what does Asthetix do to addresse Jitter in the Romulas? |
I don't know, but it seems to work pretty well. If one could find any fault with this player/dac, I could say it is a tad dark. The Signature mods help address this somewhat however. I think a Sistrum Apprentice stand will also help and I have one on the way soon. |
Try changing tubes if a bit dark. I am very well pleased with the 'profile' of sonics. A bit less dark and tubby now with a bit of sparkle on top. Just right for my system now with different tubes. |
What tubes did you decide on for more of this air and sparkle? Thanks |
Thats a good question about the tubes to roll to in the Romulus,However, I do not understand why people buy a tube product and attempt to get this so called none tuby sound, why not buy a solid state player?, If I buy a tube product, It better sound like one!, If it does not, It will be gone!, I already went the route of a tube product that had over resolving powers, did not sound like a tube product at all, needless to say, see ya!, that's what happened to that player, LOL!, I believe that the old adage of solid state tring to sound like tubes, and tubes tring to sound like solid state is sinceless!, tubes should sound like tubes, solid state should sound like solid state! |
Better tubes sound more like tubes:) more air, 3d stage etc.... |
Yup, really great toobs never hurt anything, except maybe the pocketbook. 8^) |
An update;
guys, this is the one to beat (no pun). I did get some time w/ this player and feel that it is better than the ARC CD9.
Associated gear- Aesthetix Calypso signature pre-amp/ Atlas power amp on Vandy Treo and Quattro speakers.
Silent Source and Signal Cable(s). |
Jafant, which model did you get time with, the signature model, or the standard model Romulas? |
Well the Romulus has had time for the upgraded Signature parts to burn in. The Vishay TX2575 Z Foil resistors, Dynamicaps, and the stellar Jupiter Copper foil caps. The music is even more engaging and inviting.
Anyone with the standard unit would be well served to make these upgrades if they are handy or have a tech who will do it for a reasonable cost. The parts I used are listed here;
4 Jupiter copper foil .22uf caps
8 Dynamicaps 4uf
4 Vishay TX 2575 Z Foil resistors 36 ohm .... These are special order direct from Texas Instruments. All 4 cost $60 shipped and took a week.
Last thing I will do is place a Star Sound Sistrum Apprentice rack under the player. I get it Monday! |
Grannyring,
Unfortunately, your "Signature" upgrade doesn't allow you to hear how good a Signature Romulus/Pandora sounds with DSD files.
BTW, a Romulus/Pandora with the VC needs more than just the .22uf coupling caps. |
I don't use a computer and DSD is not important to me at all. Yes, the 12
caps and 4 resistors do make a significant improvement over stock.
Suggest this be done to stock players for better music!
I would never go without a great preamp so the volume would be a waste
for me and many others. I have tried direct and passives so many times
and they never matched the full scale authority, body, richness of tone, and
meatiness of my tubed preamp.
I will report back after the Sistrum stand as I know from experience it will
bring more musicality to the Romulus.
|
"I would never go without a great preamp so the volume would be a waste."
Since your Romulus doesn't have a VC, how do you know?
I don't care what preamp you're using, less is more. |
Kana, we disagree on this. No problem as we all have different tastes.
BTW the Signature version does not have to come with volume. One can have a Sig version with no VC. One can send a non VC unit in and have the Sig upgrade done.
I have owned many top end players with built in volume and no go in the end. More simple, as you say, does not automatically equal better sound. I suppose your reasoning would make an integrated amp, or better yet a receiver with dac the top of the audio chain:-) |
Grannyring, You know I am a fan of the Romulas, maybe you have not found the best direct to amp set-up yet, look at Mattnshilp's thread, The absolute best for top tier redbook dac, you will see Guidocorona sold the Top model Roland pre-amp to use the Roland Aeris dac with Volume control to use straight to his amp, I wonder why he did that?, I understand what may work for him may not work for you, Guidocorna may be on to something. |
Kana813, Do you have a signature Romulas with volume control running direct to a amp? |
I have owned the best direct and tried it many, many, many times.....it will
never do for me. I must have a top flight TUBE preamp or too much is lost
IMHO.
I am reading that DAC thread. I see G sold his top flight SS pre and that is
good for him. He likes a certain type of sound that may well be different
than my preferences. I don't like Class D amps and he seems fond of them.
