@tubesrule Great question! I recently had the opportunity to hear both the Salon2 and 802D3 back to back - powered by Levinson 536 amp + 519 player.
The Salons sounded invisible, effortless, and natural to me. The 802d3 sounded boomy at the bottom and a bit shrill at the top. The Revel+Levinson synergy is tough to beat. And no, I don't work for Harman :)
My 2¢ - no refunds! |
Reviving an old thread, amazingly, all these ears later the ultima2 line is still current; it's spanned the end of the B&W "D1" (simply known as D) , the 2011-2016 B&W "D2" (simply known as Diamond), and now the 2016-present "D3".
So the General consensus is that both the 802D2 and Salon2 are fabulous, however most people seem to prefer the revel salon2. Fast forward to summer 2017 now, the salon2 is still current, how do folks feel about salon2 versus the current 802D3?
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All of the above is true, and this is why B&W is a premier speaker company. However, I feel the Revels are the better speaker, at a higher price though. For $15000 (retail) you get quite a lot of speaker for the money with the B&Ws. The same can be said for the Revels. So, to me it just depends on what you're looking for in a speaker. The Revels are more neutral and accurate, imo. But, the B&Ws have better bass, imo. It's kind of a toss up, really! lol. |
Baranowski wrote 'The constant debate over B&W speakers is nuts'
Mate there is no debate really - they simply polarize a bit - that's all. Some love em - some find them ho hum for all sorts of reasons. I had a guy over while visiting a friend in Canberra who has the same speakers I have and who had just been at a B&W dealer that was gushing how great they were - he personally couldn't stand them for reasons I will not repeat. He liked my speakers a lot better. But another guy I know wrote me saying he was very concerned about all the negative comments about B&W but loved them - it was giving him pause about pulling the trigger. I had to explain to both there is no right or wrong here - there is a wide variety of tastes in Hi Fi - viva la difference I say.
Hear them and make up you own mind and check out other speakers as well so you have a baseline. Its that simple - nothing hard about it at all. No need for arguments, getting upset or anything.
All the OP needs to know is the B&W's polarize in opinion so be sure they are what you want before getting them.
Thanks
Bill |
Mr M here is the frequency responce:
http://www.stereophile.com/content/bw-802d-loudspeaker-measurements
People can make up their own mind about the amount of bass hump there is - I describe it as about 10 db from where it dips below 0 db but I won't get into an argument about it. Regardless of how you look at it such a hump is not the mark of a genuinely neutral speaker. All I am doing is pointing out some people don't like them - of which I am one. I could say have you ever thought the reason for that is they are crap - but I won't because I understand from listening to gear over many years with others how much personal preferences comes into it and there is no right or wrong here. All I am pointing out is if you are spending that sort of money you owe it to yourself to listen to other gear in that price range - that's it that's all. Oh and there were quite a few people in this thread that did not address a direct comparison. This often happens when someone posts about two specific products - some posts just address one or speak in general terms.
Thanks
Bill |
The differences between the two speakers will have to he through your ears only. If you can listen to both pairs in the same room with the same appropriate amplification. Both sound great. as a speaker should at that price point.
The constant debate over B&W speakers is nuts. the facts of B&W speakers are this...
1 B&W make their own drivers (alot of the other companies use drivers they buy from other companies)
2 The internal bracing of the cabinets is copied now by alot of the other companies. this is the b&w matrix bracing.
3 b&w's curved back of their speakers is copied by other speaker companies.
4 B&w is known for their accuracy of music reproduction, some may have heard a poor recording on the speakers and think it is the speakers fault. ever seen an older tv show say MASH, on a 1080P tv? it looks like ass, but it is not the tv's fault.
5 b&w is a larger company... everyone would have to agree that if they were a smaller company, their speakers would cost considerably more. So, if anything that should be a positive not a negative.
6 B&W have one of the highest resale prices. that should tell you a lot about the company and the quality of their products.
