My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!
So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:
Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series NAD M25 PARASOUND HALO PARASOUND CLASSIC KRELL TAS KRELL KAV 500 KRELL CHORUS ROTEL RMB 1095 CLASSE CT 5300 CLASSE CA 2200 CLASSE CA 5200 MCINTOSH MC 205 CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7 OUTLAW AUDIO 755 LEXICON RX7 PASS LABS XA 30.8 BUTLER AUDIO 5150 ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005
With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer. My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)
NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes) Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)
Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)
rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)
cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)
parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)
lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)
McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.
butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)
pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.
classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)
Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:
PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp. Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.
It is articulate sounding too Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either. Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!
So I wouldn’t say I’m a bass freak. Not at all. My most recent comments should prove that.
You assume that simply bc I find the Wilsons superior to the Maggies, bc in your mind that is the only reason one would reach that conclusion, based on your preconceived notions.
That’s way too simplistic. In reality, I find the Wilson DAW superior to the 20.7 in almost every way, except possibly in soundstage and perhaps a bit in quickness. But that’s personal preference. Others will disagree and that’s ok.
But as to bass, what I would say if the music calls for it, then the gear is inferior if it cannot produce. Even classical has deep bass on occasion, as you will surely recognize. That said, loose or boomy or overwhelming bass is decidedly worse sounding than a presentation that is too light on bass.
But give me the Collosseum and Sasha DAW, which hit the magical sweet spot across the board that I haven’t yet heard matched in the videos.
Recall that right after the very first Alexia 2 and Mephisto video, I was the one person who suggested that even there the bass may have been too much, and I think subsequently WC repositioned the speakers ( not based on my comment necessarily but just illustrating a sensitivity to excess bass and to counteract the allegation that I love bass - I guess I do but it’s gotta be done correctly )
All- i wanted to communicate to you all that i will no longer continue to post or update anything on this thread until there is a resolution put in place that addresses all the personal attacks i have been receiving from individuals who took it upon themselves to chase me, harass me day-in day-out and who came together to create a narrative that does not exist. I have been advised to not continue to engage with anyone who is constantly attacking me and to refrain from commenting on anything that is a direct hit at my character. At this time, i am taking a hiatus from this, but will continue to do what i have been doing on my other platform where i have full control of what is said about me and can block, delete or remove anything i feel is a personal hit against me in order to keep things running smoothly. Next month, it would have been the 4th year anniversary since i started this thread. Four years of sharing my story and journey with you all. However, i don’t have the time or energy to be fighting off the constant attacks because i do have other responsibilities that i have to prioritize in my life (job, daughter, wife, my health) Once again, THANK YOU to those of you who have had my back from day 1 and please do not hesitate to find my email and connect with me.
Sorry to read this. I have enjoyed and learned from this thread and intensely dislike ad hominem attacks. Hopefully the moderators will set this straight so that you can continue.
It is too bad that they won’t do anything about this. I see posts which are nothing more than simple discussion get removed, yet someone whose only purpose is to ruin everyone else’s fun is allowed to continue with whatever they please. Which is why my previous comment about what is the need to remain on this forum. Any simple discussions bring out the trolls, and if you respond then you get posts removed.
Not a smart decision Jay, the interactions and audio discussions are tedious at times, but are for some of us the reason we watch the videos. The limited commentary on youtube does not at this point come close to what we have here. For me personally being in Europe excludes me from almost every video with music, they are simply blocked because of copyright issues, and the comment section is not even open. Yes you get rid of the Trolls, but you get rid of some of your regular followers in the process too.
Jay, I respect all you do, as well as your last post. Personal attacks against anyone are never appropriate, although respectful differences of opinion should be welcomed. Respectful disagreements often open the door to more insights from both parties. In that spirit, I will respond to grey9hound below. I hope you and some others will find it useful.
grey9hound, My experience has confirmed what you say about the naturalness of some tube equipment. In the early 80's, I tried an ARC SP6B preamp. It had an openness that was superior to the SS preamp I had then. The HF were slightly rolled off, but I enjoyed the ARC overall. Later, I tried the Theta preamp, which was better in every way than my SS preamp. With top Roger Modjeski tubes it was better still, although I noted how the midrange became cooler. But when I got the SS Spectral DMC 10 gamma preamp, it was better in every way than the Theta. By this time, SS was improving so that it became natural.
