Crem1, Agreed except for your ideas on why the mono Beatles albums are collectible. In '67 all hippie aspirations were for stereo. The mono versions were likely passed over rather than ruined by bong water. Just can't imagine the beard in tie-dye saying "Hey, man, this MONO version of Lucy in the Skies will blow your mind..." What's more, this same fellow would probably have found an imaginative use for the Perfection Steamer quite different from steaming records.
Tish,tish Tvad ... Smoke ain't my thing. Dgarretson, I'm buying a tye-dyed T shirt tomorrow ... Have a great evening ... Smokey or otherwize ... Charlie
You guys are kidding right i mean April fools day was the 1st. I'm getting into my late 50s and can hear the difference that using the best water available for a double rinse of my lps. For now its Near lab grade water its some what expensive but for the time and effort i put into cleaning my vinyl its worth every dime.
Just kidding i now use Tiger water man it sends my vinyl like a 340 yard drive. This is a lie dont use this on your vinyl it may cause your eyes to get blood shot mon.
Tiger Water ??? Instead of puffing at the keyboard go to Aquafina web site www.aquafina.com . Read a tad , then go back to fondeling lead-laced power cords & corn-cob pipes. Don't forget taking the screen out of the bathroom false-set & lite up only the pollen brushed from the flowers(smooth'e) while I try to find a 2XX T Shirt to muck up.
Cought, Cought ... Hey ! Where did all this smoke come from ?? I need that Tiger Water ASAP ... Seriously visit Aquafina you might learn somethin' ... Let's all enjoy SILLY on our journey ... Charlie
PS Aquafina is 100x cleaner than EPA regs devoid of chemicals & minerals. Nothin' to muck-up your steamer , your LPS or health.
Ok, Ok I'm done ... Anybody for lunch ? Tabs on me.
Golly, What's happen ?? ... Have we reached a agreement (regardless of our personal views) that one's choice of water is ok ??? Go-Gamma, That's Good ... with me ....
I believe that's what's panning out on this thread are the ebb & flow of ideas to improve the listening experience. Of course , use any water source anyone wants. But as far as this fellow is concerned I see Stltrains point of view . We have no difference other than the water product we use and hold strong views that the water source can affect what can be gleamed from that tiny grove embeded on a LP. Without wishing to offend anyone , our choice of equipment may also play a roll. But, it is un-deny-able that Steam Cleaning creates a vastly superior musical experience in the world of analog.
I do not deny that I am an extreme'ist when the subject of Audio comes up. I design my own listening rooms, redesign air bearing turntables and other designs, I manufacture my own power cords & sometimes interconnects & even tear-down exotic speakers because of my belief I can vastly improve all these products . I even redesign isolation platforms & resonance blocking boxes. My designs are sucessful. Steam Cleaning has my personal marque : I'm gratified that so many others get more joy from their record collections. Pardon my passion. Its what I do ...
Please, please I deplore bowing , with exception of the cultures of Japan , China & S. Korea. All I wish for is that we be contributors , persons that care about fellow AG'ers. In my opinion, there can be no shame in helping & shairing ideas.Perhaps, that is not the same elesewhere. I try to make the moment count & keep on counting.
I acknowledge I am a audio extreme'ist. Its a fact, I visited Ft. Meyers repeatly just for the chance to sit in Thomas Edison's home & in his chair, in his Lab, to read under his actual 25W tungson lights & listen to his talking machines under the same conditions as He.Believe me, it was worth the effort to be in the shadow of the Great One. Today, I own a 1903 Edision in perfect condition thanks to expert Larry Summers who restored mine. I am comitted analog'er who appreciates digital as well.
"T", keep in mind the world of analog is reading. No bowing allowed. Most respectfully ...
No , Wax melts ... I own pre-1887 bees-wax 2 1/2 mimute cylinders. Each is well-over a century in age : The Libary Of Congress has a interest in those cylinders that I may bequith ... I own the rarest that I purchased for nothing 40 years ago. I only use Disc Doctor Fluids to preserve them. I am purchasing exact duplicateds of Edison's 1903 light bulbs so I can listen to them by tungston filment. Tungston creates the most involving light source I have ever experienced.The world is golden...Why limit your listening experience ...
i started steam cleaning then came across this article on positive feedback. should it be of concern? reproducing the relevant para, note the last line.
