Theaudiotweak, I can understand that the mechanical impedance at the point of spikes, but what it would be with StillPoints Ultra Fives seems ill-defined. The base is 3 inches in diameter and the top is somewhat smaller. But the top ceramic ball would be very small and what vertical motion there would be there would be gone by the bottom of the ball pile would be gone. Also that on the bottom of the pile would be gone by the top. |
Norm
You are describing a transducer, conversion of energy from one form to another. Not as efficient. Tom |
What Tom said makes sense. I would be interested to hear what Rick Schultz himself has to say on the subject as he has been an advocate and end user of Sistrum products in the past.... |
TOM, yes I understand Transduction is not as scientifically efficient and why.
I know that a manufacturer building a product needs efficiency for cost reasons. They must stop short of doing everything they could do for the same cost considerations.
Once I get the product home I like to play with it to see if I can get it to be more effective for my ears and my system. I often use less efficient methods but I like it more. If I like the sound of adding a transducer or 20, then I like the sound.
Scientific advances have continually improved my listening experience.
This was never more true than with Rick's amazing High Fidelity Products.
Listening and liking music for me is sometimes emotional, subjective and personal rather than reasonable.
Meanwhile, I am having fun and hope you are too. Dave |
Theaudiotweak, all I really know is what I hear. I have not heard the Star Backstage but nothing I have heard surpasses the StillPoints, and I have tried many, many vibration solution, including the Halcyonics active systems, plus boxes full of brass footers of varying sizes. |
Norm
Sure it's up to the end user in how and with what means they want to terminate their equipment.
I know that the designer of the product uses methods and control terminations inside his product that are similar in concept to many of our product designs. By using the same concepts for mechanical ground inside and out there will be a synergy of sound by engaging the same methods. Transitional changes from direct mechanical coupling internal and then the relay hand off to devices that claim to isolate or decouple external may deprive the listener the total impact potential of the product they purchased. You may not know for sure unless you try the same methods all the way thru to mechanical ground. Tom. Star Sound Technology |
@ Chris_launder, @ TBG, Hi Gentleman, My amp only accepts balanced inputs and Krell cast, no Rca inputs, that was the reason I wanted to know my self, thankyou for the heads-up of when the balanced cable may arrive.cheers to the both of you. |
Agear, he still does. I have never even seen any of the Star gear. Do you have it? |
The Coulomb Effect is well understood. Coupling is well understood. The Diode Effect for cones is well understood. And vibration isolation from very low frequencies is well understood. But these techniques are not interchangeable. They are complementary. |
Good-day Audiolabyrinth, first and most important is that we are not here to hijack this thread. Rick Schultz and I have known each other for thirteen years are friends and have worked on many projects together including technical approaches to Vibration Management in all categories of audio.
Referring to your statement from 09/19:
As engineers we are trained never to say the words never, ‘impossible’ or non-existent. The opinions below are that of our company, products, technology and the applied laws of physics; static mechanics and analytical micro-dynamics.
The process of mechanical direct coupling and variable tensioning affecting performance and frequency has been proven and documented in an article from Stanford University titled “The Resonistor: A Frequency Selective Device Utilizing the Mechanical Resonance of a Silicon Substrate dated July 10TH, 1967.”
As you are aware, there is not much evidence of third party testing in the field of High End Audio largely because of the additional financial outlay; one has to depend on historical advancements or the people behind the product.
Resonance tuning related to our understanding is the ability to alter rate of transfer of energy resulting from vibration passing through and around a mechanical grounding plane (Back-STAGE or Sistrum Platforms™) where as the sonic ‘Q’ (original sonic reference) of electrical driven components or passive loudspeakers of the product can be altered.
The grounding plane must consist entirely of metals that conduct resonance. In order to adjust the sonic measure of an audio product you would require some type of tension device. Analogy: a string instrument such as the cello where as there is a bridge (the metallic Platform), a string crossing the bridge (the audio equipment) and the tuning machines at the top of the neck (the tensioning device). The correct term for instruments is ‘tuning’ and the proper technical term based on our applications is ‘adjusting the harmonic structure’.
The speed at which resonance flows through and from a product can be mechanically altered through tensioning, where in listening applications will affect the sound of equipment residing on the adjustable grounding plane.