I believe everyone can agree on these statements, or read them in the numorus reviews. so like them or not, it is what it is. |
Bhobba. Get your facts straight. The upper bass hump is approx. 6db, not 10db. The 4db difference you describe is very large in measurement terms. If your friend measured a 10db hump then the room and/or placement is the problem. I'm not saying the B&W 802D is a purists speaker. It even has a "house" sound but then that can just about be said of any speaker line. My views of the measurements come directly from the Stereophile mag dated Dec. 2005 of which I have in front of me right now. You wonder why so many people go ga ga over them. well maybe they are fine speakers in other people's eye or ears for that matter. Stereophile gave the speakers a Class A rating. The OP wasn't/isn't interested in your preference of speakers. He wanted to find out what the comparison between the 802D and Revel Salon 2 would be. Something you did not address. |
The thing about the 802d's is they polarize. I heard them when a guy I know who has measuring equipment had them and asked me down for a listen. I walked in and immediately thought - yuck - dead grungy midrange and out of balance - boomy and bass heavy. Then he showed me the measurements - a dirty great big about 10db hump in the bass. And it wasn't just room acoustics or something like that - sterophile measured them and it was exactly the same.
Yet there are people like you that go ga ga over them so one can't really say anything in general except they polarise.
If you are spending that sort of money you owe it to yourself to hear other speakers. I do not know the Revel but the speaker I would listen to is the Rockport Mira 2 - easily in a different league IMHO - but like I said the 802D's polarize and I am one of those that simply don't get that speaker.
Thanks
Bill |
Any opinions on 800 N vs. Salon2? |
Hey Jeff, if you interested in the 802d's email me. And we can talk "offline" Email is nbeadles@charter.net. Couldn't figure out a way to contact you directly in Audiogon.
P59teitel: thanks for the link - I will read up on it. I still won't have confidence in my opinions even though it is a good starting point. The Revels do have less coloration (in my opinion) and a wide sound stage. The highs are clear and cohesive without being too forward. I would say they were ruthlessly accurate. They are like a woman with very little makeup. If the original recording is good it will sound good,if not then not. The speakers "reveal" that fact; they do not "mask" the sound. |
"I wish I had a better descriptive vocabulary in the context of describing sound. Sometimes I feel like a person who like fine wine but who cannot express it. This Chardonnay has the aromas of toasted oak and hints of vanilla. Uh what? It tastes really good."
Here ya go - study up on this -
http://www.stereophile.com/j_gordon_holt/50/index9.html
and pretty soon you'll be slingin' it with the best of 'em! |
Jeff you are accurate on your description of the B&W's, but part of your response to the Revels may be a function of amplification and/or the room. In my room (and it's a big one with high cathedral ceilings) the Revels seemed to me to have a more accurate low end (less distortion and forward presentation) than the B&Ws. They have a real "clarity" overall. I do like the warmth of the B&Ws though. No doubt. I wish I had a better descriptive vocabulary in the context of describing sound. Sometimes I feel like a person who like fine wine but who cannot express it. This Chardonnay has the aromas of toasted oak and hints of vanilla. Uh what? It tastes really good. Both of these speakers sound really good and it may be with a different room configuration the B&Ws might beat the Revels. When I get my man-shed (listening shed) built Ill know more (but my ears might be shot). I'll sell the B&W's before that project is completed. |
I'm planning on selling the 802 diamonds. I haven't sold anything yet. I tend to buy on Audiogon etc. and then hold 'em because I'm too lazy to pack stuff up and advertise. I'm sort of like a pawn shop that buys and never sells. The foam packing on the base of one of the B& W speakers was cracked and I need to get a replacement before shipping. What a pain.
Around here I have to basically buy speakers to demo them. I live in central Georgia and no place around here will carry high end (even Atlanta doesn't have much as far as I can tell). |
Try to hear what Vandersteen and Magnepan offer before you write a check....If you are in New Jersey, Audioconnection has them both. |
Nab, are you going to sell the 802 diamonds? |
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Same price point? I have not heard them (of course this is a thread on B&W 802d's vs Revel Ultima Salon 2's).
