Slap-
Just a thought....
My HD receiver has an aspect/resolution button that allows me to scroll through different settings (my setup is DirecTV HD through a Samsung HD Receiver). The component video out to the TV simply feeds the signal as processed by the convertor/receiver box. Check your owners manual for the receiver and see if you can change aspect/resolution there. |
Slapster,
No time to re-read your entire post as I'm headed off to work, but I think Danlib1 may be onto something.
My cable box had setup for aspect ratio. I set mine for 16X9 and things display correctly. However, I don't think I can change the aspect ratio of hi-def. channels. I think they are "you get what we broadcast" and it is a function of the TV.
However, when watching SD programming through the component output of the cable box, I can change aspect ratio.
So, check your cable box for setup. Lastly, "cable-guide" is available only via the cable box for my cable company. It is part of the digital tier.
Enjoy,
TIC |
My Directv box has the aspect ratio button---which doesn't work for any so called "hd in 4.3". My tv itself allows me to stretch. Anyone concerned with burn-in needs to make sure you don't watch to much with black bars on the sides.---So it ain't your cable box; your tv needs to be able to stretch this "4.3-HD".(which ain't hd;it's upconverted 480 material) |
Your friends TV cant be hooked up via Componet video and be able to stretch SD 4.3 signals into widescreen, it just doesnt work that way...what you are getting in terms of performance is completly normal |
Slappy,
If your hd tuner is a Motorola, turn it off, leaving your plasma on. Press the menu button in your remote and you'll see the menu for the cable box. One of the options is to force a 4:3 to a stretched 16:9 or to display the native signal without scaling.
The OnDemand movies are mostly upconverted analog signals and will be displayed with 4 bars and horrible quality. In the OnDemand menu you'll see a 'HDTV' link showing the only few movies shown in HD in OnDemand.
As for connections, the usual rule of thumb is to use dvi or hdmi if you have a plasma and componet if your monitor is a CRT. I have a 34" Sony KD34955XS and the component connection is superb.
Hope this is somewhat useful, |
To summarize a little, I believe component is inherently 16x9, so that when you use component, aspect conversion is done by the box sending the component signal--whether DVD or STB. "Aspect" isn't any standard convention, so what your friend's TV may have is a "zoom" feature for 16x9 images. I've got a Pio 16x9 plasma and Comcast service, but my region (Alexandria, VA) uses the Scientific Atlanta boxes. Some other areas, including the adjacent DC market, use Motorola boxes. The thing to do is run a search on the box model over at AVS Forum-- http://www.avsforum.com--and you should find a thread on how to get to some "not-for-Joe-bag-o-donuts" settings on your STB. You can also try the mfr's website. You want to make sure your STB knows what resolutions, for example, your TV likes. When I watch OnDemand, I get blackbarred SD 4x3 stuff, but I do get widescreen when the movie is widescreen, so there is something funky going on. If your box happens to be a Scientific Atlanta box (either an 8250HD or 8300HD, I've got some experience with those. Both of those are HD DVR boxes, however. Also be warned--some of the SA boxes have a DVI out, but it may not be functional. While I like the digital video interfaces with my TV, DVI and HDMI can be a PITA b/c of HDCP. |
Try avsforum.com. But ask them to tone it down; those guys make us 'files look like "joe-bag-o-donut". |
:)
You're kidding me right?
Here's some hints:
"My buddy has a Panasonic CRT HDTV with the same box, he uses the HDMI and his TV will broadcast widescreen in widescreen, and his Aspect control WORKS with the SD."
The keyword is HDTV and something your TV is not.
"When watching the source through the COAX input, i am unable to get the HD (as expected). When watching standard definition programming i can use the aspect button to switch from Full, Just, 4:3, and ZOOM"
What is the max resolution of the coax input?...285-325 lines
The TV has an ASPECT button, however, when watching through COMPONENT the ASPECT button DOES NOT WORK. The TV will not go into Zoom, Full, Just, or 4:3 mode.
