I have been a consumer of audio gear for 30 years now. I have owned McIntosh, Krell, Conrad Johnson, Marantz, Perraux, Revox, and top end Sony, Yamaha, Teac 3340, Nak Dragon. Tubes & SS epuipment. I liked/loved/hated all at one point.
McIntosh cost are higher for many reasons. 1 overlooked fact is Americans handcraft each one in NEW YORK where the cost of living is higher. The comany has been on the cutting edge in amp research since it started. No other company even comes close to the number of Pat. McIntosh owns in amps!
McIntosh DVD players are always playing catch up and may not be the best value.
Looks and performance. Outstanding. Sold the Krell Amp KAV 300 because lack of involvement no meters. I wanted more than a box with led light, beautiful heat sicks. Don't get me wrong This is a wonderful amp. As far as the sound goes. B&W 801 s3 with Sigma IC's I could not hear any difference Just being honest. I don't have 100% McIntosh eqipment in the 3 rooms. But all have McIntosh amps.
If you are careful and buy a used amp lets say MC 602 New $8500.00 Used $5000 average. I would willing to bet a buck in 10 years you will still have a outstanding amp and be able to sell it for more. Just due to inflation, demand, and the fact that these are the best amps in the world. The reason I have owned so many different tpyes of equipment is I wanted to save a buck. But always compaired what I had to McIntosh. Once I purchased my First McIntosh I quit compairing and have setteled for the best. What a piece of mind. And if and when I do upgrade again I will just smile. |
I have just finished re-designing my system. It now comprises: Genesis APM-1 speakers, McIntosh C41 pre-amp, MC352 power amp (both replacing my previous MA6800 integrated amp), MCD7010 player (a change from YBA CD 3 Delta), Thorens TD2001 record player + Synergistic Research Resolution Reference cables with active shielding + Fadel Art Hotline Plus. The final tweak will be replacing the current pre-amp with the C2200 model, funds and wife permitting. This will be the ultimate crowning of my quest for a personal musical Holy Grail.
I am not an audiophile. I wouldn't know an aliquot tone if it jumped and bit me you know where. I also don't care whether the sound of a wrapper coming off a boiled sweet emanates from the 7th or the 9th row of the concert hall. However, I like my music, and Mac's gear simply hits the spot for me. It looks great, its reliability is legendary and its musical performance first rate (at least in my humble opinion). Put together, it produces wonderful synergy. |
Although it was bought by Japanese company, they did not reveal and release their transformer technology. This is why MC-275 is still, to me, the best sounding amp. |
Porziob: Single Ended Triodes in the 21 Century! Who'da thunk it? People vote with their pocketbooks so in looking at how well McIntosh is doing, I'd say they got elected. If they don't get your vote, that's fine. I think they are aware of the transistors low impedance and it's more about impedance matching: lower it for tubes, raise it for transistors. Bottom line is if there was only one way to do things, everything else would be falling by the wayside and I don't see that happening. |
I had an MA6900 for 6 months but couldn't get it to sound pleasing even after changing sources cables etc. It was beautiful and the build quality was outstanding. But, I sold it here and the new owner sold it within 2 months; said it was 2 dimensional. I'd have to agree. |
prozoib, been waitin a year now to see that killer rig of yours,i guess you only give answers. |
Autoformers in the 21st Century! Who`da thunk it? Guess it takes time for the fact that transistors are low impedence output devices to reach Stone Age Binghamton. |
Autoformers on pwr. amps in the 21st century. Who da thunk it? Guess it takes time for the news that transistors are low impedence output devices to reach Stone Age Binghamton. |
Can't say I agree with the above comment at all, but we all hear what we hear, I have found electronics can make a huge difference in the sound. Speakers, in my opinion are last in the chain, they certainly can change the sound but do they make it better?? I believe higher performing speakers can make the sound better as long as you have the proper source and electronics to do so.
I mean if you hook up a 20 yr old cd player and a 100 technics reciever to say the 10,000 Martin Logans...you will get a sound...will it be good ?? I doubt it.
The store that I frequent ( and they carry Mac) does an intersting demo, they have in their low end room, small speakers...nad,denon etc, they play that thru a pair of pioneer bookshelfs around 200/pr...not bad....then they take the same speakers down to their hi end room and fire them up with a stack of Mac.....man what a difference, much better sound, the stands the speakers are on are more expensive than the speakers.
Anyway I use my Mac gear on a small pair of B&Ws around 900/pr....it just sings.
