Feedback QLN Prestige Three Speakers Requested

thank you @bluethinker66 !

some of us still have to work :)

@grislybutter - All good! I was off Audigon for a few days as I was finalizing a new job offer. I saw the other thread with moderator, happy to share my personal information to send that promised photo! 

I'll try to do that today/tomorrow! 

@bluethinker66 sorry for the messages drama, hopefully it didn't confuse you or piss you off. I have a short fuse sometime.

new record day Ron is head over heels the LTA

Next step will be Qualiton with the Sonner Audio Legato Duo. Even more exquisite sound is sublime and they are built for tubes. 

How am I supposed to get anything done with this damn sound system in my house.

A high-quality problem fer sure, but I’m sure you’ll figure it out.  Congrats!

I'm finding the Audio Hungary Qualiton 100 watt tube power amp (not the integrated) is pairing wonderfully with the Linear Tube Audio Microzotl preamp. As an aside, I want to call out the great customer support I've received from Audio Hungary/Qualiton, their USA distributor and the audio dealer I purchased the unit from. I did have an issue at some point and they addressed it and took care of me. Super impressed with their customer support. And really in love with their 100 watt standalone tube power amp. It's a beauty and I can't recommend it highly enough. 

The LTA preamp is a stunning piece of kit, but much more expensive than the Qualiton APR 204 preamp I'd been using, so It's not quite a fair comparison. For the money the APR 204 is a great sounding tube amp! The LTA preamp is, in its own right, just a masterful performer.  

The QLN Prestige Three speakers, driven by the aforementioned equipment, have me intoxicated with music. How am I supposed to get anything done with this damn sound system in my house. Once you sit down to listen to music, hours can roll by as you explore various recordings. It's like being slowly fed mind bending intoxicants. Time vanishes and one ends up lost in thoughts, memories and the enjoyment of artists from around the world.  

I'm sort of joking, but I'm also kind of serious! 

I don't know if all Hungarians are created equal. I had an Audio Hungary Qualiton a50i ... 50 watts of pure class A and drove many speakers extremely well. I preferred it over Luxman 590AXII, VAC 160 and ARC GSi75 -- I owned all three prior to the Qualiton. That being said, I wasn't impressed with their X200 all that much. But if you're looking for class A tube amplification, the Qualiton a50i is very very good.

@bluethinker66 great to hear it, I told you to ditch the Hungarian :)

Looking forward to the photo!

@perkadin - You know EXACTLY what I’ve been wrestling with! It’s that lower volume listening one does in the evening before retiring for bed. I’ve loved listening to those hypnotic mid-range and treble frequencies, but coming away feeling like something was incomplete. With the tube amp, the HS had a holographic quality that was especially appealing. I’m not quite getting that with the QLN, but I’m still preferring the more balanced delivery.

@soix - Well... You were right! I got the LTA preamp set up today and moments into the music it was clear the system had taken an enormous leap forward over the previous tube amp I was using. My jaw dropped!

I’m happy to say that I feel all the glowing reviews for the LTA preamp are legitimate. It’s arguably the single best upgrade I think I’ve made.

@grislybutter - Posting a photo as you requested as soon as i figure out how to do so! 

Hah, I knew it was a lower volume issue!  Its exactly the same for me.  It's like that fabulous tweeter and midrange frequencies eat up all the available power and the bottom octave falls out, which never happend with my Contour 1.1's and the R8.  Probably it's because the 1.1's arent as good at lower levels, everything is diminished in scale including the mids/highs, and they also have a much smaller bass port which helps retain some of the punch.  Since the 1.1's are moving to a home office setup, I have a Linn Classik coming that I picked up here on Audiogon.  Ironically, the Classik and 1.1 combo is the first higher end system I had ever heard and got me interested in Dynaudio years ago, so it feels like I'm coming full circle in a way.  I never forgot that punchy rythmic sound, its quite a pairing.  

