I would like to ask the advice of fellow Dynaudio/Plinius owners and fans.
I am considering upgrading my speakers to Dynaudio C2's and im wondering wether my Plinius 9200 would be adequate to drive them or would i need to upgrade to a bigger Plinius amp.
My room is approx 15' x 18' and i generally only listen at low to moderate volumes so will the 9200 still give me the kick??
Yes... you will be fine. I've owned the C2's and now the C4's in a room measuring 21' x 15' and partially opened on one end... I've had no problems giving them kick with the Plinius SA-102 amp (125 wpc).
IMO I disagree...The dynaudio C2 as well as the C4 will sound and preform its best with power even at lower volumes.Bigger is better on this situation..Check out a Mac 402 or 501 combo which sounds great on my C4s.I dont really think a SA102 would really do it,not for me anyway.I ran a Pass X150.5 and a X250.5 and the diff was head turning..
As oppose to most of theorist around here I listen to every piece of equipment before I comment on its quality. And I am not a salesman ,so i ahve no vested interest in misleading folks as oppose to you AudioFeil.
Interesting observation. I listened to less expensive or perhaps the least expensive Dynaudio Countour 1.4 through Linn integrated then trough Naim nait in both cases treble was dead, just like you described it : there was no Alive-sound to be found.
Side note: 99% of speakers are just horrible exercises in cabinet making and have nothing to do with competent design.
If anyone needs a good set of speakers they don't need to look anywhere other than ATC floor standing speakers preferably active.
Dkzzzz ..Man, what are you smoking??...To say Dynaudio speakers are tubey, warm and lack treble im guessing something very strong.Dynaudio is known for its accurate and musical top end.The esotar2 tweeter is one of the best made,period.First of all there is a very very big difference between the Contour line and the Confidence line.We all know that except you I guess.Maybe its just you cant afford C2s,that I dont know but you are way off the mark.....Johnno35,I would totally ignore the comments he has made.I suggest taking your amp to where ever you are buying and you be the judge..Im betting you will be listening to the C2s in your home for some time to come.. Enjoy!
I think Plinius 9200 will drive these speakers purely from power perspective. Not optimally, but it will. I would not worry about that from the get-go. But in a long run, you should know that Dynaudio speakers like power.
Does Plinius mate well with Dynaudio sonically? That is a different story. If we are talking integrated amps, I would rather pair the Dyns with a Krell integrated than with the Plinius. I think Krell amps are a good match with Dynaudio. Dyns are one of the few speakers with which I would most likely not hesitate to use the Krell amplification. But that's just me. Or a new Pass Labs integrated amp, the INT-150, I think would mapir nicely with the Dyns, but may be a bit on a smooth, relaxed side as well.
Anyway, if you like and want to C2s, go for it. You can always try a different amp with them at a later point. The most important thing you should decide is whether or not Dynaudio C2 is the speaker you like and want. That would be more important than worying about an amp. You should buy amp for the speakers. Not speakers for the amp.
I dont care what you folks read in brochures printed by manufacturer and in stereo mag reviews : Esostar tweeter Wee- wee or Meee God!!!. I have a pair of ears and I can hear what type of junk Dynaudio puts out. It is your loss if you cannot hear how boomy and out of phase that speaker is. Perhaps they make some super-expensive or rare model that was designed well, I did not hear it. If you like soft, blanketed sound and strive to match bad speaker with bad amp for warm bloomy crap to come out, then Dynaudio C Co are perfect as any other box for such experiments. You all need to step away form your keyboards go buy a ticket to a local symphony hall and listen to live performance for a change . re-set your ears. You clearly have been in audiophile-land for way too long.
P.S. I would not recommend to use Krell KAV for 2-channel sound. Krell KAV is one of the worst amplifiers I have ever heard.
Dkzzzz - You seem to bash everything. Do you like anything other than ATC active speakers... or is everything else garbage in your opinion?
Also, you never responded to my question from a few days ago... what does your system consist of (amp, pre, source(s), cables, speakers? I'd like to know.
