Tomorrow marks the 2 week run-in of my modded Bidat. It has changed dramatically in those 2 weeks. I think by now you folks know that I like my Power Dac, but the Bidat is beginning to pull ahead and open the gap a bit.
I was asked by a fellow audiophile what I thought the differences were between the two and I put it as such:
The Bidat (if both are compared to women) would be more of a ravishing beauty with not quite as much depth, while the MSB would be likened to a very attractive woman with perhaps a more cerebral tilt. Leaving that analogy for a moment, if you stood at an abyss and the music were emanating from somewhere in the abyss, the MSB would portray that music as coming from a much deeper point than the Bidat....That was until about 2 days ago.
The Bidat now has that seemingly bottomless pit depth of sound origination plus it remains the ravishing beauty of the bunch. At this point I would say it is the best D/A I have ever experienced (not just owned.., experienced).
Now the MSB is no slouch and for $4300 ($5k with volume control) it is simply one of the best most musical dacs available and really does break the cookie cutter sterile sound of so many highly praised dacs which fail to deliver anything resembling music.
Stay tuned I shall continue to comment as things unfold. |
Audiofun,
Thanks for the fascinating and detailed update. I had little doubt that the Bidat would have trouble keeping up in the hi rez domain. It just doesn't have the computing power. Not to take anything away from the fine work being done at MSB, but it is amazing that a $2000 DAC manufactured in the mid 90's is keeping up with a brand new $8,000 stat-of-the-art converter when it comes to Redbook. John Wright has figured out a way to really squeeze the very most out of the 44.1 material without losing the music. For those of us with extensive redbook collections, the modded Bidat is a valuable treasure. If Mr. Wright ever figures out a way to take this technology into the hi rez realm he'll have a giant killer for the future. If music distributors ever start offering ALL of their material via hi rez on the web, everything will change. Until then, I'm glad I have a Bidat. |
Ok, so I will try to make this concise and clear:
With about 25 hours on the Bidat I did some preliminary testing last evening. Note that John Wright has informed me that the Bidat mods need 3 weeks to fully settle in so this is a sort of "take it for what it is" review.
I just found out that HDTracks is now carrying the Verve Catalog and they have Diana Krall "Quiet Nights" on 24/96khz FLAC ready for download. I already owned the Redbook version so I thought, great I will download it and compare the various versions.
I converted the flac files to AIFF using Max (I run a mac mini using the HiFace converter and a FIM Gold digital S.E. cable to the various dacs).
I first compared the Bidat and MSB Power Dac using the 24/96 material down-sample in iTunes to 44.1khz. That is a no-no iTunes did not do a very good job and I did not like the sound on either machine. I then compared the 24/96khz material down-sampled to 44.1 using PureMusic (MUCH MUCH better than iTunes doing the down-sampling :) the sound was very close, but I noted that the Bidat did not seem to sound as good with the down-sampled material as the MSB...it had a sort of constrained uptight character to the overall flavor of the music.
Next up I compared the 24/96 version played (obviously) on the MSB to the Redbook on the Bidat. This is a comparison that I don't think yielded much real world information. The material is mastered too differently, the Redbook is compress (like most RB material) whereas the 24/96 material is very relaxed and flowing. Despite this I walked away thinking the MSB 24/96 was most enjoyable, but the Bidat RB was more energetic. That last statement may seem to contradict my comments concerning compression, but it really does not, I did note both characteristics.
Now this is the test I believe was most telling. RB on the Bidat vs the MSB. Bidat wins!!!
Ok, kidding it is not that simple. The Bidat does in fact sound far more musical than the MSB all things being equal, but when one allows PureMusic to handle the number crunching duties instead of iTunes, the MSB becomes so close to the Bidat (kissn cousins) I can not readily make a decision as to which is better (remember the Bidat only has 25 hours on it). I would go so far as to say that ANYONE who owns the MSB owes to themselves to purchase the PuerMusic software (and before anyone asks, no I do not have any type of relationship with the folks a ChannlD other than they got my $129.00 for the PureMusic s.w. :)
PM on the MSB is really beautiful, but with the Bidat.., NOT so much. The Bidat did not take to the PM very well at all in fact I flat did not care for the sound. The Bidat has a character which is simply breathtaking and the PM did not mix well with its' natural character.
