Boston - Goodwin's High End - Spectral Audio. Let me know what you think.
I'm interested in hearing what "the best" systems sound like, where to go?
I have my system sounding pretty good now with a wide sound stage and good depth and imaging. I hear faint details that I have never heard in songs before. It took me three amps, two CD players, two sets of speakers and room treatments to get where I am. But the rabbit hole being what it is....I can't help but wonder....do I have the best it can be? I've been to brick and mortar, high end audio stores, but they don't really have listening rooms. Do any of you know of a place that has a good selection in stock that also has a good listening room to try them out? I would like to hear what is considered "the best". I would like a yard stick to use to determine if I'm getting everything out of the recordings that I can get. Even if it is thousands of dollars outside of my budget, I would like to know what I'm chasing.
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My 2 cents...let me first start by telling you I’m a member of the suncoast audiophile society here in the Tampa Bay Area. I have heard many systems, both privately and at shows. I have a somewhat modest system: bob Latino ST-120 dynaco pas-2 with erhard audio mods (recently replaced with a Vincent sa-t7 music hall cd/dac modified Jolida jd-9 bluesound node 2i thorens TD 125 with sme arm and Hana eh furman power conditioner variac bob crites “cornscala’s decent cables my system easily competes with others 3-4 times the price of mine. trust your ears, ignore price tags and brands. the end |
OK, in case anyone is wondering why is the sound at shows frequently so bad, aren’t these guys professionals? Well, yes and no. Here are the top four or five reasons why getting good sound at the shows can be rather elusive. 1. Brand new speakers, electronics and cabling. I mean, come on people! That’s a recipe for disaster. 2. Everybody is plugged into the same circuit. No they don’t have dedicated circuits for every room. 3. Vibration isolation of all front end components is probably not common, I’m guessing a little here on that one. Seismic type vibration can be a real issue at shows, you know, what with all the foot traffic. 4. Tweaks are not used extensively on most exhibits, again I’m surmising. Maybe I’m wring, but I doubt, it. Even room treatments. |
My two cents: someone mentioned high end audio shows. Beware! They are great experiences, and a great place to talk, get quick listens, etc. But sound will not be optimal and if it is, its luck -and that distorts what is good vs bad. Having set up at those shows more times than I wish to remember, the sound if often way below what we hoped, and what we could produce with some control of the room - and maybe more than overnight with lost equipment and the inevitable tech gremlins that attack without warning. Dealers are a mixed bag. And they too, if honest, will admit that sometimes they have magic, and other times, the magic is elusive. G |
@Baclagg, I highly suggest you take up @mikelavigne and @millercarbon gracious offers to hear their systems. On whatsbestforum.com, Mike’s system has garnered many complements from several forum members who have heard it. Just looking at @millercarbon system pics it’s obvious of the time, energy, and $resources were committed to this system is something extraordinary. Both have a wealth of information/experience garnered by years of building their systems. Frankly, the time and cost to visit them is a bargain/no-brainer compared to say buying a component, in fact it may save you time, $, and it also scratches your curiosity itch. In addition, I believe Mike’s system is SS while @millercarbon is tube – it may be valuable info on why they choose their different system building paths. Other options tend to be hit and miss - visiting audio brick-n-mortar stores, joining an audio club to hear member systems, or going to an audio show. Audio shows are often notorious for bad sounding systems caused by the rented undertreated rooms (ie: Magico S5mk2 sounded great at 2 shows, but flat at RMAF last year), but you do find some good/great sounding systems. Manufacturers often use them to showcase their latest products. You may even hear a system “sound” that you emotionally connect with so that you can subsequently steer your system towards. AXPONA is the largest North America audio show, but note it has been rescheduled from April 17-19 to August 7-9, 2020 out of concern for the health and safety of all participants due to the growing coronavirus situation. If you’ve never attended a large audio show I suggest you do so – I always greatly enjoy them. |
I am in love with my system because i know some ways to makes any system likeable with the right method to embed it... :) I boast about that not about my system "per se"... It is simple to crush my marvellous Sansui, simply buying a ZOTL Berning amplifier will do... :) But I am a bit too serious now.... My salutations to you glupson... |
