Supratek Owners Thread

@tksteingraber 

The Russian military tubes are pretty standard for him when he can get them but the NOS Radiotron's are an upgrade from the normal.  The 6SN7's should be fine as are the the Russian 6L6's.  I would look for a NOS rectifier though as the first swap.  They are getting more and more expensive but a good one should last you many years. 

Anyone take delivery of a Supratek recently?  

Originally ordered a dark brown wood/chrome Chardonnay and ended up upgrading to a Cabernet 6SN7 since Mick had one available to ship sooner.  Might have been a cancellation…don’t know.  Mick mentioned he was having a very difficult time getting new tubes and said he was sending quality NOS tubes from his stash.  I received Radiotron (RCA Australia made 50’s-60’s) 6SN7’s, Russian made 6N3C’s 90’s?, Russian 5U4C 90’s for my set of tubes.  Curious to hear what tube set any of you received?
Also, would like to hear from any Cab 6SN7 owners on what tubes you are using or prefer.  Thanks

@reimarc Thanks!!!

If it's "bloom" you want, Mick's creations are hard to beat. Any music passing through my Grange sounds just "grand" and very intoxicating (same preamp-stage as the Cortese). For two months now I have burned the night oil with this extraordinary instrument with all musical genres and analog as well as digital sources. In my opinion, a Supratek preamp is a final purchase.

Great thread!

I am pondering Supratek Cortese LCR preamp. Currently have EAR Yoshino 868PL which is also a full function preamp and is currently paired with Pass Labs XA30.8 amp.

Just wondering if anyone compared EAR preamps with Supratek? The EAR preamp is very good, absolutely nothing wrong with its pairing with Pass Labs but I am looking to get MORE air, bloom and realism in the music.

depending upon the 300b tubes you have installed maybe,  maybe not..   you need to measure.  the dimensions of the GF tube are given at the site.   

Would these tubes fit the Cabernet that has both 300B and 6SN7 ?

seams to be very little space !

https://premiumvacuumtubes.com/product/treasure-globe-6sn7-se-pair-gf-limited-special-edition/

Glad to hear this @rrboogie . Horns are very demanding. Adjustable gain is a Supratek advantage. It allows better system matching and lower noise.

Those are some highly rated linestages. Glad it is performing so well. I considered Modwright and Rogue before ordering a Supratek. I think 6SN7 tubes and avoiding circuit boards is a step in the right direction. 

Thanks for the review,

aldnorab 

Mick just sent me this link to his latest blog post, featuring the Grange with a picture of mine on top (Reimar's White Grange): enjoy the read from the pen of the man himself!

I am a happy new owner of a Cabernet 6SN7. I was a bit worried that I would have an issue with the noise floor or tube hiss on my 100db efficient Altec A7 since I had issues with a Border Patrol EXT, Modwright LS 36.5 and a Rogue RP 7. I can happily report that the Supratek is dead quiet at the speakers when no music is playing. The soundstage, imaging, vocals, percussion etc are the best I have heard in my system. Everything sounds very realistic. 

Congrats!  I have one here.   A very good circuit without doubt.  

Order is in to Mick for a powder coat Chardonnay. I paid extra for the domes. Gotta have the domes for that Supratek look. Appreciate all the patience and help from the people in this thread. Especially lately from @jslateiv ​​@jackd , and of course the thread starter @markusthenaimnut . 

Thanks everyone,

aldnorab 

@aldnorab 

No not at all like that and you can change the character of the Chardonnay quite a bit depending on the tubes you pick.  Another benefit is it's not as tube finicky as the first slot on the Sachs.  I've had multiple pairs of tubes that played fine in the Supratek's but not the Sachs.  If you made me choose just one not knowing what the future could hold in terms of amps it would likely be the Chardonnay.  Others may pick the other way.  

Thanks @jackd . If the Cabernet is even less warm and tubey than the Sachs, I might be better off with the Chardonnay. My system has a little bit of an electrostatic tonal balance. A little extra mid bass warmth and lower midrange presence would be nice. The Chardonnay isn't as syrupy as a '50s preamp is it? 

Thanks,

aldnorab 

@aldnorab 

The Chardonnay is a more "classic/romantic" tube sound while the Cabernet is more neutral to my ears.  Your Sachs, which I also still have sitting around, is somewhere in the middle but closer to the Cabernet.  Either of the Supratek's are easier to match with amps due to the gain adjustments as opposed to the Sachs' fixed 18db gain. 

@jslateiv thanks for the info. It was exactly what I was hoping for. Just have to decide between Chardonnay and Cabernet. 

Thanks,

aldnorab

The XLR in is transformer based so yes, it is a true balanced input converted by transformer to single-ended for the circuit.    The circuit itself (gain stages) are not balanced.   The output is transformer based as well and able to truly balance the signal or send out via single ended..

@jslateiv thanks. I can definitely work with that. One more question. Is the XLR input truly balanced or a "convenience" connection.

Thanks,

aldnorab

@gryphongryph    Contact Mick and get my contact info.  I'd like to discuss your issue a little more but feel like we should take the convo off line from this thread.