I doubt if I'd be able to get over the cabinet - I know my wife couldn't. She said that the 802's looked "alien." |
What ever you do DO NOT LISTEN to VIVD speakers or you won't be considering either of those. |
OK I'm late in - I have had both in my home for awhile and I've tested them with my equipment in an A/B format (less than ideal room though). IMO the Revel's win the contest. Only downside for me is that I think I need to improve my amplification for the Revels ("improve" really means "more power" - OK not just any power). The Revels really like lots of good power. I've had several folks whose ears I respect, do the same comparison and they all chose the Revels over the 802d's (without my prompting).
I'll be selling the 802ds shortly, hate to let them go. I still like 'em, but I need the money. I'm planning on building a "listening/man shed" and I'd like to see how they both do with more perfect acoustics, but in my room (with various speaker placements)and with identical equipment the Revels won the contest.
I wish I could test them both some more and in the acoustic shed, but my WAF is really low at this point and the testing was tough to manage (I had to do it when the wife and 4 kiddos were gone!).
Interested in any other comments you guys/gals have. |
gandme, if you are in NYC/LI area, feel free to listen to my Salon 2's (and buy them if you'd like :) |
I am also considering upgrading to Salon 2s. I owned the B&W 802Ns several years back...they made me buy back the same speakers I sold, Audio Physic Virgo IIs. I use a pair of Rel Storm IIIs w/ the Virgos and would like to save some space and go with a full range speaker. All the same speakers come up...Wilson Sasha,Sophia,B&W 800d-802d, Thiel 3.7 and Revel Salon 2. I have to deal with a tough WAF...so that is my real bump in the upgrade road. I have the same problem as all...how do we audition these fine speakers in our room with our equipment! My heart felt deduction is the Revel Salon 2 for it's strong reviews and Living Room looks. Second place goes to the Thiel 3.7 |
Jeff, of course you realize that the signature of a great speaker is that it makes every recording sound different. That's neutrality for you. ;-) "Good song, bad song..."
I don't consider the 802D "lesser", I consider it different. To my ears the 802Ds aren't as neutral. They're a bit too technicolor for me. But no one appointed me or anyone else the arbiter of goodness, and it just might be you like the 802Ds better.
I had the original Legacy Focus, purchased in 1996. Three 12" woofers, and that bi-pole bass made them easier to place in a room for smooth bass response than most box speakers. I was happy with them for years. They didn't image especially well, or at least I never got them to, but until I heard the Salon 2 nothing got me to change. The Dunlavy V almost did, but the treble wasn't as detailed at the Legacys. I've never heard the Whisper. |
Thanks Irv. Interesting how it played out for you. I got the Salon2 as a full range answer (and sold my JL F112 assuming it would be, ugh). If it's not, I'm happy to go the sub route, but probably don't need the Salon 2 as IMO it becomes overkill at that point (financial overkill as well,lol).
I did pick up the Velodyne Optimum 12 and played Adele's Rolling in the Deep, both with and without sub, and since the recording is goosed in the bass and boosted/close mic'ed on vocal, it sounded great without the sub and not much better with. It was after that that I decided to try the Clapton Unplugged recording and was once again disappointed with the recessed vocal. It's like a roller coaster, good song, bad song. I have no problem admitting I may like the "lesser" 802Di or even drop down to an 803Di and go back to a high-end sub or pair of subs.
I do look forward to playing with the OmniMic just to see what's going on.
Which Legacy Focus did you have: 20/20, HD, SE? I was really interested in both the Focus SE and the Whisper XD but nowhere to hear them. How did you like to Focus and how did it compare to others (even the salon)? |
Jeff, the Salon 2 is very sensitive to room placement for a lot of parameters, especially bass response. Much more so than my previous Legacy Focus speakers were, by a long shot. I've mentioned in other threads that when my Salon 2s are set up for best imaging and response in the 200Hz and up range my bass response is terrible. I finally gave up and got a subwoofer I could move around to my heart's content, and leave the Salon 2s in positions optimized for everything else. I use a 80Hz-6db/octave high filter for the Salon 2 woofers, which of course requires four amplifier channels. (The mids/high run direct from the pre-amp.) In my room there was really no other choice.
