PS Audio describes in detail the changes that it has made to its digital board (the upgrade) and the benefits derived. Just go to PS Audio and click on the MKII Upgrade link in the upper right hand corner of the homepage. |
Mrtennis, There was a recent review in Stereophile on one of the Peachtree DAC/integrated amps, IIRC. The reviewer loved it but John Atkinson's measurements showed high levels of jitter.
The manufacturer's comments stated that they had not bothered to measure the jitter because they were so happy with the sound of the unit. They added that since they had been made aware of the jitter they had taken steps to reduce it and all the unit that were currently available had gotten this fix. It was pretty funny. |
The PWD is the only DAC I auditioned that approximated vinyl. |
Just received and installed my upgraded board this afternoon. Very simple process to say the least. As good as the PWD was/is......this upgrade takes it to yet another level. Space, detail, layers and separation have all been improved. And this with only a few hours of listening. Both the bridge and the PWT have benefitted from this upgrade IMHO. Plan on doing another comparison of the two when things get settled in. I can already tell they are closer now but will wait and see.
the new native x mode is fabulous!!. You can hear the difference immediately and obviously. Hi res left me speechless.....really! |
Update on the PWD MKII
Shipping has begun and mine is here singing with the biggest jump in SQ that I have experienced in a long time.
48 hours left to get the "early" pricing and February delivery.
Mine was the first one but others have started receiving and posting here.
Eat your words non believers!
http://www.psaudio.com/forum/#/discussion/2801/the-first-25-impressions |
I too have the MKII installed. I would, however, classify the differences that I am hearing as subtle, so I want to get a better idea of what to listen for. I would be interested to hear about some specifics regarding what you guys, Levi, Grobec...others, are hearing. What specifically are the immediate and obvious differences that you are referring to?
Thanks,
_Ben |
Hi Ben, just finished listening to some hi-res music you recommended a while back(i believe?). good call, as it was something i never would have stumbled on...but really enjoy now. Poncho Sanchez and Congo Blue from hdtracks (24/88). only problem is, i s*ck at articulating what i hear. will do my best but please do ask if something i say doesn't make sense. am thinking the new native x mode is responsible for most of the changes as that's where/when i could hear the differences best (not all though).
track 2 (B*Same Mama) had some very noticeable differences in my set-up(and to my ears of course). horns really separated and moved back and up. layer and definition....detail wouldn't be accurate imho because i had a ton of it before. after the horn "solo" towards the middle...the other horns blend in sweeter/softer but have a distinctly separate position/image. before they sounded almost stacked/crunched together....now they sound side to side...separate but very close (think live). also noticed the keyboard imaging stayed very consistent. this was not the case before as it shifted considerably as the song progressed. key's also seemed to have more dynamic range then before...becoming much more evident during certain sections. i do think there's a little more to it then my comments relay. bigger and "live-er" is what i'd call. no doubt many subtle differences help accomplish the new overall sound.
as a side note, i'm ecstatic about how it managed to up the bar on both the bridge and pwt. seems to me the bridge benefited a bit more because it sounds closer to the pwt now. they could be REALLY close or equal now imho. will know more soon and report back. this is the result i had hoped the most for. fingers are crossed!.
again...apologies for lack of audio terminology and sophistication....hope it points you in direction at least. this was the best i could do with 1 day under my belt. =) |
Hey Lev,
My board is to arrive next week. Was it easy to install? What do you think now? I can't wait.
Sgr |
Srg...love it. Sounds fantastic. One step closer to having the band front and center. I noticed bigger improvements to the bridge but the PWT also sounds better. Zero fatigue, silky smooth with the most non- digital sound I've heard from digital. I think you're gonna love it buddy. We stole it at $795 lol!
Install was easy for analog type A board. Type B looks a little harder but not much. Watch the video once or twice and you'll be fine. If my fat trembling fingers can do, anyone can ( kinda cool playing with guts of the thing as well lol)
Cheers |
I have the B version. I would love to hear an A/B comparison between the A and the B versions. The A version has a direct "dedicated" interface protocol for the I2S clock cables, while the B version requires an "adapter-type" approach which, from a layman perspective, looks like a more complicated circuit, longer cables and all.
My PWD has never sounded better. I already had exceptional sound-staging, imaging and openness (airiness) with the MKI version. The MKII version does all that in spades, I just don't have the ability to say just how much better the MKII version is since there's no way for me to compare the two.
Some MKII owners (many...most...maybe all but me) are hearing what they call very obvious and immediately noticeable difference. Again, my PWD with MKII upgrade sounds ridiculously good...excellent...I just can't honestly say that I can discern such an obvious and immediate difference. I really want to.
I haven't done any real serious listening since everything should by now be "properly broke-in." I'll do that real soon.