Record Chemistry
So while the choice of record inner sleeve profoundly affects the record surface, cleanliness and playback quality, the biggest barrier to maintaining a clean album and extending its useful pop and tick-free lifetime is the record chemistry itself. A primary static charge is created the moment the record surface separates from mold surface. Briefly, records are a complex chemical mixture including 85% polyvinyl chloride (PVC), 15% polyvinyl acetate (PVA), antistatic agents, dyes, stabilizers (heavy metals such as lead stearate), modifiers and lubricants. PVA, the exact chemistry of which varies among companies, both aids in the flow of vinyl during record pressing and as a plasticizer. Plasticizers play a critical role in softening the plastic/resin. Under normal conditions, stabilizers, of which there are enough to last for decades, act to consume HCl. (One fact that many those who want to steam clean their LPs seems to ignore, is that heat and UV degrade PVC; heat causes the release of HCl.)
I've steamed cleaned my lps for well over a year now, In that time at least 300+ records. Not only new to my collection also lps I had. My results are better sound and super quite playback from lps I cleaned with other methods that I had on hand. I've played these now steamed lps on more than one occasion with out any noticeable difference in playback.
Also in this time I have not heard or read any negative feedback results from this topic.
Though I do and will take all feedback on the subject with a grain of salt. Mike
Stevieboy: We are cleaning records of debris , removing gunk that inhibts the reproduction of sound. Using water hydrates vinyl. The compounds that make LPS are proprietory, no one knows the exact formula. Positive Feedback is a great Ez-ine. But keep in mind they publish transcripts submitted with no/little vetting. Should you have misgivings -- Quit steaming. Should your ears discern the difference , whom do you trust ? Your lie'en ears or someone elese ??
Tvad, a a Record cleaning fluid designer & I spent a day discussing LP compounds. She related that she interviewed nearly two dozen gentleman in Europe that designed and/or contributed to the formulations that make LP vinyl. Over hours of discussion, I learned that H20(water) was a "secret" to the mix of vinyl. Please read "Tracking Angle" a Ez-ine by Michael Fremer; An excellent article exists there to explain the composition of vinyl . Read it.
Whow -------- what a long thread!!!! can this be SO deep a subject?
I have done all sorts of 'hand washing' and later steam cleaning also (a bit), I then had a Nitty and it was just to compare results. Steam cleaning "might" have helped in some VERY heavy cases --- but it NEVER got rid of what I thought might still have been dirt in the groove, causing groove noise. The record was just shot, pitted grooves, maybe the steam cleaning did the rest. Old Mercuries come to mind, hard and brittle vinyl. The more you clean them the worse they get.
I later got a Hannl MERA, the Nitty (top of the rage model)gave me some problems, and then some.
I cleaned all my records over (uff, eventually). The ones from the Nitty days, having been done, some of them 5x or more, BUT not steam cleaned.
EVERY record done with the Hannl (I don't sell the stuff or get commission) was sounding just clearer, a bit more transparent. BUT, there are always some that do not improve the way you'd like. So, I tryed to steam clean those after the Hannl had done its bit 2x - 3x ---- no further improvement. Sorry to report: NO, zilch difference --- can't make a silk purse from a pigs ear, simple as that. AND may I say, I have truly tried my share of cleaning concoctions. I'm back with ~ 1/3 Isopropyl Alcohol, ONE drop of liquid soap, a few grains of pool chlorine (kills the algae in the waste container) and the rest distilled water.
Sure you heard the recipe 100 times in a thread THAT length.
Tvad, Do you own LPS? Do you actually Steam Clean LPS? Should the answer be no,fine, should your answer be yes than clean them & enjoy the playback experience.
Vinyl is nothing other than some doped PVC. It will 'take up some small amount of water in the 'rough' groove area. The MAIN contributor is detergent (liquid soap), which removes the surface tension and by this mechanism allows the absorption. I do know this from first hand experience when I used to do 'hand washing'. Also, it appears that some amount of Isopropyl alcohol ~ 25% helps to prevent this, it help with quicker drying after the cleaning. Also with a record cleaner you NEVER flood the surface for such an extended time as doing the cleaning by hand (my experience, I may be too slow...)
Having steam cleaned (and I have done quite a few LPs) everything is wet and has to drip off? Since I had a Nitty at the time I dried it with the Nitty, fine. Leave the stuff to dry on it's own is just no good --- that's like 3rd-world washing up :-) Cheers, Axel PS: Get a record cleaner, it is more noisy (maybe) but a lot less messy, nice sink you might use and all.
