Help with cartridge choice for Linn LP-12, Ittok turntable

I'm using a Grado AEON3 cartridge with very pleasant results on my LP12/Ekos table. Prior to the Grado, I had my Transfiguration Proteus D on the table which also sounded wonderful The only reason I changed to the Grado was out of curiosity only and it worked so well that I have been too lazy to change back.

Curious, did Soundsmith have anything to say about the woofer flutter after the rebuild?  Guesing is that something with the rebuild/change in cantilever produced a change in the resonance with the Ittok.  I suppose that it would be taking a chance on getting the Troika rebuilt again.

A few years ago, I had a chat with the folks at Audio Technica, I told them what I had used and was still not drawn in by the music in the way Linn LP12's can. They gave me this information and recommended the Art9 MC.

Tonearm effective mass (Ittok is ~11–13g) Cartridge compliance (ART9 is ~16 x 10⁻⁶ cm/dyne dynamic compliance) Cartridge weight (ART9 is ~8.5g) Using the standard formula, the ART9 + Ittok combo typically lands around 9–10 Hz, which is perfect.

I must say, they were so right, I had excellent results with Audio Technica ART9 but make sure your phono stage can handle the ART9’s low output (0.5 mV) and has appropriate gain and loading options (recommended load impedance is 100 ohms).

I now use the built in one inside the EAR 912 Tube Pre-amp, which is amazing but I also had great results before the 912 up-grade, using the Project Phono Box RS & RS Power Supply. 

Other Cartridges I have used Lyra Delos Benz & Micro Glider both worked well but I felt neither had the chops over the Art9 even though both are more expensive. Benz was a little less detailed and softer than both Art9 and Delos. Delos was very transparent but I found it a little cold and analytical.

The Art9 not as expensive as the Delos but has a wonderful balance between the two rivals I think its line contact stylus and Boron cantilever gets it to within a whisker of the Delos in micro detail retrieval but retains a sense of neutrality and balance that allows it to shine with more genres, however complex. I think it’s fantastic for the money and a genuine bargain.

Make sure you spend time with proper set up with all 3 but particularly with the Art9 do that and it will be a delight with the Linn.

I am quite familiar with the Replicant which is on a Windfeld I hear a few times a Year, the Windfeld owner also is an advocate of the FGS, which is nearly the same form.

I have heard Ortofon Cart's used as a A/B Demo, with the Replicant - FGS - FG 80 - Ogura Vital.

The System and TT>Tonearm were identical for each demo'. 

All Vinyl LP's used were the very best Source Materials.

There is absolutely no need to concern oneself about Surface Noise when the Source Material is very high quality. 

I have also been demo'd a Paratrace (shares very similar form as the Replicant and FGS ) on a few Cart's. One Cart' was a Ceramic Model from a very olden era, after a search the same Cart' minus Paratrace was purchased, as the impression made is indelible for the enjoyment that was experienced, not bad for £20 delivered.

The very best Vinyl Experience I am having in all my years, is after following the directions for Manual Cleaning in Neil Antin's PAVCR Document, my Vinyl is no linger Clean, it is Purified, and Purified Vinyl is audible. The Cleansing in relation to the End Sound, it is like a Sixth Sense in the audible realm, there is something extra but not exactly describable for the positivity it creates.

@daveyf Yes, I’m aware of how the Lyra suspension works. That’s a matter of getting the VTF right, but I set to within the suggested range and fine tune by ear. I track both my SL and Mono at 1.65 gr. 

I still contend setting up a Lyra is no more special than setting up other cartridges of the same caliber. They all need care doing so. VTF and loading always should be fine-tuned by ear. My Dynavector XV-1s is no more harder or easier for setup than my Lyra Atlas cartridges..

Based on the reference you kindly provided, setting VTA for the new Lyra does not appear appear to be any different from previous, the difference is in the geometry within the cartridge body itself.

@dwette   What I am trying to tell you is that the Lyra's with the new angle technology require a more precise set up than your run-of-the-mill cartridge to sound their best. Sure, you can set up the cartridge to a decent approximation, but you will not be getting all you paid for.

@cleeds   Go here: http://www.lyraanalog.com/lyra-new-angle.php

@daveyf Correct VTF and Azimuth are concerns for any cartridge. That's not something unique to Lyra. I give my Dynavector just as much attention for setup as my Lyras. I use a Fozgometer for azimuth adjustment, but that doesn't work for my mono cartridge, so I have to do that visually the best I can. As for SRA, I don't bother trying to get that exact. There's too much variability in record weight and cutting heads. You can only get it exact for a fraction of record playback. Agree that loading is a function of the phono-stage, ... and tonearm cable capacitance. I use 350-450Ω for my Lyra Altas cartridges.

Anyway, these are all concerns for every cartridge and not unique in any way to Lyra.

@dwette  the new angle technology of the current Lyra’s requires a very precise VTF, SRA and Azimuth alignment. I had my Kleos set up twice by two different dealers, the first got it very close, but the second time the tech was more precise and had worked with these type of Lyra’s before, the difference was not subtle. Also, I think some experimentation with loading is advised, I use 750 ohms for my Kleos, but that is also dependent on the phononstage. 

I Posted this in another Thread, it is cutting edge, in relation to be very new as a model released to the Market, it also has a very reasonable refurbish charge as well.

The user review, from a individual I know, and will say about them, that they really knows their way around audio, through what they are able to do and who they regularly associate with, is more than qualified to make such a statement. 

https://audioxpress.com/news/nagaoka-unveils-mp-700-moving-permalloy-cartridge

"  Just fitted a Nagaoka MP700. Very impressed so far, it gives little or nothing away in air and space to my Koetsu, which is a surprise, with the added MM drive in the bass. The Koetsu has a little more detail in the bass by comparison, but not a great deal in it. Only has about an hour on it so far, so hopefully will get even better. I was hoping for good things, but how good it actually is was a real surprise. " 

@porchlight1 how about a Dynavector DV-XX2 MKII

@daveyf I’m curious. Why is a Lyra Delos any more critical to setup compared to other cartridges of that caliber? And what tools does that need compared to others? It seems to me if one can properly setup a cartridge of that caliber otherwise, the Delos shouldn’t have any extra critical needs. What would that be? I’m here to learn.

I have two Lyra Atlas Lambda cartridges, but I set them up myself. I use a SMARTTractor with Löfgren B DIN alignment and a good VTF gauge, and that does the job. I have used the Clearaudio IEC alignment gauge in the past (not the plastic one).

FWIW: I think the Delos is a great suggestion for cartridges in that price range. A Dynavector would also be a great choice I think. Lyra and Dynavector both have lovely sound.

You have a system that probably tends to lean towards the warmer sound. As such, maybe consider a Lyra Delos, as it works quite well in your Ittok, plus it will off-set some of the warmth towards more neutrality. Set up with a Lyra cartridge is very critical, so be sure your dealer has the tools and ability to set it up perfectly. I think you may like the extra resolution that the Delos will bring to the party.