I have more CDs and SACDs with female vocalists and groups featuring female vocalists than I do of male vocalists and groups featuring male vocalists. (As a matter of fact, I have one double SACD titled "The Wonderful Sound Of Female Vocalists.") Like you, @yyzsantabarbara , I have both Court (HDCD) and Blue (MFSL redbook) and neither of them ever did a whole lot of anything for me (every so many blue moons I play one or the other "just because I can") but Joni is not my one of my favorite female vocalists.
I also have a lot of CDs and SACDs featuring male vocalists that I truly enjoy; however, in general, I prefer the sound of the female voice to that of the male voice. For me, it’s kind of a chocolate milkshake versus vanilla milkshake thing--I like them both, but usually, not always, when I am in a mood for milkshakes I order chocolate.
that post on sexism, my first thought was Russian or Chinese troll.
Well, you did get the 'troll' part right.
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@grislybutter Please don’t misrepresent my words.
At no point was it ever “the point” to label, categorize and speak of an artist on terms of gender, male or female.
The most recent thread topic where I expressed my objection to the “female artist” label was a OP asking whether forum members like Taylor Swift. This OP asks whether one is “missing something” when non-plussed by the albums Blue and Exile on Main Street.
When the whole “female artist” thing emerged in both cases, I expressed my objection to it in each scenario.
I kinda can’t believe how much I have to clarify this, but of course there’s nothing wrong with being inclined to prefer the sonic aesthetic of a female voice.
It’s still just an artist, not a “female artist.”
Again, my qualm is the labeling of artists, not with any individual’s preferred sonic aesthetic.
Of course, your insinuation that a male voice can’t be mistaken for a female one is overstated. Many male vocalists can sound like a female.
It wasn’t until I saw a video of Russell Oberlin singing that I realized it was a male.
There are other vocal performances where it would be understandable to mistakenly believe it was sung by a person of a different gender.
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I was 2 years old when these albums came out. However, I noticed that I had put both Blue and Court and a Spark in my ROON library. I wanted to hear these 2 again since I love my office system now. It just sounds great.
I thought Court and a Spark was rather good but could not get into Blue.
With the Stones I love Exile. I found that as my gear improved the Stones became my favorite band. I love Exile on my phones too.
I actually have to limit how much of the Stones I listen to so as not to overdo it. Now I have heard the Stones since the 70’s but maybe I am only hearing them at their best today,
The new Stones album is also rather good.
BTW - that post on sexism, my first thought was Russian or Chinese troll. I mean that in the best sense.
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@tylermunns You keep repeating that calling female vocalist is sexist. In a context where it's the point. A men won't/can't have a female voice. Not even close. If I had to choose what I can listen to for the rest of my life, I would choose female singers. I prefer female doctors, female massage therapists, female vocalists. (And I have no desire to flirt with them, I don't care for how they look, I care about how good they are at their job.)
Does it make me sexist? If it does, I am clueless about what sexist is.
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thecarpathian
I don't think Peter, Paul and Mary 'rocked' anything...
Doo you take everything literally?
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Your obviously new to music forum conversations. Female vocalists are often referred to by that description. There is no slight or bias when that phrase is mentioned.
But your one of those woke idiots that wants to turn everything into an argument.
What makes music special is that its usually exempt from all the political bullshit.
Please refer to my original post...and if you have nothing but your woke agenda to contribute....go away you troll.
My Lord even the Audiophile world is infiltrated with these poison minds that want to wreck everything.
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@jastralfu when I said “level playing field” I meant, unlike athletics where it’s a scientifically proven fact that males have a physical advantage over females, none such exists in art.
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He is working on a new book called "Killing Female Vocalists."
Bill O’Reilly the author?
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Bill O’Reilly the author?
- The Bill O'Reilly of Audiogon has never heard anyone say it
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"Peter, Paul and Mary rocked my soul..."
I don't think Peter, Paul and Mary 'rocked' anything...
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@llg98ljk you should be ashamed for having preferences!
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@tylermunns i hear what you’re saying I just don’t think it applies here. OP is not being sexist. Saying that you like female vocalists is not in the same context as your examples. It’s perfectly valid to say I like vocalists, particularly female vocalists. I often think in terms of male vs female vocalists and often lean toward female voices. Disagree that we are all on a level playing field artistically or creatively, but being male or female is not a differentiating factor. However, it might be a factor in what someone likes.