I should have added to my post above that I am making no claim or judgment about whether the rate of water absorption of PVC is significant, let alone beneficial. I am just remarking on an observed property of the material.
Without examining the ASTM specification and knowing more about the properties of vinyl, it's impossible for me to know much about its absorptive action, i.e. the rate of absorption. I can hazard a guess, however, that it's probably not constant over time. It may soak up the largest percentage of water in the first minutes of exposure.
Even if this is true, to what extent this hydration does or does not benefit the listening experience is unknown to me.
The primary point that Charlie was trying to make is that steaming is effective as a part of the cleaning process and experience has show us who have been steaming for a while has little or no impact on record quality. There are a lot of reasons why steaming is effective but as many have said, your ears will tell you whether it is effective in your case. Also, can steaming hurt your records, most definitely yes especially if you get the vinyl too hot. as for removing the various components in vinyl, I can not say whether it will or will not for certain, but a one or two steam application to clean a record in my experience has been a significant improvement in listening quality. Vinyl is a pretty tough material and as some of the older records we all have will testify, it can last for many decades without significant deteriotion.
I was off to buy a sealed chamber ... Glad I missed the Jaw, Jaw ...
As for a Psychiatrist, I know one that thinks nothing of dropping gads of green on audio toys but doesn't clean his LPS. You should hear what a 10k cartridge sounds like running over yesterdays potato chips.
For those of us that read, an excellent letter was published in Positive Feedback several years back by a fellow who had lots of credentials from thr U.of FL. According to his review a the lit. neither water or alcohol can harm vinyl unless subjected to hours of chemical dousing. Steam Cleaning done correctly is a brief event that makes a significant impact on dirty LPS , not one's already affected by owner abuse of manufacturing defects. After having Steam Cleaned for years my experience has been quite positive . But, that experience makes me awaire of how many records new & used are defective. When I buy them for pennies I could care-less but when I spend $30 & up I want perfection that is rarely there.
Had I understood water purity my 350a Hot Shot would be working but that's history.
As for Tvad he chose not to answer my questions regarding him actually being a Steam Cleaner. That failure to respond makes me suspect he is a fraud to the extent he just likes to flame-out on posters. Tvad may not even own a single piece of vinyl .... I'm toast. I only want to converse with REAL vinyl lovers. I'm out of here.
Hi, one last word on vinyl's water absorption. If you look with a microscope at / into a groove it is revelatory --- nowhere near as smooth as say the end-wax, right?
Using water on it will soften the vinyl, even a 1/3 Isopropyl mix will, but less so. It will in the process lift vinyl particles almost similar to the small flakes on you skin (top dermis). If you can feel over the groove area and it appears a bit rougher after cleaning, those are ever so slightly lifted vinyl flakes, they will bed down after playing, hopefully --- or get chipped out and leave more groove noise than before.
The other thing that makes me uncomfortable with steam cleaning is its very cleaning-action. I think that the cleaning is due to what's known as 'cavitation' in fluid technology, small bubbles of low pressure air, close to vacuum collapsing. On e.g. surfaces of metal, a ships or boat propeller, it will pit the metal after some time, and that so badly is must be replaced. I ask myself what this can do to a micro-groove after extended, repeated cleaning.
On e.g. surfaces of metal, a ships or boat propeller, it will pit the metal after some time, and that so badly is must be replaced.
The pitting of metal on boats is caused by electrolysis, not cavitation. Two completely different things. Cavitation is the overspinning of a prop because it is out of the water, or in bubbles. Electrolysis is the pitting caused by metals in the water picking up stray voltage around docks and marinas or from the boats electrical system. Neither would be a problem you would encounter while steam cleaning a record.
axel cavitation actually is the sudden vaporization of a fluid that is being pumped. It is due usually to the suction pressure of the liquid at the eye of the impeller being lower than the vapor pressure of the liquid being pumped. It is very true this action can be very destructive on the pump material. However, cavitation is not occurring on the record or groove. It is possible that the steam will suddenly evaporate some of the alcohol in your cleaning mix but i would not expect a similar violent action similar to cavitation. The primary action that steam promotes is the heating of the cleaning fluid which enhances its ability to dissolve or suspend material on the vinyl. As with many things, too much or too high of temperature can and will damage the vinyl. But used in a controlled manner is very effective at cleaning
As Crem1 knows, I recently joined this Steamer thread and tried, with enthusiasm, first a steamer from Walmart (it wasn't very good), then the recommended Living Solutions steamer from Walgreen's (though they are fast becoming scarce). I've been actively using it for the last week and carefully listening to the results. I wanted to post my impressions and, perhaps, even throw out some heretical opinions...
