Experiment with fuse direction, it makes a difference Just ask Kevin Hayes for the correct direction. In my VAC SigMKIIa pre, incorrect direction is easily audible. Sounds like out of phase. Big fat image with no impact and weight. Compared notes with several VAC owners and all hear the same. |
Experiment with direction the second day, I like Cannon D or something with good high end extension and you'll hear the right direction has more clarity/focused soundstage. |
01-28-15: Wig
Give the AH fuse a week to settle in, definitely more palpable and organic sounding than the SR. How will I know if I'm burning it in the right direction? Know of anyone looking for a Vac 160i?
Sorry, no I do not. |
Give the AH fuse a week to settle in, definitely more palpable and organic sounding than the SR.
Know of anyone looking for a Vac 160i? |
Jmcgrogan2,
You and I know that the madness NEVER ends ;-)! |
I just ordered a AH fuse for the VAC. I can't believe that I'm going to have to experiment with fuse direction though......man, does the madness never end??? |
Thanks Wig for the idea. I'll try it. |
Experiment with fuse direction, it makes a difference |
I am using the new SR Red fuse. Very happy with that. |
|
|
Thanks, 5x20mm or 6x30mm? |
|
Thanks Wig. I didn't think the 6550's could be used in the VAC, which is why I haven't tried them yet. I don't think the VAC can use anything but KT88's. No 6550's, KT90's, KT120's, etc.
As for the fuses, thanks again. Do you happen to know the size/value of the VAC fuse? |
I don't believe 6550 can be used in the Vac and the AH fuses are the real deal, I have them in all of my components and yes, they're better the SR. |
Has anyone tried running 6550's in their 160i in place of the KT88's? A friend of mine sent me a new quad of ARC 6550 tubes. I e-mailed Kevin a couple weeks ago, but got no response. He was probably tied up with CES. I don't want to just plug them in and gamble. :^)
Also, anyone using upgraded fuses? I'm tempted to try one of Audio Horizons Platinum Reference fuses.
Cheers,
John |
I have read good things about that. I am sure you have a very good amp for your purposes Lak. 300Bs are said to be very special tubes and I am sure the Allnic design is great. |
Agriculturist,
I almost purchased a 160i in 2011 however at the time I could not afford it. I've always admired the VAC product line. From what I've read about the 160i SE, it just souinds amazing!
I ended up with an Allnic 1500 integrated 300B. |
I'm not really looking for sweetness in the midrange anyway Agriculturist. I had plenty of that with my Cary SLP-98P F1 and VAC PA 35/35 amp.
I'm looking more for a natural midrange, not really a sweet one. The 160i does do a very nice job in that regard. Perhaps the SE version does a better job, and one day I may look into that possibility, but not now. Besides, I'd hate to think about being without my amp for a few weeks of shipping/mods, etc.
I think there is about a $6K difference in price between regular and SE version? As far as I know, $2K of that is the upgraded MC phono stage and balanced inputs options that are availible for the 160i, but come standard on the 160i SE. Then the other $4K is in parts upgrade, of course adjusting all numbers for dealer markups.
I have not had the opportunity to hear a 160i SE in comparison with my 160i.
Cheers,
John |
Hi Lak. Unfortunately at least as far i know no one on this thread has heard both the 160iSE and the 160i. I used to have the VAC 300.1a amp and Renaissance Mark 3 preamp, which I think is probably sonically comparable to the 160i, although with more power 150 wpc versus 85 wpc for the 160iSE and 160i which of course are VAC 's integrated models. I found when moving to the new 160iSE from the separates a substantial increase in refinement across the whole spectrum. All VAC amps have a very high and deserved reputation for their mid range and while I was very enamored of my separates, I feel that the new 160iSE integrated betters the separates even in the midrange. The difference in build between the 160iSE and the 160i is better parts - transformers, etc. - similar to those in VAC 's very high end Statement products.
Interested to hear your view point and about your interests. |
Agriculturist,
Congratulations on your purchase of the VAC 160i SE.
Looks sweet! And I'm sure it sounds great.
I find this thread very interesting.
Can anyone here tell me what the difference in sound would be comparing the 160i to the 160i SE?
Unfortunately, I have heard neither.
Best regards, |
OK, John, perhaps you won't get all the way to the sweetness of the midrange you lost, but I am sure you will get at least some of the way there. Hope to hear the 30/30 somewhere.
