Today I bought a new pair of the KEF LS50 Wireless speakers for my study (10 x 13 x 12). Just so you know my main system in the media room (15 x 20) consists of a pair of Bowers and Wilkins CM10s2 ($4000), Parasound A21 ($2500), Cambridge Audio 851D ($1000), Double Shotgun silver wires ($350), power cable from Cerious Technologies (Graphene something -- $350), with a total cost of something around $8k. I thought it would be fun to put the KEFs in the same room as my main system and play them side by side using Tidal streaming for both. Now keep in mind that the CM10s have several hundred hours on them, whereas the KEFs have probably less than 2 hours so far. The speaker stands for the KEFs are still on backorder, so right now they're just sitting directly on the media console (glass top) -- in other words, this is a totally unfair comparison. Also, the CM10s are placed about 9 feet apart and 4 feet from the wall, whereas the KEFs are about 6 feet apart and less than two feet from the back wall. What I heard was totally unbelievable!!! The KEFs, which mind you, are not broken in at all, not sitting on a proper stand, and not as wide apart from each other as the CM10s, totally blew the CM10s out of the water. The sound coming out of the KEFs is more full-bodied and balanced, beautiful midrange, and a very satisfying base. The imaging is just so much better than the B&Ws. I just can't believe how a speaker which is literally 4 to 5 times smaller than the CM10s can produce such a rich, satisfying base. I think the only aspect where the CM10s have a slight edge is the soundstage. But, I suspect that might improve with proper stands and more play time. A few weeks ago, I auditioned a pair of Harbeth M30.1 in the same media room (driven by Parasound A21). While I really liked the midrange on them, they sounded a little thin to me. The KEFs, on the other hand, have a pretty good midrange (probably not as good as the Harbeths), but to my ears, they sound better in every other aspect.
Now, I'm not saying that these $2199 speakers are the ultimate bookshelves. But they sure beat my comparatively more expensive setup by a mile.
All hats off to the KEF engineers!
P.S. The CM10s will be on the market pretty soon :)
Yeah, came here to say this. The convenience of the LS50W comes in handy, the simple tone controls are nice for tweaking the sound, and adding a sub in the future is a cinch. It's also just pretty.
I'd give the edge to the Genelec or Neumann in a nearfield scenario because of the better on-axis, but with more room sound in the mix, I feel the LS50W's smooth vertical response would likely balance out the one big flaw in its on-axis response, the dip around 1.8k.
That dip is pretty obnoxious, and I don't know why I stopped at 60 degrees instead of the usual 75, but you can see the dip straightens out by 60 degrees. Can't say for sure, but presumably, it would continue to be relatively even further off-axis. Treble tilts down a bit, but you can tweak that a bit in the app. you can get more info from there
I am also using the KEF LS50 wireless speakers and extremely satisfied with the sound quality. I know its a little bit expensive as compared to other brands. But If you can get a good amp, then you are good to go.
If you want to read more about KEF LS50 wireless speaker, you can check out this article just released. Since KEF is a well regarded company known to measure their speakers scientifically I don't think you should worry too much - they designed the amps in the LS50W to drive the LS50W. I bet they measure better than 95% of standalone DAC/Amps pairing with the LS50.
As I recall, those Harbeth are not very big either like the ls50s but go for a good bit more $$$$ than ls50 these days. I thought them very small for the price when I saw them. Never compared the two directly but two significantly different sounds I suspect. Would be interesting to compare side by side. Both would benefit from a well integrated sub or two no doubt.
@justjames72 -- I sold the CM10s shortly after I got the KEF LS50 wireless. I have never owned the passive version so cannot compare. But yes, at the time, and in the same room, the LS50W sounded better to my ears. The balance, clarity and imaging was better than the CM10s. But I agree with mapman that the KEFs are not designed for large'sh rooms.
Having said that, I bought a pair of Harbeth P3ESRs for my study a couple of years ago ... now I might eventually sell the KEFs at some point, but I don't see myself selling the baby Harbeths anytime soon.
I have ls50s and think they are very good, as good as most anything, with proper amplification and within their limits regarding bass extension and ability to go loud. Best suited to smaller rooms which is where I use them (12X12) with a sub to help.
Gottta drive them well and keep them within their limits though or things can head south.
@arafiq Do you still feel the KEF sound better than your CM10S2?
