@hifinubee "I’ve been reading that EL34 due to it’s design gets very close to 300B SET when wired in triode mode."
As someone who has built a number of tube amplifiers of varying types, and reached the point of holding several factors either constant or going in the same direction, I can tell you the folks writing those things are incorrect. The EL34 and 300B have VERY different characters. That holds up regardless of whether the EL34 runs in triode, ultralinear, or pentode operation. Some may try to draw parallels as the midrange of each tube represents its strength. That said, solid state / tube rectification, driver / phase splitter topology, and fixed / cathode bias make at least as much difference as the actual output tube.
Likewise, I disagree with folks who feel the 211, 805, or 845 represent the best sounding SETs. The 45, 2A3, and 300B, in that order generally grade out at the top of the more widely implemented types, though an obviously less sympathetic loudspeaker requires those larger tubes.
If I may, my suggestion is to hold on to the Dared 300B SET you like so much, and seek out a better partner in the loudspeaker
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@hifinubee I would look at your auditions reflecting the refinement of taste you've achieved by having experienced good components and sound in your own system.
You've likely found yourself in the unfortunate position of loving two components that do not mate well together. I won't tell you which direction you should go, but in most circumstances a 300B SET driving a B&W loudspeaker will not show either component at its best.
Again, I think because both the EL34 and 300B excel in the midrange some may want to draw comparisons even if hearing them side by side in two amplifiers implemented as similarly as they can come to allow an apples to apples comparison produces starkly different sound. One can always find exception with what I say going forward, but except in less typical situations, these descriptions should hold up... The EL34 has a tighter, more focused, more extended, and less romantic sound than the 300B. The EL34 produces low-frequency extension that easily walks away from the 300B. And of course, there comes the issue of output; one can obviously build a high-powered amplifier running EL34 far more easily than the 300B. The right EL34 in the right amplifier can produce a stunningly glorious midrange that reminds one of sunshine itself. The 300B often creates a lush and luxurious sound, again focused on the midrange where 85% of the music lies, that only a couple of tubes can compete with. The 300B can paint the sort of beautiful colors no EL34 can. Both tubes do well in the treble, but if one finds a situation where things get a bit too hot, it will be the EL34 rather than the 300B.
More than comparing the two tubes, I mentioned other factors contributing to how an amplifier sounds. It's taken me a long time to walk down this road. Conventional wisdom often holds transformers represent the most critical aspect of a tube amplifier. I used to follow that as so many have said it, but experience has taught me the effects of the rest of the amplifier, and I now consider that overstated. More than obviously, we overlook the differences in SET versus push-pull operation holding the highest position, even when the latter employs triode connection of the output tubes. After that, fixed bias versus cathode bias yield something akin to yin and yang, though it's the other way around. Some may not relate to this analogy, but think of how different a Marshall JTM50 amplifier sounds from the VOX AC30; they show the classic nature of each topology. After that come the others on my list, transformers, rectification, and the driver / phase splitter. Most know about tube versus solid state rectification, but even within that, directly versus indirectly heated tube rectifiers produce noticeable differences. On the driver / phase splitter stage less complexity produces the most direct and insightful sound and vice versa. That's another advantage of SET as it has NO phase splitter, and the driver circuitry tends to the simplistic
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@hifinubee based on your recent posts you seem willing to go in a different direction with the amplifier. I take it that means, given the choice, you prefer to keep the B&W loudspeakers?
SETs appeal to a lot of people. They often then start a quest to chase down a sympathetic loudspeaker to mate with them. I understand you really like the B&W, but I think it's easier to find a loudspeaker that works for you than another type of tube amplifier. If you do want a warm sound in a more powerful tube amplifier you may want to consider some of the BAT, Cary, Conrad Johnson, Jadis, and Quicksilver push-pull offerings. That said, in going there you likely give up what draws you to your current SET amplifier.
