Rok, maybe we should try (at least on sidelines) to define what exactly makes us like some music? The guy on the other thread (Maghister, I believe, the one that likes Bakre/Evans) tryed to write something about it. Maybe we should ask him to drop by and say hello? Here is few number just for you Hope you did not hear them before Roy Brooks 'The free slave' https://youtu.be/t1ay4rmkE1sBobby Bryant 'Aint doing to bad' from 1967. https://youtu.be/gK6n0ixvsJM |
Alex:
Most of your posts are new to me. Both the music and the artists. Including the two you just posted. I think it's because of the record labels. For some reason, most of my music collection is on the 'usual suspect' labels. Probably because I buy the 'usual suspect' artists.
Cheers |
Alex, let me tell you about something that was really painful, almost brought me to tears. I was telling a professional musician how good another professional musician was who happened to be a personal friend of mine.
"He was good, but he wasn't that good", responded the musician I was talking to.
"I'll show him", I thought, I'll find some records that will change his tune.
I scoured the best record store in town, and talked to the owner who I have known for a long time. He was familiar with the artist, and told me he had every record that artist had recorded, and that I could listen to them.
I was familiar with the records he offered, but I was looking for more; something that was recorded after the summer of 69. There was nothing to be found. I had heard the most fantastic music, this musician had ever played, and I heard it all live. Of course I had heard him live many times before, that was nothing new, but the music he was playing that Summer was new, as well as the way he was playing; I was spellbound every night I saw him, which was almost every night he played during the Summer of 69.
He got sick and died before he recorded a single note of that music. I recall he played center stage at the 4th of July St. Louis Fair, and got rave reviews. I can't find that either. I had to go back to the professional musician with nothing.
BTW, that local professional musician was a very good pianist who had a photograph resume which included many of the musicians we talked about when they came to St. Louis with out a pianist and needed one.
Although I saw him every weekend at different places for years, I can only remember his middle name, which was "Dewey". Another friend of mine who went to school with him told me the reason he didn't go on the road and become famous was because of his beautiful wife. (now that friend is deceased) Famous or not, he made a good living here in St. Louis and had a beautiful wife and a lovely home. That's a lot better than Grant Green who did become very famous. (For all I know, Grant Green might have had a beautiful wife, but he wasn't rich)
I always thought fame and fortune went together, what do I know?
|
Trent, just catching up this evening. A few things: Welcome. I'm a newbie too. In spite of some of the bickering that goes on here, this thread will enrich your life. YT has a treasure trove of films of live performances, many of them with respectable audio tracks. Downright mesmerizing, especially if you appreciate live performances. YT's value is immeasurable. Re: "Girl from Ipanema," you posted that excellent link we just discussed on the Steve Hoffman site a month ago: "'The Girl from Ipanema' is a Far Weirder Song than you Thought." This is a very rigorous review of the innovative nature of this Jobim classic. For convenience: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFWCbGzxofUSome folks are dismissive because of the ultra-cool, unemotional performances that were such a craze in the early 60s. But, in terms of composition, it's fascinating stuff. Stan Getz got it. Nice Desert Island list. I'm still wondering how we're going to power our turntables when we're washed up. |
Rok, you always buy the usual suspect music and post the usual suspect artist.
|
People here feel that a streaming service would be a waste of time.
|
you always buy the usual suspect music and post the usual suspect artist.
But boy o boy, what a list of suspects!! Cheers |
Trent, no problem for me, I do not use pc audio, but have enough time to check the titles somebody posts. Ytube is handy because you can listen to the while reading actual thread. Op, I am joking, of course.(re Gom) By the way, thanks, that is a nice compliment for a white boy from other continent. Like I said, I just dig in true sence of the word ( I have large book as well) and when I hear somebody that I like I go after his recordings as a leader and sideman. Its time consuming sometimes, but I guess we all have lots of spare time now....and who knows, maybe in my past life I lived somewhere else,ha,ha Op, here is one you might like Jimmy Forrest ’Black forrest’ with G.Green https://youtu.be/IWVNjGFLpmkwhole album https://youtu.be/XTNxCCyplQkedit.Rok, Than what do you think when you listen Acman's posts? He has the most eclectic taste. I always thought that mine posts are very straight forward jazz... |
Never heard of Roy Brooks, but I must have that record.