Bottom line, some folks easily shell out $800.00 (easily) for one power cable. At $800 the MKII upgrade is such a no-brainer... |
Ben, I think that most people would need to hear both versions in the same system and be able to A/B them to get a good handle on the differences between them. I hope that someone is able to arrange this and report on the results. |
Ben, you have a very valid point. The only way/reason the changes were obvious to many of us is due to the preparation we had to undertake to make any comparison at all. This was the first time I've ever "taken notes" and "studied" for an upgrade. Knowing an a-b wouldn't be an option forced some of us to really focus on a handful of tracks to carry over ASAP to the mk2. For me.....this was why things sounded obvious from the get go. Had I not prepared and focused.....my comments would be the same as yours.
This is exemplified by the fact that I now have no detailed observations to report. Specifics on the mk1 sound are now a distant memory for me. Putting in music I didn't "prepare with" yields me your thoughts and comments to the tee.
Am yet to hear a negative review of this upgrade. No doubt some will eventually chime in not so happy but for me.....this thing is a slam dunk. |
After more than 2 weeks of listening I agree with Levi that the MKI is but a distant memory.
A direct A/B might be interesting to read but I know,for me, there was a major jump in the signature of the MKII. Where I notice it the most is exactly the areas that I felt were weak in the previous model.
The stage was good but not great as were the separation of tones and instruments and midrange kick. The highs are now beautifully tonal and not at all fatiguing.
Not to say that the MKI was not enjoyable.
It was a great "bang for the buck".
The MKII is "a great bang for ANY buck". |
The comparison that need s to be done is the PWD against the Berkeley Alpha MKII. |
no doubt G. i've had three people tell me i looked tired at work this week. can't stop listening. tell myself i'm only going to listen for a few minutes....then 3 hours goes by. am hating my alarm clock this week.
whats really funny is...i come home tired and do it all again LOL!
outstanding upgrade!. can't get enough. |
The comparison that need s to be done is the PWD against the Berkeley Alpha MKII. |
Agree with comments above. An amazing upgrade. Smooth extended highs. More present and gripping lows. Higher and bigger soundscape with more depth and precisely separated image placement. Dynamics and extra heft and punch were immediately noticeable. |
A couple nights back, I brought my Mk I to Sgr's house, and we A/Bed it against the Mk II in his system (which is sounding very impressive, btw). All present agreed the Mk II is a very noticeable improvement, particularly in areas such as detail, spaciousness, imaging, and clarity: the Mk I sounded sludgy by comparison. Though I'd have to listen more for a fuller description, I'd say the Mk II retains the relaxed non-edgy feel that I like in the Mk I. I suspect that a majority of (satisfied) Mk I owners will think the upgrade money well spent.
John |
This is one of the biggest no brainer upgrades I've ever heard. It is a remarkable improvement. One can hear the results as soon as you plug the unit in and press play. Better bass, wider soundstage, image location, image size is proper, all the tributes that analog is known for. I really can't find an issue.NativeX really makes a difference. During the burn in it just sounds better and better. Now after about 6 days it sounds very liquid, spacious and analog sounding. Everything is in its place and when you put on a recording that will stretch out your system and you give it the gas, look out . . . |
MKII PWD owners, aside from the overall improvements provided by the complete MKII upgrade, more specifically, what is your impression of the difference between Native and NativeX? In doing an A/B between the two (by using the original remote and the new remote controllers) do you hear subtle differences or do you hear a really noticeable difference? |
Ben, that's where the good stuff is hidden imho...Native X!. it adds smoother detail and an almost "warmer sound". the improvements in space and the accuracy of that space using native-x are incredible. not so much adding space...rather defining the space and where the sound comes from. if you like a live sound...native x is a leap towards that end imho. am still on the honeymoon with the mk2 and glued to my rig, listening until the wee hours of the morning and getting up tired everyday. just can't get enough.
are you still having trouble hearing differences with the upgrade?
cheers |
Levy:
I absolutely love the sound of my system. I am getting a marvelous sound-stage with lots of air around individual instruments. I am not getting any sense of fatigue, even after long listening sessions. As I have reported on the PSA forum, I believe that I can hear subtle differences between the MKI and MKII versions - especially in the areas of "space" and imaging.
The only thing is, I just don't hear an immediately recognizable difference when I do an A/B comparison between Native and NativeX. It doesn't jump out at me. If there is a difference, it is the kind of difference that I will need to discern over time. My point in asking the question is because I keep reading the reports from others that they hear this very noticeable difference between the two...?? When I read these comments, I can't help but wonder if there is something wrong with my MKII board. Maybe it's just me...!!! |
Lev
The native setting is already a great improvement from the MKi in the ways you stated previously.
I would classify the native x difference as a step up in sophistication.
I know that sounds like a "broad" term but I really notice the difference after a week on X and then shift back to native.
