JBL K2 S9900 vs Klipsch Heritage Jubilee Horn Speakers.

K2 is on my list to audition. I heard some JBL boxes 40 years ago that I cannot forget ...i would love the Jubilees if I could find something in a smaller form factor ... been thinking about getting a horn from Ali Baba and a 2" compression driver and putting together some sort of horn bass .... any ideas?

The Jubilee has always looked interesting. The active crossover in the Jubilee allows for manual balance adjustment between the bass drivers and horn which is needed to use different amps. It also corrects the time domain. the 340hz crossover is impressively low too and It acts like a point source for much of the frequency.

how was the bass on the Jubilee (Klispch specs are worthless). I have not heard the S9900 but the extension looks severely limited. I have found bass extension to have a profound effect on soundstage. Even with the JBL 4367 that has better bass extension than the S9900 I still use subs.

If I remember correctly you are using Salon 2s. Did horns tempt you from the Revels?

@james633 My beloved Revel Salon 2 speakers are just one of a plethora of absolutely wonderful speakers out there all over the place that I could be very happy with for a very long time and the Klipsch Jubilee is just one of them. Also, the bass response of the Klipsch Jubilee was "Tremendous!!!"  No subs needed.

Kennymacc,

high praise for sure. I would like to hear/own them sometime.

I wonder if they are using celestion Axi2050 compression drivers. The specs seem to match up.

In YouTube videos Klispch confirmed the use of the Axi2050. Interesting to have such a high tech driver, probably a big part of why they sounded good.

I heard the Jubilees at the sole high end audio store in Sacramento and my jaw dropped, sublime sounding speakers.  At ~$35K for a pair, they are a veritable bargain for their SQ.  

Whitestix,

Good to hear. I was just measuring my basement door and told the wife if I buy some Jubillees I will have to remove the door frame to get them downstairs… she rolled her eyes and walked away, I would say that was a firm, yes go ahead lol.

Honestly though they are a bit out of my budget. I would want to sell some gear to offset the price. I will keep an eye out for a demo or used pair though.

@james633 wrote:

I was just measuring my basement door and told the wife if I buy some Jubillees I will have to remove the door frame to get them downstairs… she rolled her eyes and walked away, I would say that was a firm, yes go ahead lol.

Honestly though they are a bit out of my budget. I would want to sell some gear to offset the price. I will keep an eye out for a demo or used pair though.

Remember to include flower expenses in the budget as well - something tells me it might add up substantially ;) 

Would love to listen to the Jubilee's. Compared to the likes of JBL K2 and Everest they are somewhat cheaper, and more physically all-out at that - kudos. 

In YouTube videos Klispch confirmed the use of the Axi2050. Interesting to have such a high tech driver, probably a big part of why they sounded good.

Ah...ok. So, Celestion is the real hero, not Klipsch. Perhaps, it should be renamed Celestion Jubilee to give credit where it's due.

Ah, wait a sec, that driver appears to cost a 1000 dollars on partsexpress. 35k must be for the big ugly plywood box made in Arkansas (a technological miracle!).....

Deep_333

Not really any different from the JBL S9900 mentioned in the first post. It also has less than $1500 in drivers and is $55,000. It is all over priced. 

@deep_333 wrote:

Ah...ok. So, Celestion is the real hero, not Klipsch. Perhaps, it should be renamed Celestion Jubilee to give credit where it’s due.

You mean Celestion developed and manufactured the horn in front the driver and everything else? Klipsch didn’t "steal" or take credit for the Axi2050; they were simply wise enough to use the unit, and it’s openly known they do.

It does seem that the team at Klipsch (led by Mr. Delgado) developed an in-throat acoustic lens or phase plug extension in the Celestion driver, so by all accounts it has been modified to their needs.

Ah, wait a sec, that driver appears to cost a 1000 dollars on partsexpress. 35k must be for the big ugly plywood box made in Arkansas (a technological miracle!).....

For what it’s supposed to do I’m told it’s one of the best drivers around. As an outset, isn’t that the primary concern? And who needs "technical miracles" - a marketing term claimed all too often, and usually as a compensating act - when proper physics and design are in place to begin with.

Klipsch did make an interesting design tweak with their horn-loaded bass bin, in that it amplifies not only the front wave of the dual 12" woofers, but as well the ported output from their backwave - in an effort to maximize extension for a given size, I take it. Most resort to simply porting woofers, but kudos to Klipsch going with the horn-loaded approach, albeit a modified one. Did I mention they’re outboard actively configured? Another thumbs up.

And here I am thinking you were a pro-ish guy. Form follows function, anyone? If the finishing/looks keeps you from appreciating a given product (i.e.: its sound), well, only so much that can be done..

@phusis , Yeah, I am a pro-ish guy...I also do know that it costs a whole lot more (different ball game) to develop drivers from scratch (r&d, tooling, facilities, recuperation timelines, tc) and i can justify higher prices for that.  If an entity is just buying drivers from someone else for pennies on the dollar, i expect pricing to be lower.