What resolution is the Component input from the cable box... 1080i? Keep in mind the black bars are generated by the cable box. So to strech an image would require more or less resolution than your TV has?, this goes for DVD too......you're out of dots brother, you only have 480x752.
Cake and eat it= +$1000 for an HDTV plasma not an EDTV
Got to read them directions and replace all the power cords for best results :)
PS: Have no idea why your menu won't pass thru the RF connection. Cable companies can be silly sometimes when it comes to chizzling customers for more money. |
Sorry Cinematic_Systems, play again.
I've owned the commercial version of the TH-42PD50U. It is HDTV compatible, meaning fully capable of receiving HD signals in 1080i or 720p. The internal scaler then downconverts to the displays maximum resolution. This isn't so unusual, since most plasmas aren't exactly a 1:1 ratio of pixels to HD resolution--its just that in this set the display loses a little more of the information. The monitor will display a 1080i or 720p signal to the best of its ability.
The problem is that 1080i and 720p are *inherently* widescreen. The manual sez that the aspect button does not work with 1080i or 720p input signals. See p. 21. Its not a matter of running out of pixels.
The double boxing problem is an STB issue or a Comcast issue. Try using the S-Video to watch SD/AD (but not HD) off the box; should give you back the aspect/zoom at least. Frankly, some prefer the use of S-Video over component/DVI/HDMI because it tends to "blur" the picture a tiny bit and mask the resolution conversion problems. |
Does your CATV box also have a aspect control? If it does,set it to full. Make sure its not set to 4:3. If it is set to 4:3 your TV might not display SD in a widescreen stretch mode regardless of the aspect setting on the TV. Make sure the screen type control on the CATV box is set to 16:9 and not 4:3. Send a full signal to the TV and use the TV aspect control to make it look the way you want. Does the CATV box upconvert all signals from the component video outputs to 1080I? If it does your aspect ratio control on the TV will not work. Try not using the coax cable to feed the TV. Use just the component cables or try using 2 inputs with a S video cable and see which one looks better with SD. |
Sorry, ive been gone for a bit, just got back.
I FOUND THE PROBLEM, and Edsilvia nailed it right on target. He even got the page right. LOL
The aspect controls for the TV only work with sub 1080i/720p signals.
The comcast box sends out a 1080i signal over the coax, regardless to the quality of the picture. So even SD will still be sent in an HD 1080I signal. That is why i couldnt use the aspect function. Apparently, my roomates CRT panny doesent seem to have this problem, might be beause he is using HDMI and not component....
I searched through that cable box 10 times and couldnt find any settings. Turns out, there is a special menu that is not normally available. you have to shut the cable box off, then hit "Menu" and it lets you into an entirly different menu system.
On that it was set to pass 1080I on all signals, basically, i set the box to only put out a 480p signal which is all my TV is really capable of doing.
So, now i CAN use the aspect controls, and my TV is still putting out the best pic it can.
Honestly, the panasonic ED plasma's are the best performance for the price as far as im concerned. I bought the TV at a Soundtrack/Audioking/Ultimateelectroncs store, it was sittin there next to many HD plasma's and LCD TVs... I still think the only flat panel TV in the store that looked as good was the HD version, and i could only tell when i was very close looking at lettering....
It was sure cheaper than the HD models, but that wasnt even really a selling point for me, i could have spend several grand more, i just couldnt fiure out why i would want to when this little EDTV is trashing the competition and it wasnt even HD.... I know not all things are equal in those stores, and i know they jack up the video of them to be bright and vivid as possible, but a lot of the other TV's just couldnt get the realizm that this one got.
I'm loving this TV, and will never look back.
Cinematic,
Ya know, i gotta say something, why does everyone feel the need to point out to me that this is an EDTV and not an HDTV? im pretty sure i made that abundantly clear in the post i put up. Same thing happened on some different forums, instead of helping me fogure the problem they decided they needed to sit there and point out the blatantly obvious.
