grigor, You wrote, "Judging by the THD and the scope graph that shows me how much of a clean up is happening, it tells me that if I disconnect it and somehow do a double blind comparison between wall outlet and the P5 I will not be able to tell the difference." Then you go on to disparage the whole idea behind the P5 and P10, because of what appears to be a prediction, not an actual AB comparison. Have you in fact ever actually compared the sound of your system WITH the P5 installed to the sound of your system without the P5? And if so, what did you hear? In the two instances where I use the PS Audio regenerators, I do hear a substantial and worthwhile improvement in SQ, and I do not live in the most horrible AC environment that you describe.
Is the PS Audio PerfectWave P10 Power Plant worth it?
I'm interested in learning and hearing about your experiences with a power regenerator like the P10. The science behind a pure sine wave AC power supply makes sense to me. Can you guys share your experiences? The audio quality in my house varies a lot depending on all kinds of different factors. I'm trying to figure out if a power regenerator is the way to go to get consistent performance. Thx
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Here is the thing about ANY powerplant, not just the P10. It helps where it can and when it can, but that is all. Lets consider my example. I have a PS Audio P5. It is enough for my equipment. On average it launders 50%-55% of power, the THD in never exceeding 2.5% and THD out (the clean power) never exceeding 0.1%. So, do I need it? Judging by the THD and the scope graph that shows me how much of a clean up is happening, it tells me that if I disconnect it and somehow do a double blind comparison between wall outlet and the P5 I will not be able to tell the difference. Why won't I sell it then? It looks cool, that is all. I even think of getting the P10, but then paying double for doing exactly double of nothing which equals to guess how much? Right, nothing. But if your power is exceptionally dirty, it fluctuates by 5V-10V and you have a tube amp, or there are a hundred current hungry devices on your local power line that introduce devastating noises (vacuum machines, drills, hair driers, etc) or your THD in is in the 30% or even higher then you definitely need some power plant or another. How many people actually fall into that category? I'd say 95 out 100 PS Audio power products purchasers dont need them in the least. Me included. |
"cleeds" says it right: " ..... Also, many users find it's best to keep digital gear on a separate, dedicated circuit with its own AC conditioner." Without question, keep separate; perhaps AC Re-gen (for source/digital) and Balanced/Symmetrical AC power supply (i.e. Equi=tech) for analog and/or high-power components. pj |
Was the upgrade worth $4.5K? Nope!Thanks for your honesty, Sangpeiris. We tend to exaggerate or even outright lie about the supposed benefits we get from new gear we just bought, regardless of whether or not it delivers a little more than a makers badge on the face plate. In some environments it does, in others it doesnt. Looks like in yours it improves the sound somewhat, but you probably think that for the degree of benefits it introduced, you might have been wiser to invest the $4.5K more productively. I am correct here? Also, which P10 do you have? DirectStream or PerfectWave? |
I’m using a P10 with 2 x 600W Monoblocks (McIntosh MC601), tube pre-amp (McIntosh C2500), DAC (Matrix Sabre-X Pro) and Record Player (Rega RP8). The Sub is not plugged into the P10 I can open up the pre-amp to about 78% before the P10 hits it’s limits at 1200 VAmps (Watts) and auto shuts-down. That’s good thing for me to save my speakers (B&W 802D2) and the neighbors! Upgrading from a Monster Power HTS 5100 to the P10 made a noticeable difference. In laymen terms, the sound stage is better and the sound is cleaner. Was the upgrade worth $4.5K? Nope! Note my input voltage fluctuates from 111V to 124V, has about 5% THD and the incoming wave looks really bad. Totally clipped. The other thing of note is that the software features (PowerPlay) on the P10 are pretty cool. The website written in PHP is archaic and did not work till i put the P10 in the DMZ even-though PS Audio swear the product only uses Port 80 (regular HTTP web traffic). Not sure why they havent spend the $40K to write an App to do the same thing and get rid of the website. |
I run an entire system through a P10, including the powered subwoofers in my Vandersteen 5A's and a large stereo amp. Seems to provide an extra level of detail and resolution, or blacker background as someone else has noted. You can get a P10 easily for $3K, and I think it's worth it as a more or less final power solution. Having said that, I also recommend that you have AC dedicated lines and run the P10 from one of those. |
When the funds are available, go for the P5 or P10. Earlier generations of the PS Audio regenerators were infantile compared to the newest units. Not faulting the PS folks as they were aiming to revolutionize the way power is delivered to our audio systems. The early units were too inefficient and served as space heaters, only able to provide regenerated power to the front end components. The Premier Power Plant solved, in large part, the efficiency issue and ran much cooler. It's issue was questionable Chinese build quality, as these units were notoriously unreliable. The P5 and P10 both employ much more sophisticated circuitry and are hand assembled in Boulder where quality control is vastly improved. Even though the PPP was supposed to be able to handle my power amp., when I tried it, the regenerator shut down and I had to get a new unit. I was assured by PS tech. support that the P5 would easily handle my entire 2 channel system and so it does! With SACD player and its outboard power supply, line stage, phono preamp and outboard supply and power amp all feeding off the P5, I am only using 35% of the unit's capacity! The biggest rub against regenerators was that if you ran your power amp. off of one, your system would suffer dynamically. Not so any more. After A/Bing my amp being fed by a Duet conditioner and the P5 regenerator, the regenerated power allows for greater dynamic swing and more impactful bass response. |
arh If you are going to regenerate you should get one that can handle your whole systemThat's obviously not possible with a large system, where each amplifier may require its own 20A line. Also, many users find it's best to keep digital gear on a separate, dedicated circuit with its own AC conditioner. |
The PS Audio unit is fine, but not worth it as you can buy a used Topaz for a LOT less. Either is the real way to deal with noise on the AC line - not a magic cable. Assuming that your equipment itself cannot deal with noise on the AC line... and that you don't have other sources of noise that are real cause of your problems... |
PS audio P10 is a nice unit i own one. But i found that the MC 6 Hemisphere from High Fidelity gave me a little bigger soundstage with blacker blacks. Its half the price, but you give up surge protection and have less plugs to hook equipment to. The Hemisphere is for front end only no amps unless they are small current draw. I did try the P10 and the Hemisphere together, with the P10 feeding the Hemisphere. It sound ok. The Hemisphere with out the P10 was very good. Holding on to my P10 for now. |
Wow! if you can swing a P10 then have at it. I went from a PPP to a P5 and can't believe the improvement! The P5 and P10 are so much better in design and execution. I can plug my entire system including my McCormack modified DNA-1 amp. into the P5. What a benefit it is to be able to offer my amp regenerated power!! The sound is so smooth, pure and resolved! The P10 is reputed to be better still. Carpe diem! |