First, I will admit that as a vinyl devotee, I keep hoping I will discover some easy-to-perform routine that significantly reduces the errant noise we all tolerate as we listen to records. Noise is not a deal-breaker for me as it is for some who have abandoned analog for the silent Siren song of digital--digititis is much more objectionable to me. However, a desire to reduce its frequency is admirable, I believe.
I started with a VPI 16.5 RCM and a regimen of products that seemed to really help. I found an article years ago that recommended using Nitty Gritty's very volatile pre-cleaner (now re-released as "FIRSTrv") applied with a 100% cotton 2X2 stack of three pads as the first step, then a mixture of one's favorite record cleaner fluid mixed 80/20 with 99% pure isopropyl alcohol, manually applied and dried via the discontinued Orbitrac pads, then a final step of one's favorite record cleaner fluid and the VPI brush, vacuumed off with the RCM. The most impressive aspect of this routine was the FIRSTrv's ability to remove grime from pre-owned records that looked pretty good to the eye, but were shockingly dirty upon examining the cotton pads afterwards. So, I felt this recipe was pretty effective.
However, the errant pops persisted, even on brand new records, and almost always foreign debris stuck on the surface was determined to be the culprit. This discovery led me to hope that steam cleaning would be superior, perhaps heating and blasting away these stubborn bits of foreign matter (whatever they are composed of), so I dove in, first reading a LOT of this thread, then (with the kind help of Crem1) I obtained the Living Solutions steamer.
My tests are disheartening. No matter how many times I blasted the surface of a pop-infested LP with steam, and scrubbed it via Crem1's or Sltrains' techniques, these stubborn bits of foreign matter remained. The only way I can reliably remove these is first locating them by noting where the stylus is (approximately) when the pop occurs, then finding them with a magnifying glass and literally scraping them off with a fingernail (believe it or not, a fingernail does not seem to hurt the vinyl) if they are taller than the groove height, then re-cleaning with the original recipe described above. For me, then steam cleaning appears to bring no significant advantages to the table.
Here are the potentially heretical opinions: The disadvantages of steaming seem quite numerous. First, its is messy! Unlike some, I'm afraid of damaging the VPI RCM with repeated exposure to steam under pressure, so I used a separate broken turntable as the platform for steam cleaning. This meant taking the dripping wet record off and placing it on the RCM, then back again, then back to the RCM, all the while making everything really wet. What a pain. Then, I can't see a truly effective way of protecting the label completely from this assault--I tried rubber, saran wrap, plastic, and always water would creep around the label's edge. Drying this off is a pain and I wonder if it might lift or bubble some old, delicate labels. Based on my impression that I wasn't getting any real sonic benefit from steam cleaning, this seemed like another deal-breaker. Finally, I am a patient person, but I realized the steps involved in steaming were taking a lot longer than even my previous multiple-step recipe.
I will admit that the surface of the LPs I steamed cleaned looked shinier and cleaner than any method I have used, but I could not hear any significant difference in the way they sounded (and I believe I have a fairly high-resolution playback system). Worse, the pops caused by foreign matter on the record's surface remained as frequently as with other methods.
So, I've decided to give up steam cleaning records. For me, it's simply not worth the risks to the LP or the time it takes.
Before I close, I wanted to throw out one more potentially heretical statement. I've read on this and other threads that one must take steps to remove the "mold release" compounds from new records before playing them. Steaming supposedly does this, as does the FIRSTrv pre-cleaner I use. Others, including someone who even worked at an LP pressing plant, says the mold release compounds are a myth. In any event, after my steam cleaning disappointments, I decided to try a different technique on brand-new records--doing nothing! Well, I did use a carbon-fiber brush before lowering the stylus, but that's it. My initial impression so far is that this might be the best technique yet: certainly less static, the vinyl seems very quiet, and the subconscious fear i've alway had of grinding something into the grooves of a brand-new record with my previous cleaning regimen are gone.
Am I crazy? Have any other readers here tried this and compared the results to cleaning a new record before it is ever played? It sure is a simpler approach! Of course, I will always clean used records, but with brand new ones, I may now skip the cleaning ritual.
Kipdent using my 16.5 for the time i've been steaming there has been no visual or mechanical errors noted to the unit. I do line the inside that takes the steam blast with paper towels.