I would see why he likes going preless. |
When will people come the realization that we all hear differently and have different taste.This topic comes up over and over again the source to amplifier versus the insertion of a preamplifier.
There will always be differences of opinions because we all hear differently .In my opinion a first rate tube preamp is an absolute mandatory necessity other people simply don't feel that way. So be it. |
So many variables and it comes down to personal preference; I tried going pre-less but preferred the full sound my tube pre provided. |
Wig, great system! Love the look of your speakers. |
Bill,
I know you've tried the Lightspeed as well as other passive units.I recall a couple of years ago you preferred the April Music DAC direct source to amplifier over the TRL DUDE in your system. No one can say you didn't try your best to get rid of the active preamp. After all of that the active tube preamp is back. Without the full true tone and dynamics the music ultimately sounds incomplete, just listen to live acoustic instruments(color,body,harmonic richness, i.e. life and emotion).Bill I give you credit, you sure did try your best to abolish your preamp.
Charles, |
What's interesting Charles is I thought I liked the DP1 DAC direct more than going through my Dude preamp and made the worst audio decision of my life. I learned that sounding different (change) can often be appealing at first - for a time.
After a couple of months I missed the music and longed for my Dude. I had to go through the time and expense of buying another Dude. Once the Dude was in, the music was alive again. I think change can fool folks as it fooled me for a season. |
I respect what all of you are saying about running direct or not, useing an active pre-amp, I will say, their is rare instances that a componet running direct to an amp is better than an active pre-amp, and on the most part all of you are correct, and should trust your own ears, one rare componet long ago that sounded better running direct to amps versus a seperate active pre-amp was the Krell KPS-25sc, at the time of the technolgy, the Krell Kps-25sc was it, looking for a componet that can run direct to amps with success over a seperate active pre-amp is like looking for a needle in a hay stack, However, It can be done, cheers gentleman. |
Audiolabyrinth,
You simply have to go down the path that works best for you. I have no interest in telling others what's right for them, none.I just relate my listening experiences and the outcome observed. Premium active (tubes for me in particular) preamplifiers present more naturalness, truth and realism and I must have that vital contribution.
Charles, |
Ok you Aphiles. The Star Sound Apprentice 103 stand with 1.5 inch cones is just simply delicious under the Romulus. Hard to believe a simple stand/footer could make such a sweet improvement in my music.
Less electronic or reproduced sounding music.....notes float in a space as if the speakers were not there at all. Music has a delicious richness and tone that is more intoxicating. Precise imaging with a noticeable absence of haze, smearing and noise you never thought was there.
Ya, I like the stand a lot :-) |
It's nice to read that Grannyring is enjoying his modified
Romulus, but it's not IMO, a true indication of the Romulus Signature product's performance.
First,the his digital card hasn't been changed,next the
Signature upgrade includes HRS Nimbus Couplers(no need for add on cones)and finally,he hasn't heard the VC option running direct.
If you're interested in this product, find a dealer that can demo a true Signature Romulus for you. |
@ Kana813, Do you have a signature Romulas running direct to amplification? |
Kana you need to back down man. You have no idea how the units differ as you have not heard mine. Is it possible the Star Sound rack is better sounding than the HRS? Is it possible the Jupiter caps are better sounding than the Dynamicaps? They are. Is it possible the 70 pound tube regulated Dude is better sounding than the 4x4 inch circuit board card that is the VC in the Romulus Signature? Oh my it most certainly is possible.
Is it possible one's complete system and room are tuned to get more out of a given player? You bet it is.
Do some not want to deal with a computer as a front end transport? Many do not.
Is it possible that my unit is 90 plus percent of the full Signature? Certainly.
You make the stock unit sound like a distant relative. For $7000 it better not be.
My guess is you're not an experienced modifier and don't know the kinds of gains that are possible with effort and experience. I have both.
Not sure what your motivation is, but you seem to be narrow minded and rather myopic on this topic.
I like the Aesthetix company and Glenn has been helpful as we talked through these upgrades. Is there more I can do? Why yes and that will come in the future.
No unit or brand of DAC is so fully baked that careful upgrades couldn't yield additional sonic improvements.
I don't have a Signature model, no I have a unique hybrid unit placed in a well tuned complete system that you have never heard. Stand down Kana.