I have a lot of fun with the OmniMic real-time analyzer screen too. It shows you where the energy in a recording really is. I like 1/12th octave smoothing mode.
You might be surprised at the effect the tweeter control has on voices. Try turning it down to -.5 with the grilles off and see what happens.
Of course, it just might be that you will like the 802D better. I know someone that definitely prefers them to my Salon 2s. It's not a crime. :) |
Irv, thanls for the recommendation. I think thats a good investment and I will try it. I have listened with grills on and off. The adjustments simply increase/decrease tweeter and decrease bass for close to wall placement. My issue is low bass and midrange among other issues I mentioned in my previous post.
Sfstereo, with all due respect, I was simply offering my perspective here, and all suggestions and comments are welcome, even if similar suggestions were made elsewhere. Having said that, you are not wrong, I would prefer something more plug and play and not have to mess around so much with placement, room, etc. However, there may be no such animal if I want to play on this level. I appreciate Irv's suggestion, as the Dayton OmniMic is something I can buy to see if indeed these is a suckout issue, and then decide if/how I want to deal with it. For what it's worth, I have moved them around and improved the bass response significantly, but still have recessed vocals on some CDs (just listened again to Clapton Unplugged Layla cut and his voice was quite recessed), as well as the "deconstruct" issue I raised above. |
These kind of suggestions have been made to Jeffkad at another forum. I think he is looking for something that's plug and play. |
Jeffkad, there's plenty of life, musicality and slam in my system and I'm not experiencing the issues you discuss. What's your other gear upstream from the Salon 2s? |
Before you spend a zillion dollars replacing the Salon 2s you might consider analyzing your system. I highly recommend a Dayton Audio OmniMic set-up from Parts Express. It'll run on any PC. You might find that you have a big suck-out in the 500Hz-2KHz range, which might explain your problem with vocals. It could just be that you need to adjust your speaker placement for room modes. Even if you end up getting a different speaker the OmniMic is a great tool for system set-up, so IMO you can't go wrong. Yeah, it's about $300, but compared to $15K speakers it's a nit.
A couple other questions:
Do you listen to the Salon2s with the grilles on or off? Have you tried both?
Have you tried adjusting the controls in the cable connection box? |
A contrarian viewpoint to the consensus here. So I am a B&W fanboy, but as I stated earlier in this thread, I was really impressed with the Salon 2 in several reasonably long dealer sessions.
Well, lo and behold, a good deal came up on a used pair and I jumped on it impulsively. Have had them in my house for 3 weeks and...I don't really care for them.
Although I readily admit that the neutrality, accuracy, and coherence is there in spades, and the imaging and distinction btwn instruments is absolutely amazing, they don't move me. Vocals are ever so slightly recessed, and there is no "life" to them. They are quite unforgiving of even average recordings (forget poor ones), which greatly limits listening options. The bass is really good only on good recordings, but they can't seem to pull out the lower mids and bass on average CDs.
The most interesting but frustrating part of the experience is that they seem to sometimes deconstruct a song into it's musical parts: vocals, distinct instruments, leaving an uninvolving collection of distinct sounds (clear and neutral as they can be). While sometimes I am absolutely amazed at the imaging or clarity, I more often find that I'm easily distracted instead of immersed and toe tapping.
I have come to the conclusion that, great as they are, I may just prefer a fuller, warmer more forward sound. Maybe that means I like a more colored sound or the "BBC midbass hump", which I know is audiophile heresy, but so be it. It's what I like. Just my two cents.
Going to take a good hard listen to the 802Di and the Sonus Faber Elipsa. |
I also am a very happy owner of Revel Ultima Salon 2s. I use a Gamut D3i pre and D200i power amp to drive them and to me they sound phenomenal.
As a previous owner Dali Helicon 400 MkIIs and after a long audition of Dynaudio Sapphire's, I did not hesitate to purchase Salon 2s.
