Fidelity Research cartridges

Ateal,

Yes, my technics EPC100MkIV is the thegrated headshell version in P Mount version.

@ddriveman is your EPC the integrated headshell version. I have the silver MK3 and it is absolutely fantastic sounding.

It is so smooth yet reveals everything without any listening fatigue. I guess that is down to the super flat frequency response. 

It also has a great bass response.

I also have no suspension problems.

Dear ddriveman, I have read and reread your ''mini-shootout''
many times. The reason is ''obvious''. It is very satisfying to
see confirmation of our own opinion or judgment. In addition the
price comparison between the winners made me feel as a very
smart person (grin). I noticed the mentioning of Ikeda 9 C, mk III
which was, alas, not possible to adjust optimal during the test.
But the ''injustice'' done to the ''poor thing'' is corrected by your 
addendum. However you deed not vote for the FR-7fz as equal
to your (beloved?) Coral stone so your praise of the 9C,mk III
above the FR-7 FZ is not very convincing. I myself have no problem
at all to love Maria equal to Silvia despite their different qualities.
In this sense I love my FZ equal to my C9,mk II. However i just
got the REX. The latest of Ikeda's cantileverless kinds. So I
fall in love as never before and forget Maria as well Silvia.
I seem to agree with ''American Marx'': ''If you don't like my
principle I have other''...

Dear friends, since i bought the uber rare FR-7fz i have to rise some funds for this expensive hobby. If anyone interested in my FR-7f in exellent condition let me know. I will keep only one cart for myself, another one looking for new home.

The sunlight was nice today to make a picture of it:
https://scontent-arn2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/37958622_2358568874161266_3769234174796365824_n.jpg?_n...

Yes, the SPU 85th anniversary has the Urushi body. Really nice. My firend has the SPU 95th Anniversary. he likes it a lot and prefers it over my 85th Anniversary. But I prefer my 85th Anniversary on my system and his system. The 95th has a "modern" sound compared to the 85th but I preferred the vintage SPU house sound.
Damper on my Technics EPC100Mk4? Not sure if there was a problem? Plays and sounds fine.

@ddriveman nice, that 85th Anniversary has the most attractive look of all SPU, the finishing is superb. 

So the damper of your Technics stylus for EPC100 mk4 was fine? 

Ok, time to give some update since this thread has been revived and almost 4 years have passed since my vintage MC Cartridge mini-shootout review. Thanks to Chakster for finding that review.
Firstly, I was able to listen to the Ikeda 9C III again with Ikeda headshell and Ikeda headshell wires. This time, I preferred the 9C III to the FR7fz.
I've also added a SPU 85th Anniversary which is now the best SPU in my inventory. Finally, I moved from the Koetsu Coralstone Platinum to the Koetsu Coralstone Diamond Platinum which has a diamond cantilever. This is now my reference cartridge. All of the attributes of the original Coralstone Platinum but with more detail and PRAT. 
I'm still hunting for a Ikeda 9R, 9REX or 9 MUSA as I really like the cantileverless Ikeda 9 sound.
Additionally, I also have a Sony XL-55 Pro. It was nice but not better than the FR7fz in my system. If anyone is interested, I'm willing to part with it.
Finally, the cartridges that get most used in my system are :
- Koetsu Coral Diamond Platinum
- Ikeda 9C III
- FR7fz
- SPU 85th Anniversary
- Acoustical Systems Archon Cartridge
- Technics EPC100 Mk IV

FWIW

Long time ago i’ve come across this page in japanese, revisited it last week i realized the price for Fr-7fc is the highest among all of them (100 000 Yen in 1981), even higher than FR-7fz with refined LineContact tip (80 000 Yen in 1981) for some reason. But the "fc" has a conical tip, what is the reason for higher price?