And thanks Wig. Unless I am imagining things I am getting an advantage from my LPI sitting on the VAC. BTW I use Herbie's tube dampers on all tubes and like what they do. |
Agriculturist,
Those are Herbies SuperSonic Stabilizers that were used on top of my CD Player but moved them to the Vac after reading a review on the Vac PHI 200. I have not heard any improvements probably because they're too light and thought they would look good there. |
You may be right, but I have my reservations. I believe the difference is inherent in the difference between the EL34 tube and the KT88 tube. The KT88 is known to be more powerful, dynamic, etc. While the EL34 tube is known as the closest push-pull tube to a SET 300B tube amp when it comes to midrange purity. I also had a quad of Mullard XF-2 EL34 tubes in that amp.
Don't get me wrong, the 160i is no slouch in the midrange, and will better many other amps in this area. I doubt it can best the better EL34 or 300B tube amps in this area though. One just can't have it all.
BTW, I've also lusted after that VAC 30/30 300B amp, but I don't have the speaker/room to do it justice. ;^) |
John, one more thing I wanted to mention to you is that i think that any mid-range sweetness you may have lost when you gave up your 35/35 will likely come back if and when you upgrade to the SE version. Just such a gain in mid-range sweetness is what I got when I moved from my old VAC separates to the 160iSE. |
Thanks for the update John. Good to know about the VAC 35/35. One of the vintage VACs that has always been interesting to me has been the VAC 30/30 which runs on the 300B. Would not work with my NOLAs which I wouldn't part with anyway, but perhaps with DeVores or something like that the 30/30 or perhaps the 35/35 could be interesting.
Wig, seeing your ad photo gave me the idea of sticking a Stillpoints LPI that I happen to have just as you have in your photo. That is I put it on the front left of the 160iSE chassis just in front of the two 12ax7s for the phono stage. I was quite surprised by the impact. So far I am listening to piano and finding a meaningful elimination of grain that of course I did not know was there before. Vocals seem slightly cleaner too. Makes me curious about your experience, what it is that you use there, and where else you have tried placing them. The Stillpoints LPI I am using is meant either for placing on top of records in turntables or on top of DACs, preamps etc. It is supposed to supposed to dampen resonance by sucking it up somehow and converting it to heat energy. Certainly seems to be working here. Thanks. |
Yes, I did sell my VAC PA 35/35, and it was kind of interesting, especially with all those special tubes to play with. That said, when I first plugged in the 160i, the dynamics, power and extension blew me away, not to mention how much bigger the soundstage got. The PA 35/35 had a sweet little midrange, which the 160i can't quite match, but the 160i won on all other counts. I sold the PA 35/35 to a local fellow who loves it. It's 35 wpc was much more power than his smaller Shindo amp delivered. He is in a smaller room with more efficient speakers too, so the PA 35/35 works better for him than it did for me.
@Wig, I really thought you had a great rig. I was speaker hunting lately, and thought long and hard about those AZ Crescendo's, but in the end decided they would probably be too much speaker for me. I thought they would mate nicely with the 160i though. I wound up buying a pair of Reference 3A Grand Veenas, which I am very happy with.
Cheers,
John |
Wig:
Looking at your VAC 160i ad photo, I have become curious what those two flat discs are for that you have placed on the front chassis surface of your VAC 160i? Are they to dampen vibrations? Do they work well? And who makes them?
Thanks. |
Still doing my research but Pass and Hegel are a few I'm considering. It's going to be hard moving away from the Vac but more power is needed... |
By the way, separately Wig mentioned he might look at the new Pass INT-60. |
John, just curious, did you sell your VAC 35/35? It looked kind of interesting, although of course I have no use for it myself as I have my 160iSE. Anyway, after a few months of listening, how does the VAC 35/35's sound compare to your VAC 160i?
Thanks |
Wig, I see you put your 160i up for sale. What are you looking at getting next? |
I should mention that Kevin is not 100% sure about the use of E80CC as a replacement for 12AU7 as the three amp driver tubes. Brent said that the higher filament current draw of the E80CC is not a concern, but Kevin did once say to me that there might be other issues that I didn't quite understand when he mentioned them. I do get enough of an improvement in performance from these tubes that I really like using them and plan to continue doing so. This weekend I did have a VAC supplied KT88SC tube fail which I had been using continuously for 16-17 months or so, first in my old VAC 300.1a and then in the VAC160iSE for the last five months. I don't think it has to do with my use of the E80CC as drivers. But I mention all of this as a caution to others who may be considering doing so. |
Holy cow! That's a lot of money for NOS tubes!