Haven't heard upper range B&Ws, but to me, for the money, Salon 2s are as good as it gets. |
"Ahhh, I wish I were young again (but with money), now I'm old - with old ears and a fat wallet. Oh well . . . ."
Amen, brother. At least my ears are still acting young. Nonetheless, I decided to max out my audio system before my ears gave out. I know too many guys with hearing aids, and I doubt they can tell the difference between an 802D and a Salon 2.
It would also be nice if my gut was thinner and my wallet fatter by comparison. ;) |
Fat wallet or young ears....that's a tradeoff.
There are other tradeoffs in life as well, for example buying what you want or what the decorator permits.
I did have a chance to audition the Salon2s and the bass is soooo tight.
Thanks for all the useful commentary
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I have the 802 Diamond. No doubt about it - it is a great speaker. Part of the issue is taste in speakers, B&W is hard to beat for midrange and high's, but I think it is because I like the coloration of the speakers in those ranges. Let me re-iterate something I think I said before: I think room configuration has a lot to do with which speaker shines.
IMO the Reveals are more accurate (particularly with bass) than the 802's and the high end is still great (B&W might beat 'em slightly in the midrange (but I think this is preference over accuracy) - I need more listening time, but had to take one pair down). When it comes to bass the B&W's have a bit of "boom" to them compared to the Revels.
Having said that I must add that I am now compelled to upgrade my amplification to drive the Revels better. The B&W's were happy, the Reveals are not (well they are satisfied, but could use a bit more excitement). Ahhh, I wish I were young again (but with money), now I'm old - with old ears and a fat wallet. Oh well . . . . |
I had the B&W 802D. They looked cool but didn't sound like 15K speakers to me( maybe 8K ). I traded them in on the new B&W 800 Diamonds. These are on a whole other level( not even close IMO). I would also look at Vivid speakers. |
Nab, I see your point on the 802 vs 800 if we are talking used. As for your in home audition, did you have the 802D or new 802 Diamond? New Diamond is supposed to be significantly better than previous 802D. I too am a B&W fanboy, but the Salon2 is one of the best I've ever heard, and certainly better than the 802D. No argument there. |
PS. I'd echo much of what Irvrobinson wrote in his post on 1/7/11.
As an aside: My room is quite large with lots of glass and the current setup is less than ideal with both speakers. I think any speaker with an ideal room setup for that speaker can make a huge difference (I have a pair of Medowlark Herons setup in another place and the room is nearly perfect for them). What I'd really like to do is demo both sets of speakers in a "golden cube", but that'll have to wait until I win the lottery. |
Quick response. I've had both sets of speakers in my home for a few months so I could choose between the two. IMO and in my listening space the Revels Salon 2's are the best speaker. I've always had a soft spot for the B&W's, but in an A/B comparison with my equipment, my room, etc. the Salon 2's really beat them. It only took me so long because I like the B$W's and couldn't believe it. Now please, B&W people don't come out of the woodwork and beat the snot out of me. It's my ears, my place, and my equipment. Of course I've had several folks I respect also listen to the the A/B comparison and reach the same conclusion.
As for why one should compare the 802d's rather than the 800d's to the Salons, it's because the price point is closer in the used market. The B&W's retain a higher resale value (and are not discounted as highly initially) consequently the comparison in price in the used market is between the 802d's and the Revel Salon 2's. In the used market the Salon 2's fall between the 802d's and the 800d's. Depending on condition and market etc.
One last thought: the Revels want lots of power to really shine and I'm now going to have to upgrade my amplification (when I do, if I still have the B&W's I'll do another A/B, but it looks like the B/W's will be on the market at Audiogon soon). |
Yes, they are close to the wall. Some reasons for that. One, the room is a mess with speaker boxes etc. that I have to put down cellar - which in turn requires some cellar cleanout action. I'll get to that after Xmas, LOL.
Also, while I may bring them more out into the room, I may still leave them spread out wide to the walls. I like the super-wide soundstage I get from wide placement, and I'm only really noticing bass nodes building up in a couple of areas to the rear of the room where no one would likely be doing any critical listening anyway.