It was hard to find that topic, but to make it easier for every FR user i will copy his "mini-shootout: SPU, Koetsu, FR, Ikeda" right here:


"Finally had a chance to do a shootout of some of my MC cartridges. We compared 3 SPU’s (Silver Meister GM, Gold GM, Royal GM), Ikeda 9CIII (cantileverless), Fidelity Research FR7fz, Koetsu Onyx Platinum and Koetsu Coralstone Platinum. All cartridges except the Koetsu Coralstone Plt was bought used and hence runned-in. The cartridges were tested on my friend Kel’s system (Art Audio Carissa 845 amps, AR LS27 pre, Hagerman Trumpet phonostage + Cinemag Blue SUT, Hagerman Bugle fully modded + Hashimoto HM-7 SUT and Kudos speakers). We used 2 TT’s: Garrard 401 with Schick 12" arm and a Garrard 301 with Ikeda IT407 12" arm. Both Garrards have upgraded plinths. Most of the comparison was finally done with the Garrard 301/Ikeda combo. We used different headshells for the Ikeda 9CIII (Ikeda Rhodium headshell/cheap leads), Koetsu Onyx Plt (Yamamoto Ebony/Ortofon Silver leads) and Koetsu Coralstone Plt (Sumiko headshell/Ikeda Hybrid Cu leads). We started with the SPU’s. Amongst the 3 SPU, the consensus was that the SPU Gold was the best. It was between the Silver Meister which has more treble extension and the Royal which was the most laid back. The Royal have all the SPU attributes but has detail, refinement, soundstage, smoothness and musicality but more punch and dynamics than the Royal and without some of the leading edge and treble extension of the Silver Meister. Mind you, all 3 had a similar SPU house sound. We then tried the FR7fz which sounded more balance, more PRAT than the SPU’s while remaining smooth, warm, detailed and musical. 2 of our group (50%) liked the FR7fz the best. We then tried the Ikeda 9CIII which was very difficult to setup. We initially tried Ikeda’s silver headshell leads but could not get one channel to work and finally had to settle for some basic cheap leads (unknown conductor) which did reduce the sonics somewhat. But we did hear what cantileverless brings to the party. A very direct, dynamic, detail, good micro and macrodynamics, very good PART. It does have a similar house sound like the FR7fz. But probably let down by the cheap leads we had to use. All favoured the FR7f over the Ikeda9CIII as a result. But it certainly wetted my appetite to try a higher end and later model Ikeda 9 REX or MUSA. Finally, we tried the Koetsu’s. We were not expecting much. We thought we would get good mids but soft bass and treble extension. We tried the Onyx Plt and we were shocked. This is not the typical Koetsu wood body sound. Great dynamic and realistic bass. Kel and I thought it had the best bass of all. Very palpable mids. Seems like the musicians are there in the room. Dynamic, detail, airy and very musical. And mind you, my Koetsu Onyx Plt has a hairline crack on the body. I bought it that way at a low price. This was the only way I could afford a stone body Koetsu (or so I thought). In fact, the sound was so good that I then bought a new Coralstone Plt so that we can put it into the shootout. We then tried the Coralstone Plt. It was even better than the Onyx Plt even though it was brand new. More bass, more dynamics, more musical than the Onyx. And strangely more gain than the Onyx. So it could be something to do with the Onyx’s cracked body. We ran it in for a few more days. We did hear some sonic changes in the Koetsu Coralstone as it was running in, so it was obviously not performing at its best. I was told by the dealer that it needed about 100 hours of run-in. In the end, we had 2 members prefer the FR7fz and 2 others preferring the Koetsu Coralstone Platinum. Obviously this is not a formal review, not same headsells etc, but just a quick shootout over 3 days to get a flavor of these cartridges. A key take away is that these vintage cartridges SPU Gold, FR7fz and Ikeda 9CIII have a lot to offer and surprised us all. Kel has a DPS turntable/arm with Transfiguration Proteus cartridge as his reference TT. I would say that all the cartridges gave the DPS/Proteus combo a good run for the money. As for me, the Coralstone Platinum is my new reference. " - @ddriveman ( 09-28-2014 ) 

Raul is right, the FR-7Fc has 0.65mm conical stylus tip according to the answer from the two japanese sellers i’ve been chatted with.

Now i am a proud owner of the fully original Fidelity-Research FR-7fz (LineContact tip), thanks @nandric who motivated me to buy it and @syntax who helped me with some info too. It’s hard to imagine, but i bought it from the local guy in my town and the price was nice (i had to be quick).

Now i’m trying to find documentations for this model to make sure about the specs. There is a link with the specs, i hope this is correct specs.

