I am interested in the May as well. However, I read that May sounds best when feed with DSD512 up-sampled stream from HQPlayer. This puts a big requirement on the compute requirement of HQP on the up-sampling server and I certainly don't want to go down that path.
For those who are using the May, what are you feeding with ? Also, if you are feeding with upsampling stream, how big of a difference are we talking about between feeding native vs upsampled bitstream ?
|
Unfortunately it looks like kitsune has discontinued the home demo/trial offer. I emailed them and was told it's no longer feasible. A shame, tough to buy unheard... |
Thanks George. I was just reading about the Directstream and the designer was discussing how they paid special attention to phase preservation, so perhaps that's not the source of my issue. Perhaps it is just as simple as being bit-perfect (although I haven't really had that issue with other non-bit-perfect dacs). |
My theory is that some people (and systems) are particularly sensitive to phase coherency and that something about the DSD’s processing is influencing phase. Whatever it is, that product sounds like it puts the music into a blender to my ears. I was so happy to find a R2R dac (the Audio Mirror T3-SE) that eliminated whatever was happening and just sounded so much more natural to my ears. When doing PCM (Redbook 14/44, 24/96, DXD) Probably has something to do as Mojo Music states, that R2R Multibit conversion when done right is "Bit Perfect". Where DS (Delta Sigma converters) can only give a "facsimile" of it. But DS can do DSD, and now the some of the later discrete R2R Multibit dacs can too!! MoJo Music. "When a PCM file is played on a native DSD Delta Sigma single-bit converter, the single-bit DAC chip has to convert the PCM to DSD in real-time. This is one of the major reasons people claim DSD sounds better than PCM, when in fact, it is just that the chip in most modern Delta Sigma single-bit DACs do a poor job of decoding PCM." Cheers George |
@cd45123 I'm still naïve in regards to the Holo products, but I've had the Directstream DAC in my system (posted on agon) twice for extended periods. It just never worked for me. My theory is that some people (and systems) are particularly sensitive to phase coherency and that something about the DSD's processing is influencing phase. Whatever it is, that product sounds like it puts the music into a blender to my ears. I was so happy to find a R2R dac (the Audio Mirror T3-SE) that eliminated whatever was happening and just sounded so much more natural to my ears. Clearly other people with different ears and systems are having a *very* different experience with the DSD. I'll note that I had a PS Audio PWD II for many years and loved it. I downgraded back to it the two times I tried to move on to the DSD. |
I’d be curious, too, if anyone had heard this and the Rockna. Also, anyone compared this to the PS Audio direct stream?
I know I’m asking for the impossible with all these comparisons, but anyone that went from the Spring to the May, feel free to weigh in.
I’ve been seriously looking at the Spring and Pontus. Currently have a Teac NT-505 which was a nice step up from streaming on my integrated. |
Ha. I guess in that case "thank you!" instead... |
@cal3713 Actually, the first I heard of this DAC was in Stereophile. Herb Reichert mentioned it in his column, and Jim Austin reviewed it separately. |
@snackeyp you should email stereophile with a link to your first post and say "what took you so long??" |
to be serious for a moment, there is no doubt a component being named by a major magazine or website publication as ’recommended’ or ’best of’ is an accolade to be proud of - it is also important confirmation of that component being very very good at what it sets out to do
the other point to keep in mind on this topic is that media outlets get their bread buttered too, so inclusion of an item is often a measure of what is paid in advertising, or fees, or public relations legwork by the maker or dealer ... the key point is that competing units NOT included in such publications are not necessarily worse or unworthy
this takes nothing away from the holo may - which is undoubtedly a lovely sounding well built high end dac |
so does it sound even better today knowing this????
It's always nice to get recognition of your good taste from the pros. Enjoy! |
@jjss49 Yeah, probably! LOL
In seriousness, I don't know if these awards mean anything other than when a component I love gets the recognition it deserves it's exciting to hear. |
@snackeyp The Holo Audio May DAC 3 won the Product Of The Year in Stereophile this month.
I couldn’t find a web link to the article. It will probably be up in a week or two. I read this in the print edition. so does it sound even better today knowing this???? sorry -- i just couldn’t help myself LOL -- have fun and happy listening!!! :) |
The Holo Audio May DAC 3 won the Product Of The Year in Stereophile this month.
I couldn't find a web link to the article. It will probably be up in a week or two. I read this in the print edition. |
There's something very right about Holo DACs. I only heard one, years ago, at an audio show when I sat down to listen to some headphones. Holo was still new and when I put on the headphones, it was the first time I thought I could listen to this sound all day long and not want or need for anything.
