Larry, welcome to modern hifi. You have touched in some manner here on several hot topics.
1. I hear a difference between Tidal and CDs, and the same digital files saved to my computer server on both my systems. Generally, Server > CDs > Tidal. This is with the upgraded subscription. I don’t notice that much difference with Tidal served on my computer via ethernet (I.E. “hard wired”) or wifi, or via my iphone, with all feeding DAC via USB cable.
2. Your Arcam does likely have a better DAC with better jitter control than the internal DAC of the Oppo 203, which is optimized for video. So it is not surprising you find better sound playing CDs through the Arcam’s DAC via HDMI versus RCA cables from your Oppo, regardless the quality of the RCA cable. The RCA cable can’t fix mistakes upstream. You might try running a (single) coaxial digital RCA cable from your Oppo’s coaxial out to the Arcam’s coaxial in to see if that sounds better than the HDMI cable. Simpler cable with only function to deliver digital sound.
That said (number one), I have an older Arcam receiver than yours, and I find that I like the internal DACs better for Bluerays and DVDs than for CDs spun from my consumer grade Samsung Bluray player - all via a decent HDMI cable. CDs played through my external Arcam irDAC via optical cable from my modest Blueray player, and decent quality RCA cables out of the DAC to my Arcam receiver, sound better than straight from the Blueray player to the receiver via HDMI cable. The difference is not subtle.
All this makes me think the internal DACs in the Arcam are optimized for multichannel and higher resolution recordings on DVDs and especially Blurays. Get one of the Guitar Festival Bluerays and you will see what I mean. It also makes me think you might get better two channel sound by adding an external DAC between your Oppo AND your Apple TV (Via different digital cables running to the same DAC) and your Arcam receiver. The Arcam is a fantastic amp and home theater reciever, but for two channel you can do better with an external DAC. Instead of spending $5000 on a set of cables, spend under $2,000 on a Benchmark or Chord or some other well-regarded DAC, and your system (including whatever speakers you currently have) will sing like you’ve never heard it.
3. That said (number two), I hear a noticeable difference between different digital, RCA, speaker or AC cables. Even inexpensive systems benefit from upgraded cables. Be smart, set a reasonable budget, and try some different wires. The Cable Company will lend them to you for a fee if you want to rent and try before you buy.
good luck,
kn |
@fleschler,
Thank you for your recommendation on GroverHuffman cables. They are reasonably priced and appears to be a well thought out design. With 60 days return policy I will try them in very near future.
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Thanks for confirming my thought on speaker wire and interconnects. I purchased a pair of Tara Labs for $240 and find them to be sufficient. However, I have not heard the difference by comparing these to more expensive speaker wire.
Didn't realize a DAC can make such a difference. I wonder what DAC's you would recommend and at what cost. Again, would someone gain a lot more by investing in a more expensive pair of speakers? I still we never forget how incredible the SALK Encore3 Song speakers sounded at the RMAF priced at $6,000. Just wish I had been able to listen to them before I purchased mine. They would have been well worth the wait. I don't know if anyone knows Jim Salk, but he is the real deal. However, the longer I am involved in this hobby, I cannot believe how many speaker manufacturers there are out there. It still would be nice if dealers carried a full line of speakers so I could listen to all price ranges to hear the difference and then determine if the more expensive ones are worth the investment. I also still think if speaker manufacturers chose a select number of dealers to carry their line, they would be able to sell their more expensive speakers if they consigned them. Perhaps offer a 6 month consignment time line. This in turn would motivate the dealers to sell them before the time runs out. |
My approach is that overall system synergy between all of the parts from the breaker box to the wires to the collection of equipment to the room construction to the seating position is more critical than the particular parts. I have heard systems >>$100K that left me cold and systems that cost 1/10 that much that had me in seventh heaven. Its a matter of how all the parts work together in your room with your ears.
Starting with the speakers is a common place because that is where the sound comes out, and speakers may editorialize the sound more and interact more with your room than other pieces. Next to the speakers, the source, turntable or DAC, add the most “flavor”. But having a great speaker with a noisy or weak amp, or a stridant DAC will only paint you a terrific picture of upstream weaknesses. Balance, balance, balance.
I provided a couple DAC brands and a budget target for you to consider, above. More than that would require some thought. |
Qobuz is as good as a CD if content is CD or better HR. The problem was they dont have many songs. If they did, my CD player would be on Audiogon. =)
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Here are some DACs between $1500-$3,500 I think would surpass the DACs in your Arcam. If you are all in on digital music, it would be worth it to check these out. Which is for you depends on your budget, personal tastes and synergy with your other gear and your room.
