Talk but not walk?


Hi Guys

This isn't meant to start a fight, but it is important to on lookers. As a qualifier, I have my own audio forum where we report on audio issues as we empirically test them. It helps us short cut on theories and developing methods of listening. We have a wide range of systems and they are all over the world adding their experiences to the mix. Some are engineers, some are artist and others are audiophiles both new and old. One question I am almost always asked while I am visiting other forums, from some of my members and also members of the forum I am visiting is, why do so many HEA hobbyist talk theory without any, or very limited, empirical testing or experience?

I have been around empirical testing labs since I was a kid, and one thing that is certain is, you can always tell if someone is talking without walking. Right now on this forum there are easily 20 threads going on where folks are talking theory and there is absolutely no doubt to any of us who have actually done the testing needed, that the guy talking has never done the actual empirical testing themselves. I've seen this happen with HEA reviewers and designers and a ton of hobbyist. My question is this, why?

You would think that this hobby would be about listening and experience, so why are there so many myths created and why, in this hobby in particular, do people claim they know something without ever experimenting or being part of a team of empirical science folks. It's not that hard to setup a real empirical testing ground, so why don't we see this happen?

I'm not asking for peoples credentials, and I'm not asking to be trolled, I'm simply asking why talk and not walk? In many ways HEA is on pause while the rest of audio innovation is moving forward. I'm also not asking you guys to defend HEA, we've all heard it been there done it. What I'm asking is a very simple question in a hobby that is suppose to be based on "doing", why fake it?

thanks, be polite

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net


128x128michaelgreenaudio
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So Folks, take a look at this thread

http://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/the-future-of-audio-amplification

This is the latest example of "Talk but not Walk?".

Several of us are talking about different types of amplifiers and our experiences. There’s a lot of good sharing, and then there is " " (who has been called out on this many times) making statements without actually "doing" the experience side of things. I don’t see anyone minding that folks have differing opinions based on what they know has happened for them, but as you can see we pretty much all questioned " " about making statements as fact when, in fact, he has zero or limited experience with the topic.

Why fake it?

In a hobby of doing and gentlemen exchanging ideas there are those that "fake" knowledge making statements like "snake oil" when that’s the furthest from the truth. Shouting "snake oil" is only you raising the flag "you have no experience" in most cases, or the alternative you can’t hear the results of change isn’t it? That’s certainly the flag that raises for me. If you haven’t walked why talk?

I don’t think anyone here mind "benchers" (hobbyist who are into the testing more then the listening). Some of us are benchers, some are theorist, some collectors of equipment brands, some casual listeners, and some more serious. Some are even just here wasting time as they have stated on this thread. But the OP here is why, in any of these cases, fake it? Why act like you know something when you haven’t explored it for yourself?

The other part is, why get upset? We should hand out pins and bumper stickers "don’t get too close Angry Audiophile on board".

Michael Green

Very cool to see Roger Modjeski posting on Audiogon!

I've owned several of Roger's products and was one of his dealers many moons ago. We as well featured Roger's products at some of our Trade Show rooms.

Would be great to see more designers up on this forum. I told Audiogon there's no need for this thread as more designers post on the forum. If that happened (designers posting here) the trolls would eventually find somewhere else to play.

Hope everyone has a wonderful Thanksgiving!

And for those wanting to visit me on Facebook

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1764861045

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"Did they just up and disappear off the face of the Earth ???"
Maybe they are busy. Maybe they finally (or again?) started working for Michael Green.
"Your mama and your mom and your mother are oft found more in the ‘burbs."
How many of them does he have?
Did they just up and disappear off the face of the Earth 🌍??? Audiopoint! Audiopoint! Come back Audiopoint! My mother needs you!

Can we also have Audiopoints guys join? I have popcorn ready.

After cables and fuses, this is a refreshing thread. Nobody really expects much but yet it is informative in some way.


Not to belittle anyone's accomplishment, but a regular sociable high-school kid may have a few thousand likes on Facebook. Unless it gets into millions, nothing is impressive these days.

@mitch2

No, no,no, I think you’re confusing his mother with the world renowned  cellist:

Yo Yo Mama

Hope that helps. 
Bingo! Your mama and your mom and your mother are oft found more in the ‘burbs.
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>>It is clarity of intent and meaning that matter most to me. not spelling or grammar per se<<

That’s very evident. 