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Wow! So I just found out that stating a preference is sexist. Full disclosure, I love female vocalists. Generally, more than male. Alison Krauss, Emmylou Harris, Eva Cassidy or Jennifer Warnes have the ability to tug at my soul far more than any male vocalists. Don't get me wrong, I like all.
As for a preference, who knows what's at play. I grew up in the 50's and 60's listening to classical music at home and rock when I could. Peter, Paul and Mary rocked my soul back then and inspired me to become a fairly proficient guitar player. That said, I never really got the Beatles or Stones. Why? beats me.
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I’ve never once heard someone say, “I love male artists.”
And since The Bill O'Reilly of Audiogon has never heard anyone say it, that automatically means that it has never been said.
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@jastralfu Of course there’s nothing wrong with enjoying the (clearly different from a male’s) sound of a female voice.
Of course everything you say is true, but none of it addresses what I said or what the actual issue is.
I’ve never once heard someone say, “I love male artists.”
I’ve never once heard Bob Dylan or Leonard Cohen or Bruce Springsteen (or whomever - just a few ex.) referred to a “a male artist.”
They’re referred to as “artists.”
Yet Carole King, Joni Mitchell and Lana Del Rey (or whomever - just a few ex.) are so very often referred to not as “artists,” but “female artists,” as though an actual artistic distinction need be made.
It’s just dumb and sexist.
They’re all artists, some are better than others, some people like some more than others.
This ain’t athletics where there are many scientifically proven facts that point to irrefutable differences in muscle mass, strength, leaping ability, etc. between males and females.
Artistically and creatively, we’re all on a completely level playing field.
To quote Kurt Cobain, sorry to be so anally PC, but that’s the way I feel.
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TylerMunns- Go read your DEI manual and crawl back into your miserable life.
The Bill O'Relly of Audiogon cannot help himself.
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I love to watch female soccer. A lot more technical and less physical than male soccer. Apologies to men. I am also embarrassed I didn't just call it soccer.
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I can't stand Mitchell. (And to be fair it's not just the music, all subjective, my memories)
Let It Bleed is my #1, #2, #3 Stones album. Exile is OK.
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@tylermunns not sure how any of the OPs opinions are sexist. Differentiating male and female vocals is not sexist. The average vocal range of the two is different. Noting the difference is not the same as saying men sing better than women. And in this case saying that you like female vocals has nothing to do with being sexist. Liking female vocalists is no different than saying I like the saxophone. Neither is a genre but certainly valid non-sexist statements.
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TylerMunns- Go read your DEI manual and crawl back into your miserable life.
he/him
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I was...I love both Joni and the Stones. The above mentioned records were far from their best in my opinion. The point of my post is that countless times I hear an interview with a great musician...these two records are often mentioned as their inspiration to make great music.
I'm certainly not saying their wrong... I'm just saying I missed the boat on both of these iconic records.
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I don’t get Blue either and I love Joni Mitchell. For the Roses, Court and Spark, The Hissing of Summer Lawns, Hejira and Don Juan’s Reckless Daughter are all outstanding and get a lot of play on my system. Maybe I need to revisit Blue, but it’s just never clicked. Exile on Main Street is a great album but would tend to agree with you that Beggars Banquet, Let it Bleed, and Sticky Fingers are better imo.
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Music touch us so deep precisely because it is in a way unique for each of us and personal...
It is why there is no unanimous jazz album that do it for eveyone , the same is true in classical music or in sitar ragas interpretation ...
We all recognized geniuses unanimously but we differ between us about the impact of this or this musicians...
Why Chet Baker is so important for me and Bill Evans way over other names ?
It is not right or wrong just they speak as language akin to my own soul more easy to understand ..
😊
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“Full disclosure I love female vocalists…”
How does such a sexist qualification necessitate a preface of “full disclosure…”?
Full disclosure: I abhor sexism.
Do you refer to “male vocalist” as if it’s a “genre” or do you just call them “vocalists? (because that’s what they are, right?) Would we categorize and label Black Sabbath and Exile on Main Street as “male rock albums,” or just “rock albums” (because that’s what they are, right?)
These are much more interesting questions to me than whether someone likes something.
P.S. you already had the right answer when you said, “it’s all subjective.” There’s nothing wrong with you for not liking a thing. You don’t have to like it. FWIW those are two of my favorite LPs but…who cares what I think? Nothing I or anyone can say will cause you to be moved by something that doesn’t move you.
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I listened to Blue and Exile non stop when they first came out, still like both, especially Exile...not too familiar with Tool...where you around when Blue and Exile were released ? ... I was big fans of both artists from the beginning, and my interest started to fade for each, after those 2 albums...
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