Mitch.I think that it involves running a main line upstream of your breaker panel.I didn't do this but changed the breakers and lines to the uppermost location and cleaned and pro-gold the tabs on the breaker.Don't know if it did much.May be a little.
What did make a difference was driving in a separate ground rod and then from the PS Audio power port plug I ran a separate ground wire from the dedicated ground lug on the plug to the new ground rod.
Result ......no noise ! I always thought that a dedicated outlet and all and a PS Audio 300 would have cleaned things up but with that isolated ground I often look at the equipment between tracks to make it is on cause it is
so quiet.
Hope this helps.
Peter |
Your set up is essentially what I set up in my music room, except that I have only two outlets in one junction box, but its all hooked into my main panel w/seperate circuit breaker. It works just fine that way for me. YMMV. By the way are you running your amp thru the PS Audio power plant? If so do you detect a difference between that and running them straight from the wall outlet? Just curious. |
Hi Mitch
I am a fellow Pass X owner. The fact you use your conditioner as an electrical outlet for all your components, the circuit it is feeding off of is not a dedicated line. You need to have one component on one circuit breaker to constitute a dedicated line.
I have three dedicated lines, two for my monoblocks, and one for my source. The monos are hooked to 20 amp circuits. for my amps, I think such a set up is crucial, but for an X250 a 15 amp circuit will do.
Is your house on a slab, crawl space, or other? It is not pleasent moling about a crawl space, but electricians are use to that. From what the electricians are telling you, I would guess you're on a slab. Other wise, they are lying to you, to get a bigger tab. |
Run a dual phase line. run 1 phase to the amp/amps. The other phase to frontend preamp,source ect. For better measure I run a seprate ground to a 8ft ground rod to the green terminal on the outlets.I make sure that only 1 componant is grounded to the 8ft. the rest of the componants will get there ground from the system. I also use hospital death grip outlets. Keep the amps on one phase even if you need to bring in several single phase lines. |
Hiend2
If you have 2 dedicated lines. Aren't you supposed to have them in the same phase ??
To have your gears in 2 lines in opposite phase is highly not recommended. I did this for a long time without realising it. After I corrected it, the sound is much better. |
Newbee, I'm running my amp through the ultimate outlet section of the P500(non current limiting) and the rest of my gear, preamp and CDP to regenerated power.The amp sounds better through the ultimate outlet section than straight from the wall.
Muralman, There is no crawl space under my house which is why I'd have to run the line externally.
Peterd, No electrician in Vancouver Canada(that I can find) will install a ground rod. Something to do with ground potential and the possibility of a dangerous situation. I think it's just not to code here in Canada.
Hiend2, What's a dual phase line?
Thanks for all your advice,
Mitch |
In N. America, the incoming 220 volts are split into (2) 110 volt legs in you main panel box and they are in opposite phase. Each of these legs also has other appliances (breakers) on them which add noise to the leg. If one of your circuts that feed your equipment is hooked up to one leg and the other equipment circut is hooked up to the other leg, then you are picking up the noise on both legs and raising your noise floor. If you hook up both circuits to the same leg in the panel box, you are only getting half the noise, because you are only picking up the noise on that LEG as opposed to picking up the noise from both legs.
In addition, you can avoid any noisey appliance breakers ( Like A/C, washing machine, fridge and furnace breakers) to the other leg that your equipment is not on, further reducing the noise on the leg that you are using for your equipment. |
Further. If you have dedicated lines feeding your gears and they are plugged to the wall. You shouldn't need any power conditioner or power generator. If you do, you are adding another piece of electronics into your systems that will change deteriate the sound and you will hear the electronics too. |
Mitchb,
A dedicated line is one with no other devices on it. That's what you have, so long as you keep the other 3 outlets vacant. Save your money, or, if you're picky have the other 3 outlets removed and blank plates installed.
Peterd,
I once dealt with a guy whose job was investigating deaths by electrocution. He told me (from, ahem, experience) that separate ground rods can vary greatly in potential, especially during an electrical storm. It is a safety hazard to have some of your electrical appliances attached to a different ground source than the rest. Are you in a hurry to hear the stereo in heaven?
Furthermore, the NEC states that the ground conductor must be part of the same cable supplying the electrical box. In other words, you cannot run a 2 conductor cable for hot and neutral and a separate one for ground, but you can run 3 conductor Romex. If you have an electrical fire, good luck getting the insurance to pay for wiring that doesn't meet code. |
I would recommend the following regardless of internal or external house wired:
1. Install one 20 amp dedicated line for your amp. There is a distinct possibility that the X250 draws more current than similarly powered amps. Marty DeWulf of Bound for Sound seems to think so regarding this amp. Regardless, any amp close to this current draw should have a 20 amp circuit/line so as not to potentially limit the current draw during demanding dynamic passages.
2. Install a 15 amp dedicated line for your digital source. A digital source injects much noise back into the line and will pollute any other component sharing the same line.
3. Install another 15 amp line for your preamp. Again, you do not want anything sharing the same line with your power amp. Just a small current draw of 35 watts (typical of a pre-amp) sharing the same line as the amplifier can be just enough to strip away and flatten the dynamics of demanding passages thereby potentially rendering the presentation rather lifeless.
4. Now that you have 3 dedicated lines, I'd recommend selling the multi-outlet PS500 and then purchase three dedicated passive line conditioners that have no practical current limitation of it's own and simply cleans up the AC.
5. Request that the electrician install all dedicated lines on the phase/leg that has the least amount of motorized appliances.
If you haven't already thought of it, you may as well have the electrician install some audio grade outlets while he's there.
-IMO |
Sean maybe the best person to ask regarding dedicated lines, grounds, safety, etc. You can also check the archives for great information. IMO one of the larger benefits to a dedicated line is that the ground wire is not severed and shared between several outlets (regardless of what's connected to the other outlets) and you can use a hefty guage wire which will not restrict current. I use a double run of 12 guage wire to my 20amp breakers and this excedes code. I agree with everyone's opinion regarding dedicated outlets on the same leg. One thing I wouldn't do is go out and sell your P500 because you install a dedicated line but I'd consider installing atleast two dedicated lines, one for your amp & one for your front end. Also, If you're having dedicated lines installed I'd go with one more than you think you'll need because you may end up growing into the other. I had 3 lines installed and began using only two of them but grew into the third line. If I had four lines, I'd probably use all four at this point. |
Alraul,Oh sorry I did make a mistake in my description.
Both grounds are connected as like a grid, but the new rod is the closest ground to my gear and a ground wire leads from it to the main house ground.
That way the grounds don't interact or cause one to be the primary ground and sacrificing the other.
Peter |
Peterd,
You're on safe ground! :-) I almost mentioned the use of multiple (but connected) ground rods but figured it would just complicate things. I did the same thing--when the cable company stopped using their ground rod, I connected it to the real ground rod with 6 gauge (I think) wire.
Al |
Again deathgrip oulets. All amps on single phase preamps ect on other phase. If you need 220 you will need both phased obviouly. Run external ground rod for the ground prong 3rd wire. You will notice darker background in sound if equipment permits |