Fidelity-Research FR-7fz specs:

■ Price in 1984 was 80,000 yen
■ Power generation method: MC type
■ Output voltage: 0.24 mV (5 cm / sec 45 °)
■ Needle pressure: 2.0 ~ 3.0g
■ Load resistance: 5 Ω
■ Playback frequency: 10 - 45,000 Hz
■ Channel separation: 20 dB / 1 kHz
■ Channel balance: 1 dB / 1 kHz
■ Compliance: 7 × 10 - 6 cm / dyne
■ Tip: contact type
■ Weight: 30g
■ Exchange needle unit replacement: (60,000 yen)
■ Release: 1984
■ End of sale: 1989
■ Shell integrated type.

---------------------------------------------------------------------


and for comparison Fidelity-Research FR-7f specs:

■ Price in 1980 was 77,000 yen
■ Power generation method: MC type cartridge
■ Output voltage: 0.15 mV (3.54 cm / sec., 45 °)
■ Output voltage: 0.2 mV (5 cm / sec., 45 °)
■ Output power: 2 × 10 -8 W (5 cm / sec 45 °)
■ Needle pressure: 2 g to 3 g
■ Load impedance: 3 Ω
■ Coil impedance: 2 Ω
■ Playback frequency: 10 Hz to 45 kHz
■ Channel separation: 28 dB (1 kHz)
■ Channel balance: 1 dB (1 kHz)
■ Compliance: 7 × 10 -6 cm / dyne (100 Hz, 20 ° C.)
■ Tip: 0.15 mm square Refined contact, Solid Diamond needle
■ Weight: 30 g
■ Exchange needle unit replacement: (¥ 54,000)

The one conical is the 7 f/c not the 7f.

Currently runnin my Fidelity-Research PMC-3 with zyx cpp-1 (125ohm, additional 26db gain) headamp paired with JLTi 47k MM input with very good result. This compo sound better than another mm phono stage with build-in suts, also better than JLTi relatively high gain MC input. So this god damn zyx pre-preamp is a good device, i have not used it for a long time. The nest device for comparison will be Luxman 8030 silver SUT for low impedance FR-7f. 

@ausliebesurmuzik, please let me know what you think of the 407/Yamamoto/Koetsu combo.  I just received an HR-6s headshell and mounted a Koetsu RSP on an FR-64S.  I was interested because it is unclear to me how to fine adjust the zenith given the headshell’s fixed mounting holes. Luckily I can adjust my tonearms position relative to the spindle for overhang.

just to give the former Nandric FR7F cartridge an ongoing history..., this cart is now playing (as part of my collection) on various Micro Seiki turntables, currently fitted into an Fr64s silver arm on a SX 8000 MKII turntable.   The second arm on the turntable is an Ikeda 407. Standard cartridge is the Ikeda 9 TS .
After having used the Ikeda KAI, I stayed with the 9TS to continue my search for the best cart in FR64s or the Ikeda 407.
Today I fitted a Koetsu Onyx Platinum into the Ikeda 407.(Yamamoto Titanium headshell and Titanium screws, Dereneville head shell mat and Ortofon LW 800s head shell wire)
I have to say, this Koetsu Onyx platinum is a really nice one :-)
Looking forward to try it out in the FR64s.
Juergen


phonopre: Kondo M7 / SPZ, Thoeress 
Pre: Air Tight ATE 2001amp: Air Tight ATM 211
speakers: Zingari Client Name Evo 1.5

@nandric sad news about Axel, hope he’ll be ok

@rauliruegas exactly ("dead of alive", i like that), i have sold some very rare records to cover my expenses on those god damn cartridges, because so many people swear they are so good and i need to hear it myself.

The next quest is phono stage for them, still got my ZYX Pre-Preamp CPP-1 (headamp), but it was designed for 0.24 mV ZYX.

My Lundahl transformers in my WLM Phonata Reference MM/MC phono stage are not designed to handge so low output (but maybe i can just replace the transformers inside this stage myself). This product disappeared from the market before it was widely released, i got demo unit from the first run, because the WLM (Wien Loudspeaker Manufaktur) closed their business.