All the best,
Nonoise |
|
@nonoise Thanks for posting this review. |
Here's a great review of the Holo May DAC. One bit that got my attention was this: It’s worth noting that John Atkinson of Stereophile, among others, have measured the TKE May DAC finding unparalleled performance, This implies a resolution of more than 22 bits, which is the highest I have encountered. https://twitteringmachines.com/review-holo-audio-kte-may-dac/ All the best, Nonoise |
what is the difference between the may and the spring (leave aside the ’levels’ of each) - other than the separate PS in its own chassis?
out of curiosity i went to the kitsune website tried to decipher, but while there is a lot of info there, i found it hard to figure this out |
I would love to read a review where they compare the Level 2 and 3 May DAC.
|
As far as I know Lampizator no longer utilizes R-2R. They have their own ‘engine 53’ delta sigma now. Besides that, all Lampi units are tube based and the May is not. You may know these two facts but thought I’d add them just incase.
What I’m curious about is how the May and the Mojo Audio EVO compare to each other —both ss and both R-2R... |
Has anyone heard both a May and Lampizator R2R DAC?
I'd be curious to hear how they compare.
|
@snackeyp Thanks for the information. Appreciated... |
synergy among high quality components is the lifeblood of a hifi rig that thoroughly pleases its owner... |
@redwoodaudio I agree with this assessment. I made a similar comparison to the Mytek Brooklyn. The Mytek is a wonderful DAC but the May DAC just sounds more "real" than the Mytek. Difficult to describe but once you hear it you know. Herb Reichert's review described a similar experience. |
I just A/B'd my Level 2 May DAC (fully broken in, in NOS mode, with balanced outputs) w/ my Chord Qutest (with Teddy Pardo LPS and unbalanced outputs) just prior to listing the Qutest for sale. They both sounded amazing (extremely quiet, excellent speed), but the biggest difference between them that I could tell was that the Qutest was more crisp-sounding, with less "air" or reverb/decay. The May let the reverb linger for much longer, which to me makes it feel more "real" or "live" in recordings that emphasize this. However, the Qutest had such a clean crisp sound to it, and some/many might prefer that, especially for more synthetic music. Otherwise, I'd say the May's overall sound was a little fuller/warmer/richer which made the Qutest sound a little quieter, volume-wise. Can't go wrong with either, but the May won me over for good. |
@cal3713 They offer a 10 day satisfaction guarantee. Not very long but for me it was immediately evident how great this DAC sounds.
Keep in mind that you will pay return shipping to HK if you return it. Probably best to sell it if you're not happy. There is a lot of great press about this DAC right now so interest is high. |
Anyone has compared this with the Rockna Wavelight? I believe they are at similar price points and hence curious. |
Is it possible to get these dacs with a home trial period? |
@phastm3 I look forward to hearing your thoughts on how the May DAC compares to the Gryphon. |
@jcarcopo can you talk about the differences between the Benchmark dac's sound (said to be extremely neutral and resolving) versus the May (said to be natural, sweeter, and resolving)? |
I ordered one last week and I have a similar digital setup at the OP. I also have the Innuos zenith mk3 and the Phoenix reclocker. I’m currently using a gryphon Diablo 300 and it’s built in dac. The gryphon dac gets high praise even though it uses a Sabre 9018 chip. I’m looking forward to doing a/b testing between the 2 Dacs. Ron from NRD is also in the process of reviewing the May...he recently reviewed the Terminator and Amber dacs. |
Brief follow up: I'm about six weeks into ownership of this DAC and can say with confidence I have zero regrets.
I've been doing a lot of streaming from Tidal recently since my CD transport is in the shop. I like streaming while I'm multi-tasking, and one of the funny things is I continuously get fooled by this DAC. The music will be playing and when it reaches the end of a certain track I'll subconsciously get up to change the LP side, only to remember that I'm not playing records! This DAC, combined with my Innuous Zenith Mk3 and Phoenix Reclocker, is as close to analog of any digital product I have ever heard.