Anyway I'll temporarily use that as a preamp with my old SimAudio W3 and see how that works w the HS.  I just can't see myself moving fully away from the R8, there is something magical about tubes and that amp in particular.  And I'm probably being overly critical of the bass from the HS, its still there, just not as full as I'd like.  If I like it with the W3 I can always find a used Linn pre and then have the R8 side by side with the Sim/Linn stack.  Or sell the Sim and go with a beefy integrated since I tend to prefer fewer boxes.  Lots of options.  

As you can tell I'm not into overly analytical systems and prefer smoother, warmer tones along with weighty, punchy bass, but it doesnt need to go particularly low.  I'm in a townhouse so subs and big towers are out due to neighbor concerns.  The R8 has plenty of punch, but to get there I need volume, and then the highs and mids will be too loud and I'll get complaints.  So I kinda know exactly what you mean. 

that LCH sub looks interesting, but pricey for sure

(and I know I should not judge a speaker by its web site but it’s pretty flaky)

@soix @arafiq - Thank you! I'm very happy with my purchase! 

@grislybutter - That's sort of my hesitation with subs. It just sounds like getting a sub dialed in is painstaking and not guaranteed. Just hesitant to take that plunge, but I could be convinced otherwise. I was perusing the Axpona feed on LinkedIn and heard an impressive demo of what appears to be a new company -https://www.lchaudio.com/. What I heard was impressive and sort of seductive. 



@perkadin - I'm glad you brought this up. I am able to get the bass going on the Dynaudio HS with my 100 watt tube amp, but I really need to crank it to a level where my wife is guaranteed to ask me to turn the volume down. SUPER BUZZ KILL. But marriage is about compromise, right? 

As for lower volume listening, I've spent many evenings transfixed with the Dynaudio HS speakers. The treble frequencies can be sublime. I just felt like I was missing the bottom end. Over time, I realized I wasn't satisfied. 

The QLN speakers are, overall, more balanced with my current amp. You lose some upper frequency detail, but I'm ok with that.

What new preamp are you getting? 

Are you able to get good bass when you crank the volume? I have the HS paired with a Willsenton R8 tube integrated and the bass is tremendous when you let it rip, lets say 5-10% before clipping or between 9 and 11 o’clock on the dial depending upon the song. What can be really confounding about the HS is that at lower volumes the bass becomes much less noticeable due to the prominance of the highs and mids which stay full sounding regardless of volume. You really have to push the tubes to get the bass. It’s a great low volume speaker due to all that detail, but it won’t shake the room. I imagine you’d need a really muscular Class A or AB design to get the low end at lower volumes.

It seems like your bass problems have continued despite moving to the QLNs, which makes sense since its still the same amp. I have a new preamp coming, I’ll be able to test the HS with my SimAudio W3 later this week and see if that gets better low volume bass results. The Sim isnt a Wattage monster, 240 watts into 4ohms, but its a high current design with a massive 1.1 kVA toroidal transformer.

@bluethinker66

Bay Park, in the middle of SD proper.

Since I lived in Budapest for 30+ years I don’t know about the women being that beautiful but pretty spectacular for sure.

I tried different subs: Elac, SVS, Polk, Klipsch. I settled on a Martin Logan 700w. It was a step up from the "boom and chaos". But I need decent crossover control. Without it, generally, while the sound stage and 3D improved, it’s often sound chaos, reverb issues. Which is expected when both my monitors and the sub pound on the same frequencies and however sophisticated the Martin Logan and the placement are, it’s still not a clean soundstage.

I have a general dilemma with high quality monitors and subs: if a company invested so much in engineering two perfect speakers, who am I to mess with it and add a sub?

Regarding Hungary, I've been there twice and the women are stunningly beautiful! It's bananas! I'd like to go back! 

Ha!  I went to Budapest years ago and thought the same thing.  Tall and gorgeous women everywhere.  Who knew?

And thanks for the recommendation on the SVS subs. It might be awhile before I pursue them, but I'll look into them. Did you ever try Rel subs?

No, but I’ve heard nothing but good things although they’re quite a bit more expensive apples to apples and don’t offer any room integration software although they seem relatively easy to place given their high-level input architecture.  I mentioned SVS due to their performance/$, small size, user-friendly room integration software, and 45-day trial.  I do believe that once you hear your system with 2 subs you won’t go back.  It’s that significant. 