And my newest JLTi phono stage with high gain can handle 0.22mV but probably still need more gain for carts like Ortofon MC2000, FR-7f and Fidelity-Reasearch PMC-3. Maybe Joe Rassmusen of JLTi can modify his phono stage for more gain option...

Dear @chakster : The only conical stylus tip shape in that FR series is the the 7F/c all the other came with line contact. FR never used ellipthical shape in that cartridge series.

The way you are reasearching about seem to as if the matters be " dead or live ". Anyway you have the answer.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS;
R.

@halcro Vinyl Engine info is not relevant, simply because the data for the first FR-7 and second FR-7F mixed up. In their wrong database FR-7 for some reason has Line Contact 0.3 x 3mil, but the next to it FR-7F has Spherical 0.65mil which is not true at least for the first FR-7 from 1978.
  
Axel just glued a new Line Contact stylus on original cantilever ? 

@nandric You said Axel is retired, do you mean retired from re-tipping business now ? 

@rauliruegas All i know is that FR-7F has square shank nude diamond of 0.15mm cross section, but i don't know the size of the tip. It would be nice to find out relevant info about it (original manual for example). 

Many times i saw them for sale and each time sellers claimed line contact for FR-7F. 

Dear @chakster : The first F7 born in 1978 and came with line contact type 0.3x0.3mil.
The only conical FR cartridge in this series is the 1981 FR-7F/c.

In between the 7f and 7fz  ( 80-84. This the latest but not the more expensive that was the 7f-c. )

Refinement of line contact could means that is better polished but who knows what really means ? ?


Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

If it's not conical, i wonder why @halcro said it's conical and even re-tipped his sample with Axel (to have Line Contact) ? 

Chakster, there's no question that the FR-7F had a conical (spherical) tip.
Vinyl Engine even gives its diameter as 0.65mm.
My one came with its original tip sheared off but its circular base was highly visible.
I sent it to Dietrich Brakemeier (Dertonarm) (who has worked on dozens of them) and he sent it to Japan to be re-tipped by the Master who apparently did the originals.
It came back to me with a decidedly conical stylus which frankly.....did not set the world on fire 😪
When this new tip also mysteriously sheared off....I sent it to Axel who recommended replacing it with a Line Contact which I agreed to.
My new FR-7F/Lc now sounded superb...and if you check the specs against the FR-7Fz, the only difference appears to be Output Impedance of 2 Ohms against 5 Ohms.

 

I want to make it clear for myself:
What a hell is "Refined Contact Needle" of the Fidelity-Research FR-7F (made in 1980) ? 

According to the manual for FR-7F:
"A unique refined contact needle which specially polished a solid 0.15 mm square solid diamond is adopted as a needle tip. The refined contact needle is a new system that combines the advantages of the line contact needle and the merit of the elliptical needle, making it less susceptible to adverse effects (noise etc.) due to warping of the disk and dust of the sound groove. Also, scratch noise and surface noise are extremely low, so you can obtain playback sound with high clarity and no fatigue."

So the stylus of the Fidelity-Research FR-7F is not conical, but some sort of Line Contact in stock condition ?

If it's not conical, i wonder why @halcro said it's conical and even re-tipped his sample with Axel (to have Line Contact) ?
 

Hi Nandric,

cheers for the welcome :)

Just seen this after many years, so I have dragged this into 2017.

I had a Micro Seiki LC80w back in the 1980s when it was released. It had rave reviews in the UK press, particularly when partnered with an AT1100 tonearm. Sadly I broke the cantilever may years ago, after Micro went bust. Of course, I stupidly threw it away, rather than get it rebuilt (I was a junior doctor/surgical resident at the time and not particularly flush with cash).

My memories (faded with time) are that this was a pretty fine cartridge when compared to the Supex SD900, Dynavector Karat Ruby and Linn Asak. Tonally, it was very balanced and not bright at all. It was less plummy than the Supex and tracked very well.

I would certainly look to buy another, if one came up (if only for old times sake)

Charlie

T_Bone and Dertorm, Thanks for your inputs. Guess I will continue my search for a FR7F or FR702.

The MCX5 was in part designed by Ozawa-san who started Shelter in the mid 1980s after spending a few years at Fidelity Research. It came out (with the MCX3) many years after the FR-7 series and was designed for use with the XG-5 and XG-7 transformers. As far as I know, as Dertonarm suggested, it is not anything like the FR-7.

