Grado Sonata Cartridge vs. Rega Ania

yogiboy,

On another forum, posters have corroborated your view.
Conrad-Johnson’s rep is obviously wrong.

I recall when Corey Greenberg reviewed for Stereophile, and he was such a cost conscious reviewer, that I bought everything he reviewed that I needed. I have 3 preamps still working, that I bought from that time which he gave good reviews of.

When he gave a cartridge a top recommendation, I didn't hesitate to buy it; didn't like it. That's when I realized how our tastes differed in music; that made all the difference in the world.

You may think others hear what you hear, but it ain't necessarily so because there are far too many variables, taste in music is just one of them.

@orpheus10 

Most people on this forum don't seem to like Grado, and that has to be because of their choice in music, and what they expect a cartridge to deliver.  

I like sertain models of Grado, for example Signature models made by Joseph Grado himself (RIP) in the 80s. They are the best and Signature Grado XTZ is top of the line MI ! 

The cartridge must play all genres of music, it doesn't matter which genre of music you like personally, if your cartridge can't play sertain genre of music this cartridge is not good or the user likes coloration of the sertain cartridges. 

The very best MM cartridges like Audio-Technica AT-ML180 OCC plays everything, it's all about the truth (amazing cartridge). Very high compliance Grace F-14 or LEVEL II plays everything. High compliance cartridges can pass through all 3 bands of extremely high groove modulation on Hi-Fi Test LP without any single skip! This is the ultimate test for cartridge suspension. It doesn't matter how complicated is the musical passages on vinyl, any good cartridge plays the most complicated grooves easily. This is a benefits of the high compliance MM/MI cartridges. They are great trackers and even Cannon shots on Tchaikovsky 1812 Overture LP is not a problem for them. Your Grado is about 30cu compliance, Grace is even higher.  

Why should we think about "Most people on this forum" if they never tried amazing cartridges from the past (from the golden era of analog) when they are talking about today's cartridges, tonearms, turntables?  

That voltage is too low for the PV-11.

Right now I have a Grado Master, which is a shade better than the Sonata. I had the Sonata and upgraded, maybe I'm now comparing what I'm hearing to the Sonata, but I'm very satisfied.

Most people on this forum don't seem to like Grado, and that has to be because of their choice in music, and what they expect a cartridge to deliver.

In regard to brands, I don't like really high definition cartridges; they seem to bypass the music. Of course that's within a price boundary, more expensive cartridges do both.

Raul, if you can find his thread, gives advice on how to buy and audition used cartridges.

@rvpiano
FYI, 350uv=.35mv. I can’t see how that is enough voltage for the mm phono stage of the Conrad-Johnson PV-11.
Maybe I'm missing something?

I wrote to Conrad-Johnson regarding the feasibility of matching my PV 11 preamp with the Ania cartridge.  The response was as follows:

”Yes, 3.5 uV output would be sufficient to run PV-11.”

I don’t know how accurate that answer is though.

@orpheus10 In my opinion....

I'm talking about accurate reproduction of the information recorded in the groove.  You're talking about colorations and distortions, masking of information.  I want to hear what's in the groove, not be romanced by some awkward resonances and lack of detail.

Of course, this may be exactly what you like.  If that's your opinion and listening preference, so be it.  My opinion and listening preferences differ.  We can both enjoy vinyl playback in our own way.

Happy listening.  

Stevecham,

Thanks for the recommendations!

I have a Grado Sonata and a few other MM and MI cartridges; two that I have that I prefer over the Sonata, for the sonic characteristics it seems you seek, are a Nagaoka MP200 and an Ortofon Black. The Nagaoka is very, very smooth and easy on the ear, but with plenty of bandwidth, and I like it for rock, classical and light jazz. The Black is an extremely detailed cartridge and is great for massed strings and complex passages. Some find it overly clinical but it certainly gets out what’s in the groove. I’ve been trying to settle on an overall performer but my current preference goes to the Nagaoka, truly an unsung brand among current cartridge manufacturers.

Can anyone suggest an alternate cartridge to the Sonata that is more detailed, yet good for classical? It can be a MC with transformer or any other type of cartridge in the $600-$800 range.

In this price range you can look for brand new Garrott cartridges. Something like P77i 

Vintage MM/MI cartridges are better, i would strongly recommend Victor X1IIe, Pioneer PC-1000 mkII, Joseph Grado Signature XTZ. For a bit more the Grace F-14 or LEVEL II are giant killers!  

You might look into a high output MC cartridge that you will not need a SUT! Here is one that might do the trick. You can return it if you prefer the Grado!
https://www.needledoctor.com/Dynavector-10X5-Cartridge

Thanks yogiboy for the info! 

Can anyone suggest an alternate cartridge to the Sonata that is more detailed, yet good for classical? It can be a MC with transformer or any other type of cartridge in the $600-$800 range.

Step up transformer. Here are a few!

https://www.needledoctor.com/analog/analog-components/phono-preamplifiers/phono-preamp-options/Step~...

yogiboy,

Good question.
 It’s just that I’ve heard CDs on his system that we’re not that impressive.
And since our turntables are similar, I thought that the cartridge was the variable that is responsible for the improvement.
I could be very wrong, though.
What does SUT stand for?

I really like the older Grado signature cartridge. With an XTZ stylus it is beautiful. Real dependant on VTA & VTF, but once it's dialed in it sounds better than some very respectable MC's IMHO.  

That is not enough voltage for the mm phono on the Conrad-Johnson. The output of the Grado is 5mv not 5uv. You will have to add a SUT to add gain for a low output MC cartridge. BTW, how do you know that it is the Grado and not another component in your friends system that you prefer to your setup?

I understand the gain on my Conrad-Johnson’s phono section is 47dB.
Is that strong enough to efficiently run an MC cart such as the Ania (3.5uV?)

Orpheus10,

My listening is mainly classical, and I know Grado usually works well, but unfortunately it does lack the definition I heard.
How do you audition cartridges in your system?
Who’s going to lend you one?

There is so much dependent on the music you like and what in music you listen for that determines which cartridge is best for you; therefore, it's not being objective when you blame the cartridge; especially when speaking of a high quality cartridge like the "Grado Sonata" that captures the soul of female vocalists.

Grado cartridges are not conducive to the music preferred on this forum for the most part, that's why they get such a bad rap here. The solution is to find a cartridge conducive to your music.

There are still too many variables to answer your question, but it's for certain that you should audition as many other cartridges as possible.

In my opinion....

Lots of carts in that price range smoke the Grado cartridge. Denon 110, ATVM750SH and Soundsmith Otello are three that quickly come to mind in the price range of the two carts you are asking to compare. All three are high output (or high enough to work in MM inputs).   

Can't pass judgement on the Rega, but suspect it is similar to other Rega underperformers.  There are other high output MC carts that will better the performance of the Grado.

I had a Grado Sonata and gave it away to someone who makes his listening decisions based on magazine review more than his own ears. He was disappointed in the Sonata as well compared to other similarly-priced carts.

I had a Sonata in a Rega years ago, and found the cartridge musical, but short on definition and bloom.   I don't know the Ania.   I think I'd look to lots of different cartridges before settling in, if change is in the offing.