I would compare it to different times of the day that provide different power qualities.
As far as the other "gentleman" who asked for a shootout with the BerkleyII, we just did it on the weekend and my friend is taking it back. Does that answer your question.
Not that the Berkley was not great. It was just different and we both preferred the PWD for extended listening.
Just sounds "less produced"
I hope to try the new WY4S dac in a few weeks |
My upgrade kit arrived a couple of weeks ago. The upgrade process was no problem. My DAC is an early one, and there were a few details that didn't match the video or booklet, but it didn't create any problems. The DAC upgrade in my view is a subtle improvement, but worth the money to an audiophile looking for improvements in an affordable form. I would say there is an improvement in clarity of detail, most of all.
Coincidentally, I've been fortunate to be a Beta tester for Steve Nugent's Empirical Audio Off-Ramp 5 USB converter. This version, which I suspect will be available shortly, will deliver I2S to the PW DAC. It has a few technical issues he is ironing out, but holy cow what a leap forward. I've used the Off-Ramps since version 1 because of the their superiority with USB and currently use version 4 with upgraded clocks. Until now, the output to the PW DAC has been spdif or aes/ebu, which is pretty remarkable anyway. But via I2S it is stunning. The sound is more dynamic, voices are better delineated, everything is more vibrant. And the bass is better. That's what surprised me most. Bass seems to be tighter, crisper. I also have a bridge and felt that the Off-Ramp 5 via I2S bested the bridge in sheer dynamics and transient attack. With the Off Ramp 5 via I2S and the upgraded PW DAC, this is the best I've ever heard from my system. |
Jiminia......this might be a stupid question but why are you using USB to feed the pwd? |
Funny, two years ago, before the bridge was released I was sceptical about the chances of succes of the bridge project and started inquiring with both Steve Nugent and Rick Cullen if they could build me a custom USB -> I2S interface using the PS Audio I2S interface - they were both very interested. I also asked PS audio if they would build this converter but they were so focused on the bridge architecture they declined (although they had already started doing work on this project but then ditched it). In any event, then the bridge was released and I dropped the USB -> I2S converter idea. Glad it to hear it came to fruition after all.... |
stupid question but wondering why anyone would use usb to feed the pwd??. |
Has anyone had their dac modded by RAM and purchased the upgrade also? |
@jiminia,
Are you saying that Steve is using PSA's I2S offering it as an option? I wonder if my Pace-Car can be modded with the same?
@Grobec,
That is good news. Was the Berkeley fully broken-in? |
Jiminia: why would you use USB (or converted usb) to feed the pwd? |
I am under the impression that native and nativeX are two different things. Is not native a bypass of the sample rate converter; and nativeX a fifo buffer aka digital lens that resides close to dac processor chip instead of in the transport? |
Two reasons I use USB: First, its 100% reliable. No dropouts, no network issues, and no flaky software, and with the right converter it sounds superb. Second, I like having the digital out options on the Off-Ramp to feed other devices (like a DAC/headphone amp, for example).
The I2S in hdmi format will be part of Nugent's new Off-Ramp, the 5. I'd be very surprised if any of his older units can be retrofitted, but that's a question best addressed to him. |
Yes the Berkley was a dealer demo so it had break-in and hours on it.
It's a great dac too.
If I could afford to keep them all, they all have their signature, then I could select based on my mood.
I needed to make a decision so PWD was the one that kept me in my chair longer. Less wires too! |
"Are you saying that Steve is using PSA's I2S offering it as an option?"
It's not an option. Standard on the OR5.
"I wonder if my Pace-Car can be modded with the same?"
Sorry, but no. HDMI I2S is a completely different electrical interface.
Steve N.
Empirical Audio |
I responded to your questions this morning, but for some reason its not been posted yet. Here it is again - maybe this one will get posted quicker.
I use USB for two reasons: First, its 100% reliable. No network issues, no dropouts, no flaky software, and it can sound superb when done right. Second, I like the option of the digital outputs from the converter so I can run other devices (like a DAC/headphone amp, for example).
The PS Audio-compatible I2S is available in the Off-Ramp 5, which I know Steve is tweaking right now. I'd be surprised if it can be retrofitted to older units, but that's a question best addressed to him. |
Not sure how my edits all got posted?
My apologies.. |
Lewhite.
Native is indeed a bypass of the SRC. NativeX indeed benefits from the new "Digital Lens" built into the new MKII board. I'm not sure of the exact protocol.