Jcarr above recommended the FR PMC3 as worth a listen. They are not easy to find.

Hi Ddriveman, the MCX-5 has nothing to do with the FR-7 series cartridges.
Not in terms of construction/design - nor in terms of sonic virtues.
This is however often claimed to be the case by sellers to get a higher price for their MCX-5 or MC-201/202.
The only other cartridge of the FR-line up worth getting and mentioning is the FR-1 MK3 F.

Hi,

Does anyone have any knowledge of the Fidelity Research MCX-5 cartridge. There is a seller of this cartridge and he claims that this is similar to the FR7 but without the integrated headshell. Can anyone shed some light on this subject??

Rgds

The FR-7fz is really great, what else did I expect? it is very dynamical but also transporting warmth and detail. T-Bone sorry for the auction on the flywheel. Try again, it is worth. I am just driving the brother of your blue star with a HS-80 now. Does anybody have a FR-7fc and will report on it? Thanks

Hello T_Bone, when you use a FR-7f then you are on the right track already. It is a very good System. The FR-7fz is not the last version (even when the "z" suggests that), it is a 7 series with a higher output, 0,25mV (easier for a lot of Phonostages, the other ones are below 0.2mV), 5 ohm Impedance, 7x10(-6) Dyne and is like all from this series a blind buy when you can get it. When you want to see the body, go to my System, there is a pic :-)
It has an interesting History, in Japan there a specially selected 7f* units made, too, custom order with specs you can even dream on 30 years later. I listened to one of those, it was the first time where I thought the description "You will eat your heart out" hit me. Unfortunately too rare to start a discussion about that, but I am absolutely sure, when a manufacturer today would build such cartridges again (with different optics) and the Hype which is made for average units today, it would be a revolution.

My XL-88D is out of commission. It was almost dead ("just resting") on arrival because of a softish suspension. I have another XL-88 which I may use as a donor motor and try to get the motor transplanted into the 88D, or perhaps more likely the 88D cantilever mounted onto the 88 motor.

I have not found an FR-7fz, but I am happily using an FR-7f on an SME long arm now.

I lost out on an auction for a Micro flywheel recently. Geez they are expensive...

T-Bone, how do you think about the Sony XL-88D after testing it? I just received a FR-7fz and will compare it to the FR-7f. Did you consider using a flywheel for your blue star?

T-bone, if you use your FR-7f in a FR-66s connecting it with a good phono silver cable (not the Kondo one but maybe the Crystal Cable Dreamline) and put it through a Kondo KSL transformer you will end up with a fantastic result.

Also the Titan i and the Olympos match very good with this "old Ikeda tonearm". I would say those are some of the best modern designs, the FR-7f is in my ears the "best old cartidge".

As I have used the FR-7f, I have come to appreciate it a fair bit more than the FR-7. Better treble and far better transient response in my set-up. In fact, it is one of the better carts I have ever tried for listening to jazz.

Furthermore, the other interesting news is that I have just picked up a Sony XL-88D (thanks Jonathan for pointing it out - I ended up picking it up). I am anxiously awaiting delivery and will report back.

Hi Steve, the XL55 and XL88 Pro cartridges are very interesting cartridges indeed. I had 2 samples of each during the past 6 years.
However - they do have little in common with the FR-7-series ( or FR-1 MK7..... I have found the original data-sheet with exactly this destination again - will make a photo tomorrow and post it) aside from both being an integrated headshell design and both featuring comparatively wide and hefty housings.

I do have the remains of a destroyed FR-7f at hand. According to one engineer at Munich Fraunhofer Institue the magnets are Alnico indeed.
And they are VERY big compared to most other cartridges.
The FR-702 does feature a significant shorter cantilever compared to the original FR-7-versions and thus the moving mass is considerably less resulting in improved low level detail and recreation of tiny details in the sonic picture.
You should NOT interchange a FR-7 with a FR-702 WITHOUT checking the adjustment of the geometry. It may very well be the case, that now the stylus sits somewhere else as before with the FR-7..........
VERY similar in sound and output (despite the claim that it had the very same output voltage in the data-sheets, I found on the 4-5 samples I had that the output was rather 0.15mV ) to the FR-7f.
Cheers,
D.
Cheers,
D.