I own and have tried a fair amount of electronics thru those speakers, there are differences, some small some huge. |
I'm beginning to believe there is not much difference in any SS amplifiers/ Let me qualify that by saying that the Teac and a few other bottom feeders do sound pretty rough, but I really think that Sherwood (best sound for the money) and up sound pretty darn good. I would like to have a bunch of people who really think there is a huge difference, do double blind listening tests and see what the results are.
I have ownen and still have Bryston, McIntosh, Luxman, Rotel, Hafler, Fisher (Sanyo), Scott, and others, and other than reliability, I don't think there is a huge diference in sound. It's mostly about the speakers, and the room acoustics and synergy between the pieces in the system.
Tubes are definately better sounding than SS, on average, so I think it boils down to synergy and asthetic appeal.
Boy, this will start a flame war, but that's my 2 cents worth.
My friend has a system using a cheap Panasonic reciever only for the preamp and processor functions, using old Haflers for power and we both use Linus Arrays, built at the same time as front speakers, I'm using a Denon AVR-8000 pre-pro, with Bryston power amps and the same Linus Arrays as fronts. His system sounds better...synergy and room acoustics...
I use a Sherwood reciever and a DIY Seas speaker system for my TV and it sounds excellent...in the TV room..
Bedroom Panasonic reciever and DIY Eton system does not sound as good..
Speakers, room acoustics and system synergy...
Mac does hold it's value though...want to buy one? |
You have to like their styling. I don't.
Regards, |
JULES
out of everything i have ever saw wrote about mcintosh gear & how it sounds or what kind of buyer mac gear appeals to your comments are right on point.
mike. |
I have heard, read for years how marginal Mac gear is (audiophile wise). Had to get some brawn to drive a pair of Maggie 20.1's, and got a pair of 1201's to replace an older pair of MC275's. They are very nice, and easy on the ears, they also have responded quite surprisingly to tweaks (power cords, and feet). They now present a dead quiet background, and excelent frequency response. There might be some synergy with the ribbon tweeters in the 20.1's, because I am able to run them full, without a shunt resister.
Overall, I agree with the above comments, and am very happy they seem to be very active in the high-end once again.
Duane |
I own 5 pieces of Mac gear including both SS and tubes, i fully agree with the above post, Mac is 100 percent...the real deal,no games no gimmicks just pure great stuff. |
No other company has been as consistent as Mac, and is still around doing the same thing after being in the business for over 50 years.
No other company's products have better resale value.
Mac has a real engineering team with over 30 people, unlike some garage operation of other so called high end companies.
No other company has a bigger crowd of loyal repeat customers.
No other company has got the same open door policy and allows you to do factory tours like this: http://www.stereopal.com/McIntosh%20Intro.htm
And yes, I have a pair of MC275 IV and they sound awesome.
I believe Mac's reputation speaks for itself.
Simon |
I'm using a MC2200 & two MC2101 bridged to drive a pair of Watts & Puppies. Front end includes Levinson Reference Transport & DAC, Linn LP12 TT.
I've compared the MC setup against my other Levinson 26S pre & 30.5 power amp.
In general the Levinson produces a more clinical type of sound. However, as far as vocal and sonic quality, the MC will beat the ML decisively. The operatic vocal comes out very smooth & sounds like a voice with the MC.
Incidentally the ML 26s sounds decisively better than the new ML320 upon AB testing.
Running the MC2101 in bridge mode will have a much better imaging, sound stage and sound pressure. It is taking the best of both qualities out of ML & MC combined in one. |
I thought I'd chime in here on one of the reasons I think Mac is so great, at least for their solid state. It's their hand wound autoformers. I got this from something Ron C, of McIntosh, said awhile back. Transistors are not very linear compared to tubes. They get pushed around by speakers, which are not resistors. Mac designs the output stage to be as linear as possible within a certain design and type of transistor they're using then couple it to the autoformer. The output stage stays very linear while the other end of the autoformer deals with the reactive speaker. It seems Paul Speltz is enjoying success with his aftermarket autoformer. Imagine Macs experience with handwinding their own all these years plus they're matched for that specific amp. I hope I haven't butchered his explanation too much. |
They just look cool too. Like high end audio should look. I would take the aesthtics co these over Edge or Krell any day.
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you have a stereo for the ages... |
I agree that there isn't another brand that has the same consistently high resale value. Some models are more popular than others, but the tube stuff is REALLY popular. On two separate occasions, vintage MC275s recently sold on ebay for more than a brand new MC275 IV. There's a brand new MC275 IV for sale right now on ebay where the bid price is almost identical for what you can pay for a new one!
