DAC choices -- help me cross the line

@pastorbob, we can take the tube rolling conversation offline, since I don't want to hijack this @arafiq thread, but I seem to end up going back to a pair of Philips Miniwatt SQ E188CC tubes from Holland.

I had the pleasure of hearing Teajay's systems last year, and we had a great time at his place. I learned that his tastes are quite similiar to mine, so he is a great audio reference point for me when he reviews new gear. However, I got my Audio Mirror T3 SE quite a bit before he got his in house. That reminds me... I need to head over there at some point soon!

Hi 1Mark,
Whoops, yes Terry London of course, my face is red. Thanks!
He is a well respected reviewer.
If you look at the DAC's he has had for review it is amazing he has chosen the Tubadour III as a reference!

Yes, I am using the 5977's.
I am sure I will eventually get the urge to tube roll as I did with my microZotl.

My "go to" guy for tubes is Andy as Vintage Tube Services.
What is your tube rolling experiences with the AM Tub?

Let's throw Holo Audio / Kitsune's offerings into the mix.

I enjoy my Audio Mirror Tubadour III very much! It replaced the decent Metrum Onyx, with no regrets.

A vairiable to keep in mind with the Tubadour, SE version or not, is the ability to tailor the sound using a pair of any flavor in the 6DJ8/6922/7308 family of tubes.  It takes to tube rolling very well if you are looking for a diff sound from Vlad's stock tubes (2 pairs of 5977 subminiature tubes, configured as one pair).

@pastorbob, agree with your assessment 100%; btw the reviewer is Terry London (not "English", lol). Are you using the 5977s?

Arafiq,
I just want to say that the Border Patrol & RME are both very good DACs.
I enjoyed both.
There are just so many from which to choose, and I don't think you can go "wrong" with any of the above suggestions.
The issue is finding a DAC that coincides with your idea of how music should sound.

Of the BP and RME; the RME ADI 2 was a better fit for me.
I really found nothing "wrong" with that DAC & enjoyed it.
It has a ton of options in tailoring sound & allows a deep look into each track.
It can be sort of "clinical" sounding but not overly so.
Again, it is very clean & detailed. If you want to hear exactly how the track was engineered that should be a DAC you consider. It is entertaining to listen like that.

But ultimately that is not what music sounds like to me.
I appreciate a sweet, emotional sound, a connection with the music, as someone said above.
Yes, that "musical" quality is very important to me, but not at the cost of detail.

I also value spatial qualities; depth, air surrounding each voice or instrument, and solid imaging within the recorded space.

Sounds like a tall order, and it is.
But that's what the search is about; finding the equipment that fulfills our musical predilections.
Enter the Audio Mirror Tubadour III.
To me it hits all of those qualities that I find important in listening to recorded music.

Read Terry English's review in Stereo Times.
His review can probably make it a bit clearer relative to the sound, build quality, etc.  of the AM.

So, you asked about the SE version for an extra 1000.00.
When I spoke to Vlad I asked about the upgraded caps and resistors.

Vlad very frankly told me that unless your system is extremely revealing you probably will not get the full impact of the upgrades.

My system is entirely headphone-centric:
Linear Tube Audio microZotl amp with upgraded power supply and ZMF Auteur, Beyerdynamic T1, and Sennheiser HD800 phones, depending on my mood.
So, how revealing, I don't know.

Contact Vlad. He will communicate very honestly with you.

Anyway, I chose to try out the base model (also budgetary considerations..LOL),
And, obviously, I'm extremely happy with the Tubadour III base right now.

In the future there is always the availability to send it back to Vlad for the upgrades. 

Sorry for the long scribe.
I hope I answered some of your question.
Kind Regards;
P.B.

The Sonnet Morpheus sounds like it checks all your boxes.
Sonnet is Cees Reutenburg’s new company. You may have heard of his last company Metrum Acoustics.
The Morpheus is the next inline where the Metrum Adagio left off without the expensive case. Hence the retail price of $3200
BTW I used to own the Azur 851 and all the things you described is what the Morpheus does differently from the 851.

If you are interested in the Yggdrasil Take a look at their Gungnir Multibit. It is said to have a more "laid back" or mellow presentation. I have the Gungnir and love it

Maybe I'll buy the Brooklyn after I've gotten R2R out of my system, who knows!

Never, once bitten by a good R2R dac your hooked for good, they just sound more real.

Cheers George

Thanks for the advice. I know I can always count on the members here to hep me make the right decision. I feel that both AudioMirror and Border Patrol are excellent DACs in their own right, as is obvious from the posts.