I wonder what SS pieces you compared against your tube pieces. For what may be the ultimate tube amp, Mike Fremer wrote about the VAC 452 iQ in the May 2020 Stereophile. He found it superior in almost every way to his reference SS amps, except for a little politeness and lessening of bass slam, and a slight smoothing over of fine low level detail associated with less "pop." Fremer has Wilson Alexx speakers, and I imagine WC may consider the $150K monos or the $75K stereo to be his most enjoyable amp if he tries it against the Mephisto.
Post removed
Admin Audiogon Official
Personal attacks on the author of this thread or on any member that comments here will not be tolerated. All posts should be on topic.
WC, I’m glad that you let us hear the ML first without room correction, so that we can later compare with rc. I suspect that rc will not only help with the bass frequencies, but it will seem to help with other frequencies as well. At that point, the ML can truly be compared with the Maggies or even the Wilsons. For me, at this point, I would prefer the Wilsons overall.
Thanks audiogon. It’s the best thing personal attacks won’t be tolerated anymore. In all my time here , I would say viber has had the most of personal attacks here. And yet he never ever complained about it, and always responded with respect and on topic... That is a real class act, an example to follow for sure. I have also have had my share of troll naming , but never deserved that title as I always brought explained thoughts and arguments. Hoping the new rules will keep that kind of disrespect from happening again.
Ok, So now that we are all back on track and clear on what won't be tolerated anymore, here are a couple of thoughts on my current state on the 13a:
i opened my room correction kit and i am missing the USB to mini usb cable so i need to run to best buy to buy that cable so i can do the room correction hopefully today
i was checking the bass volume settings of the speaker and i had the knob at level 6 out of 10 so we can assume this was part of the issue why i was having way too much bass
I hope to have the chance to buy the cable i am missing so i can run the room correction today. I am just as excited to see what happens to the sound, but i will say that with the logans, the room correction will also help the panel sound clearer for sure. I remember this being the case when i owned the 15a. More to come!
Excellent, and thanks for returning. No doubt the room correction will improve the 13A a lot. Just don't take it too literally according to some algorithm which is often too objective. What is correct according to measurements is often not what sounds best to you. For example, you might like the bass volume setting at 4 or 5, and I might like it at 2 or 3. Yeah, I know I have my bias against bass, because often it muddies the higher freq, which is what the voice sounded like on the 13A with the setting of 6, in the opening of Q&A/Fink. But when I turn my bass down with my EQ, I do get the increase in clarity in the higher freq, mainly because these are emphasized relative to the bass. The art is to do it judiciously, not too much so you are missing the melody of the bass. Another way to look at this is that suppose the 13A bass drivers and cabinet will never be of the quality of the Alexia 2. I might still want to avoid the lesser quality of the bass of the 13A and use the setting of 2, whereas with the Alexia 2 enjoy the superior bass quality and get the quantity of bass equivalent to the setting of 4 on the 13A.
There is actually not one correct tonal balance. It all depends on the room. Even for live music, a large piano sounds heavy like an elephant in a smaller room, so a smaller piano is a better match. But the large piano is more appropriate for a large stage in a concert hall. Ultimately your ear determines what is best for you in your own room.
After all the posts you received here I don't think one more wouldn't hurt. Also appreciate these great reviews and the time you took out to evaluate each of them in your own words. I think I would agree with the Pass Labs as a very good choice. Keep in mind once you reach 1300 posts the thread is deleted. Just kidding!
Excellent video WC. I especially appreciated the dac direct myth. You were very clear about that one with all dacs south of six figures. That really should hopefully quiet some of the blabbering wisdom often spouted in these pages on the thread.
Well, you are toning down your insults about viewpoints that differ from your own. You used to use words like "we don't need your crap" but now you say, "that really should hopefully quiet someofthe BLABBERING WISDOM (my capitalizing)often spouted in these pages on the thread." It is still best to say that you disagree, and explain why, in a dignified manner. Techno just made a good post which is factual in nature.
