Thiel CS6

As an absolute, against other current models, or personally? This is still my main speaker for the past 10 years and they seem to perform better each year. Local audio buddies of mine agree. They are of solid design, coherent, a bit difficult to drive, extended, smooth, dynamic, fussy about placement (they sound best in my room pointed straight ahead)and heavy. But, at today's prices on the preowned market, a true bargain. The only speaker I would prefer over the CS6 is the Vandersteen 5A.

Though very fine speakers in their own right, in the past, I've always thought that the CS6's were the poorest value in the Thiel lines. The newer SCS4T might now be the poorest value in the Thiel lines.

I had some for 10 years and loved them. Had to get rid of them when I moved as they were too big (visually) for the new audio room.

You can find some great deals on them here at the 'goN.

They are fast like planars, but have a deep strong bass and create a large soundstage- especially with vinyl. Like my experience with planers, they disappear in the music. The downside is that they demand the best amplification, cabling and front end components that you can buy. Like Bundy said, they need space. I like how they look and the light oak color of the ones that I have (nearly) match the color of my tt. I like the symmetry of that. I am very satisfied with these speakers. I do not get the chance too often these days to hear other speakers but there is only one other brand that, if I had the means I might buy- might.

Hi Steve in what way are the Vandersteen 5A's different then the Thiel's?

Hi Tony how far apart do you have yours in your setup?

The 5As have subterranean bass extension but do share the time and pahse coherence of the CS6. My experience is that they share a common cloth in fine detail and time arrival of microtransients. When set up properly, the focus with either model is immersive.

Hi Steve thanks for getting back to me. I also learned that the earlier models where using a concrete baffel that did crack on some CS6'S. My question is that it was replaced with another material .Do you know if this changed the sound QUALITY?

Hi Tony I just asked Steve the same question. Have you ever talked to anyone with your same speaker, that has the concrete baffel or the newer material that it was replaced with. I'm wondering if the sound still had the same signature?

Thanks everyone for getting back to me regarding the Thiel Speakers. I just spoke to a local dealer who carried my Eggleston Andra 1 & Thiel's, and he said that they come very close in peformance. Just that the Thiel will have much better bass extension.
That's what I needed to hear and the direction I want to go.

Steve before I get the Thiel's. I wanted to ask you if my Pass Labs X250 which I love, will be a good match? Please let me know. Thanks Bruce

Update: Thiel's will be arriving next week.
And I will be comparing the Eggleston's to them.
Who will be the winner?

This somewhat depends on the size of the room and the level to which you typically listen. Before I traded up to a Krell 400cx, the Bryston 7BST monoblocks I was using could be taken to the limit with this speaker, but they did not double down into 4 Ohms as the Pass will. Be aware that the Thiels drop to a min 2.54 ohms at 8kHz and the Krell handles this just fine. Don't know how the Pass will react at that impedance, and it may not be too critical if you don't need to drive to crazy high levels. Thiel does recommend Pass amps though as complementary.

Alan,

Actually, I would caution the use of X250 and recommend going with the X250.5. Prior to my current speakers, Verity Parsifal Encore, I had the Thiel 2.2 and then 3.6 for many years. I was driving the 3.6 with a Mark Levinson 333. When it died, I replaced it with a Pass X350.5. I had been thinking about replacing the Thiels for a while at that time, but the Pass 350.5 brought new revelations about the Thiel 3.6 that I had never heard before. And I was sure that I had pushed them to the limit with my previous setup. It made me reconsider keeping the Thiels for few more years.

Few months before I purchased mine, I had a privilege to listen to a side-by-side comparison of X-350 and X-350.5 at a friend's house driving a pair of Avalons. The X-350 sounded like a typical SS that people complained about, cold, sterile, and unimvolving. We were all surprised that it was very out of character of what we wouldexpect from Nelson Pass. But the X-350.5 was very different. It retained all the good stuff of the X-350, but brought back the midrange warmth that Pass was famous for. We all felt the difference warranted more than a ".5" upgrade designation.

FrankC

Hi Steve, Nelson and his crew worked on my Pass Labs X-250 for two weeks around 6 years ago. It was having a slight noise problem that was coming from the right channel. while working on it, and trying to solve the problem. The new circuitry that's used in the X-250.5 was developed. Boy I got lucky!You could say my amp was the prototype that became the X-250.5. Nelson even told me on the phone, that it was a much better amp then the X-350. So I'm sure it will be fine.
Crazy but true story Steve.

Hi, sorry about the delay. I haven't looked at this post in a while. My Thiels stand 9ft apart on centers. I have enjoyed my X-350 for 10 years now. I'd love to give the X350.5 a try. Maybe next year...