@pastorbob thanks for your feedback about the regular Tubadour. I'm really hoping that someone will chime in and tell me whether spending an additional $1000 on the SE version is worth it. I will really appreciate it if you can compare it to the RME since you've had both. In what ways do you think the AM is better than RME?

I've also added Yggdasil to my short list. Since it's been around for sometime, I hope it's easier to find a used unit. 

I had not heard about the Metrum Onyx. Thanks for the suggestion, will definitely check it out. All great suggestions!

@chilli42 and @veerossi: I haven't completely written off the Brooklyn DAC+. I'm sure it's a great DAC but I just have to scratch that R2R itch. Maybe I'll buy the Brooklyn after I've gotten R2R out of my system, who knows!

BTW, although not an R2R DAC, but I've heard that Chord Qutest does sound very analog like in the right system. Any opinions?

I have Mytek DAC+ with a linear power supply. It needed a month of break-in to reach full potential.  
It’s been a year and I’m very happy with it. You won’t be disappointed.  

Just buy the Mytek Brooklyn+ or Brooklyn Bridge+.  Sometimes our first ideas are our best ideas.  You won’t be sorry.

I am currently using a Border Patrol SEi DAC and love it.  It really has a way to connect you with the music.  It just makes me feel good.  It made such an impression on me that I sold my very highly regarded Schiit Yggdrasil A2 and have not looked back.
I have read good things about the MHDT Orchid DAC but haven’t had the opportunity to audition it.

I would fully recomend the Metrum Onyx. It is an incredible DAC. The company should be back up to their old standards as the original owners have bought back the company. I used to own one before I got a TT2 and now am on th the dCS Bartok. 

What is your problem with China. Denafrips makes some great days and Audio-GD the same.

Look up teajay's reviews and other threads here about the dacs you're researching.I like my Tubadour lll very much.Mine has the upgrades caps only,so not really an se.All I can compare it to is the tubes Vincent CD player that it replaced.I loved that player but the laser gave out after 9years and couldn't be repaired.The Tubadour has more detail and dimensionality.The Orchid and Border Patrol were on my list to try also if it didn't work out,but I 've had it for a year now with no desire to change.

I have owned both the BP and AM (my current DAC).
I purchased the Border Patrol after reading some reviews that attributed an "analogue sound" to the BP. 
IMHO it is a pleasant sounding DAC, but nothing special, lacking detail and air.
I decided to replace it after about a year.

After reading various reviews (a dangerous undertaking) I decided to purchase the RME ADI 2 DAC. I really liked it and had it in system for around a year. A lot of detail and very clean sounding.
I also played around with a couple of Chinese DACs (Musical Paradise, and Audio-gd).
In short none of these were the "one" for me.

Just recently, again after perusing reviews, I came across some really positive remarks about the Audio Mirror.
I contacted Vlad at AM and to make a long story short bought the basic AM Tubadour.
It is a fantastic DAC.
It is detailed and musical, both. The best DAC I have had in my system by far. Vlad is great to do business with too.

One word of advice; give it time to burn in. It will take 50-60 hours before showing the promise of what it can do.

The AM is head and shoulders above the Border Patrol (again my opinion).

There are a few threads on here related to all of the DACs that you are interested in , including a couple of reviews by member teajay that might be worth checking out . Some of those threads have comments about how they sound one to another

I've owned an orchid, border patrol and tubadour. As far as my preferences, I like the Border Patrol better but it isn't as detailed at the tubadour, it is more detailed than the orchid and I'm sure the se of the tubadour is even better. I have not heard the sei version of the Border Patrol. Gary Dews of Border Patrol is brilliant and the Border Patrol is almost no risk. It has a reasonable return policy and the resale demand is exceptional if you want to try something different. I asked Gary recently if he was going to come out with a more full featured dac someday and he could make a few changes to the existing dac for around another $1,000 that would make things interesting. The thing is, if you are just going to sit down and enjoy some music, its hard to argue at the BP pricepoint. The Lampizator dacs are also quite good but they have shifted away recently from pure r2r and now utilize a special digital engine with a DS dac. Good luck, there are alot of great dacs and gear out there. The BP dac sei is a really cool option and you can reach him on the phone. The td1543 dac chip isnt the last work on detail or sampling rate varietals, but it is one of my favorites for value and musicality on most recordings. It is so outdated in the minds of many and yet, some really musical dacs use it. Audio note's new integrated even uses it and its not like Audio note makes rash decisions or puts out a product that doesnt meet their standards. Good luck.

A friend brought his Border Patrol DAC over a few months ago. At the time, I was using a Schiit Yggdrasil A2. The Border Patrol was smooth sounding, a bit laid back, and more forgiving than the Yggy. On my system, I preferred the Yggy with it's punchier bass, better dynamics, more forward presentation, and more detail.