This is perfect as the Bidat is on 44.1/48khz so I don't need the sample rate switching abilities of PM when I listen to the Bidat. Thus the PM software will be used exclusively with the MSB in my system.
Killer digital = Bidat + Mac Mini + M2Tech HiFace + REALLY REALLY GOOD Coax digital cable
or
MSB + Mac Mini + PureMusic Software + M2Tech HiFace + REALLY REALLY GOOD Coax digital cable (Note I have found that the best filter to use with the MSB is the default filter).
Ok, there you have it. I will follow this up when the Bidat fully breaks in. |
One man, two bidats...there must be a Chinese proverb about that.. |
John Wright just told me he didn't want to hear my opinion on the Bidat until 3 weeks have elapsed LOL!!! |
The one that's for sale was also mine, I had 2 of them :) |
Audiofun,
Not bad for a unit that ended production more than 14 years ago, nes pas? It's a classic hotrod and only gets better with time.
There's one for sale right now; looks like it's in good condition and I can't believe no one's snapped it up yet. |
Ok, so my Bidat showed up today the very latest mod from John Wright. With only about 30 minutes on the clock I will say that I find it a bit more musical than the MSB. It was wierd it was like it clicked when the components inside started heating up. I have compared redbook (Jane Monheit) so far and the Bidat renders her more beautifully. On 24/96 material downsampled by itunes, they are very close but when I allow the MSB to play the same material at 96khz one can readily hear the increase in spatial information.
I will let it cook for the next few days and report back this wknd but so far I am very glad I had the mod done... Man the Bidat is an incredible machine... |
Power supply quality is a key determinant of ultimate sound quality since audio is transmitted as modulated power. The Transporter is a fine product, but it is built to a price point and compromises have to be made by the designers. The fact that you have found power cables and conditioning to have a very audible impact points to the stock power supplies being a weak link. No surprise - one of the more popular mods for the Transporter is improving the power supplies. Clocking performance is especially sensitive to power supply quality which in turns effects jitter. Properly implemented - better power should result in lower jitter and noise which means better sound quality.
Externally clocking the Transporter could make an improvement for sure. The only way to know is to experiment. The Antelope OCX is a great clock. For less than half the price you might also try the Black Lion Audio Microtec Mk2. You can buy both the Antelope and BLA products with 15-30 day right of return from various e-tailers.
Bottom line, I suspect you could get even better sound quality from your BADAC by: (1) trying external word clock for the Transporter and (2) using an Antelope DA for AES noise isolation OR trying an outboard async USB-to-AES/SPDIF converter (which would require using a computer server). IME, noise isolation pays bigger dividends than improved clocking so I'd try an Antelope DA before an ext word clock.
If you don't suffer from OCD like most of us audiophiles (!) then just enjoy what you have and do nothing but enjoy the music...:-) |
earflappin...
i use the aes connection and have not tried the others. when i bought the dac i asked berkeley for their recommendation and they strongly encouraged the aes3 connection. another thing that really helps with the transporter is cleaning up the power. it seems more sensitive to power cables than most of my gear. i found this odd as i only use it as a tranport but most of this is odd! at present, i have an isoclean superfocus power cord to an acoustic revive rtp4 ultimate condtioner (that is one amazing device but thats another post...). a massive improvement.
your wishlist for the beta version is mostly over my head. i have considered an external clock and recently had a discussion with another member about the antelope clock. i have not heard this personally but he suggested it would be a significant improvement.
"If one is willing to contend with DB25 connectors and a DAW interface for set-up, then I suspect the MH ULN-8 could be better than the BADAC." i have no idea what any of this is!! you guys are a few steps ahead of me but this is another reason i enjoy reading your discussion. i do learn a great deal and it also gives me new directions to research. |
richard_stacy,
Thanks for the further details of your set-up. Are you going AES or SPDIF BNC from the Transporter to the BADAC? I see that the Transporter supports both. I can't tell from the Transporter specs if they use galvanic isolation or not. If so, then you are no doubt a leg up on those who are going direct from an AES sound card into the BADAC.