I ask because I have B&W 702S2 powered by McIntosh MA6600 and while the KEF LS50 are really great (I have them in another setup), they can't hold a candle to the 702s.
So, I was just curious if you still felt the same?
@arafiq , good to know! A friend of mine had mentioned that if a product is working well, do not do any firmware updates to it. He was not referring to a bluesound, he was just putting that out there “in general”.
What were the suggested improvements for the firmware update?
I guess if it’s not broke, don’t fix it?
Too bad about their customer service 👎
Kef on the other hand is indeed great with their customer service, magnolia centers not so much
I have read that the LS 50 rolls off the bass below 70 HZ. I don't own them, but if I did subwoofers would be mandatory. I don't really consider a 5" driver to be a woofer.
Update- I’ve called KEF about my LS50w and they are working with me! I have to give them props for helping out on a trade in!! Big kuddos to KEF once again, I don’t feel left out in the cold and they’ve converted me to lifetime KEF guy! it might’ve been I just got a bad pair, that will be replaced by KEF for a new KEF pair
Update- I’ve called KEF about my LS50w and they are working with me! I have to give them props for helping out on a trade in!! Big kuddos to KEF once again, I don’t feel left out in the cold and they’ve converted me to lifetime KEF guy! it might’ve been I just got a bad pair, that will be replaced by KEF for a new KEF pair.
I have an eero mesh and works great, everything works on it except the KEF LS50W. The wireless (WiFi) Function on the LS50W is awful. Its no wonder KEF with will only cover active parts/function of the LS50W for a year, it’s because it’s crap...
I've had mine or two and a half years and they have been rock solid for me. Initially, the connection was a bit temperamental, but I made two changes that made a world of difference. First I got Roon, which is a million times better than KEF's native application which I agree is horrible, to say the least. Second, since I don't have ethernet in the room where the KEFs are, I installed Nest Wifi -- one router with three nodes all over the house. The sound quality improved quite a bit and no more drop offs. Now speaking of awful products -- Bluesound. I've had it for a year now (attached to another system). It worked well for some time but then I installed the latest update and it has pretty much stopped working. This is a common problem if you search the web but their support is adamant that it's your home network. Seriously, stay away from Bluesound ... their support is pathetic.
So-al was saying the app stinks, which it does. It’s absolutely horrible.
The speakers are really pretty awesome though. Just get yourself a bluesound node and bypass the KEF app.
The reliability on them is questionable as well. Be very nice to them. I’m not sure what the answer is in order to treat the as gingerly as possible; leave them on all the time perhaps...
I’ve owned the LS50’s, and the LS50W’s. My Brother has LS50w’s (which crapped out on him after 6 months but were replaced under warranty, he know has an extra 3 year warranty covering the electronics. 3 of my friends have a pair and out of them, 1 pair crapped out Nd was replaced under warranty as well.
They are fantastic sounding speakers however with loads more bass than the passives had in my set-up, which wasn’t enough to do them justice probably.
The LS50W’s with a sub or two are something quite special. I have a pair of R100’s coming tuesday; I hope I like them!
Awful wireless (WiFi) speaker!! Kef stream app never works. I use it a 2.1 home theater system, it works well as that. kef should be ashamed of itself for putting out such a product. Ive had it for 3 yrs now and my wife gave it it to me as an Xmas present.
Awful wireless (WiFi) speaker!! Kef stream app never works. I use it a 2.1 home theater system, it works well as that. kef should be ashamed of itself for putting out such a product. Ive had it for 3 yrs now and my wife gave it it to me as an Xmas present.
My understanding is that MQA from Tidal site will just achieve the "first unfold." In order to get the full MQA experience you need hardware to do it. This could be achieved by using an MQA DAC out of the USB port on my computer and then this signal would go through the internal DACs on the KEF. Would this work? Or would there be something weird with one DAC feeding another?
I run ls50s off BEl Canto ref1000m amps (500w/ch). Top notch for their size and within their associated limitations! When the music starts it sounds very real, not like a hifi! They need a well integrated sub or two in addition to an amp up to the task to do it all though, even in a small room. Larger rooms can be very tough...they are not very big.
I was able to download the update via my imac AFTER I connected wirelessly through Spotify using the back door route. So I can stream if I want, but I still find the USB connection and using Audinirvana the best way to listen. Audinirvana allows me to listen to MQA albums on TIdal. I prefer these to all other sources so far.