I would not think of spending that on driver tubes.
My Pope's were $500/pair, that is about as much as I'm willing to spend on NOS tubes. |
Interesting auction I saw yesterday on EBay for these supposedly very special "pinched waist" version of the E80cc tubes I use as drivers for my 160iSE.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/291346306614?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
I don't have the pinched waist version myself, just the regular Philips E80CC gold pin version which cost me between $30 and $50 apiece. But these NOS Valvo pinched waist E80CC tubes must be something else, at least judging from the price they sold at! |
I'm running a pair of Pope NOS 12AX7's in the phono stage. They are the best that I've heard, but not cheap. |
If you're wanting a neutral and very quiet tube, the Sovtek 12AX7 LPS is better than Psvane TII and the reissue Tung-Sol at $30 a pair.
http://www.mcshanedesign.net/ |
Wig, will definitely do that. Thanks for the tip. |
Agriculturist,
I'll look into some NOS varieties as well. Try some reissue GL or Tung-Sol and you'll be amazed at the level of improvement at a low cost. |
Hi Wig, I am using the VAC supplied 12ax7s. But I have liked Raytheon blackplates there as well as as Philips. |
Agriculturist,
Which 12AX7 tubes are you using in the phono section V01/V02? I'm currently using Tung-Sol 12AX7 reissue because they are so quiet and very clean sounding. |
Knghifi,
The tubes worked flawlessly for 4 months and noticed the static and that one of the leds wasn't blinking with the beat. I removed all of the tube immediately before failure could occur.
Their are a few reputable dealers that have not had a GL KT88 fail but I sold mine months ago when I bought the Shuguang KT88Zs. Wished I would have kept them... |
Check with VAC, but I doubt they'd be recommended. Given my experience in Jadis amps, I would prefer the KT88s to the 6550s for the better midrange (6550s had good bass control but were leaner in the mids and highs). As for KT 120s, read Kevin Hayes' blog on the VAC website as to his feelings about that tube. |
John:
I don't believe you can use any of those, except possibly the 6550, but I would
check with VAC first as it could be problematic due to slightly different specs from the KT88. |
It sounds as if the safest bet is just using the KT88's supplied from VAC. I am using them too, as is Agriculturist. I have owned 3 VAC integrated amps, all using KT88 tubes. I have experimented with the power tubes previously, and though I had no horror stories, I can't say the sonic differences were very noticeable. Certainly not of the level noticeable by swapping the preamp tubes.
Has anyone tried any 6550 tubes, KT90 or KT120 tubes in this amp? I ask because someone is giving me some 6550 tubes, and I don't know if they are compatible with this amp or not.
Cheers,
John |
Wig, is it possible you got one bad tube?
My experience with Reissued GL KT88 is not good. Had several failed after ~200 hours and took out bias resistors. |
Wig, good to know. Thanks for the update. I have stuck to the stock VAC power tubes, but have been having a lot of fun recently experimenting with various 1950s blackplate Tung Sol 12AU7s and 12AX7s in the preamp section. I also really like NOS Philips longplate 12AX7s there. The Philips E80CC tubes as drivers in the amp section are really great as they add authority, punch and separation very impressively. Also, I am using Herbies O-Ring dampers on all tubes to good effect. The sound I now enjoy is great. |
Guys,
One of my BT KT88Z went bad after 4 months of use; noticed a popping in one channel and then noted that that tube wouldn't bias. Took them all out and put the stock tubes back in.
No issues at all with the GL but no more Treasures for me unless their QC improve... |
Sorry for the delayed reply, life has been hectic. So far, I have not really experimented too much. I just plugged in some tubes that I've had good success with previously. As stated earlier, I am using the stock VAC KT88 tubes.
In the driver stage, I am using (3) Phillips JAB 6189W's (another 12AU7 variant). In the line stage I am running a Cifte 12AU7 and a Telefunken 12AX7, with (2) Pope 12AX7's (fancy version of Amperex Bugle Boys) in the phono stage. So far, so good, of course I've only had the amp for 3 weeks now.
Cheers,
John |
And I am mostly using two Raytheon 12AX7s for the phono section as well. |
