PS Direct Stream Vs. Lumin X 1 Sound quality difference?
Thanks for helping me out. Much obliged. It’s fun figuring it out but it’s great to have help along the way. On the way.DC Cable from Lumin Power to X1 DC CablesEtherREGEN Will use good power cord into the After dark PSU. Still on the list to sort..
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Ozzy, T H A N K. Y O U! So far got the EtherREGEN in place. I couldn’t suss out much of a difference. Some? Still waiting on PSU and Clock upgrade. But the power cord from Lumin PSU into the X1 lit it up (with an unburned in cord) ! Dang if this is fun. I’m thrilled. |
Ozzy It’s hard to put it into the vernacular (not to mention that’s it so system/room dependent) but the optical cable is tighter with less air than hooking up with ether net. It’s a different sound. From the EtherREGEN instructions “The optical should be alone on one side (the A) of the moat, users who connect an optical endpoint should avoid connecting any other devices to the other ‘A’-side ports (the four RJ45 copper ports)” Obliviously the line in must go on the “B” side thus using up the EtherREGEN’s ports. I also have a Roon nucleus and a Lumin music drive.....now they must go to another either net switch and that can't be where the system is. With out the optical, then it's all in the same place (making use of the power conditioner too). Is Optical worth it? Would splitting the feed line into the EtherREGEN dilute performance? |
wsrrsw, I’m not sure I fully understand. I don’t care about side A or side B on the EtherRegen. The only side where the fiber cable goes out on the EtherRegen is what I route to the Lumin X1. The other side is used for the Cat 5 cable input from the modem. I use cat 5 because it has less metal than the cat 7-8 versions. I am using the Lumin app. This configuration produced a much fuller, expanded soundstage than when using a cat cable to the Lumin. The sound is very enjoyable at least with my system. If you are not doing this you are missing out on the sound quality potential of the Lumin. IMHO that is... ozzy |
I have experimented with both fiber optic as well as Cat 5 and 6 to my Lumin X1 both with and without the EtherRegen. Other equipment pieces have come in during this time. I do think there are perceived sound signature differences I noticed with various RJ45 cables--inexpensive generic RJ45, Ghent JSSG360, Sablon 2020, and Audio Sensibility OCC Silver Signature cables. For fiber optic, I have only used the SFP's and cable recommended by Chris Connaker to me on his Audiophile Style forum. I have read there are differences in sound with different transceivers, but have been very happy with ones recommended and have not tested others. I am back to fiber optic with the X1. Sound quality is excellent and the fiber optic setup is relatively inexpensive. It is also hugely convenient should you want or need to position switch further from the X1 due to low cost of the cable for length compared to higher end RJ45 cable. I have repurposed my RJ45 cables for connections to my server and to an additional DACs and for upcoming change to separate modem, router, and end point in office area. I really think the fiber optic option to the X1 was a great decision by Lumin. |
ozzy, The EtherRegen is currently out of the chain of equipment. It worked very well for me when I was using a Small Green Computer i5 CDR server. Early this year I added a PF Buffalo switch and Sean Jacobs power supply for it. In May I added an Antipodes K50. Later, I picked up a preowned Makua with newly added DAC module. The Antipodes, similar to the Lumin X1, improved considerably as I accumulated playing hours. All the additions required changes in equipment placement in racks, which also made for need of longer ethernet cable to reach the K50 than the Sablon cables I had. I picked up the Audio Sensibility cable not only for length, but to also see how it would pair with the K50. Soon after, I added another shorter AS cable. My experiences with Audio Sensibility on their top line silver products has been very good detail, not bright, but leaner in overall presentation. The Sablon 2020 cables for me have been fuller--seemingly sweeter in upper midrange and lower bass while AS seems more individual separation and more distinct in upper bass/lower midrange. I tried to experiment with both AS and Sablon with the EtherRegen after the PF Buffalo into the K50, and then using K50 Direct Stream output ethernet port to the Lumin and later to the Makua DAC (Tambaqui type). Unfortunately, I could not get either of the AS cables to work on "A" side of the EtherRegen, but either of them did work with "B" side. I spoke with Steve at AS on this. I suspected, and he confirmed, this cable, as currently offered is shielded and grounded on both ends. He also views this