Hello Ken ,
I don't have any of the drivers you are discussing so no help there. But i did take a look at your TT.. WOW....wicked !
Then the speakers ........
Ken you have it bad, a real nutter.....god bless yah and keep up the good work ... :)
Regards, |
Best you first hear the JBL Everest line, which is the successor to Hartsfield's. I was a great fan of the Khorn's, it was the first hi end speaker I ever heard and I was blown away. When I did hear the Hartsfield, the bar was raised. I've heard the Everest, driven by the ML mono blocks, and they had the great sound of old. Well worth your DIY effort. Yes, the Hartsfield were, in my opinion, better then the Patricians. |
Classic Audio Loudspeakers got their start reproducing the Hartsfield.
The last time I heard one of his, he had a different woofer in it from the original. That speaker was playing bass way below the limits that it had in the 1950s! |
Hello Atmasphere,
Didn't JBL have a large horn type Speaker at RAMF , did you get a chance to hear it?
regards, |
Buconero 117
The Everest was the statement JBL loudspeaker. The concept was fantastic but as happens to all loudspeakers that need the room size we had in the 50s and 60s, nobody bought them.
The K horn design hits a brick wall at 35 HZ. Back in the 60s the point was moot as program material went no lower via the playback devices of that era. Now we hear TTP issues recorded in the mid 50s with sound that makes demands on the best of the best.
I'm not looking at building a statement speaker by today's standards. I feel I have that system now.
I'd like to revisit the drivers of yesteryear for the fun of it. I'll set them up in a separate room, more than big enough for the experimental speakers, and see how they sound. If they sound like hell to me, off to the kids they go. The Ipod generation doesn't know what sounds good anyway!
Ken |
Weseixas, I did see a JBL speaker at RMAF. It had the horn on top, rotated 90 degrees from the traditional alignment, which is a good idea as this would favor horizontal dispersion. The tweeter horn was molded into the top.
It was not a large speaker, but it seemed to sound OK. I did not get much audition time with it. |
Hello Atmasphere,
They had there larger speaker with the Levinson stuff
http://live.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/ces.pl?&MT_8024&RoomView&NV&st141&&&&&RMF10 |
I used to be a vintage audio collector and had both speakers until about 10 years ago. The Hartsfields were one of my favorite vintage speakers. The old style Hartsfields reminded me much of Quad ESL's on steriods! They were not bright but an amazing midrange speaker. They were not great in the frequency extremes but the midrange was great. Some people attempted to mate the speaker with the Bullet tweeter with variable results. The older style hartsfield was a much more complicated cabinet than the later Hartsfields. The EV Patricians could play loud enough to anger an entire apartment building! Again the differed by each version. Patrician IV's sounded far different than the later 700 and 800 series. Hope this is helpful, Bob |
Weseixas, I did hear those speakers too, but I thought they were TADs when I saw the side by side woofers. I really couldn't tell you anything about that system, though I can say that the speakers did not seem to attract attention to themselves (always a good thing). |
Hello Atmasphere,
That JBL speaker seems to be the current rave in the far east. It would have been interesting to hear comments on it's sound.
Baranyi:
Interesting your comments on the JBL Hartsfield . Many moons ago i had the opportunity to hear one , but never did and a shame, it would have been interesting to have heard such an Iconic speaker...
20/20 ,
Regards, |
THE CUURENT AND ORIGINAL EVEREST IS NOT A TRUE HORN SPKR AS IT ONLY USES A HORN FOR THE MIDS AND THE SUPER TWEETER. ONLY 96db WITH 2-15'S LOOKING RIGHT AT YOU. AUDITIONED @RMAF09 IN THE KIMBER ROOM AND @RMAF IN A SLEEPING ROOM.IT WAS POWERED BY ML IN BOTH.THE SONY SPKRS IN THE KIMBER ROOM WERE MUCH BETTER THAN THE PRESENTATION BY HARMON. AS TO YOUR ORIGINAL QUESTION OF WHAT TO DO WITH THE S-8 SYSTEM YOU JUST PURCHASED!!! SELL IT ON EBAY IT'S WORTH A LOT MORE THAN WHAT YOU WILL GET OF SONIC BLISS.THE ALNICO MOTORS HAVE LOST 25-30% OF THEIR CHARGE AND WILL SOUND QUITE ANEMIC. I CAN GO ON ABOUT EACH DRIVER IN DETAIL BUT WHAT WAS TOP DRAWER IN 1961, WHEN THIS GROUP OF COMPONANTS WAS INTRODUCED , AND NOW 2010 IS QUITE DIFFERENT EVEN IF YOU ARE STILL A FAN OF HIGH EFF.HORN BASED SYSTEMS AS I AM |
Bob,
As you mentioned, the 375 mid driver was great up to 10K and then rolled off. JBL augmented the 375 driver with the 075 in later systems where it was easier to integrate than in the Hartsfield.
The patricians I built used the K horn up to 150 Hz and then I crossed over to the drivers used in the last Patrician 880. The sound was much better than the 800 that used the lethargic 30 inch foam cone woofer.
Ken |
JW,
I was traveling for the last few days and had idle time which I put to good use researching on the Lansing Heritage website. I never knew that alnico magnets loose their strength over time, especially 40 or 50 years. They can, however, be re magnetized by a JBL repair facility for about 25 bucks each. That's not too much but the shipping will kill you unless you ship a number of them back via common carrier.
The aluminum diaphrams in the compression drivers also get tired and need to be replaced. New beryllium diaphrams are now available for most compression drivers such as the 375 at about $600 each, new aluminum jobs are about $200.
I learned that the new TAD drivers were designed by the same man that designed the 375. Having said that, the main difference in all of them is the diaphram. Using a different diaphram will enable one to end up with either a 375 which needs a tweeter, or a 376 which does not.
I'm not kidding myself about the sound I'll be hearing after I switch on the music, but who knows. I'm putting these JBL drivers together just for the fun of it and it'll be a lot cheaper than buying an old sports car.
Ken |
Well Ken. I red your thoughts. I have been listening to JBL, small ones and big ones ever since the mid 70s, when I also purchased my first Decca London Blue audio cartridge, that I still own and uses from time to time. I have had real high end stuff, but at the present day I am using JBL OlympusS8 system, that I bought some 20-25 years ago.When I listen to opera records,(living stereo,Decca phase4 etc...), I feel that the 375 gives everything, sounds very good on human voice, but again I have been listening to JBL almost all my entire stereo life.My reference speaker have, for many years, been, the Hartsfield, but I have not been able to buy because of high price. Maybe someday I will be able to buy the Hartsfields. Well I suppose I am a devoted JBL fan. They sound so good, no listening fatigue or anything , just sounding good. JBL and tube amps, such as 300B for the 375 is a top match. Sounds exelent. The only thing that probably sounds better than my Olympus is horns. Good luck building. |
I would love to read an update by the OP. Hartsfields are now being replicated. Now The OP & we are talking SPEAKERS! I would very much like to hear some. |
Hi, I second what Isochronism said, an up-date would be great!, I have 1992 JBL L7 speakers modified with Taralabs omega jumper cables on the bi-amping post, this took these speakers to a whole nother level of sound performance that I did not expect from these speakers, My next mod to these speakers is going to be loosing the still points speaker spikes and tring to get the polycrystal jumbo speaker spikes, 4 on each speaker, I have experience with these resonance control products that are not in production no longer, They made some horn speakers I owned years ago right out magical sounding, Happy Listening. |