I'll report back my experience with the modded HiFace 24/192 async USB to SPDIF interface. The guy who does the mod also has a heavily modded Transporter and he says the modded HiFace is better (i.e. lower jitter and noise). It should be, however, as the modded HiFace is being powered by 3.3v lithium batteries.
I also love my BADAC. On a price/performance basis I think it is hard to beat currently, but the competition is not standing still. If one is willing to contend with DB25 connectors and a DAW interface for set-up, then I suspect the MH ULN-8 could be better than the BADAC.
I hope Berkeley come out with a Beta DAC soon. My wish list for improvements would be: (1) discrete output stage (the Alpha has a pretty pedestrian opamp design), (2) better internal clock and (3) an async USB-to-I2S interface (as opposed to having to go async USB-to-AES-AES-to-I2S). Berkeley touts their belief that one should not house the format conversion circuitry in the same chassis as the DAC....why not design one unit with a double chassis.... |
earflappin...
i use logitech transporter so it is a wireless stream. certainly the digital cable is cleaning up some of the issues that could be there too. downside is the limitation to 24/96 but i have little above that, for now. i am alsways looking for a better way but i have gotten so use to the convenience as well as the interface. i find the quality to be quite satisfying and man do i love this dac. i also run direct to my amplifier.
i did some searches after i posted and found a quote from michael ritter in another forum where he talked about the converter. it was pretty old so this must have been in the works for some time. thats pricey for what it is! |
Hey Vance, stand by on the Bidat full on comparison. It took me so long to get the MSB singing I want to do justice to that head to head comparison. |
Audiofun,
It sounds like the MSB is an impressive DAC. If I could trouble you to give a final verdict on how it sounds playing back 44.1 material compared to the modded Bidat's performance, I'd appreciate it. I know you've left spinning cd's behind, but I'd like to know whether the MSB beats the Bidat for redbook playback. I can't wait to hear how the Playback Designs unit does.
Thanks for sharing your journey.
Vance |
Richard_stacy, what do you use as your AES source/transport? I'm using a Lynx AES16 with my Berkeley Alpha DAC and it's possible the HF "zing" I hear is caused by the jitter and noise characteristics of that sound card. Although others have reported the same finding and they were using other transports (e.g. ULN-8 firewire to AES).
Regarding the Berkeley USB-to-AES converter, several people have reported being told by Berkeley they will be to market with such a device around mid-year priced somewhere between $1-2K. Based on my experimentation with the Legato I think this converter will outperform my Lynx AES16 and perhaps many other AES source devices. Time will tell. |
Thanks guys, the fact that anyone is interested in my findings makes it all worth while. I have never heard the Berkley so I cant comment on its sound. I would also like to know more about the Berkey converter, sounds very interesting.
I have had people tell me who have heard the Weiss and Berkley dac in the same sys that if I was not fond of the Weiss I would not like the Berkley.., but again without actually hearing it for myself... I have no opinion :)
I will keep everyone posted on my findings. |
sorry to hijack but i am very curious about the converter mentioned above from berkeley. may i ask where you heard this and can you provide any more details? i am a very happy owner of an alpha dac and this could be super relevant to my server future.
a side comment, i do not hear the hf zing you spoke of in my system. i do have an outstanding aes3 cable (mit oracle ma-x...head and shoulders above any i auditioned) but even when i was auditioning other cables i did not notice this characteristic.
audiofun...appreciate your efforts and have been following your thread for a while. many thanks! |
Some info on the new APL standalone DACs is now up on the APL website. I believe the smaller one is around $5K. I have the prototype for the larger one and its outstanding. |
Audiofun, I am enjoying living vicariously through your DAC reviews. I have heard great things about the MSB Platinum and the Playback Designs - it will be interesting to hear your impressions of how they compare.
One red herring for me in this thread is the comment that the Weiss and Berkeley sound similar and that if one isn't impressed with the Weiss then they won't like the Berkeley. I think you will find Chris Connaker's review on Computer Audiophile to confirm this point. Now, that being said, as good as the Berkeley is to my ears it does have a HF "zing" on CDRB.