Marty's on the Hill was a top jazz place in L.A. during the '60s, located at the top of Baldwin Hills on LaBrea. Bossa Nova hitmaker Walter Wanderly (“Summer Samba,” 1966) makes the scene.Jul 11, 2007
Been there.
|
Alex, that Jimmy Forest was so beautiful and nostalgic; it was recorded in 59, when there were so many nightclubs to spend an evening sipping drinks and listening to good live music; now, our cities are gone.
|
People here feel that a streaming service would be a waste of time. That's okay with me. I'm not evangelizing for anything. Just addressing why I'll probably differ from what seems to be the usual practice in the thread. YT has a treasure trove of films of live performances, many of them with respectable audio tracks. Downright mesmerizing, especially if you appreciate live performances. YT's value is immeasurable. Oh, sure. I've watched a good few of them. I'm just saying it's not where I go to listen. When I find something and come here to post about it, I probably won't be coming from YT. I'll be coming from Roon. If people want to go to YT to find it, that's great. I just won't have a link. Re: "Girl from Ipanema," you posted that excellent link we just discussed on the Steve Hoffman site a month ago I'll have to check that out. Thanks. I used to watch/read his camera reviews. Nice Desert Island list. I'm still wondering how we're going to power our turntables when we're washed up. Thanks. I could whittle it down if I spent some time trying, but nobody put any limits on me. :) We can run our turntables like a pottery wheel. Sit there and kick the flywheel. Want to play 78s? Kick harder. |
In 59, Grant Green was playing the local clubs in St. Louis. |
Now, I remember, Jimmy Forest was playing the local clubs around St. Louis as well; there were a lot of clubs in the St. Louis area. |
Maybe my first Jazz purchase. Hanau, Germany 68-72. Sansui Receiver, Dual 1229Q table, JBL 4311 speakers. Like a lot of people I started with the Soul or R&B Jazz. Probably the only album I have ever owned on the Cadet label. I think the musicianship of the usual suspects is much, much better. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mfl5AVTrMfESome folks like nightclub Jazz, drinking and women. Partying. I prefer to listen to Jazz played in a studio or concert hall. Cheers |
Trentmemphis, my computer play-list runs 24 hours a day everyday. I just add or delete music according to mood. When I get a new record I add it.
Maybe our collections are very large with mostly 'killers', and if we listened to roon, we would miss listening to the killers in our own collection.
Would "roon" have played the albums Alex posted?
|
Rok, Than what do you think when you listen Acman’s posts? He has the most eclectic taste. That is what is known as understatement!!! A great thread member. He never starts 'Ruckuses'. He turned me on to this, which I purchased: Lester Bowie’s Brass fantasy -- I ONLY HAVE EYES FOR YOU ECM label https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ney1VWrcywThe CD is much, much better. Highly Recommended. Cheers |
Maybe our collections are very large with mostly 'killers', and if we listened to roon, we would miss listening to the killers in our own collection. Well, again, I'm cool with that. I'm not saying anybody's doing it wrong. Whatever works for everybody, go with it. Would "roon" have played the albums Alex posted?