I have owned the C2's along with a host of other Dynaudio models. Not surprisingly, I haven't found them to have "dead" treble.
I think the Plinius would do well, but if upgrading the amp down the line is out of the question, I'm not sure I'd want that combo forever. Dyns love power, although the C2's aren't as demanding as the older confidence line. The C2's will certainly reward further investment in your upstream components.
I used them in a 14x19x8 room - I loved them. I enjoyed them on a wide range of music genres.
Johnno35 - I apologize for getting this thread off track. To summarize, I believe there is merit in many of these threads. I do believe the Plinius 9200 will "work", however, if money is not an issue, and you can afford separates, there are better options that will get you better results at a price (as mentioned... Pass 250.5, Mcintosh 402 or 501's, Plinius SA 102 or even better the SA-250). Personally, I kind of like a softer/more polite sound, in that I find it easier to listen to. There is no silver bullet, or one size fits all. I'm a believer in "you get what you pay for" in most cases. Stick with a reputable manufacturer, buy used gear if possible, and trade up when the time is right.
You may want to consider Simaudio for an amplifier. Simaudio uses Dynaudio speakers exclusively and at audio shows. I haave heard the discontined MOON W-5 LE with the C'2's, it sounded excellent as well as the new Evolution Series W-8 with Confidence C-4's. Something to consider anyway.
Pdreher if you care to know I have Marantz universal player Music Hall Mambo amp and ATC SCM 35 Passive. I use copper wires for cables. And all my power cords are black.
Perhaps it wasn't the speaker and instead the low powered integrated amplifiers from Linn and Naim which could be part of the problem?
That's my point, while you seem to ask people to leave their keyboards I'm quite confident most posting on this thread have heard more then you, and your complete lack of knowledge with regards to SYNERGY and listening to a system as a WHOLE makes one wonder.
I've never heard of anybody using small scale integrated amplifiers with Dynaudio with any success. I know I haven't. The synergistic match is usually Krell, SimAudio or Plinius. I'm quite convinced (however have not heard) that other higher powered Solid State designs from the likes of Pass, MAC and Gryphon would work as well.
Perhaps you should listen or take up another hobby as you seem disgruntled.
I don't think it is a power issue. If it was I would be complaining about lack of bass not the excess of it. Look , I do think objectively that absolute majority of products on the audio market are bad. I am not talking about voodoo products like audio fuses and power cords: those are beyond any criticisms for any rational person. I am talking about all that plethora of electronic equipment that is floating around this forum and many other sites with FOR SALE signs on it. And btw SYNERGY was invented by salesmen. I am not going to deny that most amps intensionally designed to sound distorted, so that audiophiles have something to talk about on these forums, but it's not a reason for anyone to jump on that marry-go-round. The moment I hear someone talking about MATCHING amplifier to a speaker I realize that they talking about broken electronics being paired with poorly-designed analog front. Think about it rationally; have you ever heard anyone returning from a concert and complaining that orchestra sounded soft o lacked bass or that they would look for a warmer sounding performers next time? Next time someone tells you :"Sound is subjective" laugh at them. Sound is objective to a very high degree that is evolution, that is harmony that everyone understands. If sound was subjective we would not have music or recognise each other voices.
Dkzzz, unfortunately each concert hall is different, and not all seats are equal in sonic terms. It happened with me several times that bad concerthall acoustic destroyed for me the concert. I frequently go to classical concerts. I always very picky on selecting the right seats.
I am a Dynaudio dealer, and I carry other speaker brands that use fancy tweeters with 40+ khz rated frequency extension. In all my listening, I have never heard anything as described as "no treble". In fact Dynaudio Esotar2 tweeters sound every bit as detailed, if not moreso, than the "exotic" material tweeters.
Dkzzzz, you obviously have an axe to grind, because your scathing remarks are completely unwarranted, off-topic, and just plain wrong. Dynaudio is an internationally distributed speaker brand that is relied on by some of the finest professional recording studios and most discerning customers out there. I carry well over 20 world-class manufacturers and have been doing this many years. Dynaudio is the most professional class-act of a company that I have ever dealt with! They are a real technology company that has been building their own products for the better part of 30 years, unlike most of the cheap low-tech, all hype junk that has flooded the audio market in recent years.
