One other thought as I just looked at this thread....Audion Silver Night 300b integrated. I have used their amps in the past and they punch well above others in terms of quality and sound. The EL sterling was my main amp for many years, just recently went to an Audion Special Edition with Takatsuki tubes and numerous inputs and remote.....quite stellar.
I also use a 2a3 FI -X which is amazing....less power but sublime for sound. Sometimes I think I like the 2a3 sound more than 300b, I am pretty familiar with Frank's speakers as I had the first pair here in the PNW, and I have heard the 18's at the dealer here who also represents Audion.
Message me and we can talk more if your are interested.
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@david_ten No problem! They were very responsive - I had a reply back within 12 hours and then an answer back after reaching out to Mastersound within 2 days.
The US distributor is Mofi Distribution, so I'm not surprised with the quick service!
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@mmcgill829 Thanks for sharing the info on the integrated amp from the U.S. distributor. Great to see they were responsive. The information was helpful.
Who is the U.S. distributor for MasterSound? Thanks.
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@mmcgill829
The brand does seem like it's fairly well-respected (though not very well known still outside of Europe).
Yes, I’m pretty sure the Mastersound has greater presence in the European audio market compared with North America. Although Allnic and Mastersound differ in their approach to building 300b SET amplifiers I believe both of these would sound terrific with the Coherent speakers you’re having built.
Charles
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@charles1dad Yes, definitely reassuring! I would have found it an odd choice to overtax 300b tubes, as this would no doubt result in some unfavorable opinions of them due to the replacement cost of the tubes. At sometimes 20,000-40,000 hour ratings for some high quality 300b tubes (like Takatsuki or WE), the expense can be justified, but if an amp is pushing them so hard that they are spent in significantly less time, then it becomes a big problem!
The brand does seem like it's fairly well-respected (though not very well known still outside of Europe).
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@mmcgill829
it appears 8-10wpc is expected on 120v US power, which is more in line with what would be expected
That is reassuring particularly the comment addressing tube lifespan. Their in-house built transformers are universally acknowledged to be very high quality.
Charles
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it appears 8-10wpc is expected on 120v US power, which is more in line with what would be expected.
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As an update here, I reached out to the US distributor of Mastersound, who reached out to Mastersound directly to get some clarification about my concerns on the 15wpc rating. Answers are below.
1. In speaking with MastersounD, they have given a spec at the “highest” voltage in electricity. For example, in the UK market, voltage is 220v, but in many cases, homes will have 230v or even 240v. In a more normal voltage like 220v, their power is more like 10-11 wpc. This Is still higher than what others are getting out of a pair of 300b tubes, but that is due to the in-house built transformers. These alone have been getting approx 30-40% more output of a tube as they are achieving 95% of the efficiency of the tube. The common characteristic sound of our amps are that they have more energy and dynamics than our competitors amps.
2. MastersounD regulates the 300b at a very “quiet” value without risks to the life of the tube. The 300b tube is a very delicate tube and especially during transport. That being said, they have many customers who are still on their original tubes after 20 years. It all depends on the quality of the tube.
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@mmcgill829
Your budget range will allow you to purchase an excellent quality amplifier. I’m much more familiar with the 300b genre than the 2A3 but I believe that either would work in wonderful fashion with your Coherent Audio speakers. Triode Lab uses Hashimoto transformers and chokes. I know that Allnic goes a different route with “permalloy “ iron in their amplifiers.
Allnic also believes a “bit” of NFB is desirable (Lower output impedance thus higher damping factor/DF). I’m pretty certain that the Triode Lab is purist zero NFB. Does Frank feel the added NFB is necessary or a factor with his speakers? Allnic utilizes 6 db NFB. Anyway both of these brands are well thought of. With those speakers get the best amplifier you can afford. You’ll have superb sound quality for many satisfying years.
Charles
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@charles1dad I've seen your system - looks great! I'm sure it sounds even better!
I'm mostly hanging around the 8-10k range all-in as far as pricing goes.
With some of the 300b amps like this mastersound, can find them gently used with low miles for around $5500, which leaves plenty of room to get some excellent tubes, but the power output concerns make it a bit of a risky endeavor. Even Frank switched to using this as one of his rotating amps fairly recently from what he said, so I'm not sure he will have a lot of insight into long term tube life with it.
The allnic can usually be found lightly used for around the same price point as well, and that is rated at 10 wpc output, which seems a little more in the normalish range.
Triode lab would be if I decide to go the 2a3 or 45 tube route instead. I've been eyeing the 2a3 in particular. They're beautiful amps and look very well made.
The tektron amp I was referred to does allow for tube rolling with 45, 2a3, 50, but again, just concerned with the build quality. Looking inside them, there's a lot of wiring and components that aren't supported by anything but their connections. It feels sloppy to me. I know they have a pretty good reputation as far as sound quality goes, but I just can't get over that. Even a reviewer had to re-attach things in their demo model that came lose in shipping (!), which for thousands of dollars just shouldn't be happening IMO.
Ideally looking at integrated amps since I don't have a pre-amp and it's questionable whether I would have enough room to setup mono blocks. I probably could, but it would be pretty tight.
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@mmcgill829
I'm having Coherent Audio 18s made currently, so investigating amp options that'll take advantage of their high efficiency (102dB
In my opinion based upon what I have learned about the Coherent Audio speakers you’re going to be exceedingly happy!! You are on the right course with regard to pursuing lower power but high quality built tube amplifiers. Stick with your plans as your speakers will allow this to come to fruition.