@bluethinker66 I'm so glad you like the QLN 3s. Their emphasis on musicality over anything else is what sets them apart from other speaker manufacturers. These speakers are definitely long time companions. Congratulations and happy listening!

@grislybutter - Where in San Diego are you? North County? Downtown? I used to surf a lot at Sunset Cliffs out on Point Loma. Miss those days. Some of the best years of my life. Younger and more carefree... 

Regarding Hungary, I've been there twice and the women are stunningly beautiful! It's bananas! I'd like to go back! 

Which subs are you using? What are your thoughts on Rel subs? 

I'll try to upload a photo when I get the LTA preamp set-up in the system. Everything is on a Fern & Roby rack which I like a lot. 

@soix - Thanks! 

Yeah, I'm really curious about how the LTA will impact the system. It will be a big auditory unveiling, frankly. I'm hopeful it's a positive addition versus something I'm ambivalent about. I'd read some great things from folks who own LTA products and thought I'd take the plunge (My tube preamp was on the blink at the time and needed a replacement... That situation has been remedied so I'll have two preamps on my hands now.

And thanks for the recommendation on the SVS subs. It might be awhile before I pursue them, but I'll look into them. Did you ever try Rel subs? If so, what were your thoughts? 
 

oh, and now that you talked up your minimalist design and furniture, I'd love to see a photo of your audio setup

@bluethinker66

Greetings from San Diego and from the same year (’66)!

Yes, Dynas are hard(er) to driver. I added a sub to my Dynadio pair and it made a difference. But it took a long log time and trying many subs. For most music with moderate bass, I often don’t turn it on.

Finally, I can’t resist, dump the Hungarian stuff. Nothing good ever came out of that helll-hole, including me. I couldn’t be more embarrassed about the state of affairs of my old country (but of course, the amp may be awesome, I am just joking. But the name is bad marketing.)

Glad to hear you’re happy with the QLNs but can’t say I’m surprised given their glowing reviews, and I think they look pretty cool too. I think the LTA will add just a hint of more upper octave transparency and detail and may be a perfect addition to your system.  Looking forward to your impressions.

Also, I’d recommend trying a pair of SVS SB1000 Pro subs.  They’re only 13” square so aren’t visually imposing or take up much space, but despite their small size they’ll get you down to an honest 20Hz (-3dB).  Plus they offer onboard integration software you control with your phone so you can easily dial them in from your chair.  And all this for only $1100 for a pair, and they offer a generous 45-day, risk-free trial including shipping both ways, so why not?  Remember, adding subs is not just about bass but also greatly enhance imaging and soundstage.  My guess is once you hear what they can do you won’t mind their diminutive presence too much.  Just my $0.02 FWIW. 

@grislybutter - I think the Dynaudio Heritage Special speakers are fantastic. I've gone to numerous audio dealers to audition speakers and, upon returning home, felt the Dynaudio Heritage Specials were better than I'd just auditioned... 

However, and this is a big caveat, I believe you need to drive them with a lot of solid state power - 200 watts minimum. I don't believe they were designed with tubes in mind, so driving them with tubes isn't going to position them optimally.  

I don't have subs and probably won't pursue them simply because I don't want to crowd the living room area. My wife and I prefer minimalism, so whenever "less is more" is possible, I'll go that direction. 

I think Portland is great. It's easy to live in. I've lived in San Diego, SF, Seattle and went to graduate school in LA. Each city has its magic and charm, but also drawbacks and frustrations. We moved from SF a few years ago because it had just become very challenging... Most of what had made it a great city from my youth has slowly eroded and gone away, including the loss of previous generations who were part of the cities charm and civility. 

thank you @bluethinker66 that sounds very reassuring and fun. I have heard legends about the Dyna Heritage so the QLNs must be special. I assume you don't have a sub(s)?

Portland is an awesome city.

thank you @bluethinker66 that sounds very reassuring and fun. I have heard legends about the Dyna Heritage so the QLNs must be special. I assume you don't have a sub(s)?

Portland is an awesome city.

@grislybutter - Thanks for the prompt! 

