The 93 or 95, does have the better video dac! As for sound I think you would be splitting hairs between the Oppo's and the Pioneer via hdmi. Others may be able to comment on the differences on the sound ! |
So an Oppo 93 or a Oppo 95 will sound better and have better picture quality than the Pioneer 05 using hdmi? I don't use analog out. |
I can't speak for the 05 ,but I did have the 51fd same model but not elite . I went for the Oppo 95 (I'm an analog out user) and as far as reliability and sheer musical bliss are concerned, the Oppos shine. I loved the 51fd while I had it ,but reliabilty made me look else where! If you use hdmi for audio , scoop up the Oppo 93 it s a lot of machine for the money.
Hope this helps |
Recently purchased (October 2011) an Elite VSX-52, which replaced older Denon AVR and two McIntosh amps for L/R front and center channels.
Believe me, the topic was extensively researched on the web and in stores for two months before a decision was reached. For now, we're Happy Campers as far as the VSX-52 is concerned.
I'm now contemplating the replacement of my JVC XV D-723 DVD player. An older, well built War Horse from 10 years ago that sports 6 Analog Outs (which I used to great advantage). Great sound and thousands of hours with absolutely no failures.
The question is: Elite BDP-05fd (stay in the "connected family") or Oppo BDP-93?
Extensive Web and Game connectivity is not an issue. We don't do MP-3 or Games at all.
We're a senior couple who are more into superb picture and spot-on audio (CD/DVD Audio/Theater-Quality5.1 Surround). The iPhone remote and other Apple connectivity via house wiring are a plus (Elite) but again, not at the top of the list. Currently using Roku for Netflix and Amazon Prime.
We really love our movies and BBC TV series. I've got a nice Music system upstairs with Klipsch Corner Horns for serious listening so only use the VSX-53 for casual background jazz or classical.
I know appearances can be deceiving but I can visualize two matching Elite boxes side by side. Other hand, the Oppo's minimalist design, attractively priced technology and superb build (20+ pounds) are also appealing.
Any thoughts from both sides (actual Elite and Oppo users)? I've an open mind and am not married to Pioneer. Gotta say I'm glad the Sharp relationship has gone bye-bye.
Thanks in advance for any useable data.
Bob |
The Yamaha would not light up the DTS MA light when playing from my PS3. It appears the 05 is bitstreaming. |
That is because the 05 is bitstreaming the dts MA to the Yamaha which is doing the decoding. The 05 cannot do it yet.
Kal |
Why does my 05 light up the DTS-MA light on my Yamaha 3800 on The Hulk? |
v1.08 discs have been sent to some.
Even v1.112 will not decode dts MA. ;-)
Kal |
Rumor on the blu ray forum is the 05 will soon have update 1.08 available. It has been mentioned that you can have it sent to you now from Pioneer before it is available on the website by calling them. It still wont decode DTS MA, but maybe it will improve performance. |
Unfortunately, Pioneer has not been very forthcoming on the details of their plans for decoding DTS MA internally. My experience is that manuals are often not written carefully enough to be definitive, unfortunately. The phrase in the footnote in the manual for DTS HD MA over analog is "DTS Surround Sound signals converted to linear PCM audio signals are output". They use the term "DTS Surround Sound" elsewhere in the table to reference lossy DTS signals, not MA signals. That would imply that for DTS HD MA sources, DTS lossy is output over the analogs. I just find that hard to believe and I think you agree. Note the HDMI column explicitly says that DTS HD MA is output. I would expect that same phrase for the analog column, not the DTS Surround Sound phrase. My guess is they carried some of that wording over from the similar table for the 95, which did not decode DTS MA internally. With these problems in the table, I would also not trust that the 5.1 reference is accurate. I think we need to wait for some official word from Pioneer or the actual firmware before we can be sure of this. I like Pioneer products, but they are having a tough time with some of the details on this one. Hopefully, it is just start-up pains for the new platform. |
I was wondering if anyone ever tried upgrading the power cord on one of these players for better sonics? I did this with my cd player and found it made an improvement. |
"I believe the manual reference to 5.1 applies to the current situation with DTS not necessarily the future implementation of DTS HD MA."