In closing: We will always pay for the phone call and if I personally cannot answer your questions, we do have engineers who will provide opinions in helping to educate and advance the art of listening.
Rick has an excellent product design, put years of research in developing it. This dedication and products offer a very natural and highly musical sound quality. Congratulations Rick from all of us here at ‘ground central’.
As Always, Good Listening!
Robert
Star Sound Technologies, LLC |
To All,
In search of goose bumps.
I recently had a cellist and educator purchase an endpin for her cello and in conversation she expressed her feelings on the passing of her luthier and friend Rene Morel. Never knowing or hearing of Mr. Morel before our conversation I found his obituary in the NY Times. All was fascinating but what I found most personal to me was this renowned luthier and artist of such could not play an instrument. He would have a cellist play for hours if needed and make tiny adjustments until the resulting sound would raise goose bumps on his arms. Only until he had that emotional reaction would he know all was well with the instrument and his minute adjustments to the instrument were complete.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/20/nyregion/rene-a-morel-master-restorer-of-rare-violins-dies-at-79.html?_r=0
In our mutual shared pursuit of the musical goose bump experience we may certainly disagree on the methods of reaching this physcial and emotional state but I feel that reaching this state is our goal. Tom |
Well, Tom, now I know which Tom you are thanks to your mentioning the endpin. |
Norm
It's really me.
Same Tom as when we spoke an wrote back in 2008. |
Hi Norm. I've used Sistrum products on and off since 2007. I currently use the 101's under my equipment and the apprentice stands under my speakers. Also have a sound room using their technology within the walls.
Anyway, back to Rick's cables. No more diversionary banter |
A question: for isolating a scanning electron microscope, which would be better for purposes of preventing movement of a specimen while it's being photographed -- a coulomb effect device or mass-on-spring device? Answer at 11. |
Thanks to all for recent conversations about vibration abatement.
I continue to experiment with vibration Damping and vibration Grounding methods. as always keeping a keen ear on loss of liveness, realness or humanness.
In my current system, with the WGPC (and all other magnetic wave guides )
I like the sound better with some damping directly on the wave guides as it sounds more coherent, resolving, involving.
I like the goosebumps analogy and that (or magic) is what I am always searching for. |
Geoffkait, my background is medicine, and during my training, I spent more than four years in research labs. For scanning microscopy and the measurement of structures smaller than a micron, active isolation is typically used. The semiconductor industry also makes use of them where objects can be smaller than 20nm. Slightly different application than audio obviously, but there are some who tout the virtues of active isolation in audio.
Shame on me for further digression. Cable discussion si vous plait.... |
@ Audiopoint, Hi, Thankyou for the post, good educational point about resonance control and isolation, however, all that did not explain how resonance tunning and isolation can change the electrical impedence of a componet or speakers, again, it can not!, the science of resonance is quite different than elecrical, thus have nothing to do with each other. |
Did you miss his reply on the 23rd, Audiolabyrinth?
This thread is not the place for such a discussion anyway. |
Nglazer,
Did the cables send you to heaven?? |
Yes, Glory, they did, but regrettably, I am back. (Perhaps I will write yet another book about it.)
Seriously, I have not spent enough time listening to the CT-1E's between DAC and pre (where they replaced Stealth Indras) to take their full measure, but I have listened long enough to recognize these are a step beyond the Indras in clarity, detail, what I call "naturalness," and soundstage. In fact, I was listening to an old Bobby Darin tune (Dream Lover") that had been remastered. There is a guitar riff that involves some serious picking but I had barely noticed before -- but there it was, with the distinct and realistic sound of each string picked.
More to report over time, and when I try them between pre and amp (to replace JPS Aluminata, other legendary IC's), but for now these cables have overcome my skepticism. Not much tops Stealth Indras -- these demonstrably do.
Neal |
Nglazer, well spoken review! |
Neal..glad you like them.. |
Neal,
Well expressed, "naturalness" really says all that needs to be said. What higher compliment is there for an audio component than to describe it as natural. So many products can provide hifi spectacular, only the very premium components deliver natural. |
Yes, Glory, they did, but regrettably, I am back. (Perhaps I will write yet another book about it.) That's pretty good I must say.... |
Great to hear another positive HFC experience. Thanks.
