Meanwhile ... Paging Hifinut:
I would love to hear whether your opinion of the DCC2 has changed any? Did you switch over to the supplied optical cable and if so, are you still underwhelmed relative to the AA Capitole ? |
Does anyone have a dictionary I've misplaced mine. I'm having a hard time following this thread. LOL. |
Gladstone: Your dulcet glottological excursions are quite splendiferous. Must be the DCC2. :) |
Keep up your guard and sell your preamp, you fool! |
I thought I'd share what was evaluated by some audio buddies (Ceol included) and me recently. We had what you could call a digital vs. vinyl session where we A/B'd the Meitner DCC2 with its dedicated Meitner transport against a VPI Extended Aries w/ 12.5 arm, Koetsu Rosewood Signature cart, Electron Images MCP-1 (and Manley Steelhead on loan) phono stage, and the First Sound Paramount linestage.
SYSTEM
The rest of the system included the DeHavilland Aries 845G monoblock amps and Coincident Millenium speakers (modded with Revelator tweeters, carbon fiber mids, TRS wiring, and crossover adjustments). Coincident TRS biwire speaker cables and all ICs were the Audience AU24s. The Sound Application power conditioner was used for the MCP-1 (or Steelhead), Meitner and turntable only. The Paramount and DeHavillands were plugged directly into the wall outlets. Sound levels were matched using the pink noise track from the Stereophile Test CD2. Finally, the Paramount's switching of the absolute polarity was also taken into account. We used audiophile offerings, each with the SACD and LP equivalents (and redbook CDs if SACD's could not be found).
One can argue that the Meitner may currently be the best digital playback system out there. Many agree that it has made giant leaps is closing the gap between the digital and vinyl. Our recent experience was very educational and quite revealing.
ASSESSMENT
In short, it was no contest. The Meitner cannot compare to the lp experience: the effortless rendering of highs with lots of air and smoothness to the presentation; the palpability of the mids with its alluring sense of weight and body; the dynamics and transient attacks from top to bottom; the 3-dimentional rendering of the soundstage (front to back, left to right, and from one instrument/voice relative to another).
The MCP-1 (with no gain or no cartridge loading selectability) did not have the bass extension, articulation, tightness and control than the DCC2 and so it bows out gracefully here. But the Steelhead (especially at the 100 ohm load setting for the Koetsu) was simply magic. Vinyl is still king.
ADDITIONAL
You may have already come across my assessment of the DCC2Â’s linestage vs. the First Sound Paramount (see the discussion hereÂ… http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?ddgtl&1093257504&read&keyw&zzdcc2). I thought it also interesting to note that we did extensive A/B comparisons between the linestage of the Steelhead vs. the Paramount and the latter unanimously came out on top. There was never a question about the Manley's phono stage capabilities. This is well documented. However, it was intriguing to see that if its linestage was good enough I can have a one box solution (phono + pre). This was not to be as Emmanuel Go's linestage is simply more dynamic, more musical, more harmonically and tonally correct (during attacks and decays and in between), and more musically involving. Mind you that although it was not a night and day difference (a testament to how good the Steelhead is), the delta in performance from one unit to another was noticeable enough for a unanimous vote among the four audio club members who were crazy enough to go through this exercise. It would be interesting to get the Steelhead again and compare it to the linestage of the DCC2. Another worthwhile endeavor is to see how a no holds barred passive linestage compares to the ParamountÂ… stay tuned ;-) |
realrookie says, "One can argue that the Meitner may currently be the best digital playback system out there." It isn't. I just had the opportunity to listen to the DCC2 and transport combo. We had no vinyl with which to compare it, but it was a revealing system. I was unable to bring along my Exemplar/Denon 2900, but my listening impressions would hardly lead me to want to go back to EMM equipment. While detailed and listenable, the EMM had none of the realism and soundstage that is so evident with the Exemplar. I had really assumed given all that has been said here and on AA, that the DCC2 and transports were an improvement above and beyond the DAC6 and moded Phillips sacd 1000. |
Norm it seems weird that you are the only one who feels that way about the examplar/denon combo. I have heard it and was dissapointed. It seems listener preference is a big factor, I would sure have enjoyed preffering a much more cost effective solution to digital, however to my ears it isn't as engaging. |
Tireguy, there are a lot of ways to skin a cat. No doubt Tbg is getting engaging sound. I'd really love to hear what he's got going sometime. |
Tireguy, I can understand that you might hear the comparison differently, but rest assured that I am not the only one hearing this. In my experience I know two others that had EMM gear that sold it for the Exemplar and several others that on hearing the two solutions chose the Exemplar.
I would not use the word "engaging," but as I understand it, my word for this is "involving." This is precisely why I prefer the Exemplar. I find the music realistic and causing me to tap my foot and listen with satisfaction. Were the prices the same for the two, I am sure some might be inclined to buy the EMM, but at a four to one price difference, many would choose the cheaper unit.