The other thing about the Berkeley, which may be true on other DAC's as well, is that it is sensitive to incoming jitter and noise. In other words, to hear the Berkeley at its best one needs a very high quality AES or SPDIF interface. The Lynx AES16 is nowhere near good enough IMO. As I posted above, a Legato async USB-to-SPDIF converter made a dramatic improvement in sound quality. Berkeley is coming out with their own async USB-to-AES converter which I suspect will produce the best sonic performance.
Anyway, keep us posted on your continuing quest. Have you thought about trying a Metric Halo ULN-8 DAC? This unit has gotten tremendous praise from both the pro audio and audiophile worlds. You need a Mac with a firewire interface and a DB25-to-XLR or RCA converter. The ULN-8 has a built in pre-amp and can function as a digital cross-over. |
Final word on the MSB, this has been the MOST difficult digital product I have ever judged.., whew!!!
OK, on the right vibration control equipment (you must experiment) under and on top AND with the right interface feeding it...I now love it. I am using the HiFace with the unit with the latest drivers and it is so good I pulled the ad of off Agon (yeas I was going to sell it, but no-longer).
I highly recommend it, but it takes a bit of care to ring the best out of it. In my opinion this is not a plug and play dac. One must 'tune' it so to speak. When it is burned in and paired with the right source it is an awesome sounding device. I am keeping it :)
Oh, I am still purchasing the Playback Designs MPD-5. I don't think I am opting for the SACD version as I don't own any (sold them a while ago) and I don't really spin physical media. |
Ok, just got and installed the latest HiFace driver for OSX 10.5.X and I am happy to report that it is 100% bit perfect (pops and ticks are gone!!!) and sounds FANTASTIC!!! It has edged out the built in Tos output (using real-glass Tos).
I am very very pleased and I think I will be purchasing a few more of these units. This is the device we have been waiting on... 24/192khz capable (FAR FAR better than any USB dac I have heard) and for $180.00 (BNC). |
I did buy the HiFace with the BNC connector. I use bnc/rca adapters. I will await your modified hiface review before opting for this option. As a user of the batter powered Power Dac I can attest to little if any difference when operated on battery vs AC power. Not saying there won't be a difference but as one who has designed power supplies, the differences in my opinion can be nill. If good quiet regulators are used the battery option should make very little difference. If they are noisy, it may add a noticeable benefit to the sound. |
Apology accepted.... :-) BTW, John Keny (jkeny alias) offers a mod for 50 euros for the HiFace where he uses two outboard lithium batteries to provide the 3.3V to the clock and output stages versus using the stock regs which convert from the incoming 5V from the USB port. I'm getting one. I have to believe it offers a very nice sonic improvement over the already good stock version.
Audiofun - do you have the BNC HiFace or RCA? If your DAC has a BNC input and you are using the RCA HiFace you will be leaving some performance on the table. Check out Mike Galusha's review on Enjoy the Music. He tested both versions. |
I have to apologize,
repost from tweekgeeks hiface faq
28) Does the hiFace work in asynchronous mode?
Sure, the transfer of data over the USB bus happens in a totally asynchronous fashion, with respect to their retransmission to the DAC, in short packets which use all the available bus bandwidth. Actually, hiFace is master in the transmission from PC to interface. As it uses its low jitter oscillators to time the S/PDIF transmission, line jitter is totally uncorrelated to data transmission from PC to interface |
Guys, in my experience Firewire is the best connection. I do wish read until right ripping were the rule. Despite the bit perfect claims for various drivers, I am suspicious of such claims given the time ripping takes on my Mac Powerbook. All that notwithstanding, I love the sound I am getting with the Mac/Amara/Firewire/Miinerva and have never heard its equal. |
This from the Tweek Geek site. I started thinking about the fact that the HiFace has 2 precision clocks on board (2.5ppm) and the slight delay in the interface of iTunes when using the HiFace led me to believe it is in fact Async. This is what I found:
28) Does the hiFace work in asynchronous mode?
Sure, the transfer of data over the USB bus happens in a totally asynchronous fashion, with respect to their retransmission to the DAC, in short packets which use all the available bus bandwidth. Actually, hiFace is master in the transmission from PC to interface. As it uses its low jitter oscillators to time the S/PDIF transmission, line jitter is totally uncorrelated to data transmission from PC to interface. |
Audiofun no problem!