No absolutes in this hobby. None. Impossible to know what a given unit sounds like in the context of a complete system. I pointed out just a few of the variations above. The totality of my Romulus, in my system vs. a Signature in another system with no Dude, no Apprentice rack, no mods is impossible for you to judge. |
Grannyring +1, "no absolutes in this hobby" profound in its brevity and honesty. Configuring an audio system is a mixture of knowledge, direct experince and art.
Charles, |
Grannyring,
You're a funny guy.
My point is very simple, you don't have a Signature Romulus, and have never heard one.
Your guess about modding is wrong,
Wow, you have a 70 pound preamp, does that make it better than a 40 pound preamp?
Problem here is that your ego makes you think you've done something that others want to copy. |
Kana I give up with as you just like to argue. This site has a few like you and I took the bait. Too bad. Enjoy your system and I will mine. I am sure we both have more important priorities. |
Those interested in a world class stand/footers for you gear, these Apprentice stands are an excellent choice. I will order a couple more for my preamp and amps. The whole topic of mechanical grounding is most interesting and these stands incorporate state of the art wisdom in their design and materials choice. |
I owned the Aesthetix Callisto Signature and Io non signature for 5+ years. The Signature update is not that big of a deal when it comes to parts updates. Caps updated to DynamicapsÂ….big deal! They were fine a decade ago but nothing special now. For a "Signature" product to use these as the top capacitor is questionable. And a handful of resistors in "ideal" locationsÂ….again, big deal. And the price markup for the parts "updates" is crazy.
The major improvement is to 86 all the Sovteks in these units and play a combination of Tele, Mullard and RCA. A non-sig unit with rolled tubes will easily destroy a signature unit with stock tubes. I suspect the same is for the Aesthetix digital gear.
It is very easy for Grannyring to spend a fraction of the Signature update and put in the same parts and achieve the same. I did this with the Io. In in fact, for the same cost, it is very easy to DIY to take the non-sig product beyond the Signature.
Having to "hear" an authentic Signature model to get the true Aesthetix magic is ridiculous. |
I understand Kana813's point in this sense, technically Grannyring's modified Romulus isn't "identical" to the official Signature edition. Having acknowledged this point it's surely possible that Grannyring's version could be the better sounding unit. A majority of listeners might prefer the Jupiter copper foil caps to the Signature's Dynamicap option.A very good preamp may out perform the VC sound card option.
Charles, |
And the biggest point is I like it:-)
The standard and Signature have the very same power supply which is sooo important and greatly adds to the magic of this player. Outstanding power supply. Same case work and shielding. Now my analog board is the same or actually better IMHO because of the new Jupiter caps.
I don't have DSD and the Sig does. But my CD collection, and I only listen to CD's now, is mostly redbook. On those redbook disc's I certainly have heard the Signature.
I do not have a full Signature and never said I did. All I ever said is I like it and I did some mods approaching the Sig for little money and it was fun. When and if I want DSD I will ask for that board. Aesthetix may or may not let me put it in, but I will at least ask.
I have owned their preamps in the past as well as the Altas hybrid amp. I liked all of these pieces and think the designs are very, very good.
I imagine Aesthetix knows many owners of their gear prefer using one of their actives to the sound card in the Romulus. They do make several very expensive and well regarded actives as we know. |
I forgot to mention. To owners of the Romulus or Pandora dac, tube rolling also yields nice results. I replaced the stock tubes with some nice NOS types with great results. Sylvania Gold Label and some EI NOS tubes. More air and illuminated top end were the biggest gains.
I decided on the 5751 12ax7 varient with the Sylanvia Gold label. Slightly lower gain, but that is a good thing for my system. |
Had the stock Pandora without VC with ARC Ref 5 SE, rolled in some RCA and Amperex (Glen recommended Vintage Tube supply) and also have some Russian Rockets. Very pleased w sound..neutral, relaxed, big deep image. ran that two years and had factory do SIG upgrade. The SIG gets you the caps and resistors which some are focused on. But reality is both the Analog and Digital boards are new. FPGA should help future proof it a bit..ha. roll in HRS feet and I feel the upgrade represents great value..at least in my system and to my ears. The SIG does take a good bit to break in..like 300 hours...my buck fifty which is $.02 adjusted for inflation... |
Thanks! for sharing- Tomic601-
the ARC Ref5 SE may very well be the finest tubed pre-amp in the market place at this time. It is also good to learn that it mates well w/ Aesthetix. Anyone else like the Romulus spinner w/ ARC gear?