Second, right now I'm going through the new 73-disc Grateful Dead Europe 72 box set. It's mixed from the original 16-track reels and so should have had plenty of bass throughout, but they kinda screwed the pooch on the mix on some of the shows resulting in less low end than there should be, so I've got the speakers parked in the corners for extra bass reinforcement. One of my buddies has run the release through a parametric EQ program to address some of the imbalances and I'm going to send a hard drive to him soon to copy his files and hopefully resolve the mix issue.
I do agree with Irv that they are best out into the room and off the walls, but I'm finding the trade-off of less than the absolute best sound in the "sweet spot" in favor of pretty good in a larger area to be worth it in my circumstance. I do a lot of my work in the room and don't like to be moored to one spot all day, so being able to move around and still get 90% percent performance in multiple locations is fine with me. And the fact that you can get them to sound pretty good with less than ideal placement to me makes them a more versatile speaker than the Wilson Sasha, which is a much more placement-dependent speaker system - I'd guess they would sound terrible where I presently have the Salon 2s. |
P59teitel,
Great comments. We share many things.
Any other comments on speakers that do or do not work well when placed near the back wall?
Jim |
Jeff, my mistake. I should look at Salons as well.
Thanks |
P59, glad you are enjoying the Revels. I've heard them and think they are great. May wind up getting a used pair of them myself soon (checking out a few different options, including Genesis 5.3). Anyway, As when this thread originally appeared, I still dont understand why the comparison is with the 802D and not the 800D? The 802D lines up pricewise with the Revel Studio2, not the Salon2. If one is looking at the Sasha and the Salon2, then the 800D is the natural competition (and actually cheaper than the Sasha). As good as the 802D is, I would certainly expect that it couldn't really compete with good speakers 50% more expensive. Why didnt you listen to the 800D? |
You might want to check The New Focal Electra 1038 BE. I auditioned them twice last last week along with the B & W 802D. To my ear the Focal was superior. The B & W did have some more in the low end however the Focal I thought handled the lows well and were an overall superior speaker.
I couldn't believe the Focal sounded better as I am a B & W fan. I went back another day and both my friend and I who I brought along came to the same conclusion. |
Jim, my sunroom is also fairly large and also has a lot of glass. When auditioning speakers for my new system in late October, the three best I heard were Wilson Sashas, Revel Salon 2s and B&W 802Ds.
I ultimately went with the Salon 2s. The Sashas sounded great in a controlled dealer environment (carpet, room treatment) - especially the bass - but I thought they'd be too shrill in my room with all that glass. They are definitely not a "neutral" speaker, let's put it that way, and in my environment a certain level of neutrality is necessary even for a bassophile like me. In your price range you might want to check out the Wilson Sophia III - it's similar to the Sasha with I would say a bit less dynamism and deep bass - and in any event I would try to listen to either the Sasha or Sophia.
I was frankly not all that impressed with the B&W 802Ds - they were powered by some nice Classe gear but the treble sounded a little forced. The mid-bass was good but it seemed to roll off quite a bit as it went deep. They didn't really seem to have the kind of punch I was looking for at volume, either - I don't blast music all the time, but every so often I want to put on something like Houses of the Holy, crank it to 11 and pretend I'm 14 again, and these just didn't seem the speakers for that. Overall I didn't find them engaging and just didn't get a thrill from listening to them.
Where the Salon 2s really impressed me during my dealer audition was in two areas: soundstage and dynamism. I didn't go in thinking I'd find those areas so important, but when I walked BEHIND the Salon 2s and still could hear a well-defined soundstage and great stereo image, well, I was beyond impressed. I also thought they were not only very dynamic, but very realistically dynamic: a Herbie Hancock grand piano solo recording with a surprising amount of dynamic range was rendered so effortlessly that when I closed my eyes, I was THERE. And this was despite the fact that I frankly wasn't that impressed with the ML 532H power amp/pre-amp combo driving the Salon 2s that I thought was lacking in low-end oompfif not extension. To be fair to the ML gear, speaker placement and the room may have had something to do with that, but I left certain I'd like the Salon 2s with Plinius gear better - which as it turns out I do, very much so.