WC was about to stop posting here because he was tired of the negativity. Even slight negativity often leads to a chain reaction of escalating negativity as people react to it. Please say what you want without negativity. You will get the respect you deserve, and maintain the high level of conversation of this thread. Thank you.
First, it wasn’t my opinion that preamps are nearly always superior to dac direct, except POSSIBLY when you have a six figure dac. That is WC’s opinion, which he clearly articulated in the video. Watch it.
Second, I didn’t call anyone out with my statement. But it is often repeated here on this thread by you and others that dac direct is always better. Of course you have typically never heard the combo in question, that goes without saying. You only rely on what you believe to be historically true based on outdated information. Not current products.
Listen, I don’t have a strong opinion on the matter, because I know enough not to talk out of my .... when I haven’t heard the equipment. But WC does have a strong opinion on it. So much so he made it one of his TOP 10 MYTHS. His statements, not mine. Watch the video. Again, no personal attack intended, and not sure how that could have even be reasonably interpreted.
”Blabbering wisdom” phrase chosen simply because that is what typically feeds misguided myths, and this one apparently so pronounced that it makes WC’s top 10.
All I was doing was amplifying WC’s point about preamps being superior in almost all cases to dac direct. Why amplify?
Because all too often WC will very clearly make his opinion known on a point like this, and then a day later you pronounce the exact opposite and claim it as fact and say WC also thinks that. Twisting reality.
Just putting a marker down here on the thread that WC has spoken on this issue, after dozens of trials to form his opinion.
So in three days don’t try to convince him dac direct is better. That is a top 10 myth, after all. Watch the video and learn.
And in case you missed the significance of it being a top 10 myth, let me point out by continually pushing the myth, you are the prime perpetrator of the myth, on this thread anyway. So if anyone should tone things down, I suggest you stop pushing the dac direct myth (WC’s myth selection, not mine)
Hi guys, I would like to articulate things a bit further here in regards to using a dac as a preamp:
A dac can certainly do a good job as a preamp, but it is very system dependent.
The more inefficient the speaker, the more a preamp is needed
I have used my dcs rossini with a clock straight into my Mephisto and it simply can not keep up with what the Momentum HD preamp did. It sounds less "full", not as controlled.
If you listen at comfortable volume levels and your speakers have powered woofers i can say a dac should suffice as a preamp
A good dac such as DCS, MSB, ETC should be more than plenty of a preamp than using something like a parasound preamp for example. In this scenario i would totally use the dac if i can’t afford a better preamp.
Your speakers, amplifier and listening habits will dictate what works best for you, but this IS NOT applicable to everyone. There is no "global" law that we should all follow.
I can understand why some people prefer a dac direct into their amps, but it would be interesting to know their speakers, room size, and volume levels they listen at. I PERSONALLY have always found brightness when cranking up dacs too much. They become a bit "fatiguing" over long listening sessions at moderate to loud volume levels. They have a volume "sweet spot" that you need to stay within or else they become a bit too much.
I suppose it is fair to point out that WC’s preamps that led him to the conclusion are generally top of line. Maybe it doesn’t extend to budget level preamps that would fit with Vibers Mytek amp. That may be possible. I don’t know.
... The more inefficient the speaker, the more a preamp is needed ...
Why? Of course, whatever drives the power amplifier must have sufficient gain for the amp to reach rated output. But the efficiency of the speaker has nothing to do with it.
Maybe the point whitecamaross is trying to make is that if a preamp has inefficient gain to drive the power amp to acceptable volume levels than inefficient speakers will make this situation even worse. On the other side some preamps like passives, require a higher gain amp to get the desired results.
Hey guys, let’s stop talking about who says what about dac, vs preamp, or arguing about any subject. We should be able to have a simple discussion on subjects, knowing we each have our own opinions and that’s ok. I like listening g to others ideas and why they feel the way they do, even when I may not agree. It gives me insight to their logic, and maybe let’s me see things differently.sometimes there’s more than one way, as jay mentioned above. It’s not always right or wrong, and in every case, it’s about what’s right for you, dosnt mean it right for everyone, but you’re the only one that matters on your own system. We need to understand we all have different needs and likes.
