members with no feedback?

I did it one time. Never again. Was told the Totem's were 6 months old, an e-mail to Totem confirmed they were 9 years old. I payed via paypal immediately, only to get the run-a-round for a month until I finally disputed it with paypal and Visa. Money was retuned to my account within 24 hours.

I was fortunate to have no issues when I became a new member on Audiogon. I bought and sold items and quickly built up my positive feedback. In fact, I bought and sold so much, so quickly that I built up more feedback than most of the Audiogon registered dealers, when suddenly, one day I received an e-mail from the Audiogon staff that I was now going to have to register as a dealer. After several e-mail exchanges I convinced Audiogon that I wasn't a dealer...and by the way, I am still NOT a dealer. (o:

In addition to my encounter with the A'gon buyer w/no FB I posted above, I had another one on Fee-bay a few years ago.

Back when Fee-bay sellers didn't have to take paypal, & could offer money order, personal check, whatever, I listed an expensive item "BIN", clearly stated no paypal, cashier's check only. Of course someone with no FB, bought it, then started demanding to pay by paypal. No matter how many times I explained that I hadn't offered paypal, & that he shouldn't buy items unless he agreed to the terms, he didn't care, didn't get it, seemed incapable of understanding the concept. Then he wanted a local friend of his to come over to my "store", had assumed I had a B&M "store".

I read a FB given by a Seller on Fee-bay once about a troublesome Buyer: "Typical Newbie: Me, Me, Me, Me, Me....." Doesn't mean all Newbies are "bad" at all, but there's a possibility of being Totally Clueless....

Ya gotta start somewhere!

If you have no feedback yet, you should expect special, or extra scrutiny on your first transaction, especially if you are selling something. No way I would do anything in that instance unless there was an escrow arrangement. Stuff on here, in general is too expensive, and there are too many crooks out there.

Also Wpines, did you really complain that you accepted multiple offers and someone left you bad feedback? That shows a lack of integrity right there. Why would you do that? Once you accept an offer, it's done. You get paid, then you ship it. If you were going to take another offer, because of no payment for a certain amount of time, then you should have contacted the original buyer, and given them a deadline, and put the other buyer on hold; because you already made a deal. That's the kind of feedback I am interested in when someone has something for sale.

While I have spoken on the phone on some transactions, I find phone conversations a bit sketchy. 99% of my transactions (and I've had a number of them) have been without phone conversations, 1% with phone conversations. Too often, I'm afraid the folks I've spoken to I'd rather not have spoken to. (some strange folks out there!) But if you are buying from a person w/o feedback you're sort of stuck with the need to establish their credibility as a legitimate seller.

“How do you deal with zero feedback sellers?”

Carefully. Or not at all.

Much of my comments here are based on the $$$ involved. More $$$? More concern. One has to choose at what level can you be comfortable if all goes down the drain and take those measures necessary to CYA, OR forget about it.

Feedback too isn’t the ‘end all be all’

Basically I think the biggest portion of folks selling these sorts of items here that wwe want as a community are honest people. So gaining info and getting on the same page with them is integral.

Never think of their piece as being the only one in existence or that you’ll never see another from some other seller!

Trust your gut instincts during the phone call you have to make. If indeed you want what they have so severely, an actual person to person phone conversation must occur. Such a call ought to be to their land line, not their cell ph.

Be wary of the demeanor and personality of the seller or buyer.

Get evidence they have the thing! Ask for photos that are time and date stamped.

Prior Ebay, and Paypal sales feedback is helpful too.

If you have any worries at all, simply forget about it and move on, unless both of you can commit to using an Escrow Co. to facilitate and safeguard the deal between you both.

COD can stand for Crap On Delivery as the box can not be opened and inspected prior to payment to the carrier is made…. And if it ain’t right inside the box thereafter, the driver ain’t giving you back your certified funds. Count on that!

Get on the exact same page with the seller on how the item is to be shipped and/or packed. Double boxed. Orig Factory packing? On a skid? Which carrier? Condition of the containers, bubbled up and no peanuts. Declared value expressed and paid for? Etc.

I’ve paid extra to have a thing shipped out on a skid. If it’s a pricey enough item this recourse could be a life saver…. Or plan a road trip for yourself… if possible! Again, depending on the $$$ at risk.

I’m as if not more so, cautious about sellers that do not correspond by phone outright, or are difficult to gain info from about the piece in question. EX age, orig owner, model & or serial number, and again, the overall tone of the seller too.

If they’ve no time for a phone to phone convo, I’ve usually no time for buying what they’re selling. Private seller or dealership, it makes no diff to me then.

One thing about folks with little feedback also can mean little experience in this sort of affair too. And I do mean ignorance in fact. Inexperience is a problem all unto itself and apart from the deal that might or might not happen. Like packing up the item safely for instance.

As a buyer your feedback should be posted for you first anyways. When it’s all said and done, submit appropriate feedback wether or not they supply feedback for you is another topic. You’re done. Just waiting on them to fulfill their part of the covenant.

SELLING
If selling to no feedback or very little (<5 deals and all as buyer) arrange payment via US Postal Money order, and coach them to save and make copies of their MO receipts. If something bad happens during shipping, you’ll be very glad you did this bit.

The most notable thing with the inexperienced is buyer’s remorse IMHO.

Newbie buyers can think of private member/sellers as actual stores like Sears or Best Buy, or something. During the exchange, life can up and happen, they can be overly critical, remorseful, or simply change their minds and demand their money back even though the piece met the sales criteria. In short they can be fickle. I feel it’s due more so to their fears and unwarranted expectations than anything else… but such can and does happen.

In short, I’m a pretty big believer in this one principal… If it’s meant to be, then it will. If not that one item, then some other, and the others that have come to me are likely as good and usually better than the one I wanted to pursue in the first place.

