Jackd,
Thank you for your impressions with the kinki and bhk! I have the opportunity to buy a BHK 250 for about 5k. I was actually comparing that price with the Denafrips stack, which I'm also considering.
I've love to hear more of your impressions comparing those 2. I've been reading that my DirectStream DAC benefits greatly from a pre-amp, so initially I wanted to buy a power amp and live with the volume control on my DAC until I get the motivation to spend even more money on the BHK pre amp.
This is real dilemma. Is the BHK that much better? Is it better?
Regards,
jwlaudio |
jackd
I bet they do! You’ve got an audiophiles dream going on. Tough problem, the BHK on tone, finesse, the M7 on pure grunt? I bet both sound great. Thnx 4 sharing, b well… |
@regismc
For now the #1 speaker is the Verity Otello but I still have all of the others between two houses in two different states. The Verity's are driven by either the BHK 250 or the Kinki EX-M7 with the Supratek Chardonnay. The Nola KO's give the Otello's a good run for the money. |
Wow! Those r cool preamps. Must sound really nice. Did u settle on a speaker? I’ve some of those 6dj8 around as I once had a Dodd battery pre that required such. Think I sold it on to a fella in Eastern Europe. Sure was a good looking piece of kit though… |
@regismc
The BHK amps will take any tube from the 6dj8 or 7dj8 family. The Matsushita's I ended up staying with are 7DJ8's. I have tried the BHK 250 with the Modwright LS-100, Sonic Frontier Line 2 SE+, the BHK preamp and the Supratek Chardonnay. In the end the Supratek won out. Not as many convenience features but much better sound and less noise. |
jackd
Nice. I can relate to the small tube rolling and the subtle differences imparted. I did the same with Amprex and Mullards years ago. Still use a pr. of Bugle Boys in my EAT Petite phono pre as the Mullards go a bit too soft. Did you go with the BK preamp in your setup? After years of going dac direct, I like the Hestia pre also, just a bit more tonal body driving the Hyperion amp. ‘Sides I like the footprint of the duo. I’ve got an Athena pre here also, and she’s a beast, big and heavy. I picked it up from a fella moving to an ARC Ref 6 because he felt the added active drive helped control his speakers woofers better. It’s ‘almost’ too much in my modest system. Like moving from the 10th row to the front row. Added magnification, better separation, bigger soundstage, but the same tonal qualities as its smaller sister. I’m unsure on weather to get the dac or a larger amp next as I think any step up will force another speaker purchase. The new Zu Soul’s would be terrific with the top Denafrips gear. A bargain too! The endless chase, as really the Denafrips duo, driving the DW’s w/Jupiter caps is a nicely balanced system and I quite like how easily the entry duo makes me forget about the several tube amps I’ve collected. Are those 6922’s in the BK or ??? |
@regismc
Two my ears with multiple speakers the Kinki house sound is pretty much neutral and allows the character of the particular speaker in use to set the tone. Amps that I have owned that were similar were the Nuforce STA-200 and the Job 225, both based on the same circuit design owned by Goldmund. The BHK is just to the slightly warmer side of neutral and it can be tailored slightly by the choice of input tube. I have tried Gold Lion, Tungsram, Mullard and Matsushita in it and the sonic character only changed slightly and not by the great lengths i have seen described by others. Both are great amps but with the BHK you still need to drive it and using a DAC to do it was not for me as I tried it with the DS SR. |
jackd any comparison of Kinki vs PS amp? I’ve only read about the Kinki stuff. U certainly roll through a bunch of speakers, nice ones too… |
jwlaudio, can I ask what speaker you will be using? Both those products you mentioned, the Pass and PS are nice amps. If I’m going low power I’m going SET. So I’d pass on the Pass though I’ve heard the 60wpc sound great with a pair of Ryan’s. I like the BK amp very much though.
When I mentioned the Kinki as being ‘leaner’ it was in relation to the Denafrips. All three would be leaner in comparison. Perhaps I should have simply said more neutral, less warm, cooler.
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Not really sure with the M1+ priced at $2895 with free shipping how you are getting anywhere near the price territory of either the Pass or BHK with both at $7250 plus without shipping included. I own a BHK 250 and even at the old heavily dealer discount prices it wasn't close price wise. Also as I own or have owned an original EX-M1 and the current M1+ and M7 I have a pretty good idea about the house sound after almost four years. Lean it is not and I have used them with over a half dozen different speakers from Spatial, Verity, Nola, Reynaud, Harbeth and Fritz. |
regismc,
Thank you for your impressions. I'm getting a similar impression, albeit without any real-life experience with either system. I'm told youtube's audio is heavily compressed so I take all the videos I watch with a grain of salt, reviewers included.