When i started steaming i was using padded brushes. The difference in playback when i switched to VPIs 17f brushes was much quieter vinyl. I picked up some older blues lps not long ago and used my steaming method on them these lps were moldy, dirty and just in bad shape. Now playback of these lps is nothing short of amazing.
I'm not sure but maybe you might be missing some of the grooves or possibly not having the steam spray close enough while scrubbing with your brush to get all of the grunge out. In any case if steaming is not for you good luck in your new methods.
Best of luck with your vinyl and enjoy the music. Mike
Should you fail to appreciate record steaming , thats ok. You try once , you screw up & expect instant gradification, what a group. You have a right to expect clicks & pops and I strongly recommend you spend 2K-10K for a record cleaning machine. It might help. But, who knows the results you will enjoy from the expense. Because your collection maybe fraught with prior owner abuse or manufacturing problems. Just because that dosen't go away, don't blame anyone but your self. The alternative, give your vinyl away. We thank you. I buy many "rejects" for nothing only to enjoy sonic benefits far beyond what others believed possible. As for the frauds your future is imbeded with the fact , you are just that frauds.
Hi Kipdent what your are telling is practically a 1 for 1 story I could relate (Just not in the very lucid and detailed description of yours)
You mention 'stubborn' particles causing pops or ticks. For the ones raised above the groove surface I found also no other method than by using a finger nail (as gently as possible). I use a Hannl MERA, which does a very good job but it can not always get rid of those.
As far as cavitation and the steam cleaning goes, I really do not want to start some scientific 'side thread' on this. As an ex-wind surfer and water sports person I am very familiar with this phenomena -- check under spin-out... My point, steam is expanded water i.e. of lesser density, it is the same as in water, when due to high surface speeds water under suction (close to vacuum) creates a 'steam bubble'. Water CAN boil at room temperature if you simply lower the pressure, the same principal used in the 'steam cleaner'. It is the sudden collapse / contraction of these tiny steam/vacuum bubbles that affect the surface they are imploding on. It lifts off particles in the extremely fast and millions of times over and over repeated process of bubble implosions. This is the steam cleaners action, not high temperature (its actually pretty cool) or jet pressure or what ever.
There you have it, now go argue some more. Steam cleaning works, no doubt, but I have my reservations about it, and it is very messy. Not my idea of efficient record cleaning.
A last point for Kipdent and the 'irremovable' tick (it is seldom a pop). If it is a POP, you find 9/10 some VERY HEAVY VTF cart stylus was dropped from some height, creating a usually round indent, effecting 2 - 3 grooves. Can't do a thing here i.e. irreparable damage. Next, the small ticks and also more continuous crackle or groove noise. I had some of these, and then some. More often, if not all, are pretty hard vinyl of some vintage. 'Mercuries' and 'Turnabout' come to mind again. The more you clean, the worse they sound. It is my contention that these are simply signs of groove disintegration / break-up, the groove is 'chipped out' and gets more chipped out by repeated cleaning efforts --- steam cleaning should truly give them the rest and clean them beyond listening.
Crem1 I can see your fear-factor in spending money on some dud cleaner. I did, but look at the price of the most expensive Nitty, please!? Nowhere near 2k, nowhere near...
There are different quality products out there, yes --- like with every thing else i.e. "you get what you pay for".
I had to learn this over and over, so I got the best (well 2nd most best) and it works best. It's what the Japanese once called the Rolls-Royce of cleaners. This costs still not more than 2k, just to get our numbers straight.
Gee, I'm sorry if I offended anyone with my review, or at least Crem1. I thought I went out of my way to be fair and just describe my experiences in a detailed and polite way. I'm not sure what I said that warranted the response you posted, Crem1, but I'm sorry if I upset you. I've thanked you repeatedly for helping me and going out of your way to obtain the steamer for me--I was just relating personal experiences, that's all.
We've already had a previous thread on steaming removed because of negativity and personal attacks. For now steaming lps works better than all else i've tried cleaning my lps. If something better comes along i will check it out. You cant get better if you sit on your butt and believe you have the holy grail.
There is a difference in like and dislike and thats normal. Whats a good thing for one is not so good for another. As Kipdent and Tvad replayed above steaming is not for them. Thats the reason i love this Country and our way of life. We are not stuck with one way of doing something, brands, or politics because we have the freedom to do as we please.