cable optimized for 100Mbps audio, rather than higher speed video. He was a class act and offered to work out something for me, even though my purchases were past trial period. I elected to retain both of them. As an aside, I did not have any issue into or out of the K50 with the AS cable nor into the Lumin X1 with the AS cables, only the A side of ER. I ended up then trying both Sablon cables with the ER and also Sablon into A and AS out from B of the ER. I did not put ER in front of the PF Buffalo. I have 300Mbps service to the house, and I did not want to restrict speed to video from the PF Buffalo, which would have been reduced to 100Mbps with the ER in front. The results were good, but still left me wanting more. Vocals did not seem right to me and overall sound quality fuller and warmer than I was seeking. I then tested taking the ER completely out of the chain and running long AS cable from the PF Buffalo to the K50 and Sablon out from the K50 DS port to the Makua. Bingo! Vocals are what I wanted and overall presentation is better balanced for me. It also appears to me that the ethernet cable into the K50 as well as the ER to K50 has an impact on presentation for the digital outputs of the K50 to DAC--have used USB and AES/EBU to the Makua. Presentation to me is different on these outputs depending on the input cable, comparing cable that shipped with K50 and the longer AS cable--a bit of a head scratcher for me. I do listen via AES/EBU, USB, and via ethernet from the Makua. Using AES/EBU and USB, I am using K50 player/renderer while with network ethernet connection, I use the Roon Ready player of the Makua DAC. I also rotate listening with the Lumin X1. Both the Makua DAC and the Lumin X1 are excellent for me, but also present a bit differently. I really like both and at this point, intend to keep both. As for the EtherRegen, I'm not sure what I will do. I read of folks adding separate clocks and power supplies and cables for add-on clocks to the ER with pleasing results. It just looked like another rabbit hole for me and I elected not to pursue. As I indicated earlier, the ER was very much a positive for me with earlier equipment and configuration. For now, I am in a happy space without it in the chain. The PF Buffalo with SJ power supply is very good and I think the continual evolution of the K50 has also played a part on all this. I also powered the ER from a 3rd rail of the Sean Jacobs. |
The EtherRegen was a waste of money for me. I heard no change in the sound. However, going from a Sonore mircoRendu to the OpticalRendu was one of the biggest jumps in sound quality I have ever had. I imagine that you guys with the Lumin X1's have even a better streaming because there is 1 less conversion on the Lumin X1 than on the Sonore OpticalRendu. Of course, the Rendu's are USB which is likely a lesser quality than the fibre. I know of 3 DACs that have fibre. The Lumin X1, the new Lumin P1, and the new $39K Linn Klimax DSM Next-generation Klimax DSM | Network Music Players | Linn USA My guess is that Fibre is standard on all DACs in a few years. |
Thanks Azwill, and yyzsantabarbara for the information. It is a lot to digest. The ER with upgraded clocks and power supply did improve the sound quality. But the biggest improvement at least to me on the Lumin X1 was using Fiber cable. The cat cable from the router/modem needs to be converted to fiber by some device and the ER works just fine. ozzy |
ozzy It got these. Working very nicely. Toes 'ah tapping. emailists There's some mojo (on my system) with the EtherREGEN, clock, power unit, cords, etc. More importunely this chair is inbound. |
I didn’t read this whole thread but my question is was the DS being used balanced out and volume at 100? I certainly understand if people can’t use it that way based on their system, but IMHO any comparisons to other DAC’s are completely meaningless otherwise. (Except as they relate to one’s own purchase decision, not anyone else’s) |
@emailists, I believe there have been different volume recommendations in the past for the DirectStream, particularly in use with a preamp, often discussed with PS Audio BHK Pre. I believe Ted Smith made some changes, Redcloud or Windom, that addressed prior issue on this. I have read some believing 92 is optimal while others cannot tell a difference from there to 100, especially with Sunlight firmware, which is on mine. I do run through a preamp and have tried 90, 92, 95, and 100 from the DS, but do not find it has affected sound quality for me, only volume to my preamp. I do use balanced out on my DACs and from my preamplifier out. I also prefer XLR connectors over single ended RCA type for the locking of the connections. I have done so with DS on several preamps, Cary SLP-05, Vinnie Rossi LIO DHT, Vinnie Rossi Signature L2 DHT, and Mola Mola Makua. |