It will make you think seriously about getting out of this hobby altogether and finding another hobby, maybe model trains 🚂 or macrame. It is like dreaming about the most beautiful woman in history and thinking I cannot loved her, she will not be mine, then i dont want to be in love with my girlfriend no more... The problem is how to makes the audio system you already own a system able to reproduce piano real sound quality in an approximate manner so well made that you will be in heaven listening to it ? Saying the King Saoud of Arabia own a better system than mine has no real sense, it is a fact lacking his proper context....Of course some system are better than mine...Even the King Saoud would be jealous of some other audiophile’s system....They are no point to boast about a system... The point is how to makes any system good and mine in particular ? " The organ i was seeing makes mine uninteresting " -anonymus |
I promise this won’t take long but getting back to the subject of the thread for just a moment I would like to try to express how much better the best system I ever heard, you know, the one that’s a couple Metro stops away, is compared to the next best system I ever heard. It’s like night and day. It’s light years ahead. It will make you think seriously about getting out of this hobby altogether and finding another hobby, maybe model trains 🚂 or macrame. |
I am very glad that we concur with one another.... Perhaps we are right ….I think also that this pianist produce a quality level interpretation on all his recordings without many rivals... I had listen to all his recordings with comparisons in all case.... His mastery of tone and colors shades make him so...Others may be sometimes more intensely expressive or virtuoso but very few can produce the same subtle colors scales... :) |
Moravec interpretation of Nocturnes is the best I ever listened to...Because his touch is perfectly balanced between expression and form... His mastering of shade of colours makes him the top underestimated Pianist of the century...Then we can listen to these nocturnes thousand times without being bored... This is the difference between "more" engaged romantic interpretation... His interpretation is at the same time romantic and inspired by Bach... All his other cd are masterpiece also.... I choose this one for the sound... |
This thread has me imagining a world where people competitively compare audio systems the way hot rodders would race for pink slips. You could just loudly proclaim that your system is the best ever and wait for folks to come out of the woodwork offering to prove you wrong. Did anyone mention PS Audio Music room 2 yet? In all of Paul’s YouTube videos he tells people to come on by. |
mahgister1,570 posts03-08-2020 2:41pmAny system that can make piano great is great.... :) Each note of piano is like a particular rainbow, it takes great audio system to play these shades of colors, not only the the bass and high notes... Agreed, played the piano for years. If you can get your system to get close your doing something right. ;) |
Interesting, I never have the chance to listen to this kind of very costly audio system in my life....I am sure that it will sound musical with tweaks though.... :) Right. I sometimes worry the people who don't read carefully will see only bragging about being impossibly better than $1.3M worth of audiophile excellence, and entirely miss the main point which is to draw attention to the fact you cannot achieve excellence with any amount of money until and unless you bring everything- every tiny little thing- up to a high level of performance. The same system that underwhelms the way I heard it would I'm sure be stupefying beyond words with just a few thousand dollars of tweaks. This is Washington State, so for less than state sales tax they could go from blah to blown away. With the right tweaks. But they didn't. So they got blah. But with a whole lotta big. And it does go boom. Thus the phrase, big bada boom. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8WLYzA0lCs |
Years ago we went to the Stereophile show in Chicago and heard a lot of nice sounding systems, Back in 1999 we went to the CES show, we listened to 1 million plus setups down to single ended pure class A 2 watt amps running thru very efficient speakers that sounded amazing. All depends on what type of music usually listen to, how big your listening room and pocket book are. AT CES David Wilson had one of his big systems in a huge room with what looked like a couple of prototype sub-woofers that were the size of 30 cu.ft refrigerators, at times you couldn't hear them because they went well below 20hz. but could certainly feel the room shake. Iv'e had bigger systems in the past, currently I listen to a lot of Jazz and Blues so I'm loving a somewhat smaller set of speakers, if you like rock, classical or big band go with a larger speaker. |
I knew I shouldn’t have written that as soon as I did it. 😬 Tip for the day - clean all Schumann frequency wall outlet connections with isopropyl alcohol. I use white pipe cleaners. You can see the grime easier with white ones. 😛 Especially recommended for those with many Schumann resonators, I won’t mention any names. Clean contacts and Graphene enhancer if you can get some reduce that old bugaboo, micro arcing. |