Damn, I am getting into this price territory now, where if I spend a little more, I can get the Pass Labs INT25 or the PS Audio BHK 250 power amp (I have the opportunity to buy it for 30% off right now). This is seriously an addiction.
jwlaudio |
jond,
After you said it is pretty clear to you, I re-read the sentence, slower this time and it is pretty damn clear. haha
Thanks!
jwlaudio |
Hestia and Hyperion r the choice for my Zu DW’s. Let ‘em run n, they gotta lot of caps; so for a good month. The pair is smooth, organic, open, dynamic and powerfully musical. The midrange is excellent. If you’ve played around with tube and ss amps for a while, you may find the Denafrips sound to provide that ‘just right’ sound. Organic and dynamic, with a wide soundstage and plenty of air the duo may give up a tad of resolution but easily resolves the quality of your music collection. They’ve an analog character in a good way, open and balanced, powerful and confident.
My sense is that the Kinki gear is voiced towards a faster, leaner sound.
A set of different listening priorities, the ‘you are there’ presentation that prioritizes detail retrieval and micro spatial cues along with tight fast transients.
If these two were coupling capacitors, the Denafrips house sound is Jupiter or Dueland copper foils, the Kinki is CuTf V-Cap built around speed and resolution. If you’ve familiar with the differences, you know one must be very careful when mixing them as it is easy to introduce anomalies in the frequency response, a hardness or sluggishness is introduced by often times a component mismatch or speaker selection. They may really both potentially be very good, but perhaps not together.
Horses 4 courses… (-; |
The original EX-M1 was introduced in 2017. The newly updated EX-M1 — without the
“+” — costs $2398 and includes, among other things, changes in the
power supply, capacitance, and the volume control, the latter now using a
MUSES72320 controller instead of the previous relay-based control. The
EX-M1+ is essentially identical to the upgraded EX-M1, but adds a
preamp-stage output and a home-theater bypass to entirely bypass the
preamp stage.
This seems pretty clear to me the latest version of the EX-M1 has those updates to the power supply capacitance and volume control. The + version has those updates but also adds a preamp out and a home theater bypass. The preamp out allows you to use an outboard amp and the bypass allows you to run an AVR or something to control multiple speakers in a HT setup.
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The EX-M1 is a pure integrated amplifier without the capability of preout and power amp in ( home theater bypass), meaning it is impossible in future if you want to add another power amp to bi-amp your speaker or you want to make it to use as a power amp. While the EX-M1+ had the capability to become a power amp or preamp. |
Can you just give me his cell phone number, I’m sure he won’t mind. hahahaha Thanks for the heads up. I’m already leaning toward the M1+ now, but would still like to get as much feedback as I can before I spend more money. |
Sarjan, by the way, is in the middle of moving from his old digs in Ireland to another location (still in Ireland) that will occupy him for the next few weeks. He said he'll be back as soon as he can, but he won't be answering any emails, do any reviews or updates until then.
In the meantime, you can scour his reviews and thoughts at his site as he always references the components he uses and he uses several, all in different combos and systems to get a proper handle on the sound of things.
All the best,
Nonoise |
sns, all feedback is good feedback and I thank you! |
Thank you jackd, I will check out 6Moons and see if I can get a hold of
Srajen! |
Couple years ago looking for summertime ss amp to replace my 845SET tube amp/space heater. Had both Musical Fidelity M2si and Hyperion in for audition, much preferred MF. In my setup the Hyperion was overtly dark, closed in, small sound stage, images, one of the most disappointing audio purchases ever. I'm willing to entertain the thought Hyperion just not sympathetic with my Coincident Statement preamp, Based on specs, no impedance mismatch.
I did hear Hyperion matched with Hestia at sellers residence, not familiar enough with his system to make informed impression. Perhaps its informative to mention it was his third choice system out of three systems in his house.
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The only one I am aware of that has had both the Kinki and Denafrips pieces in house and for review is Srajen with 6 Moons. Reach out to him through the contact on his website and see what he says. He currently has the Kinki EX-M1 and the B7 monos in his personal systems. |