To the original poster: I have only heard the Plinius products with Dynaudio speakers on a couple occasions and always thought the combination sounded very good. I know of a few Dynaudio owners that swear on the Dynaudio/Plinius combination. Most of what you see in the North American audio shows is the pairing with Simaudio which incidentally works well. I would use 200 watts into 8 ohms as a minimum starting point for these speakers. Probably 300-500 watts into 8 ohms is more optimal, but there are only a couple integrated type amplifiers on the market designed for that kind of power. Some that come to mind that will do at least 200 watts into 8 ohms (though I'm sure there are more): Krell KAV400xi, FBI Musical Fidelity A5.5, A1008, KW550 Plinius 9200, Hiato McIntosh MA6600,MA7000 Simaudio I-7 NAD Masters M3 Chord CPM 3350
I would also call Dynaudio directly and ask them what they would recommend. They are always willing to help and support a fellow owner.
Wow, i didn't expect such a stir. Thanks everyone for you input, it has been entertaining as well as very informative. Unfortunately where i live in Western Australia it's very difficult to get the opportunity to audition a variety of equipment and there's not a great deal of good secondhand gear out there so all advice is good advice. Can i ask one more question of anybody still reading this post. The Plinius SA-103 is only 125 Watts into 8 with 50 Amps peak, although this is a class A amp why is it going to be a step up from the 9200 with 200 Watts and 40 Amps. Is the extra 10 Amps of more benefit than the Watts and why?
separates usually perform better than integrated amps. this is where the upgrade in sonics would come from, by switching to separates. but in case of speakers that like power, the overall improvement would be questionable at best, since you will be switching to a lower powered amp. I would start with 200w/ch into 8ohms for these speakers.
Ok, Dkzzz I realize now you are right and the rest of the world is apparently wrong.
Dyn's s--- despite the considerable evidence to the contrary. And they do not have any treble. Why would anybody pollute their systems with such Danish garbage?
Lord knows why people drop such large amounts of hard earned cash on them so easily.
I suspect from my experience with small Contour 1.3 mkIIs that most Dyns, including larger Confidence line models, like power and current...the more, the merrier.
And, they are not the easiest load to drive, so doubling power into 4 and even 2 ohms might help more than just throwing more watts into 8 ohms at them.
My Contours sound more flushed out and fuller now at most volumes on a 120w/ch Musical Fidelity A3CR that largely doubles into 4 ohms than they did earlier on a Carver m4.0t that pushed 360w/ch into 8 ohm but only marginally more into 4.
I think we can always agree to disagree since our preferences are different. If Mr. Dkzzzz thinks that only ATC speakers sound good, then I think we should discuss no further gentlemen:-))
I have owned Totem (Model One. Rainmaker), Dynaudio (Audience 52, DM 2/10-a line that is even cheaper than Audience), and JBL (S38, HS 610) and can speak from the results of my A/B testing that Dynaudio's tweeters are very good if not better than most other companies (MA, B & W, Totem, PSB, Focal, Vandys, JBL, etc...)
I can listen to my Dynaudio DM 2/10 monitors for hours without having the listening fatigue since they are more airy than other metal dome tweeters that I have auditioned. My GF seems to concur with me on the good treble that the Dyns produce.
Plinius 9200 is a very capable amp that can drive the Dynaudio speakers that you are thinking about upgrading with very satisfactory result for most people (9/10)
If you can, bring your Plinius 9200 to your local Dynaudio dealer to give them a test drive and see if the C2 and your Plinius sound good together to your ears.
Got to admit that even though Dynaudio speakers are pretty expensive for most working class folks, they are totally worth every single penny that you fork over.
You must have a verified phone number and physical address in order to post in the Audiogon Forums. Please return to Audiogon.com and complete this step. If you have any questions please contact Support.