I was afraid of that. My comment was misinterpreted. What I was trying to say was of course 70s speakers can sound better than big expensive modern ones. Of course the opposite is true, too, modern speakers can be made to sound better than 70s speakers. I was only hinting at what the general reaction to that statement would probably be, “Are you out of mind?” This is similar to the sentiment expressed on another thread that - contrary to popular audiophile opinion - yes, older CD players can be made to sound better than modern players. All it takes is a little know-how, as they say. 🤗 |
Can speakers from the 1970s sound better than big expensive modern speakers? Are you out of mind?My point is not a stupid affirmation like that at all and you know it.... My point is takes what you have, transform it, and takes it to his peak potential and call it a day... My actual Mission Cyrus speakers are not even on the same level of excellency than my past Tannoy… But they sound better guess why? You know that already... Do you think I am so fool to claim my old Tannoy were better than the best modern speakers ? I hope not.... :) |
A safe bet I think.... :) They want to create and finance their own research in engeneering that is legitimate...But we want the best sound for the less money possible...And after taking care of the embeddings who want to pay for more? Not me.... Upgrade seems ridiculous when we enjoy our music already....I dont want the best system in the world. I cannot afford it; I want the best system for the less money, I created it... :) |
millercarbon Interesting, I never have the chance to listen to this kind of very costly audio system in my life....I am sure that it will sound musical with tweaks tough.... :) And I trust your words for your feeling about your own job...Because I feel the same... My best regards... |
Definitive Audio in Seattle, when I was in there last year, had a system of flagship Audio Technica, D'Agostino, Wilson and I forget what else. Only remembered long enough to look them up and add them up and realize that was a $1.3M system. Grusin, Time Out, and it was certainly dynamic and detailed and I came away more impressed than ever.... with how good a job I did, to have a much more engaging system for having spent less than the sales tax on theirs. |
Comparing one audio system to another, with different embeddings and different gear has not great signifiance to be polite...There is always better than what someone owns....Then you are right Geoffkait…. Making what we already owned very good and working at his peak potential quality is the key problem in audio....But most people has never even listen to their own gear at his true potential sound quality...And they even dont know that....Dissatified and bored by their self imposed limitations instead of thinking about how to makes their system works, they bought the new hyped gear or ready made solutions....It is not my way... :) |
I think it depends on where you live. It is always a good idea to spend a few days at a good audio show. However, many of them will bring some of their less expensive speakers because they assume most people will spend the money. They should have floors dedicated to beginners and floors dedicated for high end. I remember sitting in a $1 million room at the RMAF and a writer for Stereophile Magazine was there. He handed them a CD and said this was the best to listen to system capabilities. After a few minutes he asked how much the system cost. When the guy replied $1 MILLION he replied that's not too bad. I knew he was full of ........... Quite frankly, I didn't see the value unless you have so much money you don't know how to spend it. After you set all of the gear up in a room, it looks ugly. No way I would want something like that in my home. Who is going to stare at ugly speakers for hours without seeing something visual. Different strokes for different folks. |
I second the idea of hearing the best. Years ago I had the good fortune to spend some time at Goodwin's High End near Boston. At one point in the conversation I asked the owner what was the best system he had. To put it mildly, I was impressed. That system has since become my reference point. I will never be able to afford it, but I now know what is possible with really good components. |
Oooohhh boy. Is the thousand dollars you mention happen to be hundreds of thousand? If you are more or less satisfied with your system don't even go there. If by chance you come upon it, great. If you seek to experience "The Very Best", find it and you like it. It could ruin your life. Speakers = House Mortgage. A fair sized house to fit the speakers. Electronics = New top end Mercedes? Then the new upgraded versions comes. |
@jpwarren58 One more thing Mike. I just realized that you are the guy who always outbids me on EBay.honestly; i've not bid on ebay vinyl for a few years; been in gear mode lately. i get my recent used vinyl on Discog. it will soon be time to aggressively jump back into acquiring vinyl as i'm done adding tt's and cartridges. so watch out, here i come. :-) |