In honesty, my analog setup beats the digital setup by a small margin, so doing an A/B between them, the analog system wins. That said, the May DAC does not sound like any DAC I've ever heard. There is no trace of square edges around the musical notes at all. No harshness, no glare. No analytical detail, yet plenty of detail! I can listen for hours without any fatigue. Excellent stereo separation, imaging and soundstage. $5K is a real bargain for this wonderful DAC. I'm extremely happy with it. |
JC, I started my listening using RCA interconnects, but a couple of weeks ago I got a new amp that has balanced inputs so I switched to XLR cables. I think the sound got even better. Just thought I'd share in case you hadn't heard the difference with this DAC. Cheers |
@cal3713 No worries, glad to help. I'm convinced you would have to spend well over $12k-$15k to get near a comparable dac stateside. |
Great, thanks so much for the information JC. Always super informative to know the within-system pecking order... |
@cal3713 I've own the Benchmark Media DAC 1, DAC 1 USB, DAC 2 HGC, and the Matrix XSabre Pro MQA DAC, Ayon Stealth DAC/Pre tube dac. I've heard others at shows, but those are the one I've owned over 20 years.
|
@jcarcopo Congrats on the great outcome. Could you mention some of the other dacs you've had in the system? Thanks. |
That's an impressive music server you've built. Thanks for sharing |
@snackeyp Thanks, It's been a nonstop marathon of music playing since I've received the May! I am (and have been for 20 years) running source direct to my amplifiers because I have no analog sources to speak of, and have always preferred the more direct and detailed presentation that running from my fanless/silent running media server directly via USB to DAC and from DAC to amplifier. I co-designed several of Niveus Media's earliest fanless/silent running media server designed to operate seamlessly in an audio rack in the living room. This was a couple of decades ago believe it or not! ( https://www.google.com/search?q=niveus+media+denali&newwindow=1&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS824US824&...). The May DAC connects via USB to a brand new custom silent-running and completely fanless Sigao Model B dedicated Roon server that has a
10th Gen 10-Core i9 10900T Intel Cpu, 4TB Samsung SSD for music library, 512gb Samsung 970 Pro NVME O/S/Roon/HqPlayer drive, 32gb DDR4 2666mhz, a separate JCAT FEMTO clocked USB PCIE add-in card (not in use atm because it doesn't support 1.536mhz or DSD512/1024 upsampling currently, but fortunately the Intel based USB ports do support the higher rates). I use Roon to feed HqPlayer software a 1.412mhz or 1.536mhz or DSD512 upsampled signal using their proprietary filters to the Holo May in NOS mode. I control the volume through Roon which attenuates it in HQplayer since the May Dac does not provide volume control. I power both the Sigao Roon server and JCAT USB Card separately with with a multi-rail dedicated 300w HDPLEX Linear Power Supply and that is plugged into a dedicated Equitech Son Of Q Balanced Isolation Transformer. Certain DSD512/1024 filter settings in HQPlayer can be very taxing on even the best CPUs hence the need for a 10/Core processor. SIGAO https://www.atlastsolutions.com/sigao-model-b-fanless-pc-10th-gen-10-core-i9-10900t-up-to-64gb-most-...HDPLEX PSU https://hdplex.com/hdplex-fanless-300w-linear-power-supply-for-pc-audio-and-ce-device.htmlJCAT USB PCIE CARD https://jcat.eu/product/usb-card-xe/ (Note: I DON'T own this JCAT model USB add-in card, but Tim Connor at Kitsune Audio (distributor for Holo Audio USA) is getting one in a week and testing it to see if the newer NEC USB chip will handle the faster upsampling speeds that the May dac supports. |
@jcarcopo Congrats on getting a new May DAC. I am also loving mine. It's not even broken in yet but sounds amazing. What is your main source feeding it? |
I got my May KTE DAC in way early. OMG! I’ll never buy a chip based DAC again. This thing makes music transcendental. It’s so damned detailed and yet so natural sounding. I hear everything, every little microdynamic nuance. This has surpassed my greatest expectation for taking my system to the next level.