The manual states that it can already decode DTS HD MA, and it shows it as 5.1 via the analog outs. What I mean is that the manual is already written as if the updates are installed. As far as the Pioneer CSRep saying it will not ouput DTS HD MA through the analogs; I dont believe it. But I dont think it will do all 8 channels. I hope it will, or you are right. People will be upset. |
Hi - Just a FYI for those who own the BDP 95FD - There is a firmware update that will bring the player to the latest 3.30 version - makes the player much faster - That is a lot less time for the movie to begin - also corrects some compatibility issues with certain Blue Rays. Some features offered on the newest Blue Rays were causing a compatibility issues - the latest update corrects that. The new player looks to be very cool but i'll be enjoying what I have for now...TONY |
I would be careful with what Pioneer customer support says regarding DTS MA not being sent to the analog outs. Experience has shown that CSRs are often not up to date on future plans. You might want to post the results of your call on avsforum, as the people there follow this situation very closely. I do not remember anyone there saying that DTS MA would not go out over the analog outputs. If that is true, there will be a lot of upset people. I believe the manual reference to 5.1 applies to the current situation with DTS not necessarily the future implementation of DTS HD MA. |
FYI. I own the BDP 05 FD and it does not currently decode DTS MA. I called Pioneer and they said there would be a firmware update on it that would allow it to decode MA internally. However, I was told that it still would not be able to send the DTS MA signal out of the analog outputs. Page 50 of the manual says it will do it as 5.1, but not 7.1. I did not ask when this update was expected. |
Well, I don't have a receiver just a processor. It can decode regular DTS but that's it. I originally purchased a HD player about a year ago and then it all went south as you know. My audio dealer was cool enough to replace the HD player I had with the Pioneer 05FD. So that is where I stand. The player just came to me so to speak. I don't think there are too many dvds in DTS HD yet so I am not too concerned about it. I just don't want to have to buy a receiver if I don't have to. So I can listen to these higher quality dvds if they do the upgrade next year and I use the 5.1 audio outs to my audio ins on my processor correct? Thanks. |
Correct, although currently the 05 does not decode DTS HD - it needs a firmware upgrade to do that. That update is not yet scheduled. Most people believe this will happen, although it looks like early 2009. There are some skeptics who think it might not happen until later, if at all. So, if you absolutely need DTS HD to be decoded in the player, you need to make a decision as to when Pioneer will do the firmware update. The 95 will never decode the HD audio formats. It does not have the computer power to do that. If the HD audio is decoded in the player you need an HDMI 1.1 input on your receiver or you have to use 5.1/7/1 analog inputs. The base managment on the 05 for analog outputs is not very complete (crossover is not adjustable and no distance settings). Do you have a HDMI receiver? The Panasonic 55 currently decodes both Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD MA internally and sends PCM over HDMI 1.1 and analog, although the analog output is not as good as the Pioneer. Using the analog outputs also requires that you can increase the sub signal by at least 10 db over the other channels(speakers set to large) or 15 db (speakers set to small) - in the receiver. The upcoming Pioneer 09 will have a much more complete analog section, but it is not clear if the video section will be much different than the 05. What receiver are you using? Does it have HDMI?
Note I have a 95 and have tested an 05. My receiver does decode the HD audio formats, so I stayed with the 95. As a new platform, the 05 will take some time to stabilize, but that is the nature of Blu-Ray these days. |
That is an awesome response Dtc! Just the info I was looking for. You really hit it on the head for me. Thanks a lot. One question I still have is it sounds like I won't need a receiver to decode the sound of HD DTS and True HD because it is done internally in the player where as the 95FD could not do this therefore a person needed a receiver to decode these correct?