You even quoted what i had said, as seen below, and where i said i am unable to get HD on coax and then quite clearly in parenthesis i stated "As expected" then decided to show me up by telling me resolution capabilitys of coax....
as that was ever in question....
"When watching the source through the COAX input, i am unable to get the HD (as expected)."
anyways, every single time i see you post on here you seem to have to try and show people up.... you feeling a bit insecure or something?
you miss the point in almost every single thread i have seen you write in.
Why dont you go ahead and analyze my system and tell me how horrible it is while yer at it? Take yer best shot, with what ive seen you post on here in the past, i hold nothing you say with any credit.
man. i dig the tv, i dig my stereo. and im happy with them to the point where i now spend a lot of my time and money pursuing other interests.
Good day. |
Slappy-
As I indicated a few months ago in a private email exchange we had, I also think the Panny 42 EDTV is an awesome display. Great contrast ratio, beautiful color rendering, on and on.
Don't be too hard on Sinnamatik_dizplays. His posts all come on a bit strong. With a moniker like cinematic _ displays, he has to know more than us about video.
Enjoy your panel! |
Cinematic doesnt get out much, lol |
Slapster,
Good to hear that you found the aspect setting. For my PACE cable box with Time Warner Cable, The "Display" button is right on the front panel of the STB. Can't miss it!
I also own the Panny EDTV model TH-42PD25U. I agree that it is a great Plasma regardless of price. Honestly, considering I don't watch any OTA HD programming, I think the EDTV Panny is an incredible bargain. Amazingly, no other Plasmas have yet matched the feature set of the Pannys. How about integrated speakers, included table stand, NTSC, ATSC, and QAM tuners, cablecard support, HDMI and memory card reader. And that was in the previous version, not even the current one.
I only bought a plasma TV because I needed to increase my viewing distance and having the TV be 20" thinner was the best way for me to do it. Now that I have it, I couldn't be happier.
Enjoy the TV!
TIC |
This is going to be fun;
1. Ya know, i gotta say something, why does everyone feel the need to point out to me that this is an EDTV and not an HDTV?
Well you didn't seem to understand the difference when it came to screen modes now did ya. You even compared your TV to your roomates tv which is an HDTV!!! Edesilva has the manual and doesn't get it either, you don't have enough resolution to stretch 1080i, 720p and 480p. HDTV plasma's can do this if they have the software on board, ie Pioneer, Samsung....Panasonic.
Uh.
2. Apparently, my roomates CRT panny doesent seem to have this problem, might be beause he is using HDMI and not component....
No master of obtuseness, his tv has the equivalent 1024x1280 resolution, it is a real HDTV. Not compatible like yours.
3.anyways, every single time i see you post on here you seem to have to try and show people up.... you feeling a bit insecure or something?
No I was just making fun of your for not being able to hook up your tv and then 10 guys who were no help either. I gave you the answers I just didn't spoon feed ya, which it appears you needed.
4. On that it was set to pass 1080I on all signals, basically, i set the box to only put out a 480p signal which is all my TV is really capable of doing.
Gee I didn't know that, wonder who the first person was who brought that concept up.
5. I've owned the commercial version of the TH-42PD50U. It is HDTV compatible, meaning fully capable of receiving HD signals in 1080i or 720p. The internal scaler then downconverts to the displays maximum resolution. This isn't so unusual, since most plasmas aren't exactly a 1:1 ratio of pixels to HD resolution--its just that in this set the display loses a little more of the information. The monitor will display a 1080i or 720p signal to the best of its ability.
And does this have anything do with stretching an image or having variable screen modes? No.
6. The problem is that 1080i and 720p are *inherently* widescreen. The manual sez that the aspect button does not work with 1080i or 720p input signals. See p. 21. Its not a matter of running out of pixels.
Then why doesn't it allow it?, because it has too many pixels? I'm not sure slappy understood his cable box was outputting 1080i on SD channels by generating the side bars. Maybe I misread his post?