Yes, the snow leopard drivers are bit perfect.
I am glad that you are happy with the hiface.
I will try it with my nonos dac and I will post.
I would also like to try a firewire to spdif like the new tc twin impact that has the jetpll like the weiss int202.
My dac is very jitter sensitive.
thanks for the feedback
Nikos |
Vetnik: My bad I see you were directing you intensity at Earflapp. |
Vetnik: Which driver verison? Because I have dealt directly with Marcos via emials and they acknowledge that the driver is NOT bit perfect, it drops the LSB. Now the new beta driver for Snow Leopard according to Marcos has solved that problem, also they are working on the new driver for 10.5.X to solve the acknowledged pop/clicks.
No need to shout, I don't think I chimed in on whether or not the Hiface is async or not. My MSB renders that moot as it discards the incoming clock, buffers the data and uses its own clocking scheme to the dac, much like any good memory player.
Either way asynch or not, it sounds FAR better than any usb to dac direct connection I have tried...dropped bit and all, so I can only imagine what it will sound like with the corrected driver. |
Rei_iii I have all the filters in a playlist in itunes called "Custom Filters" and I can change them at will. I have worked with all of them extensively :) At the end of the day, I think it sound overall best with the default filter (probably why they made it the default :). |
Audiofun,
Have you tried different digital filters for your Power DAC? There are six downloadable filters from www.msbtech.com/support/supportHome.php to play around with. It can be a pita to upload the filters, but I think it is worth a try. |
Hiface new Mac drivers are bitperfect and without pop/clicks...
@Earflapp: Hiface is not asynch!
Nikos |
Earflappin: Thanks for your post, I find what you have written interesting. It could simply be poor implementation of the USB/DAC interface. My MSB PowerDac for instance stores the data into an internal ram buffer and then clocks it out using its own precision 2.5ppm clock completely discarding the clock signal from the computer. BUT..., it still sounds inferior to the coax or Tos SPDIF signal.
Perhaps one day direct USB will get it done, but I haven't experienced it as yet.
I love my HiFace, as it breaks in it has become EXTREMELY good. Interesting what you said concerning the Lynx card as I have no experience with that device (I have a mac mini) but I was thinking of getting a Power Mac for the living room and the Lynx crossed my mind. I will say however that the HiFace has been so effective that I started giving that plan a second thought, I think I am just going to purchase another Mac Mini and a second HiFace... that device is awesome. |
Many audiophiles have reported similar findings - i.e. DAC's with USB interfaces not sounding as good as the AES or SPDIF interface. Personally, I think this is likely just poor implementation of the USB interface versus an inherent deficiency in the format itself. I don't find this surprising in that the USB and Firewire interface technology is new to the veteran DAC designers. Further, many of the USB interfaces in use are not async which means they use the computer clock for clocking the data transfer which causes high jitter. Therefore, async USB to SPDIF converters like the Legato, HiFace, et. al. will likely be the way to go for many of us.
I have a Berkeley Alpha DAC and recently tried a Legato async USB to SPDIF to compare to my Lynx AES16 interface. The Legato was better in every aspect of performance.
Bottom line, I think as designers master the art of building in async USB interfaces to their DAC's AES/SPDIF will fall by the wayside.
JMO |
Yes, I have abandoned regular CD playback altogether. I have never heard either the 781 or the 9 series. I did have a 581 (NOT the SE) which I could not stand. My uncle had the 781 and the 931/922 system. He really liked the 9 series, I am not positive concerning his views on the 781.
I used to own the Wadia 7 from way back in the day...one of my favorite transports of all time...especially with a Bidat...Now that was some great Redbook playback :))
I can't be of much help to you here because I haven't heard the systems you mentioned with my own ears.
I can honestly say I have never heard USB go strait into a dac and liked it. Now with a usb to spdif converter like the HiFace... it is much much improved.