Klipsch is not a small company with limited resources. It is either a lack of aptitude or taking the easy route/making an easy buck that I am not all that fond of.

Would JBL, Yamaha, TAD/Pioneer, etc not make their own drivers? It would be a freaking joke and downright shameful if they didn't....

There's nothing stopping you all from buying anything. I just have different requirements and standards for manufacturers and what I'm willing to pay when such standards aren’t met..

I feel sad that most new 12", 15" drivers developed by JBL, Tannoy and other companies are designed for high power transistor amplifiers. One exception is Radian Audio. For normal home listening in a mid size room don't need heavy cone 15" drivers like modern JBL. These heavy drivers are good for huge rooms, high volume listening i.e. professional usage. 

@deep_333 wrote:

Yeah, I am a pro-ish guy...I also do know that it costs a whole lot more (different ball game) to develop drivers from scratch (r&d, tooling, facilities, recuperation timelines, tc) and i can justify higher prices for that. If an entity is just buying drivers from someone else for pennies on the dollar, i expect pricing to be lower.

But what’s your product and segment reference here? Klipsch is a pro manufacturer, yes, but they also have a hi-fi division - incl. the Heritage series under which the Jubilee’s are found (apart from their (then?) pro equivalent) - and relative to the pricings of, say, JBL and anything approaching the same physical wallop of the Jubilee’s, the Everest’s come at about twice the price. Maybe not an apples to apples comparison, difficult to assess really (also depending on who you’re asking, not least the fanboys), but I’d say JBL more than have themselves paid for the R&D and what not developing and manufacturing (in Mexico) their own drivers.

Klipsch on the other hand have the balls to let the design dictate size, shape and all horn-loading, whereas JBL is focussing more on aesthetics and building their design around that - not to diminish their engineering capabilities. The Everest’s are a more exclusive looking package (and you certainly pay for it), great sounding as well, whereas the Jubilee’s can come across more "crudely" but also larger and physically more all-out, and meant for active configuration only - again, at about half the price. I don’t see how the Jubilee’s are outrageously priced compared to the competition, all things considered.

Klipsch is not a small company with limited resources. It is either a lack of aptitude or taking the easy route/making an easy buck that I am not all that fond of.

Would JBL, Yamaha, TAD/Pioneer, etc not make their own drivers? It would be a freaking joke and downright shameful if they didn’t....

At the end of the day, what’s the sound that meets the buyer? From my chair Klipsch made a smart decision going with the Celestion driver, because it gives them the opportunity to cross over to the bass horn just above 300Hz (where it’s needed, because crossing higher would have the bass horn at difficulties here), and that takes a special driver and fittingly large horn to come to fruition, not least controlling directivity that low. Mind you, they have a point source from ~340Hz on up. The only equivalent by JBL to reach that low was the 2490H 3" exit compression driver, but that was a pure midrange driver and had to be crossed not much higher than 2.5 to 3kHz, and so would necessitate and separate tweeter. BMS and B&C have coaxial driver offerings that on paper extends low, but no doubt at higher distortion levels at elevated SPL’s all the way down to 300Hz compared to the Celestion driver.

So, as a necessity from a design point-of-view Klipsch made a good decision choosing a rather unique driver offering in the world today, indeed the only one really available to them. Going about that on their own would have been a mammoth undertaking, if they would ever meet such a design goal.

Now choosing speakers from the actual pro sector is likely to see price drops, unless we’re speaking Meyer Sound and such.

Thanks you all for your comments and also your very high tech input on the contrasting differences between the drivers, crossovers and design philosophies of the two speakers. I’m not very well versed in all of the technical aspects of the Klipsch Jubilee and the JBL K2 s99000 speakers like so many of you are. But, what I am pretty well versed in is great sounding speakers.  The Klipsch Jubilee is one of those speakers that managed to capture this over 30 year audiophile’s imagination like few others. Happy listening.

I have chance to listen Klispch Jubilee on Montreal Audio show last year.
The sound disappointed me. I think the reason was because the speakers were powered by TEAC amplifiers that are not a good match for these speakers. IMHO when I think about horn speakers, especially with horn bass I mean these speakers should be driven tube amplification SET, or DHT push-pull. But most modern big audio producers built their flagship horn speaker systems for power transistor amplifiers (that I never liked). The DSP crossover also makes me suspicious. I understand that DSP can correct frequency and phase response of the speaker. BUT if I use a digital source it can be OK as DSP ADC and DAC on the same level of source DAC. If I use an analogue source, it is not analogue anymore.

@alexberger  There's a very nice high end audio shop in Sacramento California that has an outstanding Klipsch Jubilee set-up that I get to go listen to whenever I get the urge.  In this set-up, the Jubilees are powered by McIntosh SS amplification on the bottom, and McIntosh tube power on top.  And the sound that this hybrid amp configuration produces powering the Jubilees is nothing short of jaw dropping!!!  

AlexBerger,

I think you are correct I in saying this is a digital system and true analogue is lost. Klispch really does not say how the crossover works but it does not have a digital input. Does it add another digital to analogue conversion or is it done in the analogue domain (active can be analogue) . I am no expert but I always believed time delays really needed done in the digital domain.