I assume that NativeX also bypasses the SRC. What I don't know for sure, but what I also assume to be true, is that the new digital lens is an active component in the signal path (i.e.: that you don't necessarily bypass it when NativeX is not activated - what would be the point of bypassing such an integral component of the new board...?). So my guess is - someone correct me if I'm wrong - that the signal is always routed through the new "Digital Lens," while NativeX bypasses the SRC (as does Native)...?? |
that's how i understood it too Ben. sure would be nice to find out for sure though. |
I'm not sure about my aforementioned assumptions as stated in the above post. I have posed over at PS Audio to confirm/verify... |
Well, the posts over at the PS forum indicate that the new Digital Lens is only engaged when NativeX is activated. My assumptions were therefore incorrect. |
Ben
The option to engage or not is there as a "choice" right now ans also to future proof the MKII since who knows what resolution will eventually come out of the Silent Server.
It just gives more user options in case something else changes [ like a new brdge]. |
Would it matter what rez would come out of the SS? Native is still native. Transcode on the fly at the SS shouldnt matter either. Right? |
Lewhite:
Native - or NativeX - does not affect/impact the bit rate or the sample rate. Trans-coding only impacts the CODEC (FLAC to WAV).
So, yes it does matter what "rez" you stream from the SS. The higher rez will (should) sound better than lower rez material (24/192 vs 16/44.1). Native/NativeX does not alter the bit/sample rates - it simply bypasses any filters or SRC... |
Groben - I'm contemplating the Berkeley and PS. Can you describe the differences in sound between the two? Especially in regard to resolution and bass bloom. |
Ben maybe my post was not stated correctly. What I was alluding to was the case of uprez ripping then played replayed sans src; vs. a bit perfect rip and uprezed at the dac? Hope thats not too incoherant.
Whats your favorite digital cable? |
re Berkley vs PWD.
I almost kept the Berkley before I heard the PWD.
I was comparing it to QB9 and Wavelength which both sounded sweet but slightly veiled compared to the Berkley.
My original DAC for almost 20 years was the Meitner Bidat with a few mods over the years to keep the components fresh.
The PWD was closer to a Bidat with a very good update plus the added benefit of Hi-res.
It is just more musical than the Berkley.
I forget I am serving from a computer. Especially with the MKII upgrade. YMMV |
What voltage level comes out of the PWD's analog outputs (both XLR and RCA)? Thank you. |
several months ago i inquired as to the sonic benefits of the upgrade.
i received , essentially, two answers.
the first, "analogue" sound, the second, a suggestion to try it for myself and return it if i wasn't satisfied.
i wonder if someone could be specific in rwo areas, namely bass and highs.
do the highs seem more extended, or do they sound less sharp ? perhaps almost rolled off ?
does the bass sound deeper or have more impact ??
considering the cost of shipping, twice if i don't care for the upgrade, i would like to have some confidence before i consider the upgrade.
as many know, i prefer a darker sound, and so i wonder if the upgrade goes in that direction ? |
Mrtennis, my experience is that the upgrade's effect on sound quality depends critically on which version of the firmware you install after the upgrade. The SD cards that are shipping with the Mk2 board contain firmware version 2.1.0. The sound with this firmware is very extended at both frequency extremes but perhaps a bit too hot in the treble and a bit too clinical...great for a laid back system, but not so great in more highly resolving systems.
The sound quality of the Mk2 digital board is significantly different if you instead install the earlier version of the firmward, version 2.0.2. This is available on the PS Audio website in the "support" section. You just copy these files onto the SD card, replacing the files that are pre-loaded onto the SD card. This can all be done with a $5 SD card reader from Best Buy, Staples, or Radio Shack.
With the 2.0.2 firmware, my guess is that you would really like the Mk 2 upgrade. The main difference I noticed was substantially improved bass, but a mid-range and treble that is still warm and very musical. In other words, real improvement over the Mk1 DAC that doesn't veer towards overly clinical, fatiguing, or bright in any real sense.
Wit both firmware versions, the soundstage of the DAC widens pretty significantly, which is another very noticeable area of improvement. That said, the soundstage of the Perfect Wave DAC is still not all that wide.
I know there has been some debate on the PS Audio forum, with numerous upgraders complaining that they are not happy with the latest firmware version, 2.1.0. In response, PS Audio has allowed owners to download the earlier 2.0.2 version of the DAC firmware to see whether they prefer the earlier version. My impression from the PS Audio forums is that Paul McGowan prefers the latest version 2.1.0, but has kept version 2.0.2 available. Moreover, they are supposedly developing a new version that they hope will be btter than other firmware version. |
Anyone have this experience with the Mk. II upgrade?:
I am getting "skips" or brief interruptions in the music, when running a MAC book via USB into the DAC (it really does "sound like vinyl"!). Happens with two different USB cables, but not with a CDP running in via coax. The problem did not happen with the Mk I board, and happens in different places on alternate playings of the same track, so I'm disinclined to blame the MAC or software. Power is dedicated circuit, running through BPT conditioner.
Have been in contact with PSA, but no resolution yet. Thoughts?
Thx,
John |