Based on what it has recommended already, I'm virtually certain the answer is yes. |
|
Alex, **** Does anybody compose ’classical’ music today,for exmp. in 18th centuty idiom? Or in any other, from the past? Is there a significant difference in orchestral or small ensemble compositions betwwen music from the past and today? I am asking, because of discussions that are happening here regarding new and old jazz. The sam type could be led about any popular music or form from last century. Why are people so sensitive about jazz? **** Great comment and great question. Everything that has been discussed here about Jazz in regard to the PROCESS of “influences and “evolution” of the music and the various defined “periods” or “eras” of the music’s popularity can be said about “Classical” (in the broader sense) music. The parallels are many. You mention the 18th century. In the 18th century there were two major and overlapping eras represented, the tail end of the Baroque era and the first half of the Classical (the more specific use of the word) era; part of evolution of the genre and same could be said of, say. the ‘30/40’s in Jazz: Swing to Bebop. Throughout the decades and centuries there have been composers who compose in what could be called a “neo-(fill in the blank) style. Sometimes there can be a preponderance of a neo style such as what happened in the time between the two world wars when there was what became known as the Neo-Classical era. This was a move toward the order and melodicism of the Classical era and away from the disorder and atonality of the then current Modernist Era, which itself was a reflection of what was going on in the world in general. A familiar progression; as in Jazz. Keep in mind that, while this is actual analysis and not an opinion, this is all from a musicological standpoint. Listeners’ perceptions, depending on the amount of exposure to any one style and/or personal preferences may not be in sync with this. Example: some might be surprised to learn that, for instance, Igor Stravinsky was a neo- Classical composer. Yes, today there are composers who compose in the neo-Classical or neo-Baroque (and others) styles. While the music may not sound just like Mozart or Bach it most definitely uses compositional elements used in the music from the Baroque and Classical Eras and follows many of their compositional formulas; similar or even the same compositional “form” and similar use of melody. Many of Hollywood’s music scores are in a neo-Classical style; sometimes along with other more modern elements as well. You ask if there is a “significant difference” between chamber or orchestral music of the past and today’s. The “eras” represented, including the current, will obviously have significant differences in style which will be expressed compositionally. As the various eras (styles) moved chronologically to the present, broadly speaking there has been a movement toward more atonality and a more “adventurous” (more complex) rhythmic signature; and, in some cases a deliberate attempt to do away with a clearly defined rhythmic signature altogether. Composers always build on what came before and “push the envelope”. Just as in Jazz. As far as instrumentation goes, there will always be certain classic (not Classical) instrumental combinations, like the string quartet, but one of the trends is to explore new and different instrumentations by way of the inclusion of the more “exotic” instruments including the electronic. Why are people so sensitive about Jazz? I would say that they are no more sensitive than those “Classical” music listeners who think that nothing good was composed since the mid-1800’s or so. Again, a familiar theme. |
Frogman, Rok asked about "pure Brazilian"; all the Brazilian I know is "Afro-Brazilian", even when they leave the Afro out. What would be pure Brazilian? And could you find an example of "pure Brazilian" on YT?
|
Keegiam, I never paid over five bucks for a used LP; I need some pointers on how to buy used LP's for big bucks, you seem to know, steer me in the right direction.
|
O-10, I don’t believe Rok asked a question at all. With respect, I would prefer to not get into a discussion about something that some other member supposedly asked or said. RA alert! RA alert! *
I don’t know what you mean by “pure” Brazilian. Technically, the only “pure” music of any country is its indigenous music. In the case of Brazil, it would have to be pre-European and pre-Afro influence. After those, it’s all part of the melting pot; just as it is here in the US. You mentioned that you were listening to a Milton Nascimento recording before reading my post on his recording with Hancock. Which was it? He has many recordings that are much closer to a Brazilian aesthetic than the one I posted. I will post some that I think are more representative of a Brazil aesthetic later.
* Ruckus Alert 😊 |
|
|
O10, you seem confused. I recently bought an original, unopened copy of "Changes Two," which means it isn't "used."
|
Today is my day of confusion, but that's what happens when a person gets old; they get "old and confused". It's bad enough to get old, but it seems that confusion has gone along with my old age.
Just everybody skip any questions I ask, because I'm old and confused.
|
Not at all. When you stop wanting to listen to Jazz, then I’d worry. |
|
acman3, within the first 30 seconds, I thought I was listening to McCoy Tyner, who mesmerized me at so many live performances (usually from 6-8 feet away). That's a more than good thing - this is a very energetic, emotional piece. Great find, thanks.
