EL34 in triode vs 300B/845 SET


Hi All,

    I thank you ahead if some of you already helped out with my previously related post.  Quick story, I currently use a Dared VP-300B SET and just loving the sound but since I'm using B&W805 D3 I keep wondering if better higher current/watt amp would further impress me.  The best SET in the market seems to be 805B driven by 300B, very very expensive (thinking Line Magnetic 219ia).  I've been reading that EL34 due to it's design gets very close to 300B SET when wired in triode mode.  It seems far more economical to get the romantic lush sound and lots more power (relative to SET) with EL34B in triode then going 845/805 tubes (especially considering high heat).  Any anyone can share experience with above since there're lot of EL34 triode/UL amp out there these days?

    I'm also wondering since Dared VP-300B is a very entry level 300B SET, if upgrading to more expensive ones like Line Magnetic or AudioSpace or Cary...etc would make big difference with fuller body sound?  Or maybe SET is SET and won't get too huge leap of a difference.

Thanks.

hifineubee
hi mboldda1, i'm located around Seattle area.

trelja, how would you describe EL34 vs 300B?  I listened to a Primaluna Dialouge Premium HP at local dealer through a pair of Living Voices Auditorium.  Honestly while it was very good I wasn't completely floored, maybe my expectations too high.  I've listened to other higher sensitivity speakers like Reference 3A and some giant single driver speaker (forget brand), still have yet to find something to steering me away from B&W 800 series yet... =(
Keep the B and W speakers. Find the right amp configuration and you will
have a very nice system. These speakers are simply as good as the signal feeding them. Every time I have upgraded my system in any way my speakers show it immediately. I have the B and W 802 D3s. 
@hifinubee I would look at your auditions reflecting the refinement of taste you've achieved by having experienced good components and sound in your own system.

You've likely found yourself in the unfortunate position of loving two components that do not mate well together. I won't tell you which direction you should go, but in most circumstances a 300B SET driving a B&W loudspeaker will not show either component at its best.

Again, I think because both the EL34 and 300B excel in the midrange some may want to draw comparisons even if hearing them side by side in two amplifiers implemented as similarly as they can come to allow an apples to apples comparison produces starkly different sound. One can always find exception with what I say going forward, but except in less typical situations, these descriptions should hold up... The EL34 has a tighter, more focused, more extended, and less romantic sound than the 300B. The EL34 produces low-frequency extension that easily walks away from the 300B. And of course, there comes the issue of output; one can obviously build a high-powered amplifier running EL34 far more easily than the 300B. The right EL34 in the right amplifier can produce a stunningly glorious midrange that reminds one of sunshine itself. The 300B often creates a lush and luxurious sound, again focused on the midrange where 85% of the music lies, that only a couple of tubes can compete with.  The 300B can paint the sort of beautiful colors no EL34 can. Both tubes do well in the treble, but if one finds a situation where things get a bit too hot, it will be the EL34 rather than the 300B.

More than comparing the two tubes, I mentioned other factors contributing to how an amplifier sounds. It's taken me a long time to walk down this road.  Conventional wisdom often holds transformers represent the most critical aspect of a tube amplifier. I used to follow that as so many have said it, but experience has taught me the effects of the rest of the amplifier, and I now consider that overstated.  More than obviously, we overlook the differences in SET versus push-pull operation holding the highest position, even when the latter employs triode connection of the output tubes. After that, fixed bias versus cathode bias yield something akin to yin and yang, though it's the other way around. Some may not relate to this analogy, but think of how different a Marshall JTM50 amplifier sounds from the VOX AC30; they show the classic nature of each topology. After that come the others on my list, transformers, rectification, and the driver / phase splitter.  Most know about tube versus solid state rectification, but even within that, directly versus indirectly heated tube rectifiers produce noticeable differences.  On the driver / phase splitter stage less complexity produces the most direct and insightful sound and vice versa.  That's another advantage of SET as it has NO phase splitter, and the driver circuitry tends to the simplistic

one more thing to consider is tube replacement cost 300b's are rather expensive compared to most other tube types. descent ones are $150 each and up lets not even talk about NOS 300b's

There are some exotic and expensive SET amplifiers that might do justice to your speakers - such as the Kronzilla that uses a pair of T-1610 tubes. Otherwise, you are stuck with making a choice.