Why leave feedback if the Audiogon team is just going to remove it?

I'm with you on this audiofreak. It sounds very shady, saying he removed the stickers after a bunch of back and forth. It sure smells fishy to me.

I can understand your position, however if that is the case then what does that say for the post that "jmcgrogan2" left for me that prompted my response in the first place?  His post was removed by Audiogon.  I suppose that means that you DEFINITELY not buy or sell to him then?

audiofreak, the way you conduct yourself on this forum,  I would never buy or sell with you.  You are rude

John, unfortunately I didn't get to read your last response as the Audiogon staff decided to remove it.

I think maybe you are right though... I need to "man up" and "put my big boy pants on" and be like you and the other audiophile fools on here and go buy retail.  That way I can spend $8,000 for a brand new, shiny CD player instead of grabbing one used for 1/3 that price from someone like you when they get bored of it after a year.... good economic plan!

Also.... if I am spending too much time on these forums (243 posts), then what are you doing exactly (5,754 posts).... maybe math was not your best subject?

Hey , hold on here,I like the forums, nothing wrong with that. If you don't that's OK too, don't read them.

Completely disagree... I expect more from my sellers.  I have completed hundreds of transactions on Audiogon, Ebay and US Audio Mart as both a buyer and a seller.  If a buyer came to me with a concern, I would do my best to address it, INCLUDING accepting a return if he was not happy with something related to the item.

And you spend WAY TOO MUCH time on these forums... find a good hobby, like listening to music maybe?

The BIGGEST issue that I have with what happened with this transaction (and the reason for me leaving neutral feedback) is that when I contacted the seller noting that the decals were not present, and that I looked at all 3 of my existing LessLoss power cords and called 2 different audio friends of mine that have them and asked that they also verify the decals were present on theirs, he DID NOT say ANYTHING about the fact that he had removed them. 

We went back and forth with messages and he was saying that "He bought from a reputable seller" and "Just because there are no decals, does not mean that it is not authentic", etc., etc.  No mention of the fact that he removed the decals. 

Then, I ask him if I can return the item and I would be fine covering his original shipping fees.... THEN he says "I removed the decals".  TOTAL BS!  This is so deceptive, I cannot imagine a sane person reading this post would not think that this is wrong.

Again, the PROPER thing to do is offer a return if the buyer is not satisfied for some reason and move on.

There's only one side of this story being aired, so I'm only going to criticize that one side, even though the unheard side is probably open to an equal amount of criticism.

Removable stickers on a power cord proving authenticity is a joke.  Even if it did have a sticker, how would you known the sticker was authentic?

If the stickers are that important, why didn't you inquire about them before completing the transaction?  If you couldn't see them in the photo you should have asked for a different photo with the stickers clearly visible.

Before concluding that they are fake you should have them examined by a dealer, distributor or the manufacturer.

Power cable "sounded horrible" because it was "fake"? That’s awesome :)

DUH ? thats the idea freak.

If they continue to remove any feedback other than POSITIVE, then how is any potential buyer supposed to know if they are dealing with a person on the up & up???

I had another transaction where I left NEUTRAL feedback... I was the buyer and the item that I received was not working.  I was merely asking for a return/refund from the seller.  After leaving the neutral feedback, the seller leaves me neutral feedback complaining that I was a bad buyer.  So, Audiogon decides to take BOTH of the neutral feedback off.  What a total waste of effort for everyone.  I do not understand why this is happening.

Reason= buyers pay Audiogon sellers don't . 

Audiogon removed my negative feedback, for what reason, i dont know. 

I purchased a classic Thornes turntable here on Audiogon and then the seller changed his mind after he deposited my Cashiers check!! I never received the turntable, but I did get my money back from him. What a total waste of time that was. When I tried to post a negative, he was able to have it removed???? Not fair at all, and I wish there was some way to change it.


Matt

Well his return policy on the two items he has on now is: "Returns are not accepted on this item." So, he might be hiding behind that. His all time feedback rating is 98.1%, so he is being gigged for something. I wonder if AudiogoN removed the text of the feedback, but left the percentage hit. At the end of the day, I and I believe most sellers here would have accepted the return as it is an issue for you and the buyer needs to be happy with the purchase.