From my own experience of using external crossovers (highpassing subs) I have found them to be very clean and it would be hard to tell in a blind A/B if they were in the circuit or not. I would guess making a passive crossover to smoother the drivers would degrade the sound as much as the active. Both muck things up a bit from a purist standpoint.

Hi @kennymacc ​​​​@james633
I think it is possible to make an analogue active crossover for Jubilees. But it will not be as easy. Time delay can’t be done like in DSP.

But I have a friend who builds DIY speakers with and without horns with passive crossovers. So, he physically moves the midrange section related to the bass section to get perfect phase alignment between drivers. In the case of Klipsch Heritage Jubilee it can ruin these speakers.
I believe Klipsch Heritage Jubilee can sound great with a good transistor amplifier on bass and tubes on midrange-treble. In audio shows and in dealer stores a lot depends on the person who set up the sound in the room. Sometimes these people don’t understand too much in sound.

I see on an audio show the room of the same dealer always sounds good even if changes his stuff. And with another dealer the sound in the room is always bad.
But I believe that the Klipsch Jubilee bass section can work very well even with a 300B SET amplifier in a reasonable size room. If the 300B SET amplifier is properly designed. 8 watt with 107dB speakers is equal to 400 watt with 90dB.

@alexberger  I really don't believe it's necessary to change anything about the Jubilee speakers, including it's crossover.  The speakers are exquisite just the way they are.   You know the old saying........if it ain't broke, don't fix it (LOL).   Also, I would drive the Jubilees with whatever turned me on.  Happy listening.   

At the end of the day, what’s the sound that meets the buyer? From my chair Klipsch made a smart decision going with the Celestion driver, because it gives them the opportunity to cross over to the bass horn just above 300Hz (where it’s needed, because crossing higher would have the bass horn at difficulties here), and that takes a special driver and fittingly large horn to come to fruition, not least controlling directivity that low. Mind you, they have a point source from ~340Hz on up. The only equivalent by JBL to reach that low was the 2490H 3" exit compression driver, but that was a pure midrange driver and had to be crossed not much higher than 2.5 to 3kHz, and so would necessitate and separate tweeter. BMS and B&C have coaxial driver offerings that on paper extends low, but no doubt at higher distortion levels at elevated SPL’s all the way down to 300Hz compared to the Celestion driver.

@phusis ...I had the 9800 predecessor ~20 years ago now. I never heard the 9900, but, i’ve heard the jubilee. There doesn’t seem to be a optimal driver <--> crossover "mismatch", so to speak on the jbl ( associated IR --> perceived resolution/clarity/etc..)

The Klipsch is perhaps eeking out a win for the OP because of the glorious Celestion driver (all credit to Celestion, not Klipsch) and the active crossover --> possible mitigation of phase shifts, prevention of perceived energy scoopouts as is typical of Klipsches.

Eitherway, it’s ok.. i’ve got 4 Yamaha PA horn underdogs keeping me in hog heaven and maintaining fullness of my wallet recently. I’ve got the jubilee beat and If the 9900 sounds anything like the 9800, i’ve got it beat as well 😏.

It’s the end execution in a room/architectural space that matters. Here’s a paper for your reading pleasure...

https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/9/322589/i_series_white_paper_en.pdf

I have reported on my own experience of Klipsch Jubilees in another Thread.

In nutshell, the experience has been indelible and one wanted to be met with again, which will happen.

Since my encounter, the owner and my HiFi Groups resident EE, has carried out some changes to drivers, but reverted back to the originals.

The new method adopted to eke more is now from the Amplification side, a Triode Pre-Amp' is being Bespoke Built to see how the signal processing downstream of the Speaker will assist the Speaker to present at the next level.

The investigations are not being done as there is a suggestion the Speakers need it to improve them, they are something special as I have mt them.

The investigations are being done, as the Speakers are totally deserved of finding the ancillaries to act as partners, that really allows them to sing at their very best.

@pindac The investigations are being done, as the Speakers are totally deserved of finding the ancillaries to act as partners, that really allows them to sing at their very best.

 I read your post as the heart of this hobby. 

While I've never experienced the Klipsch Jubilees, peoples descriptions take me back to the late 60's and my experience with my Altec A7's. Despite the level of the source and amplification components at hand their presentation in my large loft space remains a landmark sensation for me. All the best with your groups efforts.

@kennymacc

   Can you list the upstream gears for both the listening sessions of the JBL and the Jubilee?

   Would love to see what gears dealers are pairing these giants with...

@deep_333 what are you ranting about? It's a whole Klipsch design. That midrange horn is marvelous. That bass horn is incredible. No one else uses those. 35000$ for such size and performance is an absolute bargain in 2024! It usually buys you a pair of low efficiency columns with gaudy lacquered paint! Got something against Klipsch? They currently represent best value in high efficiency speakers. Ever wondered what a similarly specced / sized AvanGarde or Acapella speaker would cost?!?