Hi Gundam91 and Tony Thanks for getting back to me as well.
Just so you know a little bit about myself. I've spent 40 years in Recording Studios, Master Labs and Record Companies.I've worked as a Composer/Lyrist/Vocalist & Assistant Engineer, on many projects in Los Angeles. I've been very lucky to work with great Musical Giants who where
Composers and Arrangers like Ray Ellis/Billie Holiday/Lady In Satin/ and so so much more that he did. His son Marc who's my best and we're still working on Projects today Who's done/The Movie Anchorman/ Master Of Disguise/and so much more. Another great friend of mine and another best friend that I miss. Jim Helms/The Kung Fu T.V. Series/ UFO Chronicals & 16 movie's of the week. Peter Anders Songwriter/and so on.. So I take this Music we all love very serious.
The Room that I have measures 18'L X 14' But opens up into my Dinning Area that is 13' L X 9' W
And the measurements that Mr Thiel has in his Manual is darn close to where I have the Eggleston Andra's. Only difference is that they're 8'.5" Center to center. In the manual it says 8' But because of the room opening up as it does, into the Dinning Area it could change.
On my review I will listen to Classical,Jazz,Rythum And Blues,Pop, Rock, Alternative, Music For Organ, Bass And Timpani and County that I've been writing with Marc ever since someone very BiG RIPPED US OFF on a Pop tune that was meant for Vanessa Williams back in 1990's.
Just to let you all know, I'm hoping that the Thiel's are the the ones I'm going to be living with for now! They're not so easy to move....

Correction on my Amp. It could of been 7 years that it was worked on . Boy does time fly...

Hi Tony my Thiel's arrived yesterday. I never told you that they're also in Maple.

Update:
12 hours setting up Thiel's
And not even setting on provided spikes. Testing CD'S...
Songs I've worked on in the studio and co-wrote.
Also Frank Sinatra The Reprise Collection."The Summer Wind" "All Or Nothing At All, "Bill Evans Waltz For Debby
JVCXR0051-2- JVC/Stereo/9376/Riverside Sunday at the Village Vanguard/Featuring Scott La Faro,Diana Krall The Girl In The Other Room/B0001826-12,Hilary Hahn Elgar: Violin Concerto-Vaughan Williams: The Lark/London Symphony Orchestra-Davis B0003026-02
So far I must say I'm very pleased.
Will be continued.

You will hear a big improvement when you put the spikes on. Imaging will be more focused and the sound overall tighter. That was my experience.

Hi Tony, I'm sure you're right.Are you using Banna plugs or spade type? I'm using a pair of gold spades

The value of the spikes will be determined by the flooring underneath them.

Hi Unsound, Nice to here from you. Yes I've used spikes on carpet with peg and groove floors & standard hardwood. In older homes like mine It can take time getting the correct levels.Setting up my Eggleston Andra's was a challenge. I've used granite & maple platforms in some projects. But because the SC6's are 50" tall, plus another 1/2" with the spikes, I'll just go through the setup pains.You see my ceilings are just the standard height in my present home. I miss having high ceilings that I had in the past.

I use spades and I crank them down good and tight. Good to periodically recheck them with a wrench.

If the floor tends to vibrate, the spikes could exacerbate the problem, if floor the doesn't tend to vibrate, the spikes should improve things.

You're right.. Also I see how Mr Thiel developed these Speakers. Which is how it should be. He knew his music and it shows that if it's a great recording, it will sound great. And a bad recording will sound really bad. And you see when I'm in the studio and I come home. I wanna make sure it's right on target.When submitting new songs you only have one shot.And if the recording dosen't have the emotion that makes you wanna hear it again. You're dead in the water... Thanks for your input..I must tell you that setting up these speakers wasn't easy. In matter a fact I almost threw in towel. So I lQQked at the manual and put the toe in just like Mr. Thiel had it. AND Thank God, IT WAS MAGIC.So before I put the spikes on now, thanks for your valuable information. I'm going to stabilize the hardwood floors in that area. (We never stop learning)Until then.. I'm very happy. Don't get me wrong to all Eggleston owners. They're great speakers. I just didn't want to buy two subwoofers.

In response to the Theil, Vandersteen comparison.... Vandersteens can more accurately be incorporated in the room. This may very well make the Theil good or not so good in comparison.

Stringreen, I would suggest that is true of the higher end Vandersteens, but at the lower end the opposite is true, with their respective subs all bets are off.

Unsound...the comparison is with Vandersteen's 5A speakers which are at their high end and uses the very same room correction as their top of the line 7

Alan, don't be afraid of pointing the CS6s straight ahead; they fill in the middle beautifully and my experience is that they sound their best aimed thusly; all of course in my room. And, it is extremely important to position them equally to the nearest cm from the front wall (the wall behind them). From the listening position this will "lock in" the image focus, even though off axis will sound great too.

