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Hall and Zoller:
Nothing to criticize here. Hall is his usual, brilliant,. stone faced, immobile, self. Wouldn't hurt to see him get 'into it'. After all, he ain't playing country music.
Zoller's first name is ATTILA!! As in HUN!! Good Grief.
Cheers |
****You couldn't get into his music because you didn't have an adequate mode of transportation to get to the "Misty mid region of Wier";*****
I think that mode of transportation is ilegal here in Texas. But in the 70's, a lot of folks traveled via that mode.
Cheers |
O-10:
You do have eclectic taste.
Cheers |
Review of Donald Byrd's "Places and Spaces"
"This is not an album designed for people who want to hear ONLY hard bop, post-bop, or other styles of "JAZZ jazz". It's not designed to showcase stunning, transcendent horn playing. It's for fans of sophisticated, plush, funky R&B."
--Amazon Reviewer.
Well said. Check out the Jazz jazz comment. Gotta love it. You have Fusion-Jazz, Rock-Jazz, Funk-Jazz, Soul-Jazz, Free-Jazz, Avant-Grade-jazz, and now we have Jazz-Jazz., Brilliant!! Thats the kind we all know and love.
I will use this from now on.
BTW, the clip was nice.
Cheers |
Frogman, according to some, "Fusion" is not jazz. Since I'm not in the defining business, I'll leave that to you, and anyone else who's posting on this thread; but, the 70's most certainly was the decade of "Fusion". When almost all of the "high profile" artists in jazz were engaged in some form of fusion, even Horace Silver, just not the same kind as Herbie, how can you call it any other way?
Enjoy the music.
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Frogman, I have this LP titled "Silver and Percussion", I like it, but since we've engaged in this conversation about "Fusion", I don't know whether or not we can call it "Fusion". Since on one side it fuses elements of Native American with jazz, is this fusion; and on the other side it combines elements of African music. Although this was done many times in the past, we never called it "Fusion", and that's why I was reluctant to get into this decade; because of all the con-fusion. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGivttfAGlU&list=PL872DDBDD38965152Enjoy the music. |
I warned you people. You can't say I didn't warn you!! I said, "if we keep going on like we're going, we will sooner or later, piss off Chazro":. Now, look what you have done! There will be hell to pay for this!!
Acman3: You didn't miss much. The clip we discussed had Hitler on Piano, Himmler on Bass and Goering on drums. They played 'OstFront Blues'.
But I did learn something from the diatribe. Three more Jazz types to add to my list.
1. European Jazz
2. Modern Jazz
3. Nazi Jazz
I think European-Jazz and Nazi-Jazz, are one and the same.
Cheers |
Well, while I have not been innocent myself, I think that infrequent comments on a thread (out of context) should be kept a impersonal as possible. Having said that, there is truth to what Chazro says; there IS a misunderstanding about modern jazz. I and others have, one way or another, tried to point this out. That is the reason that the most productive and interesting approach to discussion should be more from the standpoint that I tried to outline a few posts earlier: more from an attempt to uplift the standard of awareness of what makes good music and good musicianship, and less from the "if it feels good, it must be good" mentality; and, PLEASE, before the barbs start flying, notice I said LESS of, not devoid of. As Schubert correctly pointed out (and to paraphrase), excellence is reached through a marriage of emotion and intellect.
Chazro, if you're still out there, I would like it if you would stick around and contribute. I do feel that this thread could use more diverse input to make it less of what is, at times, mostly the type of discussion that is no more than a conversation between two people. I mentioned previously that it seemed to me the thread was at a milestone of sorts; I hope I am not mistaken. |
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O-10:
Jutta Hipp.
I remember her from back in the day. I have her Blue Note LP, "At the Hickory House".
If I recall correctly, she eventually pulled a 'Miles' on us, and left Jazz and went into working as a seamtress.
That was a nice Clip, thanks mostly to Zoot. Had he had a proper first name, he might have gone all the way.
Trumpet players and Sax players are the gunslingers of Jazz, so you gotta have a name befitting that image.
Cheers |
*****The 70's was a tough decade for pure jazz, ******
Very true. I noticed that if you google 70's Jazz, seems as if every link comes up with the word 'Fusion' in it. I also notice a lot of artist just didn't seem to record in the 70's. Sad era.
BTW, the correct term for pure, or real Jazz, is 'Jazz-Jazz.'
Hey, you gotta go with the flow, so the current hipsters can understand what we are talking about.
Cheers |
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Acman, Duke Jordan's flight to Denmark was outstanding. He visited Copenhagen and this was followed by his decision to make the move as an expatriate to Denmark; the guy had to drive a cab for awhile in New York to make a living.
Enjoy the music.
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O-10, no need for con-fusion; while a marriage of any two styles can be called a fusion, its probably wise to keep the term to mean jazz-rock fusion which is as most understand it. There is little by Horace Silver that I don't like. BTW, the tenor player on that cut is the "some guy" that some guy said some of us "went gaga over" a few posts ago. Loved the Hutcherson clip, thanks. |
O-10, as you said, nice groove on the Jutta Hipp clip. However, I think there's a reason why she takes only takes a couple of choruses to Zoot's four. She has been posted before and my feelings haven't changed; a decent, but unimpressive player with great sidemen. |
Acman3, you are still on a roll; some great stuff posted; thanks. The Gary Burton clip is as much of a contrast with the Elvin Jones clip as is possible. One very intellectual and, as you said, more out there; the other (Jones) earthy and visceral. BTW, as I am sure you know, that was the same band as on the "Live At The Lighthouse" clip I posted a couple of days ago. Keep em coming. |
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Frogman, the link wouldn't work on my main computer, but somehow works on my iPad. How weird .