Preamp or no preamp...guys the solution is simple. In 2020, there are lots of full analog preamplifiers with excellent dac modules included. Some as options you can build on your needs...( phono section , etc. ) TODAY, this is the best someone can do, as you get the best of both worlds. You don’t have to go full out big money on a separate dac these days. Well implemented dac modules in preamps and in integrateds do the job. Dacs are the most difficult audiophile jewelry to tell apart, blowing crazy $ on a dac doesn’t mean more performance anymore.
There is a certain element of truth to the fact that dacs are getting better and better and cheaper offerings are really making things quite difficult to choose a super expensive one over a cheaper one. I do not disagree with that statement in most cases, but as you go up the ladder with regards to the rest of your system, the differences will be more obvious. Please remember, a $5,000 powercord won’t make a receiver sound like separates. You have to be logical with your assessment of components.
As far as to why i think having a preamp is almost "mandatory" with difficult loads is because i have personally experienced this. Take for instance my 20.7 Magnepans; They do not come to life until you give them volume so if you are expecting a WOW effect at low volume then you will sitting in your chair waiting and you will soon realize you gotta give it "gas" to make them wake up. I am not disagreeing that some of you guys are getting excellent results with using a Dac straight into your amps. I think that combo worked well for me as well when i owned other speakers and amps, but it wouldnt work with my current set up. Another speaker that was super power-hungry that i owned was the Dynaudio Confidence C4 Platinum. Those swallowed juice and i also suspect that a dac would work as a preamp UP UNTIL a certain volume level, but once you go above that threshold , the presentation gets too in your face and it comes more at you without opening up. When you push the gas pedal on the dac, the sound becomes a little too in your face (in most cases, not all) and it does not open up. When you introduce a well-designed linestage and you give it gas, the sound opens up from top to bottom, side to side, the control is far greater and the presentation does not have this sense of "directionality" that you get with a dac as a preamp.
@kren: i ran the room correction and shot a video today of the logans with room correction engaged. You all saw the before and after graph i posted so we shall see what you guys think. I do not want to give an opinion just yet because i want to give you all the chance to listen first and let an adult debate take place. Makes sense?
Preamp or no preamp...guys the solution is simple. In 2020, there are lots of full analog preamplifiers with excellent dac modules included. Some as options you can build on your needs...( phono section , etc. )
As far as to why i think having a
preamp is almost "mandatory" with difficult loads is because i have
personally experienced this. Take for instance my 20.7 Magnepans; They
do not come to life until you give them volume ...
But the power for your speakers comes from your amplifier, not the preamplifier. Don't get me wrong - I'm squarely in favor of using a good preamp. But that has nothing at all to do with choice of speakers, or whether a speaker is a tricky load for the amp.
Yes I agree but the power of the amp is completely driven by your preamp. Even if you have 2,000 watts of power for a magnepan, you will tax the volume of the dac far earlier than you will with a preamp in the mix. The preamp can use that power of the amp and manage it better than most dacs can in this specific scenario. Let's not forget about the brightness induced after a certain volume level with a dac being used as a preamp.
I know you asked techno the question but thought I'd chime in. I have the Mola Mola Makua preamp with the optional DAC installed and really love it....One less PC and pair of IC's.
Well, I just finished recording a third video which will address all these questions above... One was with the dcs straight into the mephisto and the other one was with the preamp in the mix. This will answer many questions.
I have a video scheduled for tomorrow around 12pm Eastern which will show you how the martin logan 13a sound with room correction applied and the second video with the preamp in the mix will be released onTuesday night. That will make it 4 videos with the martin logan 13a. I plan to do 4 or Maybe 5 videos total with them and then we will circle back to the Alexia 2 and let’s see what happens :)
Before I forget, there is a huge system upgrade arriving Monday night. 108 lbs of speed, slam, tremendous control AND precision is what I have been told. Will it live up to the expectation? Will it be the best preamp I have ever owned? Can it dethrone the Gryphon Pandora? Stay tuned to find out :)
Finally, I plan to put together an "affordable" system here and compare against an "expensive" system in order to hear what you get with more money or maybe what you don’t get? Here is what I am doing:
System A Martin Logan/Magnepan Parasound JC1+ monos Dragon PCs on parasound Merrill audio preamp Dcs dac with clock Gryphon VIP Series Speaker cables Cardas clear beyond xlr
VERSUS
System B: Gryphon Mephisto Gryphon Pandora/Secret preamp Dragon Pc on mephisto Wilson Audio alexia 2 Secret speaker cables Dcs Rossini with clock Dragon pc on dac Gryphon VIP Series xlr
There s pluses and minuses to separates vs integrated. You should get great synergy with an integrated. One issue could be that one portion is that one component might be an after thought as opposed to a full commitment to the same level as the rest of the unit. Another issue might be that you like another component better, like a tube phono stage when using a solid state integrated. You can tailor to preferences better with separates, while integrated can cost less, and simplify the setup. Certainly don’t need so many expensive interconnect cables with integrated. A case can be made for both, it just depends on the individuals preferences.
