How do I smooth out violins?

After reading your post and the responses, I listened to several CDs to see if I could hear anything similiar.

Beethoven Sym #9 1st movement
Bohm and the vienna Phil

Same piece but Karajan and the berliners SACD.

Julia Fischer Bach concertos with ASMF

The Fischer disc was a little fast, but the strings were easy on the ears. no complaints. Of course she was great.
The Bohm was GREAT. Very smooth. No irritation at all.
The Karajan sounded sort of harsh and strident.
Both of the Beethovens were recorded by DG.
The Bach by DECCA.

A lot of CDs are like this with big orchestras. I own a lot of them. Have not listened to them in years, once a I got a better performance and recording. Just a wall of sound that sort of grates on the ears.

I would advise you, as someone said, get a KNOWN well recorded violin heavy piece and listen. If you find it grating on your ears, then maybe you do have a gear peoblem. But remember, if your system will play at least ONE CD with mass violins to your satisfaction, then it will play ALL properly recorded CD the same way. If you modify your system to make BAD cds sound better, what will it make the GOOD cds sound like. Don't say, ' MO Better' :) Beethoven's 5&7 by Carlos Kleiber and the Vienna is considered one of the best classical recordings. Try it.
The Philadelphia Orch with Ormandy was know for it's violin section. But that was on LP. I can't believe I just said that. :) Good Luck.

Cheers

If you decide it's the speakers that are the problem I just might be tempted to take them off your hands. I would love to revisit the 1/2e's in my system.

Personally though I do not think the speakers are the culprit.

I find your question interesting in that I listen to classical music exclusively on a modest system. I too found the sound of violins too harsh.
I made two changes; I switched to a tube preamp using some great NOS tubes that rolled off the highs a bit, but still sound very open (RCA Blackplates). Strings were finally sounding very natural, and it was now easier to tell which cds were poor recordings.
I next got rid of the Audioquest Type 4 and switched to some Cardas spkr cables which sound more forgiving. The type 4 are very detailed and you might look for a more laid-back cable. It worked for my situation.

Good point to validate what the recording in question can sound like first Have you heard it sound better on a reference system somewhere?

Once you establish a reference sound, i would look at power conditioningon the preamp as a first attempt to better the sound. That can usually only help if done well. Then i would consider a good tube preamp next if still needed. I can recommnd the arc sp 16 or line stage only version for digital only. Your issue is one that i find the arc preamp addressed very cost effectively for me.

I will also support the idea of getting power conditioning and better power cords. After that I think you need better cables and CD player for classical music......

Mass string is very difficult to reproduce well with digital source. I suggest you start with the CD player. But if you want silky strings, I am afraid you might have to change over to vinyl. IMHO of course.

I think the tube preamp is a good idea along with the cables and power conditioning measures that Elizabeth mentioned.

... Massed violins in their upper registers (1500-3500 Hz) OFTEN [emphasis added] jump out from the mix and sound a bit harsh, unlike what one hears live.

As I read it the information provided does not exclude the possibility that it may be a recording issue, as Rok2id suggested.

Have you found this to occur with orchestral recordings that you know to have been recorded with "purist" microphone techniques (e.g., 2 or 3 well placed mics), and that you can say with confidence have been well engineered in other respects? Or have all of the recordings on which you have perceived this problem been heavily multi-mic'd, with the forest of microphones that are typically used for orchestral recordings released by many of the major labels?

Regards,
-- Al

Need tubes somewhere. Try a cj or quicksilver preamp or something similiar first.

I think you're going to have to play around with substitutions a bit. Do you have any friends with gear, who would be willing to bring it over? I'd focus on the preamp and source (CDP). What about your room. Is it overly "live"? I'm assuming that you hear this affect on multiple recordings, so it's not just the recording.

Maybe it's the CD, the recording itself, not the player. You should not attribute every aspect of your sound to a component in your system. Nothing will correct a poorly recorded LP or CD.

Bojack,

As you can see from the responses you are getting, opinions will vary greatly. That's to be expected since all we can do provide your with out best guesses. The only component I've owned that you have are is amp. I don't think your amp is the problem, although the high frequencies can tend to a little on the bright side. I agree with you on looking at your preamp first. Theres no guarantees, of course, but I believe its the most sensible thing to look at first. I think its a mistake to only consider a tube preamp, though. My primary focus would be on getting a good preamp; tube or solid state. Just because a preamp is solid state, doesn't mean it won't work for you.

Real 'live' violin sound is hard to hear listening to recordings, either massed or solo. To some degree you can simply charge this off to recording techniques, i.e. microphone placement. You usually are quite some distance from a violin when you hear it live, not so much with a recording where the mic is usually very near. Afar you do not get the highlighted upper mid range you often hear in recordings.

That said, many folks find tubed units can be helplful if for no reason other than tubes can have a more fluid sound. But violins can sound bright and etched using tubed units if you are not careful in tube selection, not a small chore in tuning you system. A 'warm' toned pre-amp will help, or if you go for an integrated, get one with an actual pre-amp with dedicated tubes, not just a passive pre and tubed power section which is very common, unfortunately.

Good luck. Oh, FWIW, I doubt that you will find the AAM3A a solution for your problem. Personally I'd get a tubed integrated as apposed to getting a tubed pre to match with a solid state amp. But thats just me. :-)

I have never heard your speakers, but this sounds to me like a speaker issue. Your speakers cross over from midrange to tweeter at 3 KHz. Its possible that your tweeters beam more than your midrange which would tend to make the upper frequencies stand out more. I have also heard harshness in some speakers at the cross over point. If you have a test disk that plays warble tones at various frequencies, it may be easier to diagnose if this is due to a tweeter beaming than with music playing. Just go back and forth between the frequencies above and below the crossover point and see if you notice a lack of coherence, that is, an obvious shift of sound from the midrange to the tweeter. My Magnepan 1.6QRs used to do a similar thing in the violin range where the violins would jump from the planar magnetic panels to the quasi ribbons. That lack of coherence drove me nuts.