THANK YOU to everyone who made a comment and suggestion here. I read them all over the past few weeks and were all greatly appreciated. 

I did end up pulling the trigger on the QLN, purchasing them from a sound engineer in New York. I asked him to make a recording of some music I know intimately, using the QLNs as speakers, as a final validation before purchasing. For any early 90s shoegaze fans out there, I had him record some Ride and Stone roses tracks along with some classical tracks (Satie, Brahms). 

He's a recording engineer, so the recording he sent me sort of blew my mind. The QLN speakers sounded majestic - big, balanced, detailed and musical. 

So I pulled the trigger and had them sent to Portland where I live. When they arrived, I was overly eager to set them up after a long day and ended up doing a little damage to one of them. Ugh... Its ok, because it's cosmetic and sort of made me double-down and commit to them as "my speakers." 

How do they sound? Am I satisfied with my purchase? 

Short answer? Absolutely. I love them and anticipate having them the rest of my life. 

The QLN Prestige Three speakers are incredibly balanced and musical sounding speakers. From the reviews I'd read, I did expect more bass output, but I'm satisfied with what they deliver. The top end treble is enjoyable and never bright. I am coming from the Dynaudio Heritage Special speakers where the amount of top end treble detail delivered sort of blows you away - at moments the detail is mesmerizing and hypnotic, but sometimes morphs into overly bright and overwhelming. I'll miss some of that detail and focused details of instruments from the Dynaudio Heritage Specials, but I'm comfortable trading it for the more balanced delivery of the QLN Prestige Three. 

A few posters suggested and for-warned me the QLN Prestige Three might sound overly polite or "held back." It's true. I can see how the QLN Prestige Three could be characterized that way. These speakers DO NOT demand your attention. 

What they do seem to offer, in contrast, is a listening environment where you just want to listen to the music and forget about the audio equipment. I'm typing here in the living room and could easily spend the day listening to music for the entirety of the morning and afternoon.. and maybe into the evening. These QLN speakers just make it easy to relax and decompress. In this overly frenetic world we live in I consider that to be a wonderful quality! 

Many of us on this forum seem to have the "upgradeitis..." I now have the same affliction. It's crazy how a "I'd like to purchase a proper" audio system leads us down this path, huh?! 

NEXT STEPS 

I've got the Linear Tube Audio MicroZotl Preamp coming next week and will provide a report once I've got it set up in the system and had some run-in time... 

I'm currently driving the QLN Prestige Threes with a Qualiton/Audio Hungary 100 watt power tube amp. It sounds fantastic and I'm happy with it. 

HOWEVER, the AUDIO UPGRADEITIS IS REAL! So, I'm wondering about the Balanced Audio Technology (BAT) VK255SE solid state amp that delivers 150 watts into 8 ohms. I heard it recently and found that it's mantra of "warmth of tubes and details of Solid State" was accurate. If there was any possible improvement to the QLN Prestige Three it would be to drive it with more power. The audio studio engineer I purchased the QLN Prestige Three speakers from, when he made the sample recording, was using one of his powerful studio equipment amps to record, and boy did the QLN speakers sing with that power. 

Will update all on my audio journey/affliction! 


 

@bluethinker66 how are the QLNs?

@bluethinker66 Incidentally, my friend was running his QLN 3's with Audio Hungary a50i integrated amp. I also owned the same amp and loved it. He was very satisfied with this combo. I'm quite sure the combo of LTA preamp and AH 100 watt amp will be phenomenal. The QLN 3s are not difficult to drive. Good luck!

Enjoy the journey. 

@soix @jeffstrick - I'll share my impressions once I get everything up and running. I'm very curious how the LTA preamp will pair with the Audio Hungary 100 watt tube amp and QLN speakers. 

I somehow suspect that particular combo might not have been tried too many times, but who knows, right?! 

Should be fun. 

I think the combo of the LTA and AH amp could be absolutely sublime and look forward to your impressions. 

Oh yes very much so. I have also had great results with the Norma IPA-140 also. 

Really the QLN will do well with any respectably powered tube IA or PA. Did have Bel Canto M600 and did not care for them with the QLN P3. 

Enjoy and be confident you made some great choices along with the LTA Pre. 