I bought an MC240 and MX110 off ebay and had servicing done (mostly recapping). Sounds really wonderful. Beautiful really, like real (live) music.
Of course, I haven't bathed my $9,000 interconnects in Hai Karate and gone over my speaker cables with a drowsing rod to test for "directionality," so maybe I haven't acheived the ultimate in transparency and other "high end" drivel.
But it sounds really great. |
I own the mc352 (350 wpc) and love the punch and detail it brought out for my b&w N802. I previously owned a conrad johnson mf2500 (240 wpc), and while I enjoyed that amp, I felt the speakers needed more punch. The mac provided that and much more. In imaging and musicality. So, from my point of view, a hardy recommendation for the newer Mcintosh amps. |
I would not own anything else. Pride of ownership, quality, sound, resale value. |
I know a guy who went from a Classe SSP (don't know the model but it was the biggest) and just got a McIntosh MX135 to replace it. He is thrilled with the change stating the Mc is clearer and livelier with more detail. I would say the MX132 is similar but not sure.... |
I am wondering about the MX132. If I can pick one up for near 2000 is it priced well for it's quality? |
If you're looking for a reciever and don't need remote control, I would imagine the 4280 would be good.
some info:
http://www.roger-russell.com/rcvrs.htm#mac4280
You can also try audioclassics.com |
I have only had this hobby for a couple of years and with a recent move to vinyl bought an MC2200 preamp. I have loved it. I also bought a Musical Fidelity NuVista preamp. The differences in sound between these pieces and my Anthem PrePro is so distinct it's hard to be believed. I finally realize how subjective equipment choice and evaluation is with higher end gear. I am going to sell my McIntosh and Musical Fidelity because of space considerations, and just run a phono stage through an Anthem D1 Statement.
Long winded, but the only reason that I didn't just buy a McIntosh MX119 to replace all was they don't have HDMI or IEEE1394 on the board any time soon that I know of. Anyway, it's like anything else it's what you like. But from an investment standpoint, it's a no brainer. They are worth what you pay because they hold their value so well. Ferrari's analogy was spot on with Rolls Royce v. Ferrari. They are different beasts, but equally satisfying depending on taste. If you are thinking about purchasing any McIntosh equipment go ahead and do it. You are almost garanteed not to lose money doing it if you decide to trade out of it.
Good luck.
PS - I did try a Mac 501 amp setup for my Maggies and hated it. But it sounded great with a friends Joseph Audio Gear. |
mac is an iconoclistic brand like harley-davidson. i like their sound (some don't). one thing for sure, historically and now, investing in it for a high end system isn't flushing your money down the toilet. mac will be mac and harley will be harley long aftyer most high end gear is landfill. i have lots of other cool gear that i love listening too, but hey, mac is what it is. |
I am looking at buying an older Mac receiver it is a mac4280 can anyone give me some thoughts on this receiver.
good or bad. |
You are right in not naming names, I should have kept that private aswell |
Chad, no.
And I'll not name them.
Where I live is SEVERLY audio challenged.
It's not necessarily the fault of the stores but rather due to the economic ability of the surrounding area.
The surrounding area is hitorically blue collared in nature and has the attitudes associated with a blue collar work force.
Try charging more than two bucks for a Bud and people think you're trying to rob them. |
I bought an MC-7270 in 1990 for $1900. Over the years , the soothing blue meters faded from direct sunlight, the tiny ridges in the knobs flattened out. I sold it for 1895 on ebay last week |
Hbarrel, were you at 'Audio Arts" by chance? |
Went into the local Mc dealer yesterday at lunchtime. Wanted to check out a MA6900.
Asked him what he had in the way of integrated amps. First he took me to receivers. I looked at him and said "I asked about integrated amps not receivers". Next he pulled out a book and showed me a $200 dollar Panisonic unit. I finally asked about the McIntosh units. He showed me a MA6500 and said he could get a MA6900 with a seven band equalizer. I said, "really!" "Are you sure they don't have 5 band equalizers." He just rolled his eyes and assured me they have seven band equalizers.
So I inquired as to what was the best price on a MA6900. I was quoted $5K. Mcintosh has raised thier prices.
The door did not hit me in the arse on the way out.