Cheers,
D.

Dear Perrew: Maybe not because according with this:
http://74.125.95.104/search?q=cache:1fIRyl0l5NgJ:www.audioinvest.no/fr/products/frc_702.htm+fidelity+research+mc-702&hl=es&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=mx

has only two magnets and usually when a designer put Alnicco use more than two.

Maybe Jcarr could have a more precise answer. Btw, why is so important to you?

Regards and enjoy the music,
Raul.

Steve, Jonathan may be able to shed some light on this but as far as I know, there was no business relationship between Ikeda-san of FR and Sony Soundtec. The magnet structure is different, and I thought the XL-55 and 88 have different coil concepts than the FR-7. The XL-55 is heavy, the FR-7 is even heavier; but lucky thing is, the FR-7 and the XL-55 have the same distance from headshell mount to stylus tip, meaning the FR-7 fits perfectly on tables/arms which take the XL-55 perfectly.

FWIW, I'd be happy to send you an FR-7 in exchange for your XL-88 if you ever wanted to...

Hi Marco (Heradot): I didn't see your post for the longest time, apologies for the tardy response!

First, I removed anything on the arm structure that wasn't absolutely essential for playback. That means in particular the armlift, also the armrest. IIRC, I remade the armrest as a separate piece which was secured to the armboard/plinth. I normally have no need for an armlift, so I simply removed that.

I would have liked to have removed the horizontal plate that holds the armlift, but IIRC you would need to dissassemble the arm to achieve this, so I grudgingly left the horizontal plate in place. But I did use blocks of paulownia wood between the horizontal plate and the armboard (or turntable plinth). Paulownia is somewhat like a high-strength version of balsa - it is light and strong, internally lossy, and is also somewhat compressible (albeit less so than balsa). This will help control the ringing of the horizontal plate and will clean up the sound.

And as Raoul suggested, I use the Warren Gehl armwrap, which is far more effective than heatshrink. It dampens the resonances of the armtube by compressing it radially, and works on a similar principle to how you play harmonics on a bass or guitar.

The armwrap's radial compression of the armtube makes the 64S and 66S operate a bit more like Ikeda's later arm designs like the IT-245 and IT-407, although these added interference damping by force-fitting multiple concentric tubes of various materials together.

FWIW, from the resonance-control point of view, Ikeda's personal favorite among his own designs is the IT-345, which I believe has a three-way concentric armtube structure. The person who's been building these arms for the past 20-odd years is of the same opinion.

As an aside, I normally used a combination of dynamic and static VTF, and balanced the contributions of the two to achieve a sound that was subjectively most pleasing. Note, however, that the turntable that I preferred to use with the FR-64S was a Micro-Seiki SZ-1S, which has a vacuum clamp and therefore little LP warpage and little vertical arm movement to speak of.

Finally, the headshell has a major impact on the sound, but I am sure that you are well aware of that.

best and hth, jonathan carr

The FR series look very similar to the Sony XL-55 series with the figure 8 coils. Who manufactured the FR and the Sony carts?

I don't have an FR series (yet) but I have three of the Sony XL-55/88 pro series and they give my UNIverse and Allnico Z a run for their money.

Steve

Does any one know if the MC702 have Alnico magnets?

Found an FR-7f and have tried it out. It is, indeed, a bit nicer than the FR-7. It has, at first trot, more delicacy to it. I am not sure how else to put it yet. Both are very nice, but if I had to choose just one of the two to live with, I'd take the 'f.' More in a bit.

Dear Marco: All is a matter of preferences/priorities and different tolerance range level of distortions.

Regards and enjoy the music,
Raul.

Hi Raul,
also own the 407 but compared with FR-64/66 the 407 has less details and precision. Prefer the FR.
Rgds,
Marco

Dear Dertonarm: It is hard to say if Nagaoka or maybe Supex was the builder.

In USA was marketed by SAE with a retail price of 400.00

I read that this Agon person: Topoxforddoc, own or owned the cartridge, maybe he has some information about: you can ask him.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.