There is a 'mute' switch, yes.   but you have to engage/disengage it manually.  Not automatic at startup/shutdown.

Thanks jackd. Have a question about Chardonnay and Cabernet output. My solid state amps stay on all the time for better sound quality. Does Supratek mute the output during power up and down? 

Thanks,

aldnorab 

@tksteingraber 

Take a look at the Van Alstine SET 500 or the Kinki EX-M7.

@jslateiv the gain adjustment is only possible on the 300b something I wish Mick had informed me about before I decided to buy, buyers should be made adware of that I feel.

I am certain it is the switch that is the problem, but unfortunately I live in the North Atlantic Ocean with no real tube experience person to help me with this problem, really don’t want to send the pre back to Mick one more time.

it’s unfortunate as I feel only half of the amp works as intended, but I paid full price.

Anyway, the sound from the 6SN7 is great, even if I have to use 12db attenuators

to match better with my power amp.

@jackd my speakers are Goldenear Triton 2+, $3000 or less new or used

What speakers are you doing to be driving?  I own both a Cabernet and a Chardonnay and have used at least a half dozen different amps.  Also price limit if any?

Hey Supratekers…I have a Chardonnay being built by Mick and I was wondering if anyone can share what amps ($3000 or less new or used) that pair well.  I do have a Decware Torii Jr. on order for over a year that I will give a try but not sure that is a good pairing.  Any thoughts are appreciated.

The original dual was adjustable on both channels.  His current version 300/SN7 is adjustable on the 300b. SN7 is only main VC.    @Gryphongryph ,  does the gain adjust the sn7 output ?   Regardless,  if your losing a channel when you engage it,  something is up.   Possibly the switch.   If your in the US you can send to me if need be.  Contact Mick for my info.   Swap tubes side to side first though just to be sure.  

It was my understanding that if you have a Cabernet Dual you can only have adjustable gain on one of the two output tubes.  Either 6SN7 or 300B but not both. 

I guess I will start with the obvious question. Did you try swapping the position of the tubes? If so, does the fault follow the tube? Just wondering if one might be bad. Start with the 300Bs, then make sure all the others are properly seated. Plus the umbilical, then the interconnects. If none of that works then talk to Mick about having his Tech in the US work on it.

I had some problems with my Cabernet when I got it, problems with hum, it ended with the pre being sent back to Mick for fixing,

When I got my amp back the hum had disappeared but unfortunately while the 6SN7 was working great, the 300b output only works as long as I don’t use the gain control, as soon as I engage the gain control switch I lose the left channel, therefore I can not use the 300b output to my satisfaction.

Not sure if it is a quality issue in production or it is shipment damage, have open it up and taken pictures of the inside but I can not see anything loose soldering or otherwise or out of place.

I think it is a bit challenging to buy from a small company and having it shipped halfway across the world.

Yes

Do the Chardonnay automatically ship with one set of input & output XLR?

Thanks,

aldnorab

If you are struggling to get the centre image balanced may I suggest-

.Try swapping left for right speakers and right for left and see if the imbalance is still there.One speaker might be faulty.

.Swap the tubes left for right and right for left and see if that changes anything.That will indicate if there is a faulty/low output tube.

If all that tests OK then you might need to change the balance pot for a different value.Any technician could do that.

This is the reply I got from Mick today about my balance inquiry:

>>>

Reimar

Theres nothing wrong with the balance, as I said previously, its not a conventional balance control, it only has a very small amount of “shift” compared to a full cut balance control, which has a negative effect on sound quality.

I have a MC cartridge with uneven L R output and the balance control is all the way to one side to compensate , but it could still do with a little more. 

I’m cursed (?) with very precise imaging ears, I can hear the slightest amount off centre sound staging , which is why i built the balance that way, it gives me very fine control for getting an exact central image.

Mick

Michael Maloney

www.supratek.com.au

>>>

I am not talking about a >6dB shift: that would indeed indicate something is wrong with my setup. But my left ear is slowly deteriorating: I described this to Mick when I ordered the additional volume control for my Grange a year ago. What I got, does not work, as I cannot detect ANY balance shift at all, even with my ears directly at the speaker cones. I would probably show Mick some oscilloscope traces to get his sympathy. I have to conclude that either the balance knob is disconnected or that there is a faulty pot involved. On digital feeds I can use the DSP on my Mac w/o any sound degradation (the sound being not great to begin with), but with other sources, especially LPs I am stuck; and I don't want to put another box into the signal path.

Lastly: I had a functioning balance control on my previous preamp, and I could not detect any "negative effect on sound quality".

Any suggestions how to address my predicament? I was so looking forward to the Grange, but this really puts a dampener on my joy, as EVERY tune I play comes out with its center at 2 pm, no matter where the balance knob is pointing.

The balance shift is slight.  The control is not implemented in the traditional style where it is another shunt to grd. in addition to the Vol. pot.   Mick does this purposely because there is less degradation to the signal but the caveat is that there is less total shift to either side.  There is also the thought that if you need to shift the balance more than 6db or so left or right (for whatever reason) then something in the setup or associated gear is wrong and needs to be reevaluated.   Alot of pre’s completely omit a balance control these days. I think that is a mistake as there can easily be situations where a slight shift is needed, especially with tube gear.   As tubes age and get hours on them there gain can shift slightly (or more) over time and some balance shift may be required to recenter the image.  Hope this explanation helps clear any confusion.  