I was more "concerned" at first, asking where he had purchased the power cord and if he had the original bag or receipt, which he did not.  He made no mention that HE actually removed the decals at all (at first). 

Then I ask him to return the item... that I was not convinced that it was authentic.  Then we went back and forth a few more times through Audiogon messages and he was saying it was real, etc., THEN he finally said that he had removed the stickers...  I found this part to be a real issue - that it was not mentioned when I first brought up the issue after receiving the cable.

I just think that the correct thing to do would have been to offer a return if he had no proof of purchase.

And I still have no real answer (as usual) from the Audiogon staff of WHY the neutral feedback was removed.

When I remove decals or stickers, I put them on the receipt or ad page if I bought it on line, then into a file. Most people don't think this way tho. I bet he thought nothing of removing the stickers and didn't even dawn on him that it might be important for resale value to some. Did your discussion get heated before the feedback was left? Was there an accusation of "fake goods" from the beginning?  

Exactly... we tried to work this out without needing to involve PayPal, but the seller was not cooperating.  If he would have just offered me a return, less his shipping costs, that would have been acceptable to me.

If it was noted in the original ad that there were no decals or he removed the decals... would you be OK buying the cable?  I would not.

The buyer has not proven the cables are fake. He has only said they came without the decals or stickers. Now, does the absence of the decals make them fakes? The seller said he removed the decals and at the time, didn't think it would become an issue or even think it would matter or he forgot. Maybe he didn't like the looks of the decals. I remove the stickers or decals on all my gear. The buyer only commented on the sound of the cord after he was asked and maybe is convinced it is fake based only on the fact that it has no stickers. It seems to me that this could have been dealt with out of the feedback system by two members of AudiogoN in good standing. I would have offered a refund just because the buyer was not happy with the purchase. 

As you know, Feedback can really damage the Seller’s reputation with no return.
Now if the Seller honestly didn’t know the cable was fake and later on refunded or made things OK for the buyer, then Feedback should be removed.
Now, if Seller don’t take responsibility and simply ignores the buyer, then yes Feedback should be Negative as this seller should not be part of Audiogon.
Also LessLoss is a European based company and can confirm for you whether the cable is indeed fake. If you need help contacting them, let me know and I will happily help you
Zen

  I have bought hundreds of tubes not so many cables. Sometimes I get a bad tube.  I refuse to pass these tubes along to the next guy like a lot of people and this may be the case here.   I just leave no feedback at all.  I don't care for the adversarial exchanges with small sellers, I will contact larger operations and ask for some relief. On occasion I will complain to a seller if it is a particularly egregious sale.

The seller may have asked moderators to remove your feedback by stating that he performed a legitimate sale. You should state your case to Audiogon.

LessLoss is in Lithuania...
http://www.lessloss.com/contact_us.html?zenid=hpsgc4u1qhemcdjs1prf9r5v97

audiofreak32, I was hoping Lessloss was U.S. based.

Sounded horrible, because it was a fake.

BTW, how does the cable sound?

Do you know where LessLoss is located?  That would take weeks and cost money.

One option would be to send the cable to LessLoss for verification.

Hard to see if they were or not in the photos (small, low-res pictures + angle of photos), but my question is more about the Audiogon staff removing feedback that was left... why?

Where the stickers on the cable in the photos that were part of the classified ad? Not passing any judgement, just asking a question....

After contacting LessLoss, they confirmed that there are fakes out there and that they always had both of the decals on each end.  Because the seller said (after I brought up the issue) that "he removed the stickers" does not make the cable authentic.

The PROPER thing to do is to say...

"I'm sorry that you are not happy with the transaction... I will allow you to return for refund, minus my shipping costs". 

He admitted he removed the stickers, so you have an authentic cable. Just no stickers, do they make it sound better? I don't find this to be "INCREDIBLY DECEPTIVE". He does have good feedback.

What is the point in leaving feedback for an item that you purchase if Audiogon is just going to remove it? 

How about other buyers that might be interested in buying from this member?  Should they not be aware of a situation with a past sale?