Coincidentally, I was the North American importer for Consonance. Just to clarify, the Reference 5.5 used only 2 X 300B per channel, and as its not at all a powerful amplifier, would not much more than you already have. If you want to go in the PSE direction, I recommend the Cyber 300B PSE monoblocks as a much better alternative, but still won't meet your current needs, as they are also seriously deficient in the low-end. Consonance also produced 211 (great midrange, not much low-end) and 845 (good low-end, overly dark and veiled midrange) versions of the Cyber monoblocks, which work best with back-loaded horn loudspeakers. As I previously stated, neither of those larger tubes produce what people like so much about 300B amplifiers. SETs have ridden this popularity wave for more than 20 years, and with it, the larger tubes. So many people have found themselves in the same situation as you, loving the lower wattage amplifiers, but wishing for more output to adequately drive their loudspeakers. If the larger SETs represented the solution, they would have already caught on in a big way. As things are, the 300B handily outsells them, for good reason. To provide acceptable power and bass response, you may also want to consider push-pull triode amplifiers, using 300B, or even better, 2A3 tubes
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@hifinubee thank you for the kind words.
As a suggestion, you may want to seek out a Consonance Cyber 10 Signature. It's an integrated amplifier, using 2A3 triode output tubes in push-pull configuration, and a Mullard long tail pair driver stage. Not a huge number exist, as the amplifier looks all wrong on paper. It's a product I had to work harder than any other to sell, as everyone (including myself) dismisses it out of hand without even a listen, but I believed in it that much after hearing it and living with it. I imported enough of them that they come up here and there on Audiogon, USA Audio Mart, and eBay. Typical pricing ranges from $500 - $900. It's a deceptively wonderful amplifier, and in my experience, one of their best products across board. I realize most find it hard to believe, but at just 11 watts per channel, it can drive the typical loudspeaker with authority, excellent low-end output, and a seductively sweet tone. They also produced a more or less identical, more expensive version
using the 300B tube producing 22 watts per channel, called the Cyber
100S Signature. It lacked the seat of the pants power, bass response,
and magic of the 2A3 amplifier. The Cyber 10 Signature 2A3 ran just about stride for stride in terms of loudness, power, and oomph with the 35 watt EL34 / 40 watt KT88 Cyber 100 Signature amps
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@hifinubee it looks like you’ve picked the B&W loudspeakers over the Dared 300B amplifier?
The Shuguang 2A3C may be my favorite current production non-exotic output tube. For just a few dollars, we transitioned from the 2A3B to 2A3C with the Consonance Cyber 10 Signature, and it proved an instant upgrade. Again, I recommend you seek out one of those integrated amplifiers. The tube worked anywhere I’ve used it without issue, and provided excellent sound. I have seen it not physically fit into some amplifiers because of its noticeably larger glass envelope / bulb. As much as I love the 2A3, it doesn't offer enough power to make a usable SET amplifier in the way a 300B does. Run it in push-pull configuration, and it can drive the typical loudspeaker, and I believe definitely leaps over the 300B.
The Cyber 880A would have no trouble driving your B&Ws, and certainly offers good sound. As you said, you’re getting away from the SET sound with it. Not only does it use a push-pull output stage, but the Mullard long-tail pair driver moves at least two steps up in complexity from the typical SET, and as I’ve said, most often, the simpler the amplifier, the more immediate the sound. That’s a huge part of the SET magic, the simplest output tubes used in the simplest output stage, and normally driven by a very simple circuit.
The other issue I have with this amplifier is now you’re talking serious money, and more than double your target price. Of course, if you can find a used one, that might fit. I don’t think higher priced Chinese amplifiers make sense from the standpoint of economics or logic today. The market seems to agree, as I don’t see anyone moving anything in this realm beyond the midrange price point. Since I no longer represent the brand in North America, customers have no support, service, safety net, etc., and so the brand pretty much disappeared from this market outside of re-badging their solid state amps and CD players as Hegel. The current Consonance importer operates more or less as an order taker, and the factory in China drop ships directly to the customer. The customer gets to pay substantially more for the simple task of a middleman invoicing the purchase. It’s lose - lose, and a poor way to do business on all levels in my mind
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