Hi Steve,

Thanks for the advice.I have two questions to ask you.Do you know what year the front baffle was changed from using Concrete to the other baffle material? And was there any other improvements made on the CS6's between 1997-2003?
This is in regards to the Stereophile Reviews 1998 & 2003.

Steve and Tony I finally got the right placement of the Thiel's. 9' feet to center. They do sound better in my room toed in a tadd. Still not on spikes yet. I'm thinking of placing a 1/4" of granite 17" X 23" first, then installing the spikes.The hardwood floors are beautiful but a pain to get the right levels. They do sound incredible.

When you get the spikes on, be sure to level them carefully so as to ensure that the sides are parallel to one another and that they don't rock in any dimension. Obvious perhaps but you will find that mm adjustments matter with these babies. When all is well and dialed in, they will sonically disappear and the music will float in room disembodied from them.

Hi Steve, The Eggleston Speakers was easier to do because of the size. But they do weight 170 lbs each too. I will have someone for sure helping me. Thanks again.

I would rate the Thiel's on a 1 to 10 scale?

Very close to a 9. Sure glad that I found these gems.

What I have found as someone who has been writing and Composing music with Ray Ellis and Marc Ellis his son, is that these speakers are like Vandersteen 5A'S with much more detail on top end, but less just( a little less bass) on the lower freq..So Getting two subwoofers will give you what the recording REALLY SOUNDS LIKE. Yep, In a Audiophile Recording.If you're reading this I see why Mr. Thiel loved these great speakers that you don't have to ROB A BANK TO HAVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And If you want to come over to my my house and bring your favorite RECORDING I'll show you!!!!!!The truth is in the pudding!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hi Alan,
Glad you are having success with your CS 6s. You are absolutely correct about not having to break the bank! Jim Thiel knew what he was doing and apparently the CS 6 was one of his favorites. Gary Dayton showed me a pair when I was at the factory last, which belonged to Jim as his primary home speakers until his death. Enjoy the Thiels! I purchased a pair of CS 1.6s in birdseye maple a couple weeks ago for my new little room and absolutely love them.

Boonetrc
Nice to meet you. I wish I would of found out sooner about the CS 6. Enjoy your new CS 1.6s.

9/19/2012 Correction regarding adding two subwoofers.
I moved the Thiel's 1" to the back walls and that did
the trick. We never stop learning.

I know this is an old thread, but just wanted to chime in that I bought a used pair of CS6 a couple weeks back. The seller had bought them at an auction, as they came from a dealer that had gone bankrupt. I paid a quite reasonable price, got them home (after almost 800 miles of driving to get them and bring them home), hooked them up and they sounded horrible. Came to the conclusion the tweeters were fried after talking with Tim in Thiel service, who was fantastic.

More to come, but $162 later I got new tweeters delivered today via UPS, installed them which takes all of about 30 seconds each, and played them for about an hour on a variety of music. Night and day, the tweeters were what these CS6s needed, and with absolutely no tweaking of setup, toe-in, etc. they sound fantastic. I also have a pair of CS2.4s (which led me to seek out the 6s), and while those are great, too, the CS6 is a true full range speaker.

Now I need a center channel that pairs well...any suggestions? Thanks!

"...,the CS6 is a true full range speaker." Well, not really.

Bottom note on a piano- 27Hz. Freq response of CS6 (-3dB) 27Hz. You're not missing anything music wise; but if HT is your thing then a sub is needed.

As for center channel, there's really nothing better than a Thiel MCS1 to pair with you CS6's

"...You're not missing anything music wise;..." Well, not really.

Unsound has a life. Well, not really.

Yes really. Don't confuse the range of human hearing with the range of music. Yes, I know a few pipe organs around the world can go down to 8 Hz. Again, if you want to "feel" sounds, eg. HT, get a sub. And brace your walls. I had some large speakers for 14 years that had a frequency response below 20Hz. I had a test disc with 16 Hz on it and it would shake the walls. The only things I heard in that range were footfalls here and there and thumps- especially live recordings. Realism? Maybe, but it took away from the music, I think. Even after 10 years of no longer having those big speakers, I have a couple of recordings where I brace myself for the thump- like someone bumping the mic stand- and I don't hear it with these speakers. I don't miss it either.

No, not really.

http://www.contrabass.com/pages/frequency.html

Do you ever have anything to say that's more productive than "not really"? Let me guess, not really.

All that I am saying is the bottom of the frequency range for music is 27Hz or so. Below that is subharmonics. If one wants to experience the "feel" of music, like the feel of the 64ft pedal on a pipe organ, then a subwoofer is generally the best solution; unless you do not mind living with very large speakers.
Granted, the canon fire on my Telarc 1812 disc is not nearly as impressive as it was with my large, old speakers; but I can live with that.