I think of my experience with Rick's cables this past year from the time I
read the very first post on this thread by Alpass. Then going from listening to Ct 1, CT 1E, to an all CT Ultimate system with Wave Guide Power Conditioner.
AN AWSOME RIDE!!! Redefining Naturalness, intimacy and soundstage presentation for me... many times. Thanks Rick!!
Dose anyone have more to tell about WGPC? |
@ Agisthos, Hi, Yes I did get his post on the 23rd, great post, never got to the point I was reffering to, Agreed, this is not the place for that topic!, Its about High-fidelty products and cables here,I enjoy all the over the top feed back on these cables, why nobody talks about the presatation is beyond me?, you gentleman know what I am saying, what seating role does each model suggest?, whats the imaging like?, how tall and deep is the sound stage?, to me, natural would land the presatation dead middle between the speakers and the listener, No forward sound period!, soon, when the balanced cables are available, I will give the very best HF has to offer a spinn, likly rented from the cable co, I enjoy this thread, great stuff! cheers. |
Hi, one more question, Is the presatation similair to the virtual dynamics cables at all?, thanks. |
Audiolabyrinth, I cannot imagine what you are talking about in saying that nobody talks about the presentation. Soundstage, realism, and a sense that you are at the recording event are all mentioned. I also don't understand why you want the soundstage just between the speakers. In both of my systems the sound is high, wide, deep, and involving. But it is the ease of the sound, the sweetness of the top end and the definition and profoundness of the bass as well as the detail capturing. I continually hear things that I never heard before in the recording that I wonder if even the recording engineer ever heard. |
In both of my systems the sound is high, wide, deep, and involving. But it is the ease of the sound, the sweetness of the top end and the definition and profoundness of the bass as well as the detail capturing. I continually hear things that I never heard before in the recording that I wonder if even the recording engineer ever heard. What more needs to be said? |
@ TbG, Hi, No, not in between the speakers, I said between the speakers and the listener, In the middle of the room, If the soundstage is more forward than that or more recessed than that, to me thats not a sound compairable to a live musical event, I say that because I am a musician, and know what live music sounds like, virtual dynamics cables are forward sounding, role a thru c, not natural!, I have never played live or been to a live musical event where the music is in my face or so recessed to where it sounds as if its on stage, I wanted to know if the presatation is any of these, I know the resolution may be there, the tone may be there, presatation? |
All your audio components on an individual basis create a row G or H presentation? How could you determine the individual perspective of a single component when you have to have several hooked together to re-create a audible signal. And when it comes to materials from what and how does Strain Gauge derive its signal? Tom |
Quite simply - the musicians and instruments are exactly where they are supposed to be. The width of field extends beyond the speakers when it should, the depth or layering is excellent, as is the imaging. When you close your eyes, you are THERE.
These cables are NOTHING AT ALL like anything that had been released by Virtual Dynamics.
I hope this helps. |
Audiolabyrinth, I prefer to hear the sound stage before me as though I was standing about where the mics were. Of course if the mics pick up the high frequencies correctly and your system reproduces them correctly, you are going to hear the music as you would standing close to the mics.
What I like most about the High Fidelity cables is their ease and detail, which captures decay of the notes and subtle portions of the music.
I can find no definition for the word "presatation." |
Thankyou gentleman for your responses, cheers. |
Ddraudt, do you want to come over next weekend? I have the WGPC in the system. |
Norm, visiting sounds like fun and next weekend is a possibility.
How is the WGPC sounding? |
Ddraudt, I have just begun experiments with it. It is plugged into the wall and two other devices feed off it. One is the HB Designs Acrylic PowerSlave with all analog device plugged into it and the other is a Japanese device with all digital devices plugged in. This allowed a simple with and without the WGPC.
With was definitely superior with all the properties of the HF cables but to a far greater extent. The soundstage is very wide, deep, and high, it is very detailed with no doubt as to how wide and where the marimba is, where the audience member who is coughing is including how far away from the performer, one can easily hear the decay of the notes in the hall, and the timbre of instruments is right on.
I want to move on to skipping the use of other devices in ac filtering, but having only eight outlets on the HF WGPC is a limitation.
I do wish the Hubbell 5362BLK duplexes without cryogenic treatment were used. I wish all could be zapped on the SR Tesla Coil.