Yes, I love that Corea recording! I have had Return to Forever "Musicmagic" in high rotation for a few weeks.
What cartridge are you using, or have you gone digital? |
Yeah, very weird. New IPad arrives in a day or so; don't like the Kindle at all, it does strange things. I did find (think) that if one copy/paste the URL link into a new search it usually works.
"Have you gone digital?" Horrors!!! No. Well, only when I have no choice for a recording I really want or need. I am using either a Shelter 901 or Acutex 420 STR, or Empire 4000D III, or Vandenhul, or.....what are you using? |
Frogman, remember, we can stay in this decade as long as you like, or leave anytime you get ready.
Enjoy the music
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Frogman, all of your recent links have been bad. Name the selections, and I'll look them up.
Enjoy the music
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*****I heard the incredible Michael Brecker; perhaps the greatest saxophone virtuouso to ever live (really!) and who would become the voice of fusion saxophone.*****
He could have been. I would go so far as to say, he is Fusion!! His contributions to Jazz, are exceeded only by those of the Trumpet Virtuouso, Maurice Andre.
Cheers |
**** we can stay in this decade as long as you like, or leave anytime you get ready.*****
Wow!! You Folks ready to move on so soon? I thought we would be talking about this wonderful and interesting music for months!!
I'll see you guys when you complete the loop. I'm brushing up on Jelly Roll as we speak.
Cheers |
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Pray for me, Cassandra Wilson is at the Dakota in Mpls, tonight and I can't get a ticket-SOB ! |
O-10, IPad arrived just one hour ago. I will repost. |
Rok, I think that as suggested recently, you really must be a troll; I don't think it's possible to be able to read and write (sort of) and be such an idiot. Anything positive or insightful to contribute? |
Schubert, I feel bad for you as I'm a big fan
I myself would go there and try if it is not too far away.
Good luck, I hope it's not too late. |
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Chazro, I Went back over the postings to see if you ever posted anything unrelated to your love affair with Rok, and I was pleasantly surprised to see that you made some worth while contributions.
"Birds got to fly, fish got to swim"; by now, everyone should know that Rok's got be Rok's.
I'm not saying that is good or bad; I'm saying this is the "jazz show", and not the "Rok show", but it's being turned into "The Rok Show".
When two guys are rolling in the mud, it's hard to tell the good guy from the bad guy.
Enjoy the music.
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O-10, I always appreciate your attempts to bring calm to the proceedings here. You are correct, we do know that Rok's gotta be Rok; same as everyone. I would say that Rok insists on being Rok with little interest in filtering his comments; comments which are, at worst, sarcastic, provocative and disrespectful of those he addresses or their message; and sometimes completely out of touch with the reality of the subject we try to discuss. Case in point, and I use a personal example only because it's recent:
To suggest that Michael Brecker, a player that just about every current significant musician and critic considers to have been if not the, then certainly one of the most influential jazz saxophonists since John Coltrane, has contributed no more to jazz than a classical trumpet player is so ridiculous that it transcends being an expression of personal taste and should be considered nothing more than provocative rabble rousing. We all post on the thread because we feel passionate about this music . There is clearly room for different opinions and viewpoints, but I don't think that anyone should have to endure the kind of sniping that he routinely does without reacting. The net effect of Rok "being Rok" is the derailment of the discussion into "the mud" and the inevitable return to the Blue Note, Wynton, or Proms clips. As one of our contributors pointed out a while back it ends up feeling like a kind of bullying and return to "the Rok show". It's really a shame because of Rok's obvious and undeniable passion for ONE slice of the total pie. The pattern is as obvious as it is in the audio side of things: why participate in an audio forum if one is going to be so anti-audiophile and derisive towards the interests of others? The same can be said here.
Although I certainly would prefer not to, I can deal with occasional rolling in the mud with Rok; it doesn't change the facts. But obviously not everyone can or is willing to deal with the mud and its a shame that the thread loses interesting participants as a result. As I have done many times before, I would encourage Rok to reconsider his stance and his attitude. I know you're out there, Rok. |
Aficionados:
I agree with the comments of O-10 and The Frogman, concerning my conduct. Message received and understood. My apologies to all.
Cheers |
Frogman, could you re-post 03-10-15 links "No discussion of 70's fusion would be complete without........"
I'll respond after I give them a listen, and since you prefer in depth responses, that's what I'll give them.
Enjoy the music.
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We began to form our musical tastes from the time when we were jumping up and down in our baby crib after hearing our favorite music; some of us even did the "Baby Boogie".
Later on in high school and college our musical tastes became more defined. What years we went are very important. My musical foundation in jazz was laid in the summer of 56 at my cousin's apartment in Chicago.
I'm sure everyone has heard the story about the blind men and the elephant; the one who felt the legs said the elephant was like a pillar, the one who felt the tail said the elephant was like a rope, the one who felt the trunk said the elephant was like a tree trunk. When it comes to music we are similar to those blind men, and we believe our perception of reality is "The Reality", when it's only our perception of reality.
Once you realize all of this, you understand how we all can be so different; the problem lies in not allowing room for the other man's perception.
Enjoy the music.
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