-Auraluc Vega
-Bryston BDA-3
-Chord Qutest
-HoloAudio Spring Kitsune Tuned Edition Level 3
-iFi Pro iDSD DAC
-Mytek Hifi Brooklyn DAC+
-Naim DAC-V1
-Schiit Audio Yggdrasil
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Oh, and add the Benchmark DAC3 HGC to the list above. |
Don't rule out Qobuz if you talk about stream. You should try Qobuz studio 192khz/24 bit. Compare to CD, it is day and night. Try it yourself.
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I personally would be scared to purchase used speakers. How does a novice even know they are in perfect condition? Why is the party selling them getting rid of them? That would indicate they were not satisfied with the sound quality.
I wonder if anyone has ever heard a pair of SALK Song3 Encore speakers? For $6,000 they were much better than a pair of $60,000 speakers I heard at the RMAF. They are certainly better than any of the Focal speakers I have heard. Obviously, no one in this discussion group thinks much of Focal otherwise you would constantly hear people bragging about how great they are. They are also over priced. However, I do like their tweeters and their mid voicing. I think they are designed to hear classic music and vocals such as Diana Krall or choral music. |
“Why is the party selling them getting rid of them?”
I wouldn’t be worrying about this too much. People change / upgrade / downgrade components for various reasons. The key is to read available specs and reviews for the component or speakers you’re considering before you make a purchase. Next thing you need to make sure that used item has no operational or cosmetic flaws and what’s being included in the sale.
SALK Audio makes great speakers and are reasonably priced. I am not sure about the analogy of $6K vs $60k....i think this kind of broad generalizations ( like any Focal speakers ) is too vague and carries no weight. I personally don’t care for low end Focals but once you get upto mid to high range they are pretty good.
You find Focal’s overpriced, no argument there but so is everything else that carries ‘fat’ dealer margins. Plus Focal’s are being made overseas, so one must account for import duties and freight costs.
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I've sold at least a dozen mid-fi pieces of equipment in mint condition including McIntosh MX110, Fisher 1000 preamp, Acoustat Xs, 2&2s, Martin Logan Quest and Monolith IIIs. The reason, I purchased something I liked better. I did purchase my current Legacy Focus speakers defective in that the prior owner rewired it but left out the mid-range insulation so that the speaker was very bright and forward for brass, upper voice and upper strings. Yuk. It took a few years until I found the problem (I used other techniques to alleviate some of the brightness) and stuffed the cavities with ample damping materials. Now it sounds smoooth in the upper mids. |
If you’d just bought the 205 instead of the 203... 😜
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I find CD to be deeply flawed medium and much prefer Tidal, my reference is my turntable and live acoustic music. |
I can hardly tell difference between CD and Tidal. I am now subscribe Qobuz Studio (a lot 192kHz/24bit and 96kHz/24bit), I am quite satisfied. |
I just read a review on the Legacy Focus speakers. They must be incredible. I wonder how they sound compared to Jim Salk's Song3 Encore towers priced at $6,000. To date I have not heard better. I couldn't believe how they sounded compared to a pair of $60,000 speakers I hear at the RMAF in October. I don't think anyone handles the Legacy Focus speakers in Denver, but I will be looking.
To change the subject, I wonder how people in this group feel about how important amperage/current is when buying an amplifier to create superior sound quality? For example, Parasound has a 5 channel amplifier that delivers 180 watts and 67 amps per channel while Primare has a 5 channel amp delivers 150 watts and only 30 amps per channel. I contacted Primare and the guy told me sound quality is not dependent on current. He also told me the Primare would blow away the Parasound amp. I think this guy was blowing smoke and mirrors. I wonder what people in this group think. This in itself would make for an interesting discussion. |
Someone just replied and said he thought the sound of TIDAL was better than a CD. Glad I am not the only one who feels TIDAL quality is better. I hard wired my router to my Apple TV and perhaps that makes a difference. The same person told me prefers vinyl over everything. I don't know how this is possible because there is more noise with vinyl and the needle is only able to make contact with so much area on the groove of the vinyl record. This said, you must be losing a lot of information and as a result detail. |
Agree it makes no sense that an old fomat like vinyl tops CD but there is no contest in my high end rig. I did hear the Audio Research CD9 at a show and it sounded good but home audition revealed it to be not so good. I like 16/44 redbook files though. |