My PowerDac (MSB) has the USB option and the Toslink (real glass cable) beats it like a red-headed step child...
red-headed step child is a fictional character and any resemblance to a real person is purely coincidental (my attempt to be funny...I need coffee :) |
I followed your thread just today and seem to understand you got rid of ordinary CD playback? I have used a Wadia 781 with its usb input to great satisfaction, and am considering now to go all the way to the series 9: Have you ever considered those sounds, and what was your verdict?
thanks. |
I wont have it before the end of April. I can say that my MSB Power DAC is sounding better, it may be that this thing just needs MEGA breakin... |
When do you expect to have the playback design? |
Thanks for the heads up. I was looking into the various versions just yesterday. If you are not archiving vinyl this would be the better (read) cheaper way to go. :) |
Pure Music is less expensive at $100. |
Further use of the HiFace unit has proven insightful. While I think they have a potentially great product on their hands and I am glad it exists, it is simply not ready for the mac as yet...at least in MY case. While the popping has stopped for some reason...I have no idea, it is still not able to pass a bit perfect stream which may be why the built-in optical with a glass Tos still outperforms it :(
The Hiface sounds very very good until you goto the glass/Tos then you realize it is not as full sounding and ambient room information is not coming through with the same presence: this it where it appears to be faltering.
Now I realize I have to use two differing types of digital cable, but I can tell you that I have done comparative tests (exhaustive tests) between my FIM coax digital and my glass Tos using my standby shop queen modified Cambridge D500SE as a transport and the cables sound nearly indistinguishable.
For now I will let Pure Vinyl downsample my HRx recordings to 88.2 and use the built in output. I will continue to play with the Hiface but they really need to address the lack of its ability to pass a bit perfect signal in the mac world. |
Clarification: I wrote:
Sometimes there is a slight delay, (concerning the use of Pure Vinyl in memory mode)....
I was referring to the time between the start of the next song, NOT during song playback which would be totally unacceptable :) |
Ok, it appears that for some reason unbeknown-st to the makers of the Hiface (their words)some macs still have the clicking and popping problem. They are working on a new driver.
New things, I have finally given up on Amarra, it simply destroys very fine detail that iTunes easily renders. I have lived with it for about 6 months now and I have decided to move on. I did love the fact that it could switch my midi sampling rate on the fly and bypass iTunes SRC mechanism...but the sound trumps those features... BUT!!!!
I found Pure Vinyl and it seems nearly perfect. It bypasses iTunes and switches the midi settings, is only $229.00 has a 64 bit core, allows one to record and has built in 64 bit RIAA processing for archiving vinyl. Finally, it sounds better than Amarra to these ears. The low level information I mentioned earlier (and at the very start of this thread when speaking of my Amarra trials) is present once again.
It can also be used as a memory player, which I think sounds best and sort of negates the need for expensive SSD drives. It will buffer your music (in my case, from my 1TB NAS over wifi) to the internal memory of my mac mini and then play it from there. Sometimes there is a slight delay, but in Hybrid mode, it launches another thread and starts to preload the next track so it is nearly seamless.
The ONKY thing I have found that Amarra does better is related to 'remote' on my iPhone/touch. The realtime file playback timing information is veryv ery smooth when using iTunes alone or when using iTunes with Amarra. Not so with Pure Vinyl, first you have to turn it on in the preferences and then it is jumpy and can make the music skip a bit. They need to address this, but it is a minor annoyance and I leave it off for now.
So there you have it, between the Hiface and Pure Vinyl (about $410.00 (Pure Vinyl is slated to go up to $299.00 with the next full release) I can play ALL my files all the way up to 24/192khz... The Hiface will pass 32 bit information should you have any.
Oh, one last thing I love about the Pure Vinyl, it reads your midi setting upon start up and uses that number to base up sampling on (should you turn upsampling on, I prefer it off but it is very good, just not as good as no upsampling to me) for instance: say most of your' files are 44.1 I think it would be smart to pick 88.2khz as the midi setting. Now with upsampling on, PV will upsample everything below 88.2 (which will probably be mostly 44.1 stuff) to 88.2 (even order math) anything 88.2 or greater will be player as NATIVE S.R. with no upsampling involved. So if you are a fan of upsampling this is the golden ticket...or egg ... or goose or whatever it is thats golden and good :) |
Well, I have the Hiface (BNC version) and while I hear great promise, mine unfortunately has the clicking/popping issue which I thought this latest batch was supposed to address. I do hear a great deal of promise with the unit, I have contacted Mike Garner at Tweek Geek and he is all over it, getting back to me last evening after 10pm EST within 15 minutes of my email....NOW THAT'S SERVICE!!!