Mastersound is a very reputable manufacturer that’s been around for years and I believe that they build their own very high quality transformers. My only concern is that 15 watts per channel rating is unusually high for the 300b tube. The good news for you is that there are no shortage of other low power SET (Or push-pull) tube amplifiers to consider. You are “not “ going about this in a wrong manner.
Frank has explicitly designed and implemented his speakers to be superb partners with these types of fantastic sounding amplifiers. Have you determined a particular budget range for your amplifier? Take your time and you’ll have a splendid high efficiency speaker/low power tube amplifier audio system. My system is posted on this site. I went this route 14 years ago and there’s been no looking back.
Charles
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@jond I'm having Coherent Audio 18s made currently, so investigating amp options that'll take advantage of their high efficiency (102dB). Frank recommended two amps - this one and a Tektron amp, but I'm not too fond of the build quality of the Tektrons (they look pretty thrown together for the price they ask). I'm sure they sound wonderful, but that's a huge turn off for me. Mastersound supposedly has excellent build quality, but I'm just hesitant since there isn't much info out there about these.
Some other short list considerations - triode lab 2a3 integrated, allnic T-1500 mk2, but that's for another thread to discuss 😂
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@mmcgill829 I'd say if your speaker maker recommends the amp they obviously have experience with it perhaps they can answer your questions? BTW what are your speakers?
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I wanted to experience the 300b sound. So I got the Woo 300b amp for my headphone system. I also put in Takatsuki tubes in them. Honestly my headphone system became incredible sounding. So much so that I had a hard time listening to my $70K main system. The realism, natural musicality, detail… emotional draw. So, this caused me to completely upgrade and reconfigure my main system. Now both my main system have the same character, detail, midrange bloom, emotional connection. It is an all Audio Research Reference system… but you get the same warmth, natural sound, detail, musicality with the foundation series and even the integrated.
Let me suggest, you are going at this in the most difficult way possible. Trying to power a main system with a 300b is a very difficult thing requiring lots of big compromises. You can get the character in a main system and with lots of power by using Audio Research, Conrad Johnson, Cary, or VAC. You can then choose from lots of great speakers.
If you must experience the best the 300b has to offer… get a headphone amp and power some great headphones. You can see my headphone system and main system under userID. A fantastic headphone system will cost 1/10th thst of a main system and you can get the magic of the tube through great high power components made to power the pajority of speakers on the market.
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@charles1dad Yeah, that was my worry, especially if I plan on getting Takatsuki or Elrog tubes to put in it. At that expense for the tubes, it would be silly to put them in an amp that is going to make their lifespan dramatically less. They're just too expensive to do that.
It's too bad there's no documentation that I can find about this amp or any measurements done on it to get a glimpse into how it's operating. While I got offered one at a great price and it came recommended, with so much unknown, it's probably better to look for alternative options maybe.
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@mmcgill829
I've been considering this amp since it was recommended to me by the speaker-maker of my speakers, but I have some concerns - notably the 15wpc rating on it. As a SET 300b amp, that seems quite high. I'm used to seeing half that in SET applications for 300b, so I'm a little wary as this may negatively impact tube life - which, considering the cost of these 300b tubes, would be a dealbreaker.
These are valid concerns. 15 watts from a single 300b is very high and certainly suggests that the chosen operational points are very aggressive and pushing the 300b quite hard. In this scenario a shortened tube lifespan is very likely. The sweet spot for SET 300b is usually 6 to 8 watts per channel. Now there could be some innovative circuit that can achieve this level of power without stressing the 300b. If so I’m unfamiliar with such.
Charles
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Sorry to revive an old thread, but can't find much info on this amp online...
I've been considering this amp since it was recommended to me by the speaker-maker of my speakers, but I have some concerns - notably the 15wpc rating on it. As a SET 300b amp, that seems quite high. I'm used to seeing half that in SET applications for 300b, so I'm a little wary as this may negatively impact tube life - which, considering the cost of these 300b tubes, would be a dealbreaker.
Anyone have any experience, thoughts, insight, etc? Reviews online are all quite old and for previous iterations of this model or for the 300b SE or 845.
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This is one of two integrated amps I did not bring in to demo (the other being the Dueundici) due to the low power and lack of speakers to properly show the amplifier.
I have had the Compact 845 as well as the Evo 300B. The Evo 300B was an incredible amplifier and possibly my favorite overall integrated they made. It had twice the power and much more current though so it was able to handle some things the Compact 300B simply wouldn't.
The Compact 845 is an excellent all-around integrated and the most popular model. Even with this one, I found the amp to sound great with speakers with 2 or 3 drivers maximum. Once you started pushing four or more, the amp began losing control of the speaker. The Evo series does not suffer this fate.
The MastersounD products are very good products but they need to be in the right environment to shine.
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it got good reviews a decade ago. But at 12 watts what are you going to be powering? I love my 300B Woo amp with a lot of current powering my headphones. But you need very efficient speakers and the right sized room. Then it could be a great choice.
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SS rectification can sound good or bad like all things it depends on the implementation. I had a great tube rectified amp I now own a great SS rectified amp. I have not heard the Mastersound 300B however.
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It is solid state rectified.
I know some people insist on vacuum tube rectification, but in this case it makes little difference unless you are looking for an unreliable mushy sounding amp.
The Compact 300B is definitely neither of those. Highly reliable, dead quiet, and very very good sound quality.
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Robert, reach out to member @audiothesis He used to carry Mastersound as a dealer. All the best.
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Don't own one but the tube compliment doesn't include a rectifier - : 2 x 300 B - 2 x ECC802 - 2 x 6SN7
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