The best ampith and the best preampith shall only be as good as thine friut.
Thy goodith music giveth and lousyith music takeith away.
And so shall it be. I have spoken :) |
You may not need a stupidly expensive amp for your pre-amp because the speakers you have are extremely efficient, don't need massive power and interact well with your amp, so you can go with a very low power, lesser expensive (not all low power amps are less expensive. I know!!!) amp.
IMO Minorl has made several excellent points in his post, but this one particularly deserves emphasis (although ZD also makes a good point in response, at least when it comes to speakers having especially high efficiency). For a given level of sonic quality, the price of an amplifier will tend to have a significant degree of correlation with its power capability, and with its ability to drive speakers having difficult impedance characteristics. So how a given investment in the amp + preamp should be apportioned between those two components will tend to depend on the efficiency and impedance characteristics of the speakers that are being used. One important reason why, as I said earlier, that IMO a general purpose answer cannot be defined. 01-26-15: Wlutke
Your amp can't sound any better than what the preamp gives it. This is true. But it is also true that the preamp can't sound any better than the amp allows it to. So the location of a given component in the chain is in itself of no significance, IMO. Regards, -- Al |
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You may not need a stupidly expensive amp for your pre-amp because the speakers you have are extremely efficient, don't need massive power and interact well with your amp, so you can go with a very low power, lesser expensive (not all low power amps are less expensive. I know!!!) amp."
You're missing one point in that example. When you say that not all low power amps are less expensive. I know!!!, you have to ask why that is. When you use extremely efficient speakers, they demand a certain level of quality and experience matching components, or you'll have problems. You really need to know what you are doing when getting into high efficiency speakers. Wouldn't recommend that path for a beginner unless they fully understand what they are getting into, and have someone with experience to help. |
Great integrated amplifier....problem solved. ;^)
Cheers,
John |
I really wouldn't put much emphasis on whether the amp or pre-amp is more important. This is the grand voyage in the world of audio. You really are never done. You can take the advice of many and put more money into the pre-amp, only to find that the sound sucks because the amp isn't up to par or the amp to speaker interaction is bad. The way I have found that works for me is to keep within the price points of components and the recommendations of the manufacturers.
If you are looking at a particular pre-amp, the manufacturer will typically recommend some amps that work well with the pre-amp. Look at the prices of those amps, go audition other amps that are within that range, taking into account the speaker interactions and go for it.
For example, what amp does Audio Research recommend with their REF5SE pre-amp? I'm sure it is an AR amp, but, what is the price point? I have heard demonstrations of the REF75, REF150 and REF250 amps with the REF5SE pre-amp. But, I'm pretty sure the REF750 amp is recommended with the REF10 and 40th anniversary pre-amp.
Just a small example. I just know that it really comes down to what you like in terms of sound from each component. You may start out with components that are not really matched well in terms of costs and quality, but eventually, you will end up at the right level, because the sound just won't be right. One component just won't get you "there".
This is a dynamic hobby. I haven't seen one example (I'm sure they exist) whereby someone purchased all the equipment of the bat and each one worked for that person, without the need to upgrade to something else.
If you like mp3 quality recordings and don't care about excess compression, sound dimensionality, depth, etc., then any amp/preamp combination will do, because you won't hear the nuances anyway. But, if you do know, then you will hear problems and upgrade.
My advice is the select a price range you can afford for components, say, the pre-amp and amps are roughly the same price and start auditioning (hopefully in your home).
You may not need a stupidly expensive amp for your pre-amp because the speakers you have are extremely efficient, don't need massive power and interact well with your amp, so you can go with a very low power, lesser expensive (not all low power amps are less expensive. I know!!!) amp.
No matter what anyone says, YOU!!! have to pick a price point that you can afford first, taking into account the type of music you like, the quality of the music you like, etc.
take your time and enjoy the trip. |
I think that Zd542 got it right. If I had a given amount of money, I would invest most of the money into a good active preamp, you can then fudge a little on buying an amp.
Then there is the crowd that think that buying both components of the same manufacturer will take the risk out of matching. This is true to some degree but then it is possible the mfg could excel in making better sounding amps then preamps or vice a versa. There is no substitute for years of knowledge/experience in matching and knowing what components sound good together. |
What Almarg said. Labels on components alone like "good" or "great" mean nothing. its only as good as the weakest link in the chain and each chain is different. Lots of ways to make really good chains. Start with getting a handle on teh speaker/room interaction including an amp well suited to drive the speakers. Then choose a pre-amp (if needed, not always anymore depending on what source gear will be used).
All these things alone will have a major effect on the sound. YOu have to get the whole puzzle right which means teh right pieces that match. At minimum, you need speakers, amp and one or more sources. Pre-amp these days is optionl. A passive pre-amp is another option that can work very well if done right. It all depends. Sorry, but if you really care about how things sound rather than just listening and being satisifed, this is what you are dealing with. Good news is if you like this stuff it may be a fun journey. Otherwise, not so much. |
Assuming your power amp has no trouble driving your speakers and it doesn't do anything really bad sonically, I would say that the preamp is easily more important. Just to give a rough example, if I had $5000 to spend on both pieces, at least $3000 would go to the preamp. Keep in mind, though, that this is very general info, and in audio, there are always some exceptions.
If you're on a limited budget and can't afford a really good active preamp, a passive unit is a great alternative. There's nothing worse than having to suffer with a cheap active line stage. Especially if you're new to high end. Chances are that you won't figure out what the problem is until after you spent a lot of money. |
My opinion is that a general purpose answer can't be defined. It depends on the specific components that are being considered, and also on how synergistically they match up with the speakers, the source components, and each other.
I would emphasize, though, that the amplifier/speaker matchup is one of the most important considerations.
Regards,
-- Al
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IMHO, the preamp is more important, BUT the amplifier/speaker interface is more critical. Once you get the amp and speaker match correct, a fantastic preamp will make it even better. |
I like to have a great amplifier with a good preamplifier with same brand and generation.
The most important to remember that the goal is to increase your enjoyment of music. To me, I'm listening through a component that is going to make me happy, relaxing, and just settling into the music not the equipment. |
Pre-amps are far more important, can make a so-so amp sound
good, best amp in the world will only sound as good as the signal from pre-amp. |
Your amp can't sound any better than what the preamp gives it. Consider the preamp as the heart of the system you eventually want and put the money there. |