As important here aside from the buyer seller deal is the shipper…. They scare me more often than the buyers or sellers, every time!

Reasonableness, common sense, communication, and prudence on both ends will go a long ways to help things go smoothly.

Hhh
I feel more comfortable when a seller has feedback going back a couple of years. If I see one new with no feedback and asking for payment only in the form of a personal check or money order I slink away. Hey its human not to trust their are many a scam artist.

Schipo

When you joined Audiogon did you start with feedback? There is always a starting line.

Feedback or not, NOTHING beats a phone call to sense the ''personnality'' of the buyer. If I stumble on anything looking (meaning mostly sounding) like a wheeler-dealer fast-talking mister know-it-all, that's all I need to go to the next contestant. Very subjective of course, but it has worked for me so far.

If I was buying from a seller with zero feedback, I'd ask him to ship the item to me first, then I would pay. If he would ask why, it would be very simple...

"You have zero feedback, I have over 300. I have proven my trustworthiness, you have yet to demonstrate yours." If he didn't like that, I'd just move on.

After all, we aren't dealing with a store where you always plunk your money down first, and where you have recourse. There is simply no reason that you need to send the money first in this case.

No,I'm not kidding.

Someone with an Audiogon rating of 300 is not more trustworthy than a person who has no feedback because they have neither bought nor sold anything here?

I did not say anything in my post about anyone with any Audiogon rating not being trustworthy.Please don't twist my words.

It is earned, not assumed.

I did not say trust should be assumed.You are the one that is assuming trust with your statement above.

I remember my first transaction and I was nervous that the seller wouldn't sell to me because of it. So I was extra nice and communicative to make sure it went well. That's what first time buyers and sellers should do-establish trust.

I totally agree and this was exactly how all transactions should occur.

Good points Justlisten. I do the things you mentioned too. I probably should have said there is less to be concerned with as a seller than a buyer. That chargeback 2 months after the sale from Paypal seems like something that you could have taken to litigation.

"Some members seem to forget that they had no feedback at one time. Why do they feel that they are more worthy of trust than others are?"

You're kidding, right? Someone with an Audiogon rating of 300 is not more trustworthy than a person who has no feedback because they have neither bought nor sold anything here? Not in my book! I remember my first transaction and I was nervous that the seller wouldn't sell to me because of it. So I was extra nice and communicative to make sure it went well. That's what first time buyers and sellers should do-establish trust. It is earned, not assumed.

Foster-9 said "as a seller there is very little to be concerned with"-

I beg to differ -having gone through a PayPal chargeback for over $4000 on an item I sold 2 months prior---there are considerable risks from my opinion.

I do my homework in any transaction, especially for a no-feedback buyer. Has he or she ever contributed in the Forums? When did they sign up? Are they selling anything themselves?

If I were to sell to a brand new buyer with no feedback, I would almost certainly require payment by US Postal Money order

As a buyer I'd only use Paypal or Amex, that way I would feel I had some backup if the deal was less than forthright. I'm very cautious of Money Order only transactions now, every time I've been stung that was the sole means of payment accepted!!!!!!

My integrity comes before all else in my personal conduct.
That said, whoever judges "feedback" at this site gave me a negative.
I sold a JL F113 sub to a buyer who actually called me, talked with me and funded my Paypal account with my asking price.
Another buyer had made an offer (which I accepted) but did not fund my account.
PS - There were 6 other subs for sale at the same price at the same time but the disgruntled party filed a complaint and I got slapped with a negative feedback.
No feedback and even negative feedback is meaningless.
Talk with the seller and determine their integrity FOR YOURSELF... just like everything else in life!

The last time I had a potential Buyer with no A'gon feedback, he was local, & called me. I was selling a mint condition one mo. old TT. It was a weird conversation where he was asking some very odd questions, like, "what did I do for a living", he seemed very suspicious, like he thought even A'gon members with great feedback were selling fake items or something. Oh, & he also insisted that I deliver, & set up, the TT for him.

After about 10 minutes of this, I finally told him, he should go to a dealer, & buy a brand new one, if he wasn't comfortable buying used. Then he said, "oh, well maybe that means you're actually legitimate" (!!?).

Next day, I sold it to an A'gon member with good FB, happy transaction for both of us, no BS.

some type of escrow transaction is the only way I would do it

I get to know the person, and finalize the transaction once I'm comfortable the person is legitimate. Feedback on A'gon isn't the only way a person can learn about online purchasing or selling, and other things like good faith, and honesty.

Some members seem to forget that they had no feedback at one time.Why do they feel that they are more worthy of trust than others are?I'm sure glad the first member I dealt with didn't have this attitude.

For member (seller) without any feedback, I would deal with them if only the transaction involves smaller dollar amount to minimize risk.

If you are the seller there is very little to be concerned about. If you are the buyer you can ask the seller if they have feedback elsewhere (like Ebay). I've bought from individuals that had substantial good feedback on Ebay, but little or no feedback here. I've also heard of COD (cash on delivery) payment. and using escrow, but have no experience with either. Short of this, I'd move on.

I usually wait to see if a member with good feedback makes an offer. I am more likely to take an offer, even if a little lower, from someone with good feedback. Not a guarantee, but a little more reassurance. Also, I wait a day or two after receiving the money in Paypal to make sure the account is still good.

I have had some very interesting experiences with some low feedback members which have led me to to be very cautious. While it is true that everyone starts sometime do you REALLY want to be the one who has to explain that "BUYING" something involves sending actual money and not saying that you will come and pick it up from several hundred miles away sometime in the future.

Everyone starts out here with zero feedback.

I get payment via Paypal or Money Order. If transaction goes smoothly, then they get their first Positive feedback.

Every member here had no feedback at one time.