|
The 05 is Pioneer's current player, released about 2 months ago, whereas the 95 was launched a year ago. The 05 is a new platform, not a simple update to the 95. The 95 is till listed on the Pioneer site as a current model, although I doubt anyone is selling it as such. If available, it should be at a deep discount since it is last years model. The 95 does not decode Dolby TrueHD or DTS HD MA internally (and never will), it only bitstreams them over 1.3 HDMI. The 05 decodes Dolby TrueHD internally, but is still waiting for a firmware upgrade to decode DTS HD MA internally. The 05 also has many more options for enhancing the video - including a mode that outputs 36 bit deep color signals in xvYCC color space. Some people see the benefit of these modes, others do not. The 05 has Wolfson DACs for its 7.1 analog audio outputs, which provide excellent analog out for CDs and multichannel sources. The 95 has Pioneer's Home Media Gallery, which has been dropped from the 05. The 05 is essentially the same as the 51, except for some cosmetic differences and higher speed video DACs for analog video output on the 05, which is not important if you are using HDMI. The 05/51 are very versatile players although they have had growing pains like most Blu-Ray players and are undergoing regular updates to fix problems. The DTS HD MA internal decoding firmware update is expected in the next few months (maybe January) but Pioneer has not set a release date. The current list price of the 05 is higher than most comparable products, in particular the recentlhy released Pananonic 35 and 55. The Pioneer players have several featuers that match very well with Pioneer receivers and Plasmas. For people using external video processors, the Pioneers (95/05/51) have a "source direct" mode which passes the signal directly from disc to HMDI. Most other players do not have this feature. There is a lot of information on avsforum.com on both the Pioneer and the Panasonic players. If you decide on the Pioneer, the real decision should be between the non-Elite 51 and the Elite 05. |
It would appear to me that after a little research that the 95FD and the 05FD are essentially the same player. Both decode True HD and DTS HD. The 05FD is listed at $200 less. Is there something more that the 95FD offers? It looks like both were released at about the same time. |
I have the Elite 95FD and it's absolutely stunning.
The Godfather in Bluray on The Pioneer into Elite Kuros 60" was like watching the movie the 1st time I saw it in the theater. They did an awesome job with the DVD and the Pioneer Elite exploits all of it. Sound is amazing as well. I've seen the movie more than any other and have heard dialogue and sounds I have never heard. |
Latest models are 51 FD $599.list. I just purchased from Amazon for $499. w/free shipping. Just arrived today. The other is 05FD at $799. list. Minus the "Elite" badging on the 05FD, the units are 99% the same. The new 09FD will be their "reference" player and will be close to $2k. The 95FD is a previous year's model. The general concenus is that both the 51 and 05 are upgrades from the 95FD. They're cheaper only because the market is moving all players in that direction.
Take a look at www.avsforum.com and check under BluRay sources and there is tons of info on a thread about both current models. Be prepared for a loooong read but very worthwhile. |
Recently purchased the BDP-51FD ($600).
Think the video quality is a notch below the Toshiba A35 HD player it replaced ($350 + 10 free HD movies on Amazon).
The 51FD has (sporadic) problems resyncing dialog to the picture when slow-motion is used.
The 51FD is quieter (cooling fans?) than the Toshiba.
Finally, I've noticed my Samsung LED DLP TV making LF noise switching from scene-to-scene.
I'm not saying the Pioneer is causing this, I just never noticed the noise with the Toshiba. |
I see the 95FD cost $200 more than the 05FD. What extra do you get for that price? Is it worth it? |
There is a BDP 09 FD model that will cost in the $2K. Probably out early 2009. Not much info on this piece yet. |
According to the Pioneer website, the BDP 05 FD and BDP 95 FD models are listed as the current top models. If a new model is imminent, I don't think they would announce it too far in advance and undercut the sales of their current model. Since the mass market manufacturers change their models pretty well every year, something new is inevitable in the shorter term. If they are going to come out with something new before the winter CES, they would likely do it now for the Christmas shopping season. What you should look for are current models being discounted by stores. This is a sure sign that a new model is about to come out. The stores are ordering and they want to move the old units out. If nothing new comes out by November, you're safe until the spring. I have no inside information. This is just my opinion based on how the market for consumer electronics typically works. |