All my best to mama and grandmama. 
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Touche’! There ya go again, flauntin’ yer high school education. ;-) . But why so nasty ("stooge")? In my case, "your" has a different meaning than "you’re". It is clarity of intent and meaning that matter most to me. not spelling or grammar per se.

As for capitalizing Grandmother and Mother, that was done in the name of respect, rules be damned!

“Grandmother” should not be capitalized. 
Neither should be “mother”. 
It’s “she to me” not “she to I”.

It appears the family tree’s education was lost on you. 

The use of “your” in my post is grammatically correct. 

Work on that GED stooge. 
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Sorry, but my Grandmother was a school teacher and then principal, and passed on to my Mother the importance of the correct use of the English language, as did she to I. You’re, not your, is the contraction of you are. Class dismissed ;-) .

Thank you Mods!

And thank you Facebook friends, your the best! I'm not sure what the talkers are talking about, but I'm thrilled to see the walkers getting a hold of me and other Tunees.

"dopey girl from Dr. Phil" ? Sounds like someone has way too much time on their hands. lol Who's Dr. Phil?

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Thanks for the Ad Kosst!

tuneland.info 1,010,627 members

Michael Green Facebook 2,884 friends

most people on TuneLand at the same time 145 (new) 335 (old)

Kind of cool looking at some of the numbers.

Michael


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It appears audio websites that were once powerhouses, thriving and active and enthusiastic, dry up and blow away like so many dandelions in a stiff breeze as soon as Michael leaves the building. Stereophile is now a vast wasteland. Did they all pack up and go to Tuneland? Can that be our destiny, to become a dried up useless husk? Have we been cursed? OMG!! Michael! Come back! Michael! My mother needs you!
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Hi Glupson

About a week ago I visited the forum here but only found a couple of things to post about so my visit will probably be fairly brief. This thread....https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/poorly-recorded-songs-that#1650805 ….pretty much sums up the status quo. People not yet understanding "playback".

As far as the Stereophile forum, today when I looked, there was only one active member signed in, John A. On my forum there are a ton of posts that I need to get caught up on. Other than that on the forum front it's a big yawn.

I'm getting about 100 emails a day from Facebook, so that's getting most of my attention.

A nice Rev6 speaker review came out, and a RoomTune review is on it's way.

If there was more going on on Audiogon I would spend a little time posting this season, but it looks like things are slowing down here quite a bit. And, it's pretty much the same posters over and over saying nothing new, so that doesn't exactly excite me and other walkers who are now turning their (our) attention to tuning.

Michael

http://www.michaelgreenaudio.net/

Michael Green promised "see you in a month or so". Other threads are pretending to be serious. This one is like a nice wastebasket that does not pretend to be a Chanel bag. It is no worse than others. It is hard to trash any of them.
WTH Glupson?
Why on Earth would you want to deliberately raise the dead!
Bored trashing other threads I take it?
O...M...G! Did Costco Emoji just call someone a bully?! Well shut my mouth and call me corn pone! 
Wake up everybody! It has been more than a month. Time to start trolling again.
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wolf_garcia,

You are neither first, nor the only one. Taco Bell name was envisioned during one listening session that included Pachelbel's music. The rest is history. Well, even this fact is history now. Multiple ingredients are designed to evoke synesthetic responses. For example, beans should make a diner think of tuba. His fellow diners are then expected to have multiple senses overwhelmed. It is all about the sound of that music that announces impending involvement of other senses.
Is it just me, or when you hear Pachelbel do you immediately think of Taco Bell? These are the types of cerebral questions that need answers. And brevity.
Maybe, High End Audio, whatever that actually means, was invented by people who could not construct more intricate objects. They could only do simple stuff so they needed some way to market it. They decided to call anything more elaborate than their doings "High End Audio" as some way of mocking what they could not achieve.

Just another conspiracy theory.

Taco Bell should have more non-meaty items on the menu and sauce packages should be bigger..

Ironically perhaps, HEA was invented by salesmen and aspired to by audiophiles who couldn’t afford to join the club, eking out what they hoped was 90% of HEA on a Taco Bell 🌮 worker’s salary. 
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