7. The double boxing problem is an STB issue or a Comcast issue. Try using the S-Video to watch SD/AD (but not HD) off the box; should give you back the aspect/zoom at least. Frankly, some prefer the use of S-Video over component/DVI/HDMI because it tends to "blur" the picture a tiny bit and mask the resolution conversion problems.
Need I say more?
8.Why dont you go ahead and analyze my system and tell me how horrible it is while yer at it? Take yer best shot, with what ive seen you post on here in the past, i hold nothing you say with any credit.
Well, that's not my job and you haven't complained about the general quality of CD playback on your system in an open forum. So it's none of my business really.
9.man. i dig the tv, i dig my stereo. and im happy with them to the point where i now spend a lot of my time and money pursuing other interests.
I never said one thing about your system, never will unless hell freezes over and you ask my advice. I thought it was funny you couldn't operate your tv because you hadn't read the directions but I said that already.
10.You even quoted what i had said, as seen below, and where i said i am unable to get HD on coax and then quite clearly in parenthesis i stated "As expected" then decided to show me up by telling me resolution capabilitys of coax....
as that was ever in question....
"When watching the source through the COAX input, i am unable to get the HD (as expected)."
What is funny is I was trying to point out that changing screen modes has to do with the resolution of your tv and the signal source, which you now know. So was the other guy but you didn't understand we were trying to fill in some background not show you up.
So there we are. I love this place. |
Cinematic- just an observation. As a career salesperson, I've learned that HOW you say something is often as important as WHAT you say. It's all in the delivery.
Now to state the obvious:
Condecension, smugness, and biting sarcasm will simply guarantee the same. That's why you sometimes receive less than appreciative responses when you share your thoughts.
To quote you- "I love this place". |
Cinematic_Systems, holy moly, you are *so* right! Slappy just needs a better TV!
But wait a minute. If Slappy had slapped down a bunch of extra greenbacks for the TH-42PWD7UY, Panny's HD plasma of the same size, why does page 20 of that manual also say ASPECT IS DISABLED FOR 1080i/720p SIGNALS?
Maybe what the aspect button does has nothing to do with "running out of pixels" or buying a more expensive TV. Maybe it has to do with the fact that Panny decided that button was only going to work on certain resolution inputs. |
Cinematic, im sure sooner or later even a bright guy like yourself will figure out why you have no friends.
I know it is ED. christ. that was never the point. I dont know what kind of psycholigical blind spot you have, but you are one irritating person.
Let me break this down so that even a 6 year old can understand....
My roomates CRT panasonic accepts a constant 1080i signal from comcast, -ALL- broadcasting is send over as 1080I. When he flips to an SD channel, it is still sent over a 1080I signal, even though it is only SD Quality. His TV can still stretch out 1080i, which gives him the ability to watch SD quality programs over 1080i, and while he CAN watch it with the bars, he can also zoom and stretch etc.
MY TV, set to the SAME type of box, ALSO accepts 1080I signals, but downconvers to 480p. When i recieve 1080i all the aspect controls are gone.
That is where the difference lies, because my buddys TV retains the aspect controls. probably just some type of logic processor or something that can figure it out, or maybe as the HD box sends it out over 1080i it sends a flag to mark it as SD so his tv enables the aspect controls. That is just a guess, i really dont care how his TV lets him watch SD quality over 1080i and allows him to use aspect.
this has nothing to do with filling where there is no information, this has to do with zoom/stretch features, basically, it expands the pixel from 1, to 2, or 3. thats it. Saying you cannot stretch or zoom a HD signal? that is absolutly retarded. Sure, mine cannot, but the concept of being able to is sound and solid, it works the same was as a digital zoom on a digital camera, it is just slightly more sophisticated. And THAT is the POINT of aspect controls, to fill the screen where no information is being sent.
Either way, the FIX was not in the tv, it was a HIDDEN menu on the COMCAST BOX that you cannot access while the comcast box is turned ON, it can only be access by hitting menu when the box is OFF, and it takes you to a menu that is not otherwise available. All i needed to know was where the hell that freakin menu was hidden, and presto i had it.
The problem here, is my set is not designed to stretch SD broadcast over 1080I, and his is. Plain and simple.