I will keep you all posted. |
Audiofun, if you're going to use the RCA version of the M2, I can't resist putting in another plug in for Moray James digital cable...I'm sure he'd send you one to audition. It beats anything I've tried from Kimber Illuminati to Harmonic Tech and based upon the music for pleasure review of the M2, the cable interface may make a significant difference. I heard an M2 (albeit not with high rez)a few weeks ago and was impressed. Look forward to your review. |
OK, FINALLY... my M2Tech HiFace is going to be delivered today. I can't wait to try it out and report its capabilities. I will keep you posted. |
Audiofun,
Unfortunately, my rack and set up won't accommodate "stiffies" but I'm glad you've found a good match. |
Vhiner: The finest power cord I have ever used (on everything: pre/amp/Bidat...etc) is the FIM Gold (the original, I know nothing about the sound of the CRL but I was told by one of the original owners of FIM that when it changed over the CRL the formula for the cables changed a bit. The FIM cords, though stiff and a ROYAL PAIN!!! to work with are the REAL DEAL and make a massive difference :) |
Audiofun,
Fascinating. Thanks for the update.
Don't let anyone tell you you're nuts about the input issue. I have had similar issues with placement of digital interconnects in relation to interconnects and power cords (something that Robert Harley himself has written about).I know of one Bidat owner who has to routinely re-set his unit so that the "c-lock" mechanism will properly lock with the transport. He gets "sound" without doing this, but the difference when the "lock" has properly occured is substantial. Another friend of mine once referred to the building and creation of DACS as a "dark art." Based upon my experience, this is true and little things can really make a difference.
I don't know if you've ever placed a serious after market powercord on any of your DACS, but you might be surprised by the effect. Several of us Bidat owners have found Shunyata Helix or CX cords to mate very well with the unit. |
I am getting close on the MSB, here is the what I am finding. The unit is very refined and I know I keep saying that like a broken record. The reason is that I am not happy with the amount of treble energy. I find that the vocal region seems to be (almost spotlighted) more prominent than the energy in the treble region. I remembered reading something like this and so I googled MSB review Platinum and found the old Stereophile review of the original Platinum dac which I believe contained the 1st generation of there in-house designed R2R ladder dac. Now granted the power dac has the 2nd Generation dacs and a much more powerful digital filter, but man... the reviewer described exactly what I was hearing in the treble. It is not bad by any stretch of the imagination so don't get me wrong. It is simply a presentation I am not comfortable with.
To be fair I spoke to one of there engineers and Vince (a great guy by the way) who suggested I order new batteries. I did so ,but they won't arrive until Wed or Thursday of this week (which is why this review was delayed and even now I am doing so with pause). I did open the unit last evening and measured the voltages on all 5 batteries (without the unit being connected to the charger which could give a false read) and they were all at spec, so next I made sure all the connection were tight and that the voltage at the terminals was the voltage sent to the circuit board. All was good. I did note that the treble seemed to improve after placing the unit back in the system.
Now comes the other bad thing... :) I had been listening to the DCC-1 (Museatex) on input 3 only. Well whilst comparing the MSB and DCC-1 I decided to try it on input 1 (1 and 3 are both TOS). OK....I can hear it coming, but I am telling you there was a huge difference. The number 1 input was much fuller than the number 3 input. I tired number 2 but it sounded identical to 3. So perhaps the receiver for the num 1 input is further from the mains or some EMI/RFI interference...I don't know but I know what my ears told me.
So, now the one advantage that I thought the MSB had over the DCC-1 (fuller, weightier more refined) is nill. I am now listening to the DCC-1.
I will of course reserve final judgment until the new batteries arrive and are installed and (thought they come pre-charged) have charged for at least an hour to make sure they are topped-off.
One other thing, one of the guys at MSB (when I described what I was hearing) stated that it was something in my system. When I informed him that I owned 5 dacs and had many others in for eval with ONLY the MSB displaying this behavior that argument went out the window.
I am having fun though :) |