Happy Listening! |
I had the Romulus Signature and liked it very much. I however like the sound better when I use the PS Audio Transport to it. The difference being night and day. I sold the Romulus and bought a Pandora DAC since I wasn't using the cd player. I then upgraded the signature to eclipse. Oh my gosh a totally different player now. Much more detail, refinement. I think this is worth the upgrade. The Stealth caps need at least 400 hours. If anyone is interested in using a PS Audio transport I can recommend a digital cable that is fabulous with it. |
Granny,
You still play around with those small signal tubes? It's all about DHTs and big bottles for me now. LoL
Stay far away from you old haunts as you may get hooked on Level 7 and have to dig into your pocket. Hahah
You really are missing out on DSD and DSD2x an upconversion to even higher rates, but I know you hate Computers.
Anyway, enjoy the CD collection. If it aint broke... |
Wison,
Bill (Grannyring) sold his Romulus and is currently using the Japanese Yamamoto DAC and PS Audio transport(PWT).
Charles, |
Nooooo!
Granny is yet to find some rest.
thanks for the info Charles. |
Thanks Winson. Yes I moved from the Lampi which was bested by the Romulus to the Yamamto that will stay. I like the Yamamoto more than any $10,000 dac I have heard including the mighty Lampi family.
The Yamamto is a very simple and special dac. No need to compare to other players as it just pleases. Makes one not care about this or that Aphile attribute or those big $$ dacs. |
Sorry about the typos....Yamamoto. Those other dacs I owned certainly did some Aphile tricks better, but none could quite match the simple musical pleasure of the Yamamoto. The Romulus was very musical and perhaps if I mated it with the Perfect Wave transport I would still have it. The Perfect Wave transport is magic with the Yamamoto dac.
The Yamamoto dac may also be a better match with my DHT SET amp and sound. It seems to be cut from the same sonic cloth as a great DHT amp. |
Bill,
There is actually a lot of logic in your statement concerning the Yamamoto DAC when you factor in the man behind it. Shigeki Yamamoto made/earned his reputation via his SET amplifiers and analog cartridges over a 20 year period(primarily in the Japanese market). He was determined to apply this experience and audio aesthetic and perspective to his DAC(he certainly succeeded ). Utterly organic, it just sounds right reproducing music as you have noted and I agree with you.
Charles, |
Charles1dad, hi, did you find enough interest in the Yamamoto DAC to buy one for your self?, also, is their more than one model?, thank you. |
Charles and Bill,
I am happy for both of you. I have having extreme purity and musicality from my Big7 and can trnsform the presentation by rolling DHTs in combination with therectifiers.
I am currently running a JAN 5r4gy with a new pair of EML45 - mesh plate pair I received yesterday. It stokes me that I have pairs of 45 globes from 1919 that I can use to get incredible midrange musicality and rectis like the Phillips metal base GZ34 that gives a tight minty fresh flavour. Most of these old tubbes cost me less that $20 a piece from a vintage seller in my area.
Nothing like big bottle DHTs...especially for chipless DSD. |
Wisnon,
I have no doubt that the Big 7 DAC sounds fantastic. I use a DHT(101D)Line Stage and a 300b SET amplifier. DHT tubes when implemented properly just seem to be able to reproduce music in a most natural manner.The Yamamoto some how, someway has a very similar music making character. There truly are many roads that lead to Rome. The synergy aspect of putting together a system can't be overstated.
Charles, |
I've owned my Yamamoto DAC since Feb 2010 and plan to keep it for a very long time. There are two versions, transistor and tube. Bill and I have the SS model. I haven't heard the tube DAC. 6 Moons did a review of both and found the same family signature with "subtle" differences. They said if you like one, you'll like the other. The retailer who I bought from felt the same for what it's worth.
I trusted his opinion and got the SS version as it was 500.00 USD less. I generally much prefer tubes but in this case I made an exception. I have no regrets, as Bill said the DAC sonically mates with the DHT presentation quite well.Ultra simple circuit,minimal filtering, no Op amps or NFB are probably major factors to the natural sound it has. |
Many roads leading to Rome. i agree! |
