power conditioners, gear, pucks, what have you. These days I just want to kick back and listen. Now excuse me while I go and obsess over what cheap redbook player to buy since my Micromega Stages haven't survived the move. |
Letch,
me too. My wife and I play albums and cd’s while sitting on our couch. We like looking at the covers and album notes, we find it very relaxing, and we connect. Streaming is good for background music so I’ll want to keep it as an option.
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I think it's a good option to have. Just wanted to chime in and rather than take a side over which may be "best" just point out that there are different modes to how we can listen as well as ways to listen. You get it. |