It had --nothing-- to do with an inability to correctly set up the TV, the TV was correctly set up, it is the fact that there was no literature with the comcast box that showed where the hidden menu was located. In FACT, i talked with 3 different Comcast service reps before one of them knew that there was a hidden menu.
So once again cinematic, you are unable to grasp the concept of the question, you run off some other unrelated concept and pat yourself on the back for being such a smart guy. The entire question was obviously over your head.
Well, enjoy it, i certainly dont see anybody else sitting here patting you on the back, if anything, i see people getting tired of your arrogance.
But let me just get this one thing straight, according to you, you cannot stretch/zoom an 1080i signal. So everyone with Comcast digital cable needs to use 2 seperate video inputs? They cannot watch HD then flip to an SD broadcast which is send over a 1080i singal and have aspect controls?
Because guess what? Comcast HDbox ONLY sends 1080i over component if you have 1080I setup, it will NOT send 1080i and later on send 720p or 480p or 480i. it simply sends the highest resolution, which is the resolution you select on the hidden menu, and it will send SD quality over 1080i
I verified this myself a few days back when i had my buddy put on an SD station and checked the TV's OSD which said it was recieving 1080i... even tho it was only sd quality... and guess what? HIS FREAKIN ASPECT CONTROLS WORKED>
So nice try, too bad, so sad. Why dont you go do some research before you start running your mouth.
moron. |
|
Slappy, I am glad you perhaps shoved him off of his soap-box...or maybe his mom wont let him on the computer anymore, anyway happy HD, music and peace. |
You guys are quite a crew,
So none of you understood my posts? That's brilliant, I had two goner's read my posts and they understood. But they have +100 IQ's so maybe it was an unfair sampling.
I did make one mistake I forgot a question mark after Panasonic because Desilva had the manual, I wanted to know. I didn't know if they removed this feature, but on older Panasonics it was there on the 42 HD's.
But if you read my post you'll see that your final explanation is regurgitating back to me what I already told you. But I'm the Moron?
How do you respond to someone who is incapable of understanding what you write.
Clearly I made every attempt to talk as far down to you as I could but I simply need to find an 89 to translate what i'm saying.
As for my friends, let me add I don't have any "stupid" friends. Clearly this is why we don't get along.
"That is where the difference lies, because my buddys TV retains the aspect controls. probably just some type of logic processor or something that can figure it out, or maybe as the HD box sends it out over 1080i it sends a flag to mark it as SD so his tv enables the aspect controls. That is just a guess, i really dont care how his TV lets him watch SD quality over 1080i and allows him to use aspect."
I've explained this to you twice, when are you going to read and have it sink in?
"Either way, the FIX was not in the tv, it was a HIDDEN menu on the COMCAST BOX that you cannot access while the comcast box is turned ON, it can only be access by hitting menu when the box is OFF, and it takes you to a menu that is not otherwise available. All i needed to know was where the hell that freakin menu was hidden, and presto i had it."
Never said the fix was in the TV, you said you wanted your cake an eat it, which was aspect controls with 1080i input. So now you have a 480p input not HD, so I'm still blaming the user as the biggest problem.
"But let me just get this one thing straight, according to you, you cannot stretch/zoom an 1080i signal. So everyone with Comcast digital cable needs to use 2 seperate video inputs? They cannot watch HD then flip to an SD broadcast which is send over a 1080i singal and have aspect controls?"
Never said that, must have been someone else.
"Because guess what? Comcast HDbox ONLY sends 1080i over component if you have 1080I setup, it will NOT send 1080i and later on send 720p or 480p or 480i. it simply sends the highest resolution, which is the resolution you select on the hidden menu, and it will send SD quality over 1080i"
Let me clarify your comments on your cables system that is the case, But that was never in dispute.
"So once again cinematic, you are unable to grasp the concept of the question, you run off some other unrelated concept and pat yourself on the back for being such a smart guy. The entire question was obviously over your head."
