The 12AU7's are RCA clear tops and the 12AX7's are of Japanese origin. I've replaced them with Telefunkens. |
Rhanechak - I appreciate your efforts to build a "Made in USA" system. I've always purchased what I like best irregardless of origin, but totally understand your motivation!
Pdreher's comment I must address - VAS Inc., the Cayin USA distributor, is exemplary to deal with and provides class leading support of their products. So, yes, I CAN say that about Cayin! Oh, and that Creek amp? Made in China... |
Oh. Thank you for your detailed and well reasoned reply. |
I think that Samlucas091 was saying that how good an amp will perform is system dependent, and especially viz-a-viz the speakers it will be driving. To compare such different amps independently of the speakers it will be asked to drive is almost impossible. Now if you love the Rouge, fine, I'm sure it is a very nice tube integrated amp, and indeed made in the U.S. from many parts made elsewhere. And it may be a great match with your speakers. That does not mean that with a different type of speaker, lets say one with big impedance swings and input impedance below 4 ohms in the bass region (something like a Thiel or some of the B&Ws for example), that the Creek would not have been a better choice. I thought that was what Samlucas091 was trying to get at and why a disaster waiting to happen can happen if system context if not part of the question. Of course you might have struck it right that you have a speaker that can be driven optimally by tube amps, not all can. |
Hello all,
I just got off the phone with Mark O'Brian (sic?) the owner of Rogue. I have had several discussions with him and his staff and I have to say the folks at Rogue are pleasant, informed, informative and pleasant.
I am pleased to have an American made integrated supported by an American staff in America.
In case you think I've lost focus, The Cronus Magnum sounds terrific, and I have begun tube rolling. Truly the pleasure and revelation continue.
PS: I got an e-mail from an Audiogoner who claimed Rogue are made in China and that they make components for other manufacturers. NEITHER CASE IS TRUE. |
All I can tell definitely is the 12AX7's are NOS Made in USA, and the 12AU7's are NOS Japanese tubes. If anyone has any idea what they may be please let me know.
I am definitely impressed with this amp and the KT90's.
As Pdreher said, When in doubt, go with the tubes (and buy American). |
Rhanechak what signal/driver tubes did yours come with? |
Well, I finally pulled the trigger and bought the Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum. After one day with it I am very pleased.
Samlucas091 I would like very much to hear your impressions of the Rogue you're getting in the mail.
I enjoyed reading your impressions till you wrote "if you have to ask you are off on the wrong foot my friend. Regroup - get some knowledge. This looks like a disaster waiting to happen," which is overly dramatic and judgmental.
You claim that if I have to ask I'm off on the wrong foot. If this is the case, no one should ask anything to increase their knowledge using the Audiogon forum.
Thanks all for your excellent input. |
Something to consider: The Cronus Magnum is a different animal than the garden variety Cronus, which is the one, I presume, that Vinyladdict was comparing. The Magnum uses an entirely different output tube with about 60% more output and wider bandwidth. In addition, according to the review, The Magnum tag ... reflects a set of upgrades designed to increase transparency, improve dynamics and frequency extension, and provide for a smoother overall presentation. In the Cronus integrated these tweaks include a larger and more sophisticated power supply, the addition of polypropylene bypass capacitors, as well as precision Dale-Vishay resistors in critical spots, gold-plated tube sockets, upgraded input signal tubes, the KT90s mentioned above, as well as superior binding posts for more solid speaker cable connections. This could make a significant difference in how it fares against the Cayin. |
Alright a month late. But I may be of some help. Certainly it matters more what your speakers are than these two amps.
The Creek Destiny is a very very good little integrated for the money. Running Harbeth P3ESR with them it was a very very good match. It is simply a very transparent amp that is quite musical and could get the current behind the little Harbeths and make them sing, wonderfully might I add.
The Rogue is a Push-Pull tube amp and will sound as such. Warm - Forward - Punchy - Tube Sweetness. A horrible match for the Harbeth I am sure (Harbeth likes a more laidback amp) but an awesome match for my current Zu Omen Defs.
I am getting my Rogue in the mail tomorrow. Give me a few weeks and I will have a comparison for you.
My current thoughts are that in this case: if you have to ask you are off on the wrong foot my friend. Regroup - get some knowledge. This looks like a disaster waiting to happen.
Email me if you'd like. |
Pdrher, Vinyladdict,
I really appreciate your opinions. My focus IS on creating an all American system. I KNOW the Creek is not American, but I may consider it. As no one is offering any opinion of it, apparently it either stinks or it is a super sleeper no one wants to share.
I am also looking for the long term, and I think I'd like to go American made. |
Vinyladdict - While I can't discount your statement that the Cayin is a better value from a price / performance standpoint, I would still seriously consider the Rogue as it is American made and I know I would get long term support if I would need to get it repaired. Can the same be said for Chinese gear? |
I hate it when people do this.... but I'm going to do it anyway!
I've owned the Cronus and have to tell you, a Cayin A70T or A88T is far superior and can be had for similar money. I auditioned a slew of ~$2k integrated amps and the A70T is in a different league all together.
Sorry for not sticking to your original offerings! |
Thank you, the TAS review is most informative.
Creek opinions anyone? Anyone? |
The latest TAS has a review of the Rogue. |
My Rogue sounds fantastic. Head and shoulders above my previous Arcam integrated.
Good luck with your decision making, and Happy Listening ! |
Yes, the tube rolling is a benefit. I own both tubes and SS. I like mu amps but I'm looking for something I can keep without hesitation for a few years. Surely someone has a definite opinion on the Rogue Cronus Magnum and especially the Creek Destiny? They are said to be breathtakingly good integrateds. |
If you are asking because you are considering purchasing one or the other,remember,you are the only one that can determine what sounds best to you.It's not a bit apples and oranges,as you say,it's a truck load!!There are many more variables than just one being SS and one being tubed.You have to take into consideration other equipment you will be using,etc.,etc.,etc.I wish you luck in whatever it is you are looking for. |
When in doubt, go with tubes (in this case the Rogue). You can customize the sound to your liking by rolling tubes. |