I also felt that the Salon 2s would be more forgiving speakers for flawed recordings than the Sashas would.
You should know that my system is a dedicated stereo system and will not be used for home theater purposes. Accordingly, my selections were made solely for music listening, mostly classic rock (Stones, Who, lots of Grateful Dead) and some jazz. The sound you are looking for in a home theater setup may be entirely different than what I wanted. |
Your listening space sounds very similar to mine. For the uses you have in mind you might find the 802D a better choice. In fact, the 802D is so good with voice reproduction you might not need a center channel.
Both the Salon2 and the 802D like to be out from the rear wall, and well out of corners.
If you like action movies I'd highly recommend a subwoofer. If you have a typical two-channel audio system I'd choose a self-powered sub with a high-pass output for the amps. If you don't use a sub both of these speakers like about 200 watts per channel of solid state amp. With a subwoofer you can get away with less IMO. |
This discussion is very helpful.
I am having the same debate between B&W 802 diamond and either the Revel Studio or Salon. I have a family room that adjoins the kitchen. The family room is hexagonal and is about 500 square feet. The kitchen is another 300 square feet. All the rooms have large glass window surfaces.
The primary use will be for normal TV viewing (news, etc), movies, and only 10% music. Consequently the center channel is key for voices.
Three questions:
- Will either option work better in an environment with a lot of large glass windows?
- Is one option better when located close to the rear wall?
- Does one require a lot more amp power?
Thanks for any comments.
Jim |
I've listened to both, and it is very important to listen to the latest version of the 802D. IMO, B&W really improved them, but for some reason didn't update the designations at all.
That said, I prefer the Salon2 and purchased them. Not only did I prefer the overall spectral balance of the Salon2s, but their bass is significantly better than the 802D's, and IMO so is the important woofer-to-midrange transition on grand piano. The real clincher for me, though, is that to this day I've never heard the B&W 800D or 802D image well front-to-back. The newest 802D disappeared in the side-to-side soundstage, even putting images beyond the speaker positions when appropriate, but I could never close my eyes and get that feeling of having the images come out at me, and the Salon2s do that in spades. The Salon2s are extraordinary in this regard. It might just be the dealer set-ups I've heard with the B&Ws, but I heard pretty much the same thing in two different venues.
One comment I would make is that if you haven't heard the Salon2s you might think 802Ds are about as good it gets. Or, you might not be as sensitive to a 3D soundstage as I am. Or you might like the fact that the 800D/802D have more "bite" in the upper mids and highs than the Salon2s do. Some people just prefer a more up-front balance, and then the 802Ds might sound superior.
Another impression I had is that, IMO, the B&Ws have better cosmetics than the Revels. The 800D and 802D look and feel sumptuous. The wood finishes, especially, are luxurious. The Salon2s, either finish, have a shiny, almost plastic look to them. In black the Salon2 looks very sleek and high-tech, almost like Apple did the design, but the B&Ws look like Aston Martin did it, if you know what I mean.
FWIW, it's been eight months now, and I still marvel at the sound of the Salon2s. |
Having had the opportunity of hearing a used pair of Revel Salons at a home nearby, my reaction was that they have a very neutral sound. No well defined highs, mids or bass. Quite honestly, I found them quite dull. I ended up getting a pair of the new B&W 803Di's. Their sound is quite amazing. If you have a chance, you really need to have a listen to the new series. It is a vast improvement over the older diamond series. |
Opinions on B&W are polarized. Many love them, many hate them. I listened to a couple of them and owned a pair till I came to the point I couldn't listen to them any more. Mtdking is right. Midrange so, so.... but the tweeter was horrible. I had Nautilus not "D" so I can't speak for the new version. |
I am in the same boat, deciding between the new B&W 802 Diamond, Salon2 and Focal Scala and Andra3 |
And Jkalman........awesome system you have there!
Thanks again for everyone's input. Thanks! I haven't posted here since around a month ago, so I didn't notice I had already posted in this thread.... Hehehe, sorry about that! |