Slappy if life was simple you'd be a role model. |
Cinematic states:
1.
"So none of you understood my posts? That's brilliant, I had two goner's read my posts and they understood. But they have +100 IQ's so maybe it was an unfair sampling."
2.
"I've explained this to you twice, when are you going to read and have it sink in?"
3.
"As for my friends, let me add I don't have any "stupid" friends.-
4.
"Slappy if life was simple you'd be a role model."
Cinematic: If you talk to everyone the way you address us, then I'd have to challenge you on #3. |
"How do you respond to someone who is incapable of understanding what you write"? Perhaps it isn't Slappy's understanding. Perhaps it is that you don't communicate very effectively. Or, maybe you were just wrong and your 3XL ego won't let you admit it.
Generally, when people say things like:
"The keyword is HDTV and something your TV is not."
"Cake and eat it= +$1000 for an HDTV plasma."
"No master of obtuseness, his tv has the equivalent 1024x1280 resolution, it is a real HDTV. Not compatible like yours."
"Edesilva has the manual and doesn't get it either, you don't have enough resolution to stretch 1080i, 720p and 480p."
A fair read is that you are saying the problem is that his TV isn't HD. That, in fact, is *not* the problem.
PS. I don't, in fact, have the manual. But, some of us sub-100 IQ types have learned how to use this new-fangled internet thing to look up manuals.
PPS. I'm guessing you don't have any smart friends either. |
Desilva,
Not fair at all I would say: What about this half?
1. "What resolution is the Component input from the cable box... 1080i? Keep in mind the black bars are generated by the cable box. So to strech an (let me add "SD") image would require more or less resolution than your TV has?, this goes for DVD too......you're out of dots brother, you only have 480x752."
Addressing the Cable box, yes?
2. "When watching the source through the COAX input, i am unable to get the HD (as expected,). When watching standard definition programming i can use the aspect button to switch from Full, Just, 4:3, and ZOOM"
What is the max resolution of the coax input?...285-325 lines
More cable box data, no?
3. "Have no idea why your menu won't pass thru the RF connection. Cable companies can be silly sometimes when it comes to chizzling customers for more money".
Call the cable company...cable box issue? yes
3. "On that it was set to pass 1080I on all signals, basically, i set the box to only put out a 480p signal which is all my TV is really capable of doing.
Gee I didn't know that, wonder who the first person was who brought that concept up."
4. "That is where the difference lies, because my buddys TV retains the aspect controls. probably just some type of logic processor or something that can figure it out, or maybe as the HD box sends it out over 1080i it sends a flag to mark it as SD so his tv enables the aspect controls. That is just a guess, i really dont care how his TV lets him watch SD quality over 1080i and allows him to use aspect."
----->I repeat: Keep in mind the black bars are generated by the cable box. So to strech an image would require more or less resolution than your TV has?" Let me add a finer point; for this feature to actually look any good.
The posting in this style has nothing to do with my ego but more to do with my desire to torture Slappy. The fact is YOU also didn't read my posts completely and while I didn't spoon feed slappy the exact answer I showed him exactly where to look and why! My original post did everything but directly answer his question and gave him the information he needed. Slappy and I go back, and he didn't read his manual so it was payback time.
It's really none of your concern. So don't take it personal. |
Have you found out why the aspect control does not with the 2900? Does it work if the 2900 is set to interlaced? I wish my monitor aspect control defaulted to full, or did not work, when the DVD player is being used. I leave my aspect control on the monitor set to wide for TV and sometimes forget to change it back to full when watching DVDs. |
Been away for a while.
Well, i really dont feel any need to say anything to cinematic, he has definatly done enough to make himself look like an idiot.
anyways.
Not sure about the 2900, i havent bought any fullscreen material in years because i knew one day i would have a widescreen tv. Really hasnt been an issue for me, ill play around with it later though. |
""you don't have enough resolution to stretch 1080i, 720p and 480p. .""
This statement from an above post is not entirely true. 480p on an ED plasma can be zoomed, stretched, justed etc. |