Your weird friend |
Tbg- As long as we are all happy :) What ever your CD's are playing through I suppose it doesn't matter at all as long as you can enjoy the music.
Wellfed- I think possibly for the first time we agree, there is more than one way to skin a cat- and probably too many ways in this hobby. |
S..t!
I need a freekin education. Half of you are my friends and I need a Oxford dictionary and grammer lessions just to read this thread.
Could you tone it down so that an old, under-educated feller just looking for great music can understand, without substantial investment in further education, what the hell you mean?
And who is lucky enough to actually get a CDSD? Most of us just get stories about one day we'll get ours.
I'm listening to a DCC2 with a Panasonic H1000 DVD player as a transport given the Philips doesn't play after 25 hours.
I think that when the room is tuned, we should have the good, the bad and the ugly all bring their digital gear and have a shoot out.
Then, each of us can lie about what happened.
The stories should exceed the number of people in the room. Friends, who heard from someone they trust and know that what they heard that they heard was better than what they heard someone else heard, but haven't heard.
I can't believe I need a dictionary to read a audio thread!
Bill E. |
Tim: Rolling over from laughing my ass off. :)
Bill: I am incredulous of you inability to decipher the jargon within this inane thread.
This thread is wonderful. :) |
Out of the box, I was not so impressed, (I have the DCC2 replacing my CHORD DAC64 connected via TOSLINK on a CHORD BLU transport)......the sound seemed flat & hard.
Now after about 10 hours play time it's a whole different storey.
Everything I want to say about the DCC2 has already been said by some of you wonderful people on the ..GON and I will just regurgitate some of the highlights: natural, unbelievably detail, precise deep/wide/ soundstage etc.
Thanks to all who posted their experiences (FBHIFI,TIREGUY, HOOPER, CEOL, JTINN.....etc.) I bought on your recommendations without ever having heard or seen. Now I'm just waiting for the CDSD that will probably bring me to the stratosphere..... |
Jjwa....are you using a modified philips? I though I had heard what the DCC2 was capable of before I had a Meitner compatible transport...but now....WOW. It really makes all the difference. If you are just using a standard transport with the DCC2...be prepared to be impressed. |
Drhst20....I'm running my DCC2 through a "standard transport" via the TOSLINK connection as I await the CDSD.
Thanks for the reassurance..... I can hardly wait.
Right now I'm experimenting with using my NAGRA PL-L preamp and bypassing the DCC2 preamp.......it really, really opens up the sound! but I would like to wait until the DCC2 breaks in before passing final judgement. I read here on the ...GON that it takes 500 hrs. Does anyone know if that is 500 hrs PLAY TIME or just 500 hrs PLUGED in? |
Drhst20 is correct, if you haven't heard the DCC2 ( or DAC 6e for that matter) with the CDSD, you've not heard the this combnation is capable of. As good as the modded Phillips was as a transport, it pales in comparison to the CDSD. The difference is startling. And Jjwa, neither play time nor plugged in. Pilates. |
Just leave it turned on all the time. It is true that the DCC2 requires a long break-in period as well as warm up period, so I never turn it off unless I'm away from home for an extended period. The CDSD seems to stay on, even when on standby, unlike the DCC2 which just shuts down.
The magic isn't there until you mate it with the CDSD, not to my ears anyways. |
Have any of you guys done some comparative listening of the EMM combo with the Teac Esoteric X-01? Have not listened to EMM yet, but have listened both to X-01 and to the Esoteric P70/D70 combo, and found both astonishingly good. |
In the meantime, my own findings on X-01 are in the following thread:
http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?ddgtl&1090867688&read&keyw&zzemm
The thread also contains an excellent discussion by MGOTTLIEB, who appears to give the preference to X-01 in his comparison with EMM, and has since purchased the Esoteric unit. For redbook at least, he uses it mostly as a transport, augmented by DCS Elgar + Purcell. |
Just listened to the LAGQ ALBUM of covers with full meitner equipment used to record it.Most nauseatingly clinical sounding guitar album I have heard in a very long time.YMMV. |
Brucegel- Which LAGQ album are you referring too? Guitar Legands or Latin? I must admit I was very let down with the sonics of Latin and haven't bothered trying Guitar Legends. What equipment was used during production is interesting but- IMO- often has little to do with the end project. If you have someone over mixing/dubbing/sampling/whatevering they can ruin a great performance no matter what gear they are using. |
Well I tried the manhattan transfers album vibrate and the list of mics used is kick-ass and they used millenia pres and meitner gear and once again the sound is plasticky and has the emm tonal touch of glass to every frequency I can pin point.I would be shocked if this is the adopted choice of recording in the future. |
Brucegel: Hope things are going well with you! I did not like the LAGQ recording either, but could it be the engineer and not the equipment that was used? Pointing at the EMM Labs as being the blame is a bit short sighted.
Get those recordings going up there! |