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Is it possible to call Clarion for parts to the McIntosh range? I myself need parts for the MC2100, where right channel is dead. Can anyone confirm that Clarion has parts ? |
you would have to pry mt c-11 pre and my mc-240 out of my dying hands! |
I totally disagree with Frep's response, "Mac would have disappeared if not for Clarion's buyout" 1st off, Clarion did not "buyout" Mac, but did sink 60 million into the company which allowed them to get into car audio among other things. Mac makes great sounding, extremely reliable gear, and anyone who dissagrees is purely biased to the company. |
Mac is great, if you buy cheap and sell high. |
No, Psychic, it was Clarion the Car stereo people. Mac would have disappeared were it not for that buyout. |
FYI, Avideo, McIntosh was bought (and bailed out) by a Japanese company--I believe it's Mitsubishi... |
Nor would I make up your decision on one persons "one time" audition.
I have read numerous good reports, both from mags and users, on various products from their current line. |
I dont know about the older equipment but I recently heard a very high end set up in a custom built room at a local dealer. I personally thought it was the worst system I ever heard and I have heard better set ups at chain stores at one third the price. I highly recommend auditioning something else. Everyone likes something different and maybe you will love it but before you drop your hard earned cash I would shop around a bit. |
I agree with Nightdoggy. I am currently moving up from
Adcom separates from the mid-90s to McIntosh gear; and
very pleased with the clarity, detail, and pleasant sound.
My Thiel 3.5 speakers are very revealing of every up-
grade I've ever made (including speaker cables and inter-
connects); and the Mac gear just sounds great to me.
Also - unlike some audiophile "darlings" that seem to
go out of favor in a year or so - Mac gear holds it's value
very well. If you don't like the sound, you can always sell
it for pretty much what you paid for it. I might also
mention that MacIntosh is a solid American company in
business for a long time. You won't be wondering about
service - if you need it - two or three years down the road. |
Yes. They are well built (fit and finish and conservative component margins), have a completely neutral sonic signature and resale second to none. With respect to the sound, they have very low noise/coloration and no part of the frequency spectrum calls attention to itself. No boosted lows/highs or rolled off anywhere either. They are also well engineered (refined), unlike most other esoteric amps I've owned. No strange clicks, pops or noises, good protection and soft clipping which really does work without being audible. It can save speakers too. The meters are truly useful with peak hold and they can be turned off. Looks are subjective, but at least they will match (if you care) if you add newer models later on. |
I used to sell Mac equipment in the 80's (college job). THose 10% direct from MAC commission checks were real nice. However I'd much prefer Audio Research, Sonic Frontiers, etc. MAC is very pricey and a little out of date, of course I could say that about AR too
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I own all Mc units with 2 MC7150amps, C42 preamp, MR78 tuner, MVP831 DVD, 7008CD changer, MPI4 performance indicator, 2 ML2C speaker cabinets along with a MQ101 EQ, (as well as Sonus Faber Grand Pianos and Concertinos)
I've owned Mac for 17yrs. Not only is their stuff RELIABLE, but to me, it sounds awesome. To me, many philes are just not into music, but are really into sound! Music is what it's really about and when you have good gear, Levenson, Classe, Mac, Conrad-Johnson etc' hey, it's just about preference. If it's matched well, it's gonna sound good (assuming it's good gear to start with)
So hey, if your thinking of Mac, go to audio classics.com and speak to Frank Gow. 1st, his dad was president of Mac for 7 years. They are located 5 miles away from the Mac labs and are a virtual "vintage" wearhouse of Mac gear. Some of their gear is a bit pricey but if they say it is excellent, they mean it. I just bought a MR78 tuner that was made in 1972! I paid $2000 for it and I swear it looks like it came off a shelf from some high end store. |
McIntosh great?? Yes and No. I would say McIntosh similiar to Rolls Royce enduring value for the money.But it is no Ferrari that has both ends of the spectrum covered value and performance.I have owned McIntosh 20 years ago,but when Levinson,Krell,and Threshold came on market,left McIntosh behind in performance arena. Just my opinion. |
McIntosh gear is ridiculously overpriced relative to its sound. |
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I have owned a few pieces of Mac gear over the years.Their older tube amps 50's and 60's where some of the best gear ever made.Some of the early 90's stuff is not very good but they are again making great stuff.It is very pricey but you have to take into account the build quality.They are hand built in the USA in New York state.The cost of labour is siginficantly higher than most other parts of the USA and a big component of the cost is labour.The amps will last forever and they hold thier value. |
mac gear is not for audiophiles it seems more for music lovers who listen to music not systems as far a reliability how many other companies have their thirty and forty year old amps and preamps and tuner selling for more now than they did new |