I’m completely smitten. |
@jjss49 I've heard that about the 40's but I have never felt they have overloaded the room. I do not listen at extremely high levels but I like it moderately loud (my wife thinks it's really loud, LOL). My speakers have some shelving between them and the back wall, so this might defeat some of the low frequencies. If those shelves were not there the bass might overwhelm the room. I think as is they are absorbing the bass to some degree. If those shelves were not there I would likely need bass traps. I had 40.1's previously, BTW. Loving the Harbeth sound for sure! |
@snackeyp
nice rig! i have similar - had 40.1’s, now have super hl5’s among others - had a LFD into amp also while back driving... absolutely lovely combo... something about the LFD slight upward tilt gives the Harbeths just a lil more ’life’... brilliant synergy tremendous listenability
i would think the 40's would overload your room (it did mine and my room is bigger), but you seem to have a pretty nice tight listening triangle
have fun! |
My system is as follows:
LFD NCSE integrated amplifier
Harbeth 40.2 Anniversary speakers, Tontraeger stands
LFD Hybrid Speaker wire
LFD Spiroflex interconnects
LFD Power Cables
Niagara 7000 Power Conditioner (Amp plugged directly into wall outlet)
Digital:
Innuous Zenith Mk3 server
Innuous Phoenix reclocker
Holo Audio May DAC Level 3
Jay's Audio CDT-2 Transport
Analog:
SME 20/2 w/Tri-Planar tonearm, Lyra Kleos Cart
Parasound JC-3+ phono preamp
My room is a basement man cave, 12' x 14'. No room treatments other than carpet floors and suspended ceiling tiles, some tapestries on the walls to prevent reflections. Nothing fancy, but I've dialed it in to my liking. My ears are 8 feet from the speakers with my ears height between the tweeter and midrange driver heights. Speakers are toed in about one foot outside of each of my ears. Stereo image is very focused, and soundstage is large and appropriate to my tastes.
Harbeths are famous for their midrange sound and very accurate and neutral, which makes it easy to hear the nuances with different components, recordings, etc., but not at the expense of musicality, if that makes sense. |
@snackeyp
excellent feedback, glad u are enjoying
tell us what is rest of your system? preamp amp speakers wire
and u are changing from base case of mytek digital front end yes?
help us calibrate a little
btw don't let millerc see your post it will shatter his world hehehe |
Day three impressions:
Last night I tried something interesting. I had just received a copy of the newly issued Bob Dylan Love and Theft, MoFi 2LP 45 RPM release. I played it through on my analog system, and while I listened I contemplated the age-old argument of analog vs. digital. I decided then that I would play the digital version of this album for comparison. This MoFi release is done perfectly, BTW. Awesome sounding reissue, and limited to only 3,000 copies.
My analog system is as follows:
SME 20/2 turntable w/Tri-Planar tonearm and Lyra Kleos cartridge.
Phono preamp is a Parasound JC-3+.
Niagara 7000 Power Conditioner (Amplifier run straight into the wall)
As I began listening to the digital version (Tidal 44.1k) I was shocked at how I really couldn't hear any significant difference from the LP. This had never been the case with any other DAC I owned in the past. I could enjoy the analog and I could enjoy the digital but I never considered the digital to be as good as the analog, UNLESS it came down to comparing an inferior analog source to superior digital source. With the Mytek DACs I owned (Manhattan II and Brooklyn+) I could always hear a clear difference between digital and analog. It wasn't even close. Now with the May DAC3 I finally understand what the fuss is about when using a very high quality DAC. I'm not arguing one format over the other. I have no intention of selling off my analog gear and going full digital, at least not after only one comparison, but my mind was really blown how great the May DAC performed in this test.
After that I listened to several other Tidal streams and completely lost myself in the music. Stevie Wonder Talking Book, Elvis Costello All This Useless Beauty, Flaming Lips American Head, etc. Everything sounded so right through the May. The whole point of this hobby for me is to find the best version of the music possible, and this DAC has greatly increased my joy of music.
One last thing I noticed yesterday was just how QUIET this DAC is. Until you've heard a really quiet component it's really hard to explain it, but it makes a huge difference when a component like this lowers the noise floor so significantly.
Up and onward...
|
@duckworp
Also the Holo is sold through a retailer in Europe (Magna) and US (Kitsune) whereas the Denafrips comes direct from Singapore which implies better value as no retailer margins to eat in to the price.
Have you tried 8th Dimension to see if they have the May available?
http://www.8thdimensionaudio.com/product/holo-audio-spring-2-dac/
|
I decided to try a reference-level R2R DAC instead of my Qutest, which is the only DAC I’ve ever owned. I also didn’t want to spend more than I needed to. I chose the May based on the stereophile and stereotimes reviews. Both experienced reviewers were blown away. Terminator was similarly esteemed, though. Between the Terminator and the May, I like the design of the May better. One of the distinctions between the Terminator and May seemed to be the anti-jitter tech in the May. That was part of my decision as well. I can’t imagine you could go wrong with either. Unless you have bad OCD, I can’t imagine either choice would lead to serious regrets. @redwoodaudio - how did the halo compare to the chord in your system? Can you describe the difference as that exact model (qutest) is also on my list. |
"
Ah, but now there's a Terminator Plus model, which ups the ante, and should boost the T+ to A+ status."
I don't know. Steve Guttenberg ended up preferring the standard Terminator.
|