I was just questioning the exact same issue this week with my Chardonnay.  My balance knob has minimal effect of any kind on the sound between  speakers.  I considered texting Mick but now I understand it's a normal function from the designer.

The balance knob on Supratek pre’s only changes the balance in very small increments, according to Mick that is intentional.

Highlight your image then copy then paste to where you make post. 

Question to the forum participants. Is your balance knob working? And if so: do you hear a dramatic difference between all-the-way-right and ...-left? 

I am a Mac user: Macs do not assign URLs to private images. There must be another way. On FB, I just drag the image into the message window, but here this does not work.

Right click image click on copy image link and paste in image url

OK, can anyone help me with posting an image of my new GRANGE? I seem to be too dumb (if I click on the image icon, a dialog window opens asking for an URL).

remarc,

Congrats on your Grange.  With the white finish did you ge with the chrome? I bet that looks fantastic. 

thu

These are available at Grant fidelity. These are the ones you want

Hi @reimarc 

The reason I asked about the Linlai's is that these are supposed to be good tubes but the stock you received could have been different. There is a thread about these, the ones with the E are supposed to the best and the Linlai letters on the tube are running vertically.

There are some others the letters run horizontally and some have described these as different.

That's why I was trying to find out the ones that did not work for you which specific type were

@reimarc thanks for posting

Could you share a picture of the Linlai that came with the preamp?

For 45 try the EML 45B, I personally like it 

Well it finally came to pass, and I would like to share it with you, who contributed to this thread: my custom White Grange arrived in the first week of November, exactly a year after I had placed the order with Mick: good things will come to the one who waits! I had to completely rearrange my equipment and decided to build a new rack. I found a store room shelf assembly at Loews made of hard PVC for $145.00. I cut the "columns" to size, filled them with slow-setting concrete, and painted the entire assembly to create a unified look with the rest of my instruments. I prevented sagging of the shelves by supporting them with cross beams suspended on two threaded rods in the center: works like a charm with zero vibration anywhere. Moreover, the rack comes with ribbed shelves, which allow for superb air circulation.  I would love to show you pictures here but I don't know how to imbed them on this thread. So, I am showing them on my FB page (yes, I am THAT old), under "Reimar Bruening". Check it out.

In the beginning, I was taken aback by the very high gain of the phono stage. With the gain setting at around 10 o'clock and the volume at 9 o'clock, I got terrible noise on the left channel. Mick and another stateside customer, Johnny Slate, suggested a bad tube and to switch them one at a time from left to right. As it turned out, they were right: switching the 6688 (E180F) brought the noise to the right channel, and a few days later a new NOS set of tubes from eBay eliminated the noise altogether. However, while the sound began to bloom, I was missing the deep soundstage my previous set up had produced (Sunvalley SV-EQ1616 paired with Ed Shilling's "The Truth" optical preamp). After a three week burn-in, the sound stage improved somewhat but the placement of the instruments and the soloists was for lack of a better word "undecided", "wandering around the stage" depending on the temporary loudness of the respective source; moreover, I had to turn the balance knob all the way to the left to get a somewhat centered image: weird. I also noticed that this effect was more pronounced by the 6NS7 tubes and less so with the 300Bs (the Grange provides both options: the instrument was shipped with NOS 6SN7s by Australian brand Miniwatt, while the 300Bs are new Linlai from China). The 300Bs, however, are more powerful providing an overall "larger" musical experience, but still no precise instrument placement. Also, the timbre of the high octaves of a grand piano tends to be more "percussive" with the 300Bs (this is always a litmus test for me: Da Falla "Nights in the Gardens of Spain" with Rubinstein and the Phillies, RCA LSC3135). Well, that was disappointing. So I  began scouting for replacement tubes for the stock 6NS7s and found an intriguing pair on a Canadian site, Grant Fidelity, namely their custom-designed "Treasure Globes", made by Chinese maker Shuguang (

They arrived this morning and without any burn-in, they sound absolutely amazing. This is the sound which I associated in my dreams with the Grange, while waiting for an entire year for its arrival. The instruments are now firmly in place in a wide sound stage that extends about 3 feet on both sides of my speakers (Ellington Jazz Party In Stereo, Columbia CS 8127, original pressing) and their respective timbres are spot-on; moreover, the balance dial is now dead center. I try to keep this short; only so much: your SUPRATEKs might not perform to their fullest capabilities, if you use them with the stock 6SN7s or 300Bs. If you feel, there could be even more, or if something feels amiss of outright wrong, it's most likely time for tube-rolling. In my case, it became a revelation, and I can now see why other SUPRATEK fans swoon over their instruments. My next quest will be for the optimal 300Bs and 45s: stay tuned. But I am already completely sold with the "Treasure Globes".

@jslateiv Thanks for helping me understand the difference (or should I say no difference) between the two power supplies.