Great craftsmanship and sound from every component you selected. 

Cheers. 

@jeffstrick - I'll be driving them with the Audio Hungary / Qualiton 100 Watt tube power amp with a Linear Tube Audio Microzotl Preamp. I've had the Audio Hungary integrated at my house to demo too. I decided to take the Qualiton preamp out of the equation and test the LTA preamp as a replacement. 

I'd love to hear your thoughts on the synergy of the Audio Hungary tube equipment with the QLN prestige three. Do you feel the amp drives the QLN well? 

Any advice or perspective from your experience with interconnects, speaker and power cables? I'm ALL ears if you have a moment to share your experience. 

Congrats!  Do report back when you get to hear them for a bit. 

Enjoy them they are truly a wonderful speaker when matched with the correct IA or PA. 

Apologies for delay in getting back to everyone. Been a busy few days but wanted to thank you for your replies. 

First off, I pulled the trigger on the QLN Prestige Three. Purchased them used from an audio recording engineer in New York. He had purchased them but then decided to move up to the Prestige Five. The speakers are supposed to arrive Thursday, so I'll provide my own review of them over the next month or so. 

@ronboco - Thanks for this information to evaluate my room, etc. Much appreciated! 

@grislybutter - We've been riffing hard on a mid-century Scandinavia vibe with lots of light wood and some large format mid-century Slim Aarons photos. Simple forms and natural materials. 

@arafiq - I can't wait to join the QLN club. Truly. 

@metaldetektor @soix - Thanks for suggestion on Verity. In the end, I decided to take the plunge on the QLN speakers. But it's always great to expand horizons on what is out there, so thank you. 

Hopefully I've responded to everyone. If I somehow missed responding to a contribution, know I read and considered everyone's contributions.  

@bluethinker66 

If you have an open floor plan I’m not sure how effective REW is. Maybe someone who has measured an open floor plan can chime in. Also speaker placement is huge in determining sound quality. There is a system called Sumiko Master Set that might help in this regard. Good luck !

Ron

I forgot to tell you the one thing you will need is a microphone like U mik 

@bluethinker66 

I am also fairly new to this wonderful world we are in. I used REW ( room eq wizard) to measure my room. It’s a free software program you can download. I had a local member with experience with it come over to help me run it. It’s very powerful and can do many things. I just did a basic frequency sweep at the listening position. Check it out it would help you to understand your room better. 
 

Ron 

@ronboco - Hi! I'm a newbie, so I have no idea on how I would do that. Might you be able to provide me some general guidelines? What tools would I need? How would I do it?

Thanks in advance. 

@bluethinker66 

Your room will have as much to do with the bass or more than anything else. Have you measured your rooms frequency response  at the listening position to check for room modes? 

@jeffstrick - Hi Jeff - Amazing! If you don't mind me asking, how did you arrive at that combination - Audio Hungary tubes and QLN Prestige Three? 

What are your impressions of the combination? And what sources and cables might you be using? Also, how well do you find the Audio Hungary 100 Watt amp drives the QLN Prestige Three speakers? Would LOVE to hear your feedback. 

I'm using a Innuos ZENith and Merason DAC1 with Cardas Clear Interconnect and Cardas Cygnus Speaker cables.  

I have the QLN and AH combo. Lovely. 

re: mid-century vibe -  I am a big fan of it. The QLN does have that look.

taste is a funny thing, for months I couldn't understand the Hegel look. And then suddenly it clicked, now I think it's one of the coolest designs. 

@char2 - Appreciate the feedback! I plan on driving them with a 100 watt Tube Amp (Qualiton/Audio Hungary). That said, I bet they'd sound great with a higher powered SS amp. Good to hear you and your audio buddies appreciate the QLN Prestige Threes. My instincts are telling me it's a really good speaker for me. 

@wjob - I was listening to the Dynaudio HS last night and pondering what you wrote. They are really good speakers! I'm going to consider adding subs, perhaps in a few months when some other things settle down in my life. I might end up purchasing the QLN speakers and keeping the Dynaudio HS speakers for awhile. I guess I wouldn't be the first guy around here to start hoarding gear... Not sure it's the wisest move, but I do really appreciate the special qualities of the Heritage Specials. 