Presently, I am using the spikes that come with the HF WGPC on an Accapella isolation base. I will soon be trying the StillPoints Ultra Fives. |
Tbg, Thanks for you report on WGPC. I'm still amazed at how much MORE
the WGPC adds to the HF cable improvements. WOW!
Will love to hear you views on the Stillpoint ultra 5's on the WGPC
I have months of experiments to do on the WGPC which include trying different devices under the unit, on top of it, and inside. also trying items in conjunction with the WGPC.
One distraction is that it sounds so fantastic I get lost in the music. |
Hi folks - have been so impressed with all your positive comments that I have now got CT-1 and 1e RCAs on home demo.
Now I can hear what all the vibe has been about....wonderful music!
Does anyone happen to know if Rick can do shorter lengths than 1m without affecting the technology?
Ideally would be looking for 0.6m lengths.
Thanks, nick |
Nic10pin, this is not a good week to call him as the Rocky Mountain Audio Fest starts on the 11th and HF is in the show. But after that just google High Fidelity cables and contract them. I have a one meter pair and can see that it is possible to take out about a foot of cable.
Bare in mind that the wave guides get bigger and longer on the top cables, so it would be easier to make shorter cables on the CT-1 standards than on the soon to be released CT-1 Ultimate Reference cables. |
My suggestion is to think of resale value..who else may require or want to purchase a .6 meter cable. Some other brands digital cables take in account wave reflection. Their cables are only made and sold in lengths of a about 1.6 meters to avoid this possibility. Tom |
Hello Nic10pin,
For the CT-1 and CT-1E you can go shorter. I had Rick make me a special set of 0.75 m unshielded CT-1E phono cables for my RS Labs tonearm. The technology for the CT-1E includes an upgraded conductor (which is actually slightly more flexible that the regular CT-1) and better connectors, especially for the pin.
Enjoy. |
Nic10pin,
I totally agree with "Theaudiotweak". Going for a shorter length than the standard is fine but can pose some difficulties when you decide to sell it. It's like selling a house on a busy street, it will sell definitely sell, but may take longer, and may probably sell for a lot less than anticipated. |
Thank you all for your advice. My dealer has at last heard back from RS and apparently 1m is the min length.
Cheers nick |
Norm, Thanks Much. I really enjoyed visiting.
You system looked and sounded fantastic. Very impressive.
I learned a lot.
You have lots of great toys that will end up costing me a lot of money
to get.
First time I've gotten to see and hear the HF Ultimate Reference speaker cable.
Super fine man, Super Fine!!!
i was so happy we got to play with stuff.
Glad we got to demo my wave guide damping idea and glad it worked as well there as at my place. (better bass, detail, image, balance.)Your Stillpoints made the damping idea really sing!!
Those Stillpoints are fabulous on High Fidelity gear! I need about 50 of them.
Thanks again. Hope to hear your thoughts.
DD |
Dave, I always love to have people come listen; it helps me validate what I've been hearing. While I know of a guy in Washington with more than ninety SP Ultra Fives, I know full-well that you are not thinking entirely of Ultra Fives. You dampening of the wave guides certainly did work. Thanks for coming over to Aggie Land.
Today I'm going to put the HF WAPC on SP Utra Minis. Ceteris Paribus (all things held constant) is alway so difficult to assure evaluations. |
Good evening Folks .
I would appreciate advice from any HF CT owners who may have utilised an quality RCA > XLR adaptor , out of expedience , with ones equipment and whether this additional non HF tech link would significantly negate the magnetic flow of the cable
I suspect like a number of potential HF customers I am left deciding whether to commit to an initial purchase of source input RCA and Speaker cables whilst waiting for a dedicated Balanced cable to complete the loom between my ARC Pre to Power . |
It is actually possible for Rick to in essence "create" a balanced cable by using 2 runs of rca's in opposite directions into a 2:1 rca to XLR Cardas connector. Its expensive, because you need to buy 2 cables for each run, and it takes longer to break in than a single run. It does, however, allow you to turn Rick's rca cables into a balanced design. It worked for me when my amps started misbehaving in RCA mode. They are now all better and running rca's. |
Fplanner2000, I am using the 2:1 adapter, though by Purist Audio, also. How long would you say it took to break in?
Also can you elaborate on the "amps started misbehaving in RCA mode. They are now all better and running rca's." |