I love the speakers but have a few questions: (1) trying to update firmware, the app has a link for new firmware but when I go there "file not found." How do I find the new firmware????
(2) Right now I am not able to go wireless as the app says the speakers are not connected. Maybe something to do with my wireless router? Everything else on my wireless network runs fine. I think I 'll just go to USB when I get the proper connecting cord.
Not sure if this thread is still active. Any take on Dynaudio Xeo 20 wireless vs KEF LS50 wireless. Xeo 20 retail for $3250 CAD. LS50 retail for $2780CAD Looks like LS50 has umbilical cord connection and Xeo 20 is truly wireless with just power cord .
I'm not sure if this is the best place to ask but leaving it here, just in case: I'm simply unable to download the KEF Firmware from their site.It keeps redirecting me to their homepage. I've checked from three different laptops so it's not a pop-up blocker or anti-virus setting. Did anyone else face this issue?
@mofojo No, most of my listening was folk, blues, electronic etc.
I will say the biggest downfall of these speakers to me was at low volume listening. They do require some volume to come alive. But I am also used to my Audionotes that start hopping at quite low levels.
I also recently bought a new pair of these in white with matching stands. I have the stands filled with sand.
Ultimately I purchased these for bedroom speakers but had them in my main listening room for some break in time. Even out of the box I was hugely impressed with the authority and resolution that these speakers play.
The bass response blew me away for the size of the speakers. The bass is not just a one note wonder either. It's layered and textured with a nice hit. Imaging is top notch and these are very musical. An absolute steal for the technology, adjustability and sound you get at this price. It will be a shame to have them in the bedroom as I could see these being someone's main rig if they were on a budget.
I also tried them out with my JL E110 sub and it integrated very nicely but not a necessity depending on your room size.
I almost didn't want them to sound as good as they do for the price. It really makes a person start thinking of all the money and time he/she has invested in the past to get the sound we're at now with our main rigs. But that's also half the fun!
Doesn't your boat have an ammeter? You could turn on the inverter and see what it reads. Remember, the specs from the company would just tell you what the draw is at 120 volts. You need to account for the losses from the inverter.
Has anyone ever used a Killawatt or something similar to see how many watts the LS50 wireless draw? I have a specific use in mind and need to know how many watts the pair will draw at average listening volumes. Can someone please help me with this? thanks! ps, the specific use is on a cruising catamaran and the speakers would be powered off of an inverter, and since this draws power from the house batteries, power consumption is a concern.
Very impressed with the KEF LS50. Very solidly built, and clearly a lot of attention has gone into the new Uni-Q drivers, as they sound incredibly accurate.
Also listened to the R100 when trying the LS50 which, although no slouch, is eclipsed by the accuracy and soundstage of the LS50. The bass performance in particular is incredible for a speaker of its size.
Personally, think the LS50 would still be a five star product at double the price. A great product from TechnoVolume. 10/10!
@scarpino -- sorry if I'm stating the obvious, but did you make sure you have updated to the latest firmware? I had the same issue, albeit not quite as bad as yours, and getting the latest firmware solved it.
Secondly, the KEFs are definitely finicky about the wifi quality. How close is your router to the speakers? Do you have multiple devices connected to the same network? I've noticed that it definitely increases dropouts in my case.
Lastly, have you considered Roon? At least in my case, I find Roon to be a better application -- including user interface and overall sound quality. I get a lot fewer dropouts when listening to music via Roon.
I keep seeing great reviews about these KEF LS50 speakers. I auditioned them hooped up to a Parasound A21 and a Krell 300i integrated amp and honestly I was not impressed at all. Sound was thin, bright, not resolving enough for a $1,500 speakers. They don't sound better that a Paradigm mini monitor $500.00.
Help!! Just purchased a used pair of LS50 Wireless amd cannot get them connected to network. I use a Unifi router and when I follow the apps setup procedure I got my network to recognize the speakers on 2x out 15+ attempts! When they were recognized they were promptly dropped. I held the reset button in and although it blinked green for about 10 seconds it never would go to solid green as the FAQs suggest. I can get the speakers to only work consistently with Bluetooth. Got a PC music server to work once yesterday but not today. The app will recognize the server, begin playing music but no sound comes out. I keep getting the message that no speakers are selected, even though I keep selecting them ( they register than drop out). Could all this stem from them not being on my wifi network? Shouldn't they still work with direct input from my server (they did for a while anyway). Again, HELP and thanks for any input.
