Please Critique my Setup and Recommend Upgrade(s)
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As others have said, and I concur, you could do with better speakers(first) and better amp/pre(second). My 2 cents( and +1 kenny): Start by going to as many dealers as possible and listen and learn what you like. Don't confine your listening to models in your price range, listen to the most expensive, too. This will give you the understanding of what is possible. When you narrow down what you like/want. Then look for a matching amp and preamp. Again, a good dealer will help you with your decision, and you can always ask here, too. Bob |
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All good ideas above. It's interesting that no one has mentioned the placement of the speakers. They play the room. Although you've tried different placements before you purchase something new try this. Sumiko Master Set Speaker setup. You may not be maximizing the speakers and their amplification specifically for your room. I don't believe in formulas. Take your time. Use your ears. And it's free. Once maximized then you can upgrade first with full range floor standing speakers you like then match an amp to them. Best of luck! |
+1 for fstein. Start with speakers and then the amp. Go to as many audiophile stores that you can stand and listen to speakers in a room with enough space to equal your own. If you can find them, see if you can listen to some of the recommendations others have made in this thread. Most important, pick what sounds best to you. Then, see if you can demo them in your home. Finally, get an amp that goes best with those speakers. Make sure, the speakers can be driven by your current amp. If not, and you love the speakers, you know what's next. If you want to get on the continuous improvement merry-go-round, then the new components should better your turntable combo. Otherwise, just smile when you drop the arm! Kenny |
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It sounds like the frequency bands are a little disjointed." That's your speakers. The Elac's are OK, but you can do a lot better. You can fix that by getting time and phase correct speakers like the Vandersteen Model 1's. They're more coherent than a esl or ribbon type planar speakers. (I've actually put them next to ML's and Magnepans). I know your budget allows for a more expensive speaker like the Model 2's, but they may be too big for your room and amp. The 1's are much easier to drive. Also, Vandersteen gives you contour controls for the mids and highs that you can use in less than ideal rooms and placement. If you upgrade your other components in the future, the Vandersteen's will let you hear the differences in better electronics in ways the Elac's could never do. |
You are getting all sorts of advice, all of which is true to some extent. . I would suggest starting with the speakers as you will have an immediate improvement. Listen to the new ones before buying if possible (if they are really nice, they will let you bring your amp) . Going "used" is usually safe, and will enlarge the pool of choices. |
@proudio529 you bought low/mid end system and that’s the sound level that you’ll get .not more and not less. If you really want a big improvement you will need to upgrade your system .I can recommend one of the British speakers ATC,Proac,Harbeth or PMC. Amplification : McIntosh,Bryston or ATC . Also you’ll need good cables : Audioquest, Whireworld ,Cardas or Tellurium. |
Given your pro background, I’d listen to the new Klipsch Forte III speakers ($4000/pr). Very immediate and articulate (if they’re anything like my La Scallas). Klipsch also has a new design called "The 15s" ($3000/pr) which are self-powered, are Blue-tooth enabled and accept phono and digital input -how cool is that? They have a single horn for mids/tweet and a fifteen inch woofer. BTW, the 15s feature some sweet wood-work. They go for the "Craft built" look. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NA51bUYwuBk |
"As a lifelong musician and former recording / pro audio engineer...." In my experience musicians are very happy with poor or mediocre sound systems since they are able to produce the real thing on a regular basis. It's the recording/pro audio engineer in you that is going to need a better hifi. It sounds to me like what you are missing is realistic "scale" and seamless "coherence". Scale will require bigger speakers and maybe a bigger room. Improved coherence can come from higher quality speakers with better crossovers or from a single driver speaker. Your choices will depend on how much more you want to spend. |
Eventually, you're going to want more and better amplification. I'd start with better amp or speakers. Later on, you can pick your "final" speakers for your listening room, but I'd recommend going for better power now, with the Elacs, just to illustrate the benefits of improved current delivery. If you add a decent subwoofer as well, that just might take care of things long term. You'll never get proper bass from the Elacs alone, even in your medium-sized room. My room is about 14 x 14, opening out on two sides. You might want to look at my photos to see I've approached this kind of space, just to give you an approximate sense of scale. |
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529proaudio - I think that for the size of room that you have, if you can get full frequency floor standers, you'd be happier in the long run. As a general rule, all new systems should probably start with speaker selection. Sure, I have my favorite speakers but it's such a personal choice, what I like (Bowers and Wilkins), you may hate. I suggest listening to as many as you can and see what sounds great to you. Once you've arrived at a speaker set that you really like is to think about your amp next. All part of the fun :) Greg |
Hi Greg, I agree about the Rega being somewhat underpowered for the inefficiency of the ELACs. Given the choice, would you upgrade the speakers to something better and more efficient or keep the ELACs and upgrade to a more powerful amp? I'm leaning towards upgrading the speakers, particularly since the Rega is also my phono stage and headphone amp. As for speakers, any favorites (new or used) in the $3k range? |
529proaudio - I was just looking at the specs for your speakers and amp and here are a couple of thoughts. The Elacs are not all that efficient at 85db/1w and being 4ohm are somewhat hard to drive for their size. Your amp is rated at 50WPC at 8ohm and 73WPC at 4ohm which tells me that it’s not a very high current amp which would be a better match for the Elacs. The Elacs are also rated at 40-140WPC so you’re already kind of at the low end. The other possible consideration is that the speakers are fairly small considering the size of the room. Have you tried moving the speakers closer to each other and your seating position closer as a test? Also (and I’m guessing you know this) based on the design of the tweeter and midrange drivers sharing the same physical space, I would imagine that you’d want these drivers pointed directly at your primary listening position (right at your nose in other words). Greg |
Many audiophiles have their own opinion on this subject but in my opinion, at the end of the day, the music comes out of the speakers. You can have all the best downstream sources and amp, but if your speakers can't produce the sound, you've hit a major limitation that you can't fix. I would look into buying better speakers, potentially ones that can grow with improvements to your audio system. I think the Vandersteen 2CE could be an excellent choice, where the sound quality would improve with incremental upgrades. Last word of advise, don't try to match the speakers to the amp. Try to find the speakers you like and match the amp to the speakers. Gook Luck! |