@gdnrbob - Thanks, Bob. Appreciate your guidance. 

@grislybutter - I'm on the opposite end! My wife and I have a midcentury modern vibe going on in our home, so aesthetically they fit right into our living room. Some of the speakers that have been suggested in a related forum would look a bit out of place in our home, unfortunately. 

@arafiq - Thanks for providing this feedback! Yes, I'm absolutely looking for some warmth. I appreciate you taking a moment to provide this perspective. 
 

One of my good friend owns a QLN Prestige 3 and is totally in love with them. He has owned many other more expensive and well known brands -- Tannoy, Sonus Faber, just to name a few. According to him the QLN P3s are superb and very well balanced. What might sound laid back at an audition might be the ticket for long listening sessions with zero fatigue in the comfort of your own home. According to him, these speakers produce a prodigious amount of bass and generally do not require a subwoofer. If you prefer a bit of warmth, I would say go for them. But you will need an amp that can drive them well. Good luck!

I heard the QLN's at the NY Audio show a few years ago.

I really enjoyed the sound, but felt they were being held back.

Mind you, I own Vandersteen Treo's. The QLN's sounded like my Treo's, but when I had less than optimal wiring. (Kind of muffled).

YMMV

Bob

one issue with the QLNs is the design - for me. Swedish speakers are usually stunning, but am not sold on the QLN's looks (not that I could afford them)

I have owned the QLN's for two years. I love them. I think that I might be wedded to them? They have great base ( I had them hooked up to a Rythmic sub in my old house, big room for a couple of days and I just stopped using the sub;  I did not need the sub).  The QLN's are really really good in the bass you don't need a sub!!! They are a little on the warm side but you can deal with that if you want too with different IC's and maybe a solid state amp. I initially used them with a PASS 30.8 (it was good but NOT great. ). I Switched to a Kinki Modded integrated for speed and clarity and for the most part I have been pretty happy with the combo.....except I now have the itch to try the speakers with tubes.....and.....to be honest I'm not sure what I am doing????? The sprakers when set up correctly really image well and the high frequencies are very pleasant. 

Interestingly a very seasoned reviewer on Part Time audiophile really liked the QLN speakers and in he used a Qualiton 200 integrated a couple of times with the speakers and said they  threw a BIG immersive soundstage.  As an aside when ever my audio buddies come over to listen to new tunes or gear changes they inevitably ask me if I want to sell the QLN's...😂  My advice just get em and if you don't like them lots of people will by them from you. 

Blessings

Charlie

@bluethinker66 I can't comment in detail on the QLNs - I've heard them enough to know I like them, but not enough to give a detailed review. But the Prestige 3 isn't a super deep speaker; thus my question about their ability to fill a room with deep bass.  If you want deep bass, I'd go with the subwoofer, esp after your comments about preferring the HS to other speakers.   Subwoofers don't need to be huge, and you have some placement options to negotiate with the wife.  I'd at least experiment first with a sub.  

As to better with tube gear or ss - I've played them with both.  Right now using AVA monoblocks.  At 4 ohms the HS are a little bit tough to drive - at least need a good current reserve.  But speakers are the most important part of the chain - I'd get that right first and you can always change your amps later.  (BTW, the LTA preamp is great - I own it as well.)

also, I have seen a lot of comments that Dynaudio likes power. I noticed the difference between a 30Watt and 60Watt amps but they seem to be happy with 60Watts as much with a 100. Knowing the Danes, they would engineer them with solid states amps so maybe it's a tube vs SS issue?

@bluethinker66 

I have heard a lot of Dynaudio speakers but not the Heritage. I just read great things about it. 

I would think that they are very hard to pair with a sub(s). They are so fine-tuned that adding bass would confuse the sound. At least that's what I have been through with my Evokes. I am finally pleased with a small sub at low gain and crossover settings, not perfect but can give me the bass fix when I need it without damaging my ear drums.   

I would be curious to know how you'll proceed.  

I also never heard any Qualiton gear, pretty interesting that they came from Hungary.