My compatriots and I were always the first patrons to arrive for McCoy's shows. It was uncool of us to grab the closest table with the best view of the keyboard over an hour before showtime, but we had our priorities. The unsung, amazing Avery Sharpe always set up to the right the piano. Absolute bliss.
I'm recalling these memories to highlight my appreciation of Makhathini's music. Wonderful.
|
|
|
|
|
|
2nd-
Ambrose Akinmusire
Happy Listening! |
Keegiam, beautiful clip with Jimmy Forrest. What a tone! And good catch on the McCoy-like playing on Acman’s clip. I had the same reaction until it was obvious that there wasn’t quite as much power, but the chord voicings are McCoy all the way. Acman3, great clip on the finding of the Rollins tapes. Wow! Interesting to hear the players’ commentary. A while back I made a comment here that one of us “grumpy old men” made fun of. That with Rollins there is always a sense that his sense of time is so strong that the rhythm section plays to his pulse and not the other way around as is usual. Exactly what the players on those sessions describe. Amazing and iconic player. Fast forwarding from Forrest about 60 years to the present. I’ve been checking out this tenor player over the last couple of days. Total monster player who has a similar rhythmic power as Sonny. Well, similar...there’s only one Sonny. https://youtu.be/WkxwvNF50AQhttps://youtu.be/5MK3MnuFZ20https://youtu.be/QXOPhN4AFhAhttps://youtu.be/YWpwVAqGSHchttps://youtu.be/DUnpaDeFJog |
|
Mary Jo,
Thank You Jazz Queen, for showing us the future. I was listening to Louis Armstrong on my rig when I opened your post. I thought I was in one of those Star Trek, tears in the space-time continuum.
I don’t understand why they insist on calling it Jazz. Showing disrespect I guess.
Cheers
Make sure you read the comments on the clip. I am not alone. |
|
frogman, thanks for your comments. Alex posted the Jimmy Forrest, so I hereby re-direct your praise to him (and add mine as well).
|
MJ, is your Yoko post related to today's 40th anniversary of the unspeakable?
|
I like the Vincent Ingala Albumn especially his song Crazy. I also like the Michael Wollny Trio Welltentraum Albumn Released in 2/25/2014. Especially his song Little Person. His bass string reaches really low and it is a great piece to play when testing how the low end sounds on a system. Incredible jazz piece. |
frogman, amazing playing by Frahm. He's new to me, thanks!
The last one (the scorcher) - I opened it and thought "wow, short track at 2:23." After a few seconds I switched to "is he going to keep this up that long?" (BTW, at 1:08 looks/sounds like a brief misfire for a second out of 2+ minutes - wow again.) Will check the other tracks out more fully tonite.
|
Rok, I've read it, can't stop laughing... |
MJ, is your Yoko post related to today's 40th anniversary of the unspeakable?
Yep and I could not help myself posting...Do not say that to anyone, please. |
Thanks for pointing that out, Keegiam.
Hey, Alex!!! Nice Jimmy Forrest clip 😊 What a sound. Beautiful. Btw, hope my comments re “Classical” were helpful.
|
Re Yoko Ono/Zorn:
Funny, I don’t see the word “Jazz” anywhere in the titles or credits. Got through a bunch of comments. Nope, can’t find the word Jazz anywhere. Maybe.......,just maybe, it is not and is not intended nor presented as Jazz. Why the outrage?
It is funny, ‘though. |
Re “the anniversary“. It WAS her husband.
|
Why the outrage? I’m not outraged. In fact I am lmao. What it is, is the logical conclusion / destination, of all the noise posted on this site. You can’t pick and choose. "You got to dance with who you brung. " (Old Texas proverb). Cheers I could have sworn Zorn considers himself a Jazz player. Guess not. |
@schubert :
Blood bath (heads rolling), imminent at Ft Hood.
Cheers |