@bleu My comment about the speakers being satisfying at low volumes was only in the context of comparing with Harbeth or B&W CM10s. I felt that these two had a slight edge on the KEFs in this regard.
As for the base, I challenge you to integrate the LS50s with a fast, musical sub (I recently added REL T9) and see if you still feel the same way. I’m not a bass head by any means, but I can tell you that the difference it makes is substantial. The increase in soundstage and room-filling ability has gone up significantly, at least in my setup. It’s not just about big, thumping bass.
I don't have any curious children roaming around, but I've considered designing some grills for the LS50. The only real challenge will be method of attachment, but I might have that figured out. My concern is how they might affect the imaging.
I'm tempted by the LS50w for a second system. However, I'm hesitating because of the internal DAC. It seems like the KEF wouldn't be appropriate for anyone who already has an DAC that they really like, who listens to DSD/SACD, who uses MQA, or who has a turntable. That rules out an awful lot of people. Have any of you tried the LS50w with any of these formats run through the KEFs? What was the result?
A few more observations after listening to the speakers for the last 3 - 4 days ....
Pros: 1. Vocals, jazz, light/soft rock sounds amazing. There is a certain fullness in the sound that I was missing before. Last night, I had listened to them for over 3 hours at a stretch with zero fatigue. However, having said that, I don’t think the speakers would cut it for heavy metal or rap music. Maybe adding a subwoofer might help, but for the kind of music I listen to, I don’t feel the need to add anything else. Also, IMO classical music is not their cup of tea. But it very well could have been the recording (Rimsky).
2. The bass on these is just amazing for a speaker of this size. I am not kidding, but the base is almost the same as my much bigger CM10s. In fact, it is more textured and punchy and never gets boomy.
3. Imaging -- really, really good!! Blows my B&W CM10s out of the water. The voices and the instruments are fixed in exactly the same spots. Very accurate! This is probably the standout feature of these speakers!
4. The disappearing act -- these disappear behind the wall of music much better than my CM10s. With the B&Ws, I always had a sense of where the speakers were located, not so much with the KEFs. However, this is one area where I felt that the Harbeths that I demoed for a few hours were better.
Cons: 1. Absolutely pathetic app (iOS). Tidal integration leaves a lot to be desired. Every now and then, the music just stops playing intermittently. The only solution I found is to restart the speakers. KEF really needs to get their act together when it comes to hiring better software developers.
2. Low volume -- this is one area where the CM10s (and the Harbeth M30.1) have an edge. The KEFs sound amazing at moderate to high volumes, but lose quite a bit of their magic at lower volumes.
3. Placement -- despite the DSP advantage, the speakers are still quite sensitive to placement. Although I bought them for my home office (10x13), they sound way better in the game room (25x15) which is a bit bigger than the media room. They definitely need to be placed at least 6 feet apart and 2 feet from the back wall to sound their best. They still sound good in the office, but some of the magic is lost. Unfortunately, I cannot put them back in the game room since my kid would destroy them in a few minutes :(
BTW, I tried bluetooth streaming and did not like it at all. Tidal (via KEFs app) sounds much better. I’m seriously thinking of subscribing to Roon to play music from my NAS drive.
Lastly, please keep in mind that I don’t have a lot of exposure to high-end gear. Prior to the KEF LS50s, I’ve only owned the B&W CM10s, and LSA-1 Signature bookshelf speakers. So, hopefully, you’ll take my exuberance with a grain of salt :)
So today my kid, who has some sensory issues, decided to poke his finger into the front of the speaker. Almost punctured the area between the foam and the tweeter. I was able to straighten a part of it but there’s still a crease on the left side. Now, I have a true dilemma .... knowing my kid, I know that (due to his sensory issues) he won’t be able to resist poking his fingers to push the driver cone. I cannot return it because it now has a pretty visible crease on the front. I don’t know the impact on the sound yet. The speakers are not even 4 days old and they are now non-returnable :(
Lesson learned: these speakers (or any speakers with no front grilles) are not suitable for households with young children. I wish KEF sold front grilles for these.
Aren't these LS50 wireless speakers EQ'd, the back panel shows several EQ options. That and 230 watts per speaker (200 for the woofer, 30 for the tweeter) are going to give a certain advantage over a traditional pre amp and amplifier. But it's an apples to oranges comparison. The EQ function is giving anything but a flat frequency response. Some will like certain frequencies pushed to the foreground.
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