Hi Mike, >>> I believe an apology it owed to this thread. <<<
About what? Not steam cleaning and having come to the conclusion a RCM is ones preferred method? I don't get your apology idea. But it's also fine to have all steam-cleaners only on the thread keep telling each other how marvellous it all works. Can't see you gonna get another hyper-thread like this one again. I think the length is at least some sign of not only interest, but a degree of descent about the method too, or? Axel PS: If this is only about self congratulations, it seems little value added, at least to me.
Kip: Let's put this all in context. Your first sream cleaning experience was negative , mainly because you were not using that instant water boiler correctly. That one was returned to Home Depot. On the second unit I went out of my way spending my own money to assist you with the second steamer, a "Living Solution" that comes with a 2 year no hassel return policy; so why not return it?
Kip: FYI, PayPal has not yet forwarded any record of payment to me. So I maybe out the $51 bucks.
Over-All, what's of concern are your public remarks vs private comments I will outline below. Its vexing. You use the steamer once or twice , in a who knows who manner, declaring it worthless. This is the second time that has happened. Yet, in face to face "shoot-outs" with RCM's with noted designers personally on-hand, even they acknowledge the power of Steam Cleaning.
Kip, I believe the problem isn't with the steamer its either the vinyl is damaged , or the turntable is not properly set-up causing mis-tracking, an easy thing to do. Apparently, the grunge on one LP was so bad that even after steaming it took a nuge from your fingernail to dislodge it ... Now,that's real grunge.
For those that are RCM users, I have always said RCMS have a place in steam cleaning. A vacuum machine like a VPI 16.5 is excellent to pair/combo with steam.
Kip,perhaps, I misread your email noting that steaming was an improvement. Whats up? First you likey and then you don't? I have a suggestion-before making any claims steam several hundred LPS to get a feel for the vast number with manufacturing defects and prior owner abuse issues.
As I have mentioned in public & privately, near 50% of the LPS I formerly purchased were defective. I have greatly improved that take-home number by careful review using hi-rez reading glasses & angeling over-head lighting. Fifteen years ago that number was even higher, until I started to learn how to kull out the herd. And thats' about the time I started my search to find a better way to clean LPS that I now do via Steam.
Recently, I opined that several LP collections , totalling several thousands of LPS were given to me. So far, I have disposed of near 70%(to goodwill) because of defects , keeping only the creme for crem1. The only exception were those LPS from the 1950-60's so rare they are worth bucks in vg condition.
Kip, without experience how do you tell whats defective and whats not ? That's what comittment to vinyl is all about. CD's are EASY, LPS are difficult.
As for the payment problem, should PayPal not confirm your payment in a week I suspect I will never see it thru PayPal. If that is the case please put a trace on your account before sending me a personal check. I suspect that PayPal will return your payment to you ASAP being unable to find me. Not your problem theirs.
Kip, I certantly don't think that you aren't steaming , I do question your comittment to vinyl. Do yourself a favor, return to the second steamer to your local Walgreens for a refund. Kip buy CDS , your audio-life will greatly improve.You can always shed the analog front end on AG. All the best. Charlie
Stltrains & I stand that some of the remarks posted are out-of-line. Apology or not, it shows a lack of self-respect . Following years of responding truthfully to posts, I'm learning the differences ... If you want to stop for a vist please do so, this Thread is one of the the most popular on AG.
Just don't act like a punk (Ol'English prison slang). That does no good for the health of the Thread.
Axelwahl i should not have made that statement. What you mention above as a reason is not where i was going with what i said. It was meant for Crem and his harsh reply to Kipdent. And in truth its not my business and my apologies to you Crem.
I dont have a problem with my method of cleaning lps. My vinyl cleaned this way compared to all other methods i've used in this new age of vinyl playback is what drives me to proclaim the advantages of steaming vinyl records.
Of all of the posts here there have been some who would rather use other methods to get the best playback and i say great. We would not improve if descent and negative response were not included in a topic of doing something, like steam cleaning vinyl.
Like i said if steaming is not for you great i'm happy if you are.
dont sweat the small stuff and enjoy your music Mike
Stltrains--thank you for the clarification! I was scratching my head until your last post, especially since I had already apologized to Crem1 after reading his reaction! I agree to each his own about the best way to clean records, and I thank everyone for the learning experience this thread has afforded me. I listen almost exclusively to vinyl as I can barely tolerate digital formats, and I just was trying to share my personal experiences with this technique--that's all.
By the way, does anyone want to pipe in about my question regarding NOT cleaning new vinyl at all as a choice to minimize noise? Any opinions or experiences?
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