@grey9hound, I second ron17's pick the Mola Mola Makua, and add the Vinnie Rossi L2i SE using DHT tubes and loading it up with DAC and Phono, superb integrated.
"Benchmark LA-4: $2499 without remote $$$ Benchmark’s usual approach to design is to out-spec the competition, and so it is here. Like other Benchmark equipment he has tested, the affordable LA-4 challenged the resolution of JA’s test instruments, with "superb" channel separation, "extremely low noise, and virtually no power-supply-related spuriae." Restricting his measurement to the audio band, JA found an "astonishing" S/N ratio of 105.5dB for both channels; it remained extremely low across the audioband. He summed up: "Benchmark’s LA4 is the widest-bandwidth, widest-dynamic-range, lowest-noise, lowest-distortion preamplifier I have encountered." In his listening room, KR compared the LA-4 to a cable—and couldn’t hear any difference. He concludes, "the LA4 is probably the most transparent and revealing audio component I’ve ever used. It does not seem to leave any fingerprints on the sound." (Vol.43 No.1, WWW) "
A few folks with $20K preamps changing to this one. I was thinking of getting the Mola Mola Makua myself but wanted to hear the LA4/HPA4 since it seemed comparable to the Makua at 1/5th the price.
BTW - I mentioned this preamp about 2 years ago on this thread but I got the expected feedback then. Today, a lot of people seem to be coming around to this world beater. That is if you like an uncolored preamp.
Jay - respectfully, the efficiency of speakers hasn't impacted the performance of our DAC straight to our amplifiers. We've run high efficiency Wilson and much lower efficiency EgglestonWorks and our DAC (Meridian 861v8, Pass XA-200.5's) just plain works. While the room certainly plays it's part, I think in this case - the components have a much greater influence on the necessity of a great pre-amp. Just my experience. I'm confident I speak for many when I say "we're enjoying all you do."
WC - looking for ward to the videos you mentioned!
kren0006 - I agree with viber6, regarding the negativity. I hope we can keep this thread going. Yes, when I read your post, I absolutely interpreted it to be pointed at viber6, so I don't believe viber6 was being overly sensitive. That kind of thing just doesn't need to be said. I also agree with speedbump6, we all have different needs and likes.
Alright, let’s break this down. 1. A myth, any myth, only exists due to spread of false information.
2. WC declared dac-direct bettering preamp a myth in his video. Not just any myth, but a top 10 myth.
3. I said I hope WC declaration would put a halt to “blabbering wisdom” perpetuating the myth.
4. Without question, Viber stokes this myth on this thread. (Remember I didn’t define the myth, declare it a myth, or declare it a top 10 myth). Probably very soon Viber will revert to pushing the myth again, if history any guide.
So how is that overly negative? Have I ever, even once, previously complained about Viber perpetrating WC’s myth? No.
But when WC on his channel calls it one of 10 biggest myths in audio, it’s fair to emphasize that. It’s also fair to read into it that he probably doesn’t appreciate being commanded to continually use dac direct, given how wrong he apparently views such advice (else it wouldn’t be a top 10 myth).
If you disagree that it should be a myth or top 10, don’t come at me, take it up with WC.
i suspect Viber’s unhappiness is much more with the rebuke from WC dismantling his cherished myth than he is with me saying “blabbering wisdom” (the horrors!).
You must have a verified phone number and physical address in order to post in the Audiogon Forums. Please return to Audiogon.com and complete this